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Continuing multi-player issues (Post patch 1.10)

I guess this is for the attention of @F1Support but hopefully more will look in and highlight if they're suffering from the same problems.

The following problems are related to our multi-player league on PS4 - usually full grids of 20 experienced drivers; most/all with demonstrably reliable connections, some who stream on Twitch and others who capture with the on-board functionality.  Race distance 50%, assists on (except braking), dynamic weather, official event times.

1. First and foremost, despite various patches promising a solution we are still having issues with some drivers apparently randomly being disconnected during online sessions (in qualifying and during races).  Many drivers report seeing the poor connection icon above various cars but actual disconnections seem random and not limited to any particular driver/car/position.  You can see an example video of this happening here (luckily I'm able to rejoin the session after two laps and take control again):

2.  The Safety Car still does not seem to come out. In the race in the above videos (at Austria - dry conditions/50% distance) we had various accidents without any VSC or SC.  In our last race at Baku (pre 1.10 patch), we did have a VSC shortly after the start for apparently no reason.  No SC though during the rest of the race despite eight retirements and one car sitting across the esses in S3.  Similarly at Monaco (pre 1.10 patch) we had a raft of accidents/retirements and no VCS or SC.

3. Something I've never come across online before is in-race transmission damage being relayed to me by the engineer.  Not sure if it affected my car's performance but again you can see a video of this happening:

4.  Perhaps bad luck more than anything else but two cars ended up in the same grid slot as a result of having exactly the same time in qualifying.  Have fun viewing this bizarre bug:

I may add one or two other bugs later but for the moment, I think it's obvious issues 1 and 2 remain a real frustration in terms of have a fully enjoyable multi-player experience.  In general, F1 2017 is fun to play and the extra skill involved from using medium traction rewarding to master.  But it's constantly being spoiled by bugs that have now been evident since release without any genuine sign of being fixed/explained.

Hopefully we can see some progress soon but, in the meantime, if you have any advice on how we can avoid them just now, can you please share?




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Comments

  • TonyRacingSocksTonyRacingSocks Member New Car Smell
    I should add we use the Sim damage setting.
  • Razer12hopRazer12hop Member Wheel Nut

    The following can be added to the list.

    - If you create the lobby you get lag spikes when people leave. This is game breaking bug. Non of my friends want to host a game anymore.

    - Short qualify of 12min is to short. Make at least a extra medium option of 16 min.

    - Safety car in general is a mess. More like a danger car and you are lucky that you survived the safety car without damage or penalty.

    - All the minor weird desync bugs. Like the start lights that go out are not in sync for all the players. A bug like this in a racing game. Dafuq man.


    In general the multiplayer part of this game is still a bloody mess.


    @jennyannem and @f1support Any information about the future of the multiplayer part?

  • SmiXSmiX Member New Car Smell
    - All the minor weird desync bugs. Like the start lights that go out are not in sync for all the players. A bug like this in a racing game. Dafuq man.
    I agree completely. Btw. this was already in 2016 and all starts in our league were pretty dangerous, as somebody has green, somebody don't and than somebody is ghosted and somebody don't ... Many crashes on starts for nothing.
  • LUISMARINSLUISMARINS Member New Car Smell
    Safety car never gets deployed in Multiplayer sessions on ps4. (Custom lobby)
    Last night, on my league racing, three cars crashed and destroyed on first lap and didnt deploy it.
    Hope you fix it on the next patch. Cheers.
  • bigfguybigfguy Member New Car Smell
    Safety car never gets deployed in Multiplayer sessions on ps4. (Custom lobby)
    Last night, on my league racing, three cars crashed and destroyed on first lap and didnt deploy it.
    Hope you fix it on the next patch. Cheers.
    yep, agree with this!! it's been this way too long!!
  • Stuart949Stuart949 Member Wheel Nut
    Agreed, online is just simply not good enough at the moment. Lag, desynced cars being on different places on other driver's screens, frame drops...I could go on forever. The game connectivity has been very fragile for the duration of this game (even a dyer 2016 was better) but it has most definitely worsened in patch 1.10 and 1.8. The best its been was whatever it was before 1.8 on Xbox. It was fragile, but the season opener in my AOR league has had the best connection yet. There needs to be something done to improve this game's connection. I genuinely can't believe that after all these years, we still have a completely unstable online. It seems as if just not enough resources get thrown into the game's multiplayer in improving its connection and all the focus is put on career. Very annoying.
  • LSKoneLSKone Member New Car Smell
    edited November 7
    While I agree that all those minor desync bugs are still there, they are not as often encountered as they used to be imo. It's a p2p connection, and those will always bring problems. Codies need to develop a dedicated Server application, and it will solve many connection related issues, if it is well made.

    @F1Support
    One thing I would like to add is a weird AI behavior that I saw in the last weeks:

    PC, version 1.10, online multiplayer championship, classic cars, 6 Players + 12 AI Opponents, 
    75% difficulty, last time encountered on Track: Spa, dry.
    When going into battle with one (or more) AI Cars, I noticed that the AI can be extremely aggressive from time to time, especially when they are in a better car. It's difficult to explain, but I try. 
    Example: AI car is trying to overtake on a straight but ultimately is too slow. Normal behavior would be to brake and prevent any damage, fall a lil behind and try at the next possible occasion. But in Multiplayer they do not always do this. They do not brake and thus create (and take!) damage from crashing into the player car. So they rather crash into the player's car and risk terminal damage on their own car (yes, this actually happened) than brake and fall behind. No real driver would do this. Except maybe Maldonado.
    I'd maybe expect this aggressive behavior on the higher difficulty settings, but not on lousy 75%.

    Another example:



    Lets say that the blue car is clearly(!) ahead and leading, the red car should brake to prevent the blue car from driving into it, because the blue car is ahead and therefore follows the ideal racing line. Now in Multiplayer races the red car rarely brakes and thus creates a crash, as explained above.

    Not sure if this is just bad AI or some bad Network problem or both. Either way, AI seems way too aggressive on the 75% difficulty in Multiplayer. I'd also like to add that they never do this in Singleplayer, or at least I never experienced them doing this in Singleplayer.
  • Akkan74Akkan74 Member New Car Smell

    But this is the same experience i saw in 85% of YouTube videos for none AI player. Most of them are really aggressive and take the position of the red car to block the AI.

    As seen many times in F1 the blue car can break earlier, go on the inner side and re-attack at the end of the curve.

    For me the damage model isn't hard enough. Both player and AI risk to much and have to much contact over a race.

  • Da1reDa1re Member New Car Smell
    This game is in a really poor state especially online (offline would be fine if teammate bug would be fixed).
    Still seeing a lot of issues in the league i participate in, especially disconnects (with several issues if someone rejoins again right afterwards in a race), crash to desktop in full qualifying, green flag bug (maybe related to formation lap?) and lots of "minilags", with cars jumping slightly forward / backwards all the time. We didn't have too many safety cars either ... think only once in 5x 50% races (there were much more incidents where a sc would have been justified)

    It really makes me think quitting league racing as it is right now, because it's just a big lottery if you can have an atleast halfway clean lobby (but still others players could suffer). Even F1 2016 was more stable on multiplayer mode the same time last year (but still had the tyre wear bug ...).
  • LopenskyLopensky Member New Car Smell
    I would have limited myself to say that the game is a mess, but the reality is that codemasters seem to have not given the least attention to providing multiplayer players with a reliable, stable or at least worthy of being called such online

    They have obviously decided that it is not important to waste resources for that.

    And the fact that at a distance of months from the exit (keep in mind that the online player is one of the most loyal, among the first to buy the game, among other things at full price) still have not done anything to resolve the situation.
    I honestly lost both hope and patience.

    They took 70 euros when the game came out, but what they sold us is not a full and functioning game.


  • LopenskyLopensky Member New Car Smell
    Yesterday in our top league race almost ALL drivers suffered of drammatic loss of framerate during Q sessione, and for a lot of them the problem persisted during the whole 100% race.

    Three drivers lost connection to the lobby with 2 of them forced out since the crash happened just at the end of Q session. This kind of problems is a daily mess with F1 2017 since we host races  4 days a week and we see this problem almost always.

    Nonsense it's the only word for the SC of this game. In the last race we ran it crashed into a driver forcing it out of the race. Nothing more to say about that.

    We still have problems with lobby stability, lots of lag and disconnections, and after 1.10 still have some desync problems.

    We still have the audio bug that causes the game not render the engine's sound at race start (have to press option but a lot of people don't know that).

    And so on.. you know. The list is sooo long...
  • Razer12hopRazer12hop Member Wheel Nut
    @f1support It looks like you are active again. Could you please take a look at this threat. The biggest issues in multiplayer are described in here. Could you also give some information in what issues you are looking in.
  • dfg15dfg15 Member New Car Smell
    edited November 14
    They are done fixing the multiplayer part of the game. Check out this post from F1 Support 
    taken from this thread http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/59913/xbox-one-x-multiplayer-screentears

    F1Support
     said:
    Hello @dazza83, in multiplayer there are lots of things happening that just don't occur in single player so it's probably that something in there is a bit inefficient and causes other things to run more slowly all of which you see as screen tearing. I've made myself a note to look in to this but unfortunately we won't be able to do anything for F1 2017.
  • F1SupportF1Support Member, Codemasters Co-Driver
    Lets start with the first post by TonyRacingSocks.

    1) I can't see the Twitch videos but if people have bad connection quality there isn't a lot we can do I'm afraid. That you're seeing those icons means the game isn't going to perform well, that's why they're there. Do you get the disconnects if those players are not present in the session? Does the person who hosts have a good connection (i.e. lots of bandwidth)?

    2) See http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/comment/315123/#Comment_315123

    3) Again I can't see the video but that sounds like a bug with the engineer unless you're sure your car did have damage.

    4) Two cars getting the same time and spawning on each other, that's going to be a fun one to try to reproduce thanks. I'll take a look in to that.

  • F1SupportF1Support Member, Codemasters Co-Driver
    Next up Razer12hop who I presume is on Xbox One judging by the issues he's seeing.

    Lag spikes on Xbox One are caused by the system. I don't understand it fully but basically when someone joins or leaves the console stalls the game while it does some stuff to do with players. While it's doing that our game isn't running. There is nothing we can do to mitigate that. Best solution would be to have someone host who then spectates.

    I will pass the feedback about 12 minutes being too short for qualifying on to the designers.

    You'll have to be more specific about the issues you're seeing with the SC. I've commented on other threads about it driving and getting in the way while waiting for the leader. See http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/comment/314930/#Comment_314930.

    Again with the start lights being out of sync, I need a bit more information. I've not seen anyone else mention this so was it a one off, do you always see it?



  • F1SupportF1Support Member, Codemasters Co-Driver
    LSKone I'd like to see a video of the AI issue if you have one please. It's hard to understand what's going on despite a good description.

    Da1re what issues are you seeing when people rejoin?


    Lopensky I've made a new thread about low framerate in qualifying. I'd appreciate if you could spare a few minutes to provide some information about that. See http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/59932/multiplayer-low-framerate-during-qualifying-race

    dfg15 said:
    They are done fixing the multiplayer part of the game. Check out this post from F1 Support 
    taken from this thread http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/59913/xbox-one-x-multiplayer-screentears

    F1Support
     said:
    Hello @dazza83, in multiplayer there are lots of things happening that just don't occur in single player so it's probably that something in there is a bit inefficient and causes other things to run more slowly all of which you see as screen tearing. I've made myself a note to look in to this but unfortunately we won't be able to do anything for F1 2017.
    That comment was specifically in relation to that thread. That's not a promise either way but screen tearing requires optimisation and that's something we don't do very much of after launch because it's fraught with risk.
  • SmiXSmiX Member New Car Smell
    F1Support said:
    ... Lag spikes on Xbox One are caused by the system. I don't understand it fully but basically when someone joins or leaves the console stalls the game while it does some stuff to do with players. While it's doing that our game isn't running. There is nothing we can do to mitigate that. Best solution would be to have someone host who then spectates. ...
    But you know how the system is working from the beginning of the development, so it's not an acceptable excuse. If the game is not able to do handle that, and you know that, you should find a way how to handle it flawlessly, if it is really not possible, as you are saying, why there are not a dedicated servers to handle that???
    I believe all the time, the game is using ~99% of power for visuals and some physics so there is no more power for being a host server ... It would fix many of the bugs you have on the list for multiplayer like desynced racers, desynced starting lights, lag spikes, yellow flags which are visible only by some players, it would also lower network usage as only server will be connected so players will have a much better network connection and because that much better experience etc etc etc ... I know it is not a very probable change for 2017, anyway, this is not an acceptable excuse ...

    Offtopic note @F1Support : Thanks for changing your policy of silence to be more open with us, I really appreciate it! :-)
  • Razer12hopRazer12hop Member Wheel Nut
    F1Support said:
    Next up Razer12hop who I presume is on Xbox One judging by the issues he's seeing.

    Lag spikes on Xbox One are caused by the system. I don't understand it fully but basically when someone joins or leaves the console stalls the game while it does some stuff to do with players. While it's doing that our game isn't running. There is nothing we can do to mitigate that. Best solution would be to have someone host who then spectates.

    I will pass the feedback about 12 minutes being too short for qualifying on to the designers.

    You'll have to be more specific about the issues you're seeing with the SC. I've commented on other threads about it driving and getting in the way while waiting for the leader. See http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/comment/314930/#Comment_314930.

    Again with the start lights being out of sync, I need a bit more information. I've not seen anyone else mention this so was it a one off, do you always see it?



    @f1support

    I play on the pc.

    The lag spikes have been described many times now. When people leave the lobby the host of the lobby gets lag spikes. The lag spikes gets worse and worse until the game is unplayable. Don't play stupid on this one.

    Be more specific about the safety car issues. Dude play the game for your self. Overall the safety car is just a disaster. Again don't play stupid on this one. Found this clip on youtube. This is just one of the weird safety car bullshit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1Tm0ljKpMY


    The start lights is just a example of the many weird desync issues we have. The start lights not being in sync with everybody on the start have been mentioned by multiple people on this forum. Again don't play stupid and play the game for your self.


    Start acting a bit mature towards the community.




  • F1SupportF1Support Member, Codemasters Co-Driver
    SmiX said:
    But you know how the system is working from the beginning of the development, so it's not an acceptable excuse. If the game is not able to do handle that, and you know that, you should find a way how to handle it flawlessly, if it is really not possible, as you are saying, why there are not a dedicated servers to handle that???
    I think you've misunderstood, our game runs on top of their OS, if their OS stops our game running then we can't do anything about that.

    How many times have you seen the SC spawn on the track Razer12hop?
  • SmiXSmiX Member New Car Smell
    F1Support said:
    I think you've misunderstood, our game runs on top of their OS, if their OS stops our game running then we can't do anything about that.
    I understand very well, but you know that from the beginning that this is going to happen, so you have to count with that when it is happening. While dedicated servers will handle that without a problem.
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