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GRID Autosport - An honest review

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A very minor point, but:

"flicker in night races with smoke shadows turned on and such"

This is an NVidia SLI issue that has been fixed by the July 3rd patch.

 

As nVidia stated on their website-its an engine issue and needs addressing from dev side. Thus it has been patched by CM. You just contradicted yourself. I my post the link if you like. Don't think it's necessary though, right? :)

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MarkVenom said:
@dirt3joe: 'my guess is it is the console games that susidise the PC dev, not the other way round. If the sales were on PC alone the game would never happen. What is surprising IMO is not that CM caters so well for the PC, but why they bother at all. If you are a business you go where the money is.'

Complete BS btw. Please read, consider, understand and learn:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/analyst-pc-gaming-now-brings-in-more-money-than-console-gaming/
Just proved him right with that link.
LOL you obviously cannot read. But meh.....whatever. If you are referring to the genre scenario making up the numbers, then this only means one thing: If someone dared to produce a decent enough racing game that PC players would want to own (actually would feel compelled to won) then this would change quite significantly. Consoles are NOT where the money is right now. Period.

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flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.

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flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.
Video games are ridiculous value for money (IMO anyway). Even if you buy them at launch full price.

I will get 100+ hours out of GA, which works out to about 35p/hour.

Compare that with a DVD (about 150p/hour if you watch x3), going to the movies (about 400p/hour) or a night out on the lash (about 600p/hour).

Plus if I wanted to I could sell for 1/3 of its original value after using, which pushes it down to about 20p/hour.

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MarkVenom said:
Sorry mate, please understand that I am glad you are satisfied, but also puzzled. How can you NOT expect or demand a game better than a game 6 years old-made by the same people? This simply does not make sense. Have you been so disillusioned to not think it would be possible?
I truly mean no offence, but come on man-seriously?

P.S.: The handling and physics are not normal btw....they are plain wrong!
I mostly agree with your review, and definitely with some ridiculous understeer appearing from nowhere at just the wrong time - got it on the Golf and lola as if I was in a full blown sim.

I agree with Flowa and had already decided that if the driving physics were half decent I'd tolerate the mass of other shortcomings.
We can say what we say because the team at CM is very much different than the original team for Grid 1, so do not have the same expectations of them . . .

You said; "the same people", and that is wrong . . same company, but not same people . .
~O)

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MarkVenom said:

Original GRID was a game that defined the whole generation. The half of original dev team is probably gone :), so what did you expect? 

And i like handling, after G2, it feels nice. And i've learned how to deal with little bit of understeer.

What I expected was Grid 1 in a new look with multiplayer co-op ala co-op championships in the F1 series of games-not a game that has a sha;low gameplay and non-rewarding feel. Its not fun if there is no purpose. A lot of features were stripped from single player also and the cockpit view is a joke in comparison to ANY other game let alone their OWN work from 6 years ago. If they cannot deliver that they may as well close doors. Sorry dude.
Hey mark why is it if someone has a different opinion than you its like u try and say there opinion is wrong . BTW your thread should be titled grid autosport my opinion not an honest review. All u do is troll every thread and tell people there wrong or if they happen to agree with you there all right to you, but u obviously like confrontation. Otherwise you would put your tail between your legs and just disappear. Believe us we wouldn't miss your negativity. Have a good day , even tho I'm sure were not finished here.
Give the man due credit . . .even my ego isn't big enough to waste all that time typing a review, lol . .

Although in my reckoning writing such a review is on a par with the guy who never stops telling us how much he dislikes a particular woman . .any woman I dislike wouldn't get two words wasted on her, lol . . .peace.
~O)

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I feel very fortunate, we are now a few weeks in, a whole heap of bugs have appeared, but I love the game . .bugs and all.

I don't need to over think it, don't need to be cynical, don't feel the need to qualify or quantify why I like it, because when I jump in a car and drive it brings a smile to my face . . .and you can't pick the bones out of that one . . .
~O)

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Couldn't agree more Cap, IMO (not that it counts for much) anyone who prefers G2 to GAS handling has got to be an arcade fan, the other way roung they'll be more of a sim fan...

This game is much more sim orientated, unlike G2 which was pure arcade and nothing else.

I'll bet half the haters have never actually driven a car at or close to the limits of grip, those who HAVE know cars react quite a bit like the cars in GAS do.

In the real world you can't enter a hairpin @ over 100mph and flick the nose in and expect to make the corner, you'd end up in the barriers or the weeds.

What GAS does do is emulate a real world RACING experience where CONTROL is everything not sliding about all over the place.....

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Couldn't agree more Cap, IMO (not that it counts for much) anyone who prefers G2 to GAS handling has got to be an arcade fan, the other way roung they'll be more of a sim fan...

This game is much more sim orientated, unlike G2 which was pure arcade and nothing else.

I'll bet half the haters have never actually driven a car at or close to the limits of grip, those who HAVE know cars react quite a bit like the cars in GAS do.

In the real world you can't enter a hairpin @ over 100mph and flick the nose in and expect to make the corner, you'd end up in the barriers or the weeds.

What GAS does do is emulate a real world RACING experience where CONTROL is everything not sliding about all over the place.....
i'm not so interested in whether it models real world. But IMO it should :

i) Provide handling that helps us to have a close racing experience.

ii) Provide progressive handling so people can learn more skills over time.

iii) Provide a range of cars with different handling characteristics to master.

It does all of this IMO. After 20+ hours I am still learning things about the handling that is making me better. And I am still discovering cars (liek the oxbow) that have very different handling characteristics that throw me completely and I have to learn almost from scratch. This is the way it should be.

I think this game is a good successor to grid.

But there are things to improve. One is the menu system, which is awful.

The other is the save game bug. This doesn't affect me as currently I only run custom cup. But it is terrible that this same issue (if not the same cause) has turned up on this CM game. I hope that someone gets a rocket over this, because it really is unnacceptable. I think though that they know this and will do everything to fix asap. But quick fixes are not possible on consoles unfortunately. I hope for the future they implement some sort of backup facility for the save game. I would have thought this would have been done last time ... ?

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Couldn't agree more Cap, IMO (not that it counts for much) anyone who prefers G2 to GAS handling has got to be an arcade fan, the other way roung they'll be more of a sim fan...

This game is much more sim orientated, unlike G2 which was pure arcade and nothing else.

I'll bet half the haters have never actually driven a car at or close to the limits of grip, those who HAVE know cars react quite a bit like the cars in GAS do.

In the real world you can't enter a hairpin @ over 100mph and flick the nose in and expect to make the corner, you'd end up in the barriers or the weeds.

What GAS does do is emulate a real world RACING experience where CONTROL is everything not sliding about all over the place.....

I haven't read the thread but are there actually people saying they think Grid 2's handling is better, I can't believe that after all the complaint G2 got! Personally I don't think there is much difference between the physics of the 3 they are all just on different spectrums of the same foundation.

Grid 1 is the middle ground with the cars being extremely floaty/weightless, you needed to brake a little but for the most part you could powerslide the cars around hairpins at insane speeds.

Grid 2 obviously was closer to an arcade game with the optimum method with most cars for speed being to drift, however the cars had far more weight to them so you needed more skill/control to do it right. Personally I fell it is the hardest of the 3 to be properly fast at because putting a car exactly where you want and hitting apexes is much much harder to do when you are drifting and your course is set much earlier in the corner.

Grid: Autosport takes the best bits from both and is more of a sim, it has the weight of Grid 2 but the more realistic approach of Grid 1 and takes it further and from the 45+ hrs I've played so far completely nullifies drifting/powerslides and makes them slower than driving properly.

The graphics complaints are silly, the cockpit view isn't even that bad, you want bad go have a look at the standard cars in GT5/6 and then we'll talk, other than having no mirrors it's perfectly functional. That aside what racing game out now looks better? I would argue that it looks better than Forza 5, sure the cars aren't close but the environments are a pretty big step up when maxed, you've got 3D crowds, volumetric fog, smoke shadows, 3D trees that have defined leaves from a distance, proper smoke and particle clouds rather than the joke stuff in Forza and a full damage system on both cars and environment, really there isn't much to complain about IMO.

It might not be a sim but there still isn't a single game which simulates actual racing (not driving) as well as Grid, it's just unfortunate that they pissed so many fans off when they went OTT with their Americanising crap as now they get a constant stream of hate whether warranted or not.

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dirt3joe said:
Couldn't agree more Cap, IMO (not that it counts for much) anyone who prefers G2 to GAS handling has got to be an arcade fan, the other way roung they'll be more of a sim fan...

This game is much more sim orientated, unlike G2 which was pure arcade and nothing else.

I'll bet half the haters have never actually driven a car at or close to the limits of grip, those who HAVE know cars react quite a bit like the cars in GAS do.

In the real world you can't enter a hairpin @ over 100mph and flick the nose in and expect to make the corner, you'd end up in the barriers or the weeds.

What GAS does do is emulate a real world RACING experience where CONTROL is everything not sliding about all over the place.....
i'm not so interested in whether it models real world. But IMO it should :

i) Provide handling that helps us to have a close racing experience.

ii) Provide progressive handling so people can learn more skills over time.

iii) Provide a range of cars with different handling characteristics to master.

It does all of this IMO. After 20+ hours I am still learning things about the handling that is making me better. And I am still discovering cars (liek the oxbow) that have very different handling characteristics that throw me completely and I have to learn almost from scratch. This is the way it should be.

I think this game is a good successor to grid.

But there are things to improve. One is the menu system, which is awful.

The other is the save game bug. This doesn't affect me as currently I only run custom cup. But it is terrible that this same issue (if not the same cause) has turned up on this CM game. I hope that someone gets a rocket over this, because it really is unnacceptable. I think though that they know this and will do everything to fix asap. But quick fixes are not possible on consoles unfortunately. I hope for the future they implement some sort of backup facility for the save game. I would have thought this would have been done last time ... ?

Couldn't agree more Cap, IMO (not that it counts for much) anyone who prefers G2 to GAS handling has got to be an arcade fan, the other way roung they'll be more of a sim fan...

This game is much more sim orientated, unlike G2 which was pure arcade and nothing else.

I'll bet half the haters have never actually driven a car at or close to the limits of grip, those who HAVE know cars react quite a bit like the cars in GAS do.

In the real world you can't enter a hairpin @ over 100mph and flick the nose in and expect to make the corner, you'd end up in the barriers or the weeds.

What GAS does do is emulate a real world RACING experience where CONTROL is everything not sliding about all over the place.....

I haven't read the thread but are there actually people saying they think Grid 2's handling is better, I can't believe that after all the complaint G2 got! Personally I don't think there is much difference between the physics of the 3 they are all just on different spectrums of the same foundation.

Grid 1 is the middle ground with the cars being extremely floaty/weightless, you needed to brake a little but for the most part you could powerslide the cars around hairpins at insane speeds.

Grid 2 obviously was closer to an arcade game with the optimum method with most cars for speed being to drift, however the cars had far more weight to them so you needed more skill/control to do it right. Personally I fell it is the hardest of the 3 to be properly fast at because putting a car exactly where you want and hitting apexes is much much harder to do when you are drifting and your course is set much earlier in the corner.

Grid: Autosport takes the best bits from both and is more of a sim, it has the weight of Grid 2 but the more realistic approach of Grid 1 and takes it further and from the 45+ hrs I've played so far completely nullifies drifting/powerslides and makes them slower than driving properly.

The graphics complaints are silly, the cockpit view isn't even that bad, you want bad go have a look at the standard cars in GT5/6 and then we'll talk, other than having no mirrors it's perfectly functional. That aside what racing game out now looks better? I would argue that it looks better than Forza 5, sure the cars aren't close but the environments are a pretty big step up when maxed, you've got 3D crowds, volumetric fog, smoke shadows, 3D trees that have defined leaves from a distance, proper smoke and particle clouds rather than the joke stuff in Forza and a full damage system on both cars and environment, really there isn't much to complain about IMO.

It might not be a sim but there still isn't a single game which simulates actual racing (not driving) as well as Grid, it's just unfortunate that they pissed so many fans off when they went OTT with their Americanising crap as now they get a constant stream of hate whether warranted or not.

For me all of that does a satisfactory job of summing up all that needs summing up . . . of course this is me saying that because I agree with all of these comments.

Only in online games do we get the tweezers out and examine every little scrap, it's almost as if a mass neurosis becomes activated, bit like my EX wife looking for every little continuity fault in TV programs.

Fortunately the, "Autosport Feedback" thread has all the well thought out, sensible, informed comments for Loore to obtain all the information needed to improve matters . .
~O)

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dirt3joe said:
flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.
Video games are ridiculous value for money (IMO anyway). Even if you buy them at launch full price.

I will get 100+ hours out of GA, which works out to about 35p/hour.

Compare that with a DVD (about 150p/hour if you watch x3), going to the movies (about 400p/hour) or a night out on the lash (about 600p/hour).

Plus if I wanted to I could sell for 1/3 of its original value after using, which pushes it down to about 20p/hour.
Agreed I don't know how many I've put into Autosport thus far but I've been playing it constantly since I got my copy and I know through Origin I've put at least over 300 hours of play into the Mass Effect Trilogy.so if you find a game that's really worth it it's definitely worth doing. At the moment I would say for me Autosport is definetely one of those as I can see myself coming back and playing through career again. But everyone has there own opinion

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dirt3joe said:
flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.
Video games are ridiculous value for money (IMO anyway). Even if you buy them at launch full price.

I will get 100+ hours out of GA, which works out to about 35p/hour.

Compare that with a DVD (about 150p/hour if you watch x3), going to the movies (about 400p/hour) or a night out on the lash (about 600p/hour).

Plus if I wanted to I could sell for 1/3 of its original value after using, which pushes it down to about 20p/hour.
Agreed I don't know how many I've put into Autosport thus far but I've been playing it constantly since I got my copy and I know through Origin I've put at least over 300 hours of play into the Mass Effect Trilogy.so if you find a game that's really worth it it's definitely worth doing. At the moment I would say for me Autosport is definetely one of those as I can see myself coming back and playing through career again. But everyone has there own opinion
It's as if so many want a written guarantee ? . .there are none for tomorrow so how the hell can anyone get one for one year's time ?

I have spent nearly £300 on Warframe but divide that by the hours played and we are talking pennies, it's all relative . . .

I'm having great fun in both SP and MP so there will always be a game for me to enjoy. Of course I'd like certain things to be sorted out but the driving is so good I can forgive one hell of a lot . . .and I promised Loore that if he came up trumps with that he'll get no hard time from me.
There are definitely some understeer glitches but what a tiny fault, I mean, who the hell makes an issue about something so slight ?

Like so many I have been into CM racers since the Toca days and I can tell, from many posts, that the old guard is more than basically happy . . .this driving model is carrying the game forward. OK, we have a glitch in the corrupt saves, but is the impatience at such a level all the toys get thrown out of the pram, meaning we have a lot of petulant little souls here ?

~O)

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dirt3joe said:
flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.
Video games are ridiculous value for money (IMO anyway). Even if you buy them at launch full price.

I will get 100+ hours out of GA, which works out to about 35p/hour.

Compare that with a DVD (about 150p/hour if you watch x3), going to the movies (about 400p/hour) or a night out on the lash (about 600p/hour).

Plus if I wanted to I could sell for 1/3 of its original value after using, which pushes it down to about 20p/hour.
Agreed I don't know how many I've put into Autosport thus far but I've been playing it constantly since I got my copy and I know through Origin I've put at least over 300 hours of play into the Mass Effect Trilogy.so if you find a game that's really worth it it's definitely worth doing. At the moment I would say for me Autosport is definetely one of those as I can see myself coming back and playing through career again. But everyone has there own opinion
It's as if so many want a written guarantee ? . .there are none for tomorrow so how the hell can anyone get one for one year's time ?

I have spent nearly £300 on Warframe but divide that by the hours played and we are talking pennies, it's all relative . . .

I'm having great fun in both SP and MP so there will always be a game for me to enjoy. Of course I'd like certain things to be sorted out but the driving is so good I can forgive one hell of a lot . . .and I promised Loore that if he came up trumps with that he'll get no hard time from me.
There are definitely some understeer glitches but what a tiny fault, I mean, who the hell makes an issue about something so slight ?

Like so many I have been into CM racers since the Toca days and I can tell, from many posts, that the old guard is more than basically happy . . .this driving model is carrying the game forward. OK, we have a glitch in the corrupt saves, but is the impatience at such a level all the toys get thrown out of the pram, meaning we have a lot of petulant little souls here ?

~O)
Indeed I got into CM's racers around then as well and enjoyed playing all of the race driver games. I don't have the originaltoca's anymore  as they no longer work. Having said that though I think I still have my Playstation copy of race Driver 1 but I don't have them on PC anymore I do have and still play all 3 Grid games though as I've got careers on the go on all 3 and I'm enjoying them.Was planning on finishing Autosport first before going back through the others.

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MarkVenom said:
MarkVenom said:
@dirt3joe: 'my guess is it is the console games that susidise the PC dev, not the other way round. If the sales were on PC alone the game would never happen. What is surprising IMO is not that CM caters so well for the PC, but why they bother at all. If you are a business you go where the money is.'

Complete BS btw. Please read, consider, understand and learn:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/analyst-pc-gaming-now-brings-in-more-money-than-console-gaming/
Just proved him right with that link.
LOL you obviously cannot read. But meh.....whatever. If you are referring to the genre scenario making up the numbers, then this only means one thing: If someone dared to produce a decent enough racing game that PC players would want to own (actually would feel compelled to won) then this would change quite significantly. Consoles are NOT where the money is right now. Period.
"The growth in PC spending is being driven heavily by the explosive growth in MOBAs like League of Legends andDota 2, Cole said. That certainly gels with what we found in our recent Steam Gauge analysis, which shows Dota 2dominating in a number of gameplay statistics."

"The PC gaming market is also dominated by older titles; Cole said there wasn't a single title released in 2013 that made the top 20 list of most played games for that year, though 2014 releases like DayZRust, andHearthstone have managed to crack the popularity lists. PC gaming revenue growth has been especially strong in Europe and among free-to-play titles, Cole said."

I can read just fine. You destroyed your own argument, you're just such a blind PC fanboy that you're only seeing what you want to see, instead of what's actually there. PC market is a different market than console market. Most games do better on consoles, esp when first released.

The same gametypes (MMO, Strategy etc) do better on PC as usual.

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MarkVenom said:
MarkVenom said:
@dirt3joe: 'my guess is it is the console games that susidise the PC dev, not the other way round. If the sales were on PC alone the game would never happen. What is surprising IMO is not that CM caters so well for the PC, but why they bother at all. If you are a business you go where the money is.'

Complete BS btw. Please read, consider, understand and learn:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/analyst-pc-gaming-now-brings-in-more-money-than-console-gaming/
Just proved him right with that link.
LOL you obviously cannot read. But meh.....whatever. If you are referring to the genre scenario making up the numbers, then this only means one thing: If someone dared to produce a decent enough racing game that PC players would want to own (actually would feel compelled to won) then this would change quite significantly. Consoles are NOT where the money is right now. Period.
"The growth in PC spending is being driven heavily by the explosive growth in MOBAs like League of Legends andDota 2, Cole said. That certainly gels with what we found in our recent Steam Gauge analysis, which shows Dota 2dominating in a number of gameplay statistics."

"The PC gaming market is also dominated by older titles; Cole said there wasn't a single title released in 2013 that made the top 20 list of most played games for that year, though 2014 releases like DayZRust, andHearthstone have managed to crack the popularity lists. PC gaming revenue growth has been especially strong in Europe and among free-to-play titles, Cole said."

I can read just fine. You destroyed your own argument, you're just such a blind PC fanboy that you're only seeing what you want to see, instead of what's actually there. PC market is a different market than console market. Most games do better on consoles, esp when first released.

The same gametypes (MMO, Strategy etc) do better on PC as usual.
Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)

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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.

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dirt3joe said:
flash , you are not right that GAS is not game for full price man! Its great game with way more content compare to Grid 1 (tracks , cars etc) similar handking and physics etc... In my opinion its the best simcade in PC ....
We miss text chat and specating mode but these features are under consideration for codies ... 
I would strongly reccomended to you.. ;;)
ahaha nothing worth full price, the game worth only if online "survive" after the first year.
Next year, summer 2015 we will see if online is still populated... if not, and GA die short like grid2 is just a money waste.

Even if it's dying off by then, paying €50 for nearly a year's entertainment isn't worth it to you? Tough crowd.
Video games are ridiculous value for money (IMO anyway). Even if you buy them at launch full price.

I will get 100+ hours out of GA, which works out to about 35p/hour.

Compare that with a DVD (about 150p/hour if you watch x3), going to the movies (about 400p/hour) or a night out on the lash (about 600p/hour).

Plus if I wanted to I could sell for 1/3 of its original value after using, which pushes it down to about 20p/hour.
Agreed I don't know how many I've put into Autosport thus far but I've been playing it constantly since I got my copy and I know through Origin I've put at least over 300 hours of play into the Mass Effect Trilogy.so if you find a game that's really worth it it's definitely worth doing. At the moment I would say for me Autosport is definetely one of those as I can see myself coming back and playing through career again. But everyone has there own opinion
It's as if so many want a written guarantee ? . .there are none for tomorrow so how the hell can anyone get one for one year's time ?

I have spent nearly £300 on Warframe but divide that by the hours played and we are talking pennies, it's all relative . . .

I'm having great fun in both SP and MP so there will always be a game for me to enjoy. Of course I'd like certain things to be sorted out but the driving is so good I can forgive one hell of a lot . . .and I promised Loore that if he came up trumps with that he'll get no hard time from me.
There are definitely some understeer glitches but what a tiny fault, I mean, who the hell makes an issue about something so slight ?

Like so many I have been into CM racers since the Toca days and I can tell, from many posts, that the old guard is more than basically happy . . .this driving model is carrying the game forward. OK, we have a glitch in the corrupt saves, but is the impatience at such a level all the toys get thrown out of the pram, meaning we have a lot of petulant little souls here ?

~O)
Indeed I got into CM's racers around then as well and enjoyed playing all of the race driver games. I don't have the originaltoca's anymore  as they no longer work. Having said that though I think I still have my Playstation copy of race Driver 1 but I don't have them on PC anymore I do have and still play all 3 Grid games though as I've got careers on the go on all 3 and I'm enjoying them.Was planning on finishing Autosport first before going back through the others.
I found my original PS1 copy of Toca 1 the other day in the old hard plastic CD cases, I wonder where I put it now!

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MarkVenom said:
MarkVenom said:
@dirt3joe: 'my guess is it is the console games that susidise the PC dev, not the other way round. If the sales were on PC alone the game would never happen. What is surprising IMO is not that CM caters so well for the PC, but why they bother at all. If you are a business you go where the money is.'

Complete BS btw. Please read, consider, understand and learn:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/analyst-pc-gaming-now-brings-in-more-money-than-console-gaming/
Just proved him right with that link.
LOL you obviously cannot read. But meh.....whatever. If you are referring to the genre scenario making up the numbers, then this only means one thing: If someone dared to produce a decent enough racing game that PC players would want to own (actually would feel compelled to won) then this would change quite significantly. Consoles are NOT where the money is right now. Period.
"The growth in PC spending is being driven heavily by the explosive growth in MOBAs like League of Legends andDota 2, Cole said. That certainly gels with what we found in our recent Steam Gauge analysis, which shows Dota 2dominating in a number of gameplay statistics."

"The PC gaming market is also dominated by older titles; Cole said there wasn't a single title released in 2013 that made the top 20 list of most played games for that year, though 2014 releases like DayZRust, andHearthstone have managed to crack the popularity lists. PC gaming revenue growth has been especially strong in Europe and among free-to-play titles, Cole said."

I can read just fine. You destroyed your own argument, you're just such a blind PC fanboy that you're only seeing what you want to see, instead of what's actually there. PC market is a different market than console market. Most games do better on consoles, esp when first released.

The same gametypes (MMO, Strategy etc) do better on PC as usual.
Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)

Next-gen consoles are about the same power as todays mid-range PC's which is mainly attributed to the huge increases in wattage requirements of todays hardware, hence why they use mobile parts and really is the first time the consoles have not been cutting edge to some extent. Like for like comparing to mobile PC solutions they are probably about the same but obviously mobile has never been as powerful as a desktop.

Pre-built PC sales are declining all the time but that is things like Dell, HP etc. who are losing market share to things like smartphones and tablets and the people who only bought them for websurfing, emails etc. now have better options. The gaming market on the other hand is rising, with profits constantly increasing and number of steam/origin etc. users also increasing.

At the moment we get absolutely no sales numbers of digital downloads so it's impossible to compare numbers to consoles and only the publishers will know the actual figures but it's obviously pretty healthy given how nearly every game these days comes to PC sooner or later. So any sales figures you see are boxed PC copies and I'm always surprised how many they actually sell, personally I've not bought a single physical game since moving to PC nor will I.

Also console gamers can't say anything about Dota 2 being the most played game or any others for that matter when the top console game by a huge margin player count wise is always the latest COD and all the others since MW1 are in the top 20, great variety there!! Not only that I could pull out the top 10 on both consoles without even looking or thinking because it would just be COD, FIFA, MADDEN, FORZA, HALO, GT, GTA etc. :| .

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MarkVenom said:
@dirt3joe: 'my guess is it is the console games that susidise the PC dev, not the other way round. If the sales were on PC alone the game would never happen. What is surprising IMO is not that CM caters so well for the PC, but why they bother at all. If you are a business you go where the money is.'

Complete BS btw. Please read, consider, understand and learn:

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/analyst-pc-gaming-now-brings-in-more-money-than-console-gaming/
Anyway, re this, the point I made was regarding Grid 2 sales figures and CM, not PCs and software houses in general. With this comment you turned it into a general PC vs. consoles debate.

If you have any more accurate figures (Grid 2) on these please let us know. In the past many people have indicated that the chart figures are inaccurate, but I don't know where to get better.

PC's may well outsell consoles for certain types of game. PC gamers have particular profiles, as do consoles owners. My guess is PC owners mostly prefer sims and console owners mostly prefer arcade games.

The more detailed sims seem to appear only on PC, which tells you enough. 

There is no doubt that the type of game a developer chooses to make (sim, arcade, simcade) plus the platforms it chooses to release them on (PC/consoles) is a fundamental part of the business plan. It's not something that would be changed lightly.

I think there must be additional benefits to developing on PC, not just the sales addition. Some of this might include things like more open tools, variety of tools, lack of dependence on hardware developer, scalable hardware, lack of generation transition points etc that mean that the PC brings more to the overall development program than the console platforms, which is why many businesses with relatively low PC sales persist with it.


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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.
I vaguely recall conversations about cell technology with one of my nephews (programmer at Creative Assembly) many years back, don't remember too much but 6 to 8 processors were mentioned for this technology, making it extremely powerful.

I also remember the imbalances between games makers and graphic cards makers, causing a lack of optomization in the PC field which would suggest that until recently the PC actually being seen to be more powerful had been just a dream for the future . . .

I had heard that console sales are down, and even though overall there is a slump in PC sales more and more people are looking at the PC as the way to go . . .that said, I imagine the slump in console sales will still equate to greater profits than from the PC.
~O)

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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.
I vaguely recall conversations about cell technology with one of my nephews (programmer at Creative Assembly) many years back, don't remember too much but 6 to 8 processors were mentioned for this technology, making it extremely powerful.

I also remember the imbalances between games makers and graphic cards makers, causing a lack of optomization in the PC field which would suggest that until recently the PC actually being seen to be more powerful had been just a dream for the future . . .

I had heard that console sales are down, and even though overall there is a slump in PC sales more and more people are looking at the PC as the way to go . . .that said, I imagine the slump in console sales will still equate to greater profits than from the PC.
~O)
I agree that's why I chose to go with a new PC earlier this year over choosing to get a PS4 XB1  and I'm glad I did given that there hasn't been that many good games for the new comsoles yet. Asied from the new Fifa 14 I don't think there is much around right now that's not really been shared with the PC anyway and Fifa 15 will include EA's new ignite engine on the PC version anyway. Aside from F|ifa and watchdogs I'm not suer that really anything else has really shown up yet. I suspect I will eventually look at adding the PS4 but for now I'll stick with my trusty PS3 on that side of things.

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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.
I vaguely recall conversations about cell technology with one of my nephews (programmer at Creative Assembly) many years back, don't remember too much but 6 to 8 processors were mentioned for this technology, making it extremely powerful.

I also remember the imbalances between games makers and graphic cards makers, causing a lack of optomization in the PC field which would suggest that until recently the PC actually being seen to be more powerful had been just a dream for the future . . .

I had heard that console sales are down, and even though overall there is a slump in PC sales more and more people are looking at the PC as the way to go . . .that said, I imagine the slump in console sales will still equate to greater profits than from the PC.
~O)
The ram limitations of the PS3 made up for the cell.

PC is still less optimized than console.

Console sales were down because PS4 and XBO were approaching, the PS4 has sold more consoles in less time than the Wii, and the XBO has vastly outsold the 360 in the same amount of time. 

In other words, console sales being down are about the same as saying PC gaming is dying back in 1994.

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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.
I vaguely recall conversations about cell technology with one of my nephews (programmer at Creative Assembly) many years back, don't remember too much but 6 to 8 processors were mentioned for this technology, making it extremely powerful.

I also remember the imbalances between games makers and graphic cards makers, causing a lack of optomization in the PC field which would suggest that until recently the PC actually being seen to be more powerful had been just a dream for the future . . .

I had heard that console sales are down, and even though overall there is a slump in PC sales more and more people are looking at the PC as the way to go . . .that said, I imagine the slump in console sales will still equate to greater profits than from the PC.
~O)
PC hardware isn't fixed like consoles. IIRC the 360 has a very PC like hardware. The Sony has this multi cell architecture, which made it a very different platform to work on optimise compared with the 360 and PC. This has changed I think in PS4 and Xbox 1, where the archs are both similar and both are more similar to PC. This should help developers a lot in producing code and hopefully for us get better games IF the devs keep the profits/team sizes the same. Probably in this world economic climate though it will just be looked on as an opportunity to reduce costs.

I own a PS3 - not a PS3 fanboy, but it is convenient for me. But in the future I think I want to move to PC because I want to take the games further and love the mods that guys like Hoonhead do. There are a whole range of mods like any car any track on Dirt3 which you can use to squeeze an extra 20% out of the game if on the PC.

In general I think console sales are down. I think for many reasons. Partly because for the average fan one or two racing games are enough. So you pick up those games early on in the console cycle and then dont buy any more unless they can offer you something significant over what you already have. The casual driving buyer is like this. PC's don't have the generational gap that consoles do. That said, quality always sells. Look at GTAV. That was last gen and the sales have (and still) are massive (edit : to go along with the no doubt massive dev costs).

For me I love playing the CM games, so the market analysis is more for figuring out whether I will be getting more of them or not. I will buy games and dlc to support future dev, and prefer this to crowdfunding. I don't really want sim games - there are several available. I prefer the simcade mix that cm does, and I think it would be a big loss if it disappeared.

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Is this one of those; "my pecker is bigger than yours . . .", type arguments, lol . .

I know little about these arguments but I have heard that the rise in PC gfx card power has pushed it ahead of consoles, even the next gen ones.
It's not always easy to know who to believe because most reviewers are out and out liars owing to all the backhanders they take, but PC sales have been down, although no info to confirm that. that has happened in the gaming rig sector where many console owners not wishing to be left behind are buying the immensely superior graphical power of the PC.

So many opinions trying to pass as fact means the majority of posts become subjective, not a good way to reach an objective conclusion . . .same goes for magazine review articles . . .more tea ?
~O)
PC is, and always has been capable of more graphically. That isn't something new. But the fact remains, most of PC gamings revenue comes from older games and FTP games. In fact a majority of PC players don't have PC's that would out power the PS4 currently. Gaming PC's are a niche Market. Console is the market where all the "now" money is. It's been that way since the 90s. The sooner people accept that PC and console aren't even the same market, similar to how handhelds and console aren't the same market, the better off we'll all be.
I vaguely recall conversations about cell technology with one of my nephews (programmer at Creative Assembly) many years back, don't remember too much but 6 to 8 processors were mentioned for this technology, making it extremely powerful.

I also remember the imbalances between games makers and graphic cards makers, causing a lack of optomization in the PC field which would suggest that until recently the PC actually being seen to be more powerful had been just a dream for the future . . .

I had heard that console sales are down, and even though overall there is a slump in PC sales more and more people are looking at the PC as the way to go . . .that said, I imagine the slump in console sales will still equate to greater profits than from the PC.
~O)
The ram limitations of the PS3 made up for the cell.

PC is still less optimized than console.

Console sales were down because PS4 and XBO were approaching, the PS4 has sold more consoles in less time than the Wii, and the XBO has vastly outsold the 360 in the same amount of time. 

In other words, console sales being down are about the same as saying PC gaming is dying back in 1994.
There is a lot of conjecture concerning numbers of this and that, and all is a waste of time because none of them are going out of business any time soon.

Another of my nephews has PC and 2 different consoles . . .more money than sense in my opinion, buying 3 versions of the same game . .
~O)

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