The Cheat Thread

[Kakkela 3]

KevM said:

Oh, Sorry....                            

What is your problem?

[KevM 44]

Night Night Kakkela

Give some thought to the Leaderboard thing I mentioned, we'll all talk in the morning :)

[JZStudios 631]

Uhhh, so... cheating.... that's uhhh... um... a hell of a thing right?..... maybe ..... ?

[dgeesi0 305]

things are so strange on here at the moment.its almost like inception.

i don't use many set ups as if im honest i don't think they are the actual set ups most use.that's why i wish the select players run set up and copy would of been implemented or match players set up. anyone can upload a useless set up to steam.i tried many and a lot are poor.at least with match set ups to times you know that's what they actually used.

but.... i did try the other day porks findland bmw set up on iso and i beat kevs time first run. the car felt pretty decent.wasnt pushing just casual run.

i still think the base defaults with practice are actually better for 99 percent of drivers.

[Kakkela 3]

Yeah and setups are heavily dependant on spesific driving styles. Porks setups suits him and some people can and some can't adapt to them.

It's same in any other sim or real life. I recently got into Lotus 79 in iRacing and it can be setup quite differently for different styles.

[shadow118 18]

RinusRally said:

Didzis said:

RinusRally said:

and the people who still play with 270 wheels they need to upgrade because a used G27 is very cheap, and a T150 or a T300/TX is very affordable nowdays.

Where I live, the G27 still goes for 150-200€, or more (that's for a used one). I don't know what's your income, but for me that is not cheap. A Logitech Formula Force RX for 25€ is cheap. 

Accuforce/.Direct drive 1200 - 1700. Fanatec full equipment go for 1200+. T300/TX + T3pa or T3pa-pro is around 450. Used G27 170-200 euro. 
So used G27 which has 900 degrees is very cheapish. 

But I understand now why Pork, Gheed, Kakalla and any other hotlapper don't want locked 900/1080+softlock or any other I suggested to make the game more authentic. They are afraid to lose their reputation, lazy to adapt how "real" rallying or racing is. etc. They just want arcade steering/handling in a simulation environment.  

Compared to the Accuforce and Fanatec setups it is cheaper, but for a lot of people even those 200€ is a lot of money, so they can't "just upgrade"

[MrDeap 12]

Kakkela said:

Yeah and setups are heavily dependant on spesific driving styles. Porks setups suits him and some people can and some can't adapt to them.

It's same in any other sim or real life. I recently got into Lotus 79 in iRacing and it can be setup quite differently for different styles.

I think you should wait for @KevM impression...

[dynt 0]

I think there is a major misconception here, a badly setup car  isn't goanna set ultimate times no matter how adapted it is to your driving style.

The car is either set up correctly or it isn't you can tweak a number of parameters in order help your individual likes or dislikes but some of the setups I have tried posted on the workshop are so far off the mark its crazy.

[KevM 44]

dgeesi0 said:

but.... i did try the other day porks findland bmw set up on iso and i beat kevs time first run. the car felt pretty decent.wasnt pushing just casual run.

Of course you would!  I was running shorter gear ratios & driving casually too.  Porkys ratios are longer, so car is faster, but the handling is a joke.  Horrific bounce, 2 degrees camber, no turn in, a fully open diff and nearly full rear brake bias to provoke oversteer??  It's like the setup has been designed for totally different basic physics rules?
I'll do my ratios and attack the stage, the time will be faster the my previous no doubt

[PaloSamo 0]

I've run out of popcorn so here's my thoughts so far. It makes me wonder how a random setup can result in top times. Especially a bad one (at least that's what KevM says). Either it is a badly implemented idea of setting a rally car in a rally game or it is just a video game with its limitations. Although I've played a rally game with proper setups before ;) Am I missing something here? 

[gheeD 15]

When I was driving that stage I did the video of I attempted to set it up so the car would absorp the jumps better, but all the usual changes that would help seemed to not do anything or make it even worse. I got fed up with trying to set the car up and tried porks setup. (which i know to be a bit on the twitchy side for me but driveable) Anyways after I took the car out for a test it was immediately behaving better over the jumps. I think it was like 2nd or 3rd try with the setup that i got my run on the video.


Its not different physics, its a different driving style. If you cant adapt to it doesnt mean something fishy is going on...

[KevM 44]

A good driver can adapt to ferocious understeer, poor diff & brake settings, but nothing a driver can do, can curb chronic suspension bounce.  You can't drive a car that's not in contact with the road & you certainly can't be faster in one!!  But then, there's the concrete G Ball to consider in all of this.  

So, adaption & ability...  that's a shallow, worn out arguement gheeD my friend!  

Your video opened a can of worms.  I have tried to leave this topic many times now, but Kakkela keeps inviting me to probe the whole facts surrounding this, & the more I look, the worse it gets for the credibility of 'Top Times'.

[gheeD 15]

Its old and boring, but its the 100% factual truth.

[xkevlarx 0]

I thought the g-ball stuff was put to rest already when gheed posted the run where it actually moved like it should. Those posts were deleted from the original thread for some reason.

Anyway Twin Peaks has a new season coming up, but I don't think it will surpass this thread.

[dgeesi0 305]

hahaha waits for it in reverse may make more sense :D

[KevM 44]

100% factual truth, but yet a really simple computer program to display the physical forces in the game 'is lying', and a great adaptive driver can run like for like setup but stop a car rebounding or flying.  

Riiiiiiiiight.  Internet logic FTW

Maybe someone should teach that anti-fly driving technique to Alonso, he'd have been fine last weekend....

[KevM 44]

xkevlarx said:

I thought the g-ball stuff was put to rest already when gheed posted the run where it actually moved like it should. Those posts were deleted from the original thread for some reason.

Anyway Twin Peaks has a new season coming up, but I don't think it will surpass this thread.

That replay never happened Kevlar.

[gheeD 15]

Of course it did, but it was deleted when skiddy was cleaning the other topic. Its right here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uiG96NytA5I

[bogani 756]

Kinda sad that the hunt for best time makes the game look so silly. Hardly resemble rally anymore.

What's even more sad is that this thread is the most active on the forum :/

[KevM 44]

You had to work hard there gheeD, looks quite different to your original run.  Keep going like that, and you'll soon be able to take the stabilisers off completely ;)

Anyway, I just set an easy Top 10 with my own setup, with longer gearing dgeesi0.  Took 7 secs off my previous replay run, it was never going to be that fast as the setup was my Welsh one copied and tweaked.

[Kakkela 3]

RinusRally said:

It's all clear to me now. These elite that are named the best of Dirt Rally aren't worthy. Better take off the vip-banners cause they doesn't replicate the sim-crowd; they are hotlappers which exploit every arcadish feature for their own ego's. If the time is not fast 1st place or top 3. They just alt-F4 the game so the time won't be uploaded, they practice every daily and weekly. They exploit shortcuts, exterior cams, low dofs, low/no ffb, etc. 

Take a famous Dirt Rally Streamer as example since he switched to 270 degrees he is faster and better than ever., but does it simulate real life rally? No It's just an way to exploit fast times, boost your ego and make the Dirt Rally community think you are awesome, but you are not. 

I am a little bit done this elite that appear to be the very best. Not giving arguments, only crying against my suggestion to create a more sim-like environment for the game. Features, and other stuff.  

After all these video's on youtube and streams on twitch are good marketing for Dirt Rally, lol. 

 :D Ok, why should people not use setups that work in this GAME? Only thing pork, me or gheed are using is fixed degrees of rotation and even that is only unrealistic for pork. I use 540 wich is normal for many modern Rally cars.
If game is not punishing enough for damage and abusing of suspension it's no reason to yell at us.

[KevM 44]

We better not talk about PageUp PageUp PageUp then...  :#

[bogani 756]

Speaking of telemetry. A good while back @Porkhammer posted a video of Germany stage in the M3 where there is a haybale chicane just in the beginning. The speed which he took that chicane looked absolutely ridiculous. Would have loved to see that with telemetry just for the fun of it.

I def don't think there is any cheating involved, but I do think the physics engine has it's flawes. You can overdrive the cars and get away with stuff that just shouldn't be possible.

[Porkhammer 78]

bogani said:

Speaking of telemetry. A good while back @Porkhammer posted a video of Germany stage in the M3 where there is a haybale chicane just in the beginning. The speed which he took that chicane looked absolutely ridiculous.

Surely that must have been with V1 physics, because it's impossible with V2.

[dgeesi0 305]

RinusRally said:

It's all clear to me now. These elite that are named the best of Dirt Rally aren't worthy. Better take off the vip-banners cause they doesn't replicate the sim-crowd; they are hotlappers which exploit every arcadish feature for their own ego's. If the time is not fast 1st place or top 3. They just alt-F4 the game so the time won't be uploaded, they practice every daily and weekly. They exploit shortcuts, exterior cams, low dofs, low/no ffb, etc. 

Take a famous Dirt Rally Streamer as example since he switched to 270 degrees he is faster and better than ever., but does it simulate real life rally? No It's just an way to exploit fast times, boost your ego and make the Dirt Rally community think you are awesome, but you are not. 

I am a little bit done this elite that appear to be the very best. Not giving arguments, only crying against my suggestion to create a more sim-like environment for the game. Features, and other stuff.  

After all these video's on youtube and streams on twitch are good marketing for Dirt Rally, lol. 

edit: Take the flat tyre-discussion as example. Tyres are fine. Nothing wrong with them, but because this elite find them too precious Codemasters listened to them and upped the strength of the tyres. The elite just don't know how to properly adjust the dampers and suspension. 

  you coming across as you are very bitter. sad really. especially when some you are referring to promote and put so much effort into getting the game noticed that you are taking the low punches to try and validate your own beliefs.

i don't get why you keep trying to go against real life vs a game ? it does puzzle me. forget that let your brain ease off. its a game no game is the same as real life.some doing the top times are real rally drivers or driven those cars ingame or even the same tracks.

i for instance have driven 6 or 7 of the cars in this game.even owned some of them.do i compare this game to real life =no.

the real stinger is some of the times set on certain tracks arent even the best times.that may seem odd but for eg other night i sat with a beer in hand driving one handed was  going to record it with the subaru because someone was whining about default set ups. i managed a 6th in world with beer in hand lol.with default set up.

some people are just quicker. some also will be cheaters but if you cant prove that just dont even go there you will end up just ranting at everything and seen as a ass.

the best thing you can do other than try and force anything is just present what you think in a decent manner. if you think someone cheats get proof or present it to the devs. they check the times and other stuff. i know i send in times daily. probably 30 screenshots this week to be examined.