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VR support in Dirt Rally 2 ?

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  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    RWDsam said:

    We don't want VR, we want more extra content.


    "We" don't want it of "you" don't want it?

    Guess it is first impirtant to know how much content is left out for VR implementation, isn't it?
    And then it is not your or mine decision but cm.
    "We" as in 99% of us who don't own VR. Monitor other topics to see that we are fed up with loud 1%.
    VR implementation takes significant effort. Significant compared to what? I will let you guess. Whatever it is, it benefits 100% of us, not 1%.

    looperi said:
    So motion will be supported well but not VR? 
    MTOJay Believes so. I don't (I just said it is easier to support than VR).
  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    SamRWD said:
    RWDsam said:

    We don't want VR, we want more extra content.


    "We" don't want it of "you" don't want it?

    Guess it is first impirtant to know how much content is left out for VR implementation, isn't it?
    And then it is not your or mine decision but cm.
    "We" as in 99% of us who don't own VR. Monitor other topics to see that we are fed up with loud 1%.
    VR implementation takes significant effort. Significant compared to what? I will let you guess. Whatever it is, it benefits 100% of us, not 1%.

    looperi said:
    So motion will be supported well but not VR? 
    MTOJay Believes so. I don't (I just said it is easier to support than VR).
    "We as inn 99% of us who don't own VR".. Why do you speak for anyone else but yourself? I know a lot of folks without VR that couldn't care less if the game has VR or not, but none of them DON'T want it. They still can play on their pancake screens regardless..
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    Another one. 

    I don't care if you implement VR by yourself. In fact- do it, all the power to you.
    I care if the content 100% of users could otherwise enjoy gets cut because resources go to expensive in implementation VR that fracture of community can appreciate. So it is just as valid to say that VR users want to get VR in DR as it is to say people who don't use VR don't want to get a game with less defined core mechanics/ less content. Because that is exactly what would happen if CM would greenlight VR support development.
    What discussion on this board makes you think that people want Dirt Rally 1.5? Everyone here wants the best Dirt Rally 2.0 we can get. 
  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    What a load of BS. I don't know why you buy into this **** that it will be lesser content if they implement VR. Every other sim has loads of cars and tracks, so there is absolutely NO reason for Codemasters NOT to include it. DR2 will be a downgrade from DR1 otherwise.. Not often developers goes backwards but in this case they do.
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    eXerfit said:
    What a load of BS. I don't know why you buy into this **** that it will be lesser content if they implement VR.
    You call it BS, I call it facts https://youtu.be/YLHeJsUNB3A?t=8m42s 
    I said it is how it works even before that interview got published, it is just a common sense. I am happy to give you a credible source so you don't call common sense BS.
  • gloomgloom Member New Car Smell
    Vr is a pretty big part of every sim community I'm part of. Not everyone uses it, but it's pretty widely excepted.
    In the two leagues I'm in, both have around 40 people, atleast 10-15 of the 40 in both use vr headsets. I only know a couple that use motion rigs in comparison. I know it's a small sample size but it's a common trend if you follow alot of sim communities. And I continually see more and more adding vr to their setups. Not everyone enjoys it, but it's still significant and growing. 
  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    edited October 2018
    SamRWD said:
    eXerfit said:
    What a load of BS. I don't know why you buy into this **** that it will be lesser content if they implement VR.
    You call it BS, I call it facts https://youtu.be/YLHeJsUNB3A?t=8m42s 
    I said it is how it works even before that interview got published, it is just a common sense. I am happy to give you a credible source so you don't call common sense BS.
    Yeah, you call it facts because you buy into it. The tracks and cars are probably already modelled and finished by now so you will get your v2.0 pancake edition in time. But that does not mean that they can't make a VR patch for it later. They just have to say so and do it. To just rule it out and make people choose between content and VR is just plain stupid.
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    eXerfit said:
    SamRWD said:
    eXerfit said:
    What a load of BS. I don't know why you buy into this **** that it will be lesser content if they implement VR.
    You call it BS, I call it facts https://youtu.be/YLHeJsUNB3A?t=8m42s 
    I said it is how it works even before that interview got published, it is just a common sense. I am happy to give you a credible source so you don't call common sense BS.
    Yeah, you call it facts because you buy into it. The tracks and cars are probably already modelled and finished by now so you will get your v2.0 pancake content in time. But that does not mean that they can't make a VR patch for it later. They just have to say so and do it. To just rule it out and make people choose between content and VR is just plain stupid.
    I am sorry, I didn't realize you cannot reason, let me try to make it clear:
    SCENARIO 1
    You get two friends. Let's call them Tom and Ben. You ask Tom and Ben to make you as many pancakes as they can in 2 minutes. They make you two pancakes each in that time. You say "good job Tom and Ben! You made me two pancakes each! Let's call put those 4 pancakes (2 Ben made and 2 Tom made) into that box with "Dirt Rally 2.0" sticker on it".
    Then you tell Tom and Ben that they have another 2 minutes, and ask them to again make you as many pancakes as they can. They make again two pancakes each again. You say "good job Tom and Ben! You made me two pancakes each! Let's call put those 4 pancakes (2 Ben made and 2 Tom made) into that four boxes with "DLC1", "DLC2", "DLC3" and "DLC4" stickers on it"
    SCENARIO 2
    You get two friends. Let's call them Tom and Ben. You ask Tom and Ben to make you as many pancakes as they can in 2 minutes. They make you two pancakes each in that time. You say "good job Tom and Ben! You made me two pancakes each! Let's call put those 4 pancakes (2 Ben made and 2 Tom made) into that box with "Dirt Rally 2.0" sticker on it".
    Then you tell Tom and Ben that they have another 2 minutes, and ask them to again make you as many pancakes as they can. They make again two pancakes each again. You say "good job Tom and Ben! You made me two pancakes each! Let's call put those 2  pancakes Ben made into a box with a "VR DLC" sticker on it, and and 2 Tom made into that four boxes with "DLC1" and "DLC2" stickers on it".
    QUESTION:
    How many boxes didn't get pancakes put into them?
    Now you understands, or not understands?

  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    Ahh, so you're afraid you won't get all the DLC you want? Well, good luck with that. In the history of rallygames they have released, how many DLCs have they released after with new content? Yeah, that's what I thought..
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    eXerfit said:
    Ahh, so you're afraid you won't get all the DLC you want? 
    No.
    But I will leave it at that if you still don't understand how basic economics of a pipeline work. VR won't happen anyways since Codies said they will listen to a community. 1% is irrelevant.
  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    SamRWD said:
    eXerfit said:
    Ahh, so you're afraid you won't get all the DLC you want? 
    No.
    But I will leave it at that if you still don't understand how basic economics of a pipeline work. VR won't happen anyways since Codies said they will listen to a community. 1% is irrelevant.
    And what is the hottest topic in the community since the day they announced the game? Come on, I'm sure you have noticed..
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • SamRWDSamRWD Member Race Engineer
    eXerfit said:
    SamRWD said:
    eXerfit said:
    Ahh, so you're afraid you won't get all the DLC you want? 
    No.
    But I will leave it at that if you still don't understand how basic economics of a pipeline work. VR won't happen anyways since Codies said they will listen to a community. 1% is irrelevant.
    And what is the hottest topic in the community since the day they announced the game? Come on, I'm sure you have noticed..
    You just have to be kidding yourself if you seriously think VR is the hottest topic since DR2 got announced LOL.
    Most annoying and mostly mentioned by 1% of the community that cannot understand basic mathematics? Certainly.
  • eXerfiteXerfit Member Unleaded
    Oh you and your 1% .. I don't even know where you get that number from. But I'm sure the guys that make Assetto Corsa, iRacing, Project Cars, rFactor and so on quickly run out of business because of VR.
    MongoJon [VR] on leaderboards.
  • zissakos1zissakos1 Member Wheel Nut
    edited October 2018
    Yeah, I agree it is very silly to say content would have to be sacrificed for VR support. As if the content creators/artists would program VR support. I mean of course you would need them to optimize things, as has been confirmed by the devs in the other thread. But the majority of work is engine/rendering programming.
    Also, of yourse it is true that you only have limited resources, and if you assign a portion of a team to a differnet task, some other task might not be done.
    But we all don't know:
    - how big the CM team is and how much additional resources they could gather quickly (outsourcing, nearshore, offshore). It happens all the time in many business IT projects. Codemasters themselves have confirmed offices in India (IIRC).
    - the inner workings of gamedev teams. How widespread the skillsets are. At least tht of the specific Dirt Rally team. Also, team members are borrowed between different game projects.
    - what has already been finished and what not. Sure there is a lot of polishing to do. But does that require 100% of the team? who knows?
    - what the team will do AFTER submitting the final build for production/approval by Steam. I think it's several weeks before release, isn't it? Sure, they might work on a day 1 patch. Or VR support... :-) Maby it hasn't been decided yet and our uproar is influencing the decision?

    So I would suggest everyone to stay calm and not voice opinions as facts/sure things, because there are just many parameters to the story we just don't know. The only thing we can do is voice our opinion so it is heard, which we have been asked for by CM themselves.
    Anyone not agreeing with us, please don't get into a fight with us, just respect that there are other demands as well. Don't be afraid your game will be cut shorter, because CM will never do that. There are possibilites to do both, and CM will manage that, if the community speaks up.

    Speaking of which, what does the Community Manager say to all this, @ChristinaMc ?
    Is that enough voices for VR support or how much is enough?
    Or how else would you measure/conclude "community wants VR"? A dedicated officiall poll? Where?
    Because if you already concluded that, we might just stop here to not get into other fights... :-)
    Peace!
  • chillisteakchillisteak Member Unleaded
    edited October 2018
    zissakos1 said:

    Don't be afraid your game will be cut shorter, because CM will never do that. There are possibilites to do both, and CM will manage that, if the community speaks up.

    Speaking of which, what does the Community Manager say to all this, @ChristinaMc ?
    Is that enough voices for VR support or how much is enough?
    Or how else would you measure/conclude "community wants VR"? A dedicated officiall poll? Where?
    Because if you already concluded that, we might just stop here to not get into other fights... :-)
    Peace!
    I'm sure many of us who played the original DiRT Rally thought CM wouldn't release another game without VR support after the amazing job they did on that. Yet here we are almost 3 years later and they haven't released one other game with VR support.
    So them cutting a game short I really wouldn't put it past them, especially using it as an excuse not to create VR content.

    But the worst thing about this whole lack of VR support right now for me at least is the lack of any sort of response from CM in any shape or form, they can see the demand is there now the decision should be a simple one. They screwed up and they should acknowledge it and fix the issue.
    Post edited by chillisteak on
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  • SkiddyMcCrashSkiddyMcCrash Member Champion
    The original DiRT didn't have VR, DiRT Rally did
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  • MTOJayMTOJay Member Unleaded
    SamRWD said:
    The original DiRT didn't have VR, DiRT Rally did
    That's the thing. We are trying to reason with people who know nothing about series, never participated in discussions we did in order to improve the game, and now new accounts appear to push VR. In the meantime 1% got another blow:

    https://youtu.be/w6NXyxQmMQ0?t=6m24s

    "If there is ENORMOUS demand for it, then we can do it; it is NO SMALL undertaking".
    So, looks like we will get a good, refined game with a lot of content while VR is not likely to come after all :)
    you call that a blow?
    the first question they answer is about VR. they go out of their way to make it clear that if there is demand then they will do it. to me that was actually a good sign that they do care after all. otherwise they woudl have either ignored it or waited for later to answer that question.

    they have probably seen that the most upvoted question under all reddits threads and also one of the most discussed thing around here is vr support. i think they didnt realize there would be that much demand.

    did you see the live chat? that were not only 5 people. there were so many different people asking for vr. i honestly have a hardtime understanding why you think the community wouldnt profit if everybody could enjoy the game in the way they want.
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