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FIX THE MONEY!!...please 8P

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@Loore and  the backroom guys.

cmon guys, you gotta fix this....its becoming a pain.

I havent hit the wall yet [the money wall i mean] but i easily could run myself outta cash and go and have to go do something more boring instead.

case in point:
im doing the ol racenet challenge in the c63.....each time i complete, i get, i dunno, bout 10k reward money.....but next race, repairs cost me up to 20k!..money dwindling away see?
ok, i could go do some other challenge or some online stuff in a rental to earn some cash...but...but no...i dont want to [right now]

I see where maybe you wanted to push us with this...out of one discipline, into another that pays, but repairs are not as high...so we play more aspects of your game.
but you shouldnt really push us around like that...not in a racer like grid.

i cant see why else you would incur this type of penalty on us, especially when the races are clean!! [bar the odd over-rev maybe 8P]

so please, pretty please, with sugar on top...fix the bleeping money!

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yeee.. another patch, another disappointment. It cant be too hard to apply the lazy fix and just change 1-2 numbers till they actually make a difference on how much damage you take between a clean race and a total wreckage.

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Yeah, it's ridiculous. Reading the patchnotes...rare, sporadically, potentially... obviously stuff that surely should get fixed but appears sometimes, so not really pressing... THIS IS RUINING THE GAME!
I wish had this game in physical form so I could throw it in the garbage... cause this I'll probably do in the very near future. There's no point in playing online. I HAVE to do all the challenges to finance the coming 50 races. Buying a new car? Upgrade it? From what money?!
At least just fix it to 50% of the income or whatever, as long as you found a new 'system' to rip off our earnings.

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the thing is repair costs increase with UPGRADES, and with CAR COST. i only have this issue with touring cars. if you think this isnt realistic, think about real racing. you start with alot of money, you buy a car (costs money), and more often then not, you earn less then the cost to keep the car running at its best, which is why people are so crazy about sponsorships. if you run cleanly, and race with a high dificulty bonus, you will break even or make money. if you run all assists on and play pinball, you lose money. which driver are you?

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Except it doesn't work like that ingame. Currently it doesn't matter how good you race, you are still borderline on making money for MP.

There needs to be an adjustment that's for sure.

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Kaerar said:
Except it doesn't work like that ingame. Currently it doesn't matter how good you race, you are still borderline on making money for MP.

There needs to be an adjustment that's for sure.
sorry but this must be an issue for your platform. i race on xbox 360, and the only car i lose money while racing is my cat C touring car. max upgraded. run without upgrades or run in a different class, and i keep making heeps of money, was near half a mill multiple times before buying more cars and slots. increase difficulty, add AIs, set AIs to very hard, pick my car and invite some friends, and i only ever lose out if we all kill each other in the first corner

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Yeah, sorry to disappoint you, but as Goonertez already said (and I still know from GRID, he's a pretty good and clean driver), Repair Costs are way higher than any possible income.
So this has nothing to do with realism...
Let's break it down...
I win a race in touring with full driver field  and there's a basic 12000 Cr (I think).
Aids pretty much all disabled (except ABS), adds another 20-30%
'Car experience' (my Civic is at 50), so around 35% I think.
That makes ~19-20k Credits.
Sponsorships? Yeah, here is where they should come in place to compensate my costs. But a.t.m. I get around 2-300Cr at best per race. Sponsors in this state are nothing but a joke. I have to do 20 or 30 Races to gain as much money, as I would with one single racenetchallenge (and I mean AFTER you got the bonus for platinum or whatever).
Imagine you were racing real and someone approached you, offering you $50 to place his big fat logo on the hood of your car. I wouldn't know if to laugh or to cry.
And please remember, those are perfect conditions. Winning a race in a fully packed field. Most of the time you have less people around, meaning less money to earn but same repair costs. So I don't even enter events with less than 6 people caouse my money would last for only another 10 races and I'm broke.

Now to the costs... at current state, my Civic is at ~77% after EVERY race, and I hardly touch anyone or anything. That makes 21k Cr per race. See the problem? Even IF I win the race, I lose only a little at best. No chance at all to gain the slightest bit of money with that car. I can hit any wall and still it's 77% afterwards.
So, I am a very clean driver, have all assists off (except ABS, 2%, that probably makes the difference ^^), don't hit anyone and am pretty good at avoiding being hit. Sometimes I manage to win, most times I end up in the top 3 or 4. Now, which driver am I? The one that sould be losing money in every single race? Well, according to CM I obviously am.


So yeah, thinking about real racing, this isn't realistic at all. In a real race, you would have decent costs for doing a clean race and heavy costs for crashes. BUT they have sponsors, that actually pay them money. And I'm not talking about 500Cr per race.

Comparing this with the BTCC, with 10(?) Events and 3 Races per Event, like GRID they would have to pay over 600k just to maintain the car over the season. YES, motorsport is expensive, but I have my doubts, that 'basic' touring cars are THAT expensive. As in DTM I assume, the engine has to last a whole season. Here I pay 7k every race to fix that engine. It's touring cars, not prototypes, so here are tuned retail-engines in use. For 7k I could probably place a new one in the car every race. Suspension? I doubt they replace it after every race. Check it, clean it, lubricate it, done. No 7k. I COULD imagine 10-15k for maintenance (including personnel) after every weekend, so we would end with 5k per race. Now THAT would be a figure I could live with. You end up last, you earn nothing, too bad. You are 5th to the bottom and even, great. Better results? Money! That's how it should be.

And in the end, this is NOT real life, this is a game. Here I have NO choice but to live with these horrendous costs and no chance to do anything about it. It's not an 'oh, I'm broke, so I should stop racing', no, it's a racing game, this is the only purpose. I want to drive cars on identical level against good drivers to compete, nothing more. I don't want to win cause I have a better engine, I don't want to lose, cause mine is worse.

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Its not just the money it's also how much "damage" you got even if you dont hit something or have to much overrev the engine it is still 10% down every race.
I dont mind the amount of money if you have only 2 or 3% damage after a race without collisions.
Then you can do 3 to 4 races before you really need to repair and earn some money for it.
Thats a better solution i think then lower the cost for repairs or maybe lower both a bit.

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to each their own, our experienced appear to be quite different. oh and your little full cost bit for a real btcc team. top teams report they spend up to 400k pounds (around $680k usd) a year for EACH CAR. looking at the total season repair costs, those are a little high to be concidered an average cost to run a car, but its not outragous by any means. like i said, to each their own. i prefer the more realistic approach, as i havent built the funds to launch a real life motor-racing career. a game such as grid allows me to compete against drivers around the world, and helps keep me busy when i cant get real world seat time. you guys complain all you want, ill keep giving cm props for how they run the game, and my only dissapointment will be if they fail to fix such bugs as the corrupt gamesaves

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Real life scenarios don't mean anything in this game. The wear and tear on these cars after just a hundred miles is absurd. Buy a half million dollar car, run 20 races, then come back with your experience.

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TUSMBOX said:
Real life scenarios don't mean anything in this game. The wear and tear on these cars after just a hundred miles is absurd. Buy a half million dollar car, run 20 races, then come back with your experience.
whats the point, 1. corrupted gamesave last week so sidelined, 2. i already own at least one car for the classes i race, which is mostly touring and "tuner" classes. if you can find a car you want me to test and report back, say what it is and ill gladly get to it once microsoft approves CMs patch

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be nice to see @Loore replying to this....is it in the fix  list or not....s'all we wanna know.

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alexPSCE said:
TUSMBOX said:
Real life scenarios don't mean anything in this game. The wear and tear on these cars after just a hundred miles is absurd. Buy a half million dollar car, run 20 races, then come back with your experience.
whats the point, 1. corrupted gamesave last week so sidelined, 2. i already own at least one car for the classes i race, which is mostly touring and "tuner" classes. if you can find a car you want me to test and report back, say what it is and ill gladly get to it once microsoft approves CMs patch
Lola B12/80

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TUSMBOX said:
alexPSCE said:
TUSMBOX said:
Real life scenarios don't mean anything in this game. The wear and tear on these cars after just a hundred miles is absurd. Buy a half million dollar car, run 20 races, then come back with your experience.
whats the point, 1. corrupted gamesave last week so sidelined, 2. i already own at least one car for the classes i race, which is mostly touring and "tuner" classes. if you can find a car you want me to test and report back, say what it is and ill gladly get to it once microsoft approves CMs patch
Lola B12/80
dont think im to far off money wise, ill get on it as soon as i can

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I found the costs getting stupid with just the Endurace GT Group 1 Nissan GT-R 35. It's crazy to have a $1500 repair bill for a car that lost 2% on each repair group. I only made about 12K from the race and that car CAN'T have sponsors at all. The sponsor payout's are about a factor of 10 or even 100 out compared to what's needed to survive in MP.

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Heres a coupla questions, that id like to know the answers to:

Why has this repairing thing been introduced?
Id guess its an attempt to put off the online 'rammer' as theyre sometimes known...price em out of the game yes?...no?

assuming the above is yes, how much to repair a car thats been driven like the so called 'rammer'.
if i drive a clean race and my car drops to 80%, and i get charged up to 50,000 to repair.....what would your rammers figures be?

20% and 200,000?
or
78% and 60,000?
or what?

At the expense of binning my class C Tourer, i may have to put this to the test later.

@Loore, cmon man, what you say bout al this?

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Goonertez said:
@Loore, cmon man, what you say bout al this?
I hate to be the one but he already said they are "looking" into it a hundret times. As vague as that is by now its pretty clear he CANT say anything else on that matter.

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sucr4m said:
Goonertez said:
@Loore, cmon man, what you say bout al this?
I hate to be the one but he already said they are "looking" into it a hundret times. As vague as that is by now its pretty clear he CANT say anything else on that matter.
Yes.

This is the first time they have put it in the system as far as I am aware.

It is a good idea but needs tweaking from the posts. You can argue that they can figure out the system in advance, but it is hard without testing with a real world number of users. That way you get to see all the issues, as well as how people try to game the system (people are smart and will figure out ways).

If you alter it too fast without thinking carefully all you do is introduce other annoying features. So time needs to be taken in order to analyse it to alter it to produce the best system possible. Otherwise you just get back to square one.

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sucr4m said:
Goonertez said:
@Loore, cmon man, what you say bout al this?
I hate to be the one but he already said they are "looking" into it a hundret times. As vague as that is by now its pretty clear he CANT say anything else on that matter.
yes of course you are correct, but id like to know the current status of this issue.
weve had patches since i last saw this mentioned ffs!

i do hope this hasnt slipped into the wont fix pile 8(

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Goonertez said:
Heres a coupla questions, that id like to know the answers to:

Why has this repairing thing been introduced?
Id guess its an attempt to put off the online 'rammer' as theyre sometimes known...price em out of the game yes?...no?

assuming the above is yes, how much to repair a car thats been driven like the so called 'rammer'.
if i drive a clean race and my car drops to 80%, and i get charged up to 50,000 to repair.....what would your rammers figures be?

20% and 200,000?
or
78% and 60,000?
or what?

At the expense of binning my class C Tourer, i may have to put this to the test later.

@Loore, cmon man, what you say bout al this?
I think a good solution would be that the car takes minimal damage (maybe 3-5% max at high car levels) if the race is clean, but should then take more wear damage if you smash it up (regardless of whether it's your fault or not).

Last I got to my level 40 civic was taking about 15% wear per race when driving clean. I smashed it up a few times by accident and it took only 17-18%. So, yeah, with the current mechanic deliberately or accidentally damaging your car during a race does little as far as the end-condition of the car goes.

Now, if you were to drive a clean race at level 40 and take only 3% damage - no walls hit, minimal scrapes with other cars, no mechanical damage whatsoever - but then the next race you smashed a wall, messed up the steering column and the car took 15-20% wear as a result of that - would you agree that that would be fairer? There needs to be a big difference between accrued wear with regards to a race with no damage taken, versus one where the car is banged-up and heavily damaged. The car must be easier to maintain if it's looked after and currently that seems not to be the case.

Now, if that -was- the case, then yeah, let the costs be astronomical. By the very nature of having to pay $30K a race to fix their cars, the rammers/dirty drivers would quickly learn that they will be unable to race properly, whereas the people that race fair and manage mostly clean races will find themselves out of only perhaps $1-2K per race instead. Maybe that was the original idea Codemasters had. I give them kudos for attempting this regardless because it's not really been done before so yes, we have to acknowledge that perhaps it's not perfect and Codemasters can afford to learn and improve this in GAS.


I also expected wear to play a bigger part in performance. I honestly didn't notice any difference in car performance between 100% and 20%. 20% was around when I began to start races with a damaged engine. I did notice a few times before that the Civic was occasionally locking the diff up pretty badly on fast corners but I put that down to me just overshooting the corners ... I don't really 'feel' a difference in performance between no wear and heavy wear and in the end I've found out that when the car hits 0% condition it costs the same to repair regardless of whether it's level 10 or level 50.


Still, it's food for thought?

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A change to the repair costs are currently being tested our side and will hopefully go out alongside the new playlists rotations. All going to plan I'd hope this would go live next week (on PC) but that's always subject to change based on what comes up in testing.

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Loore said:
A change to the repair costs are currently being tested our side and will hopefully go out alongside the new playlists rotations. All going to plan I'd hope this would go live next week (on PC) but that's always subject to change based on what comes up in testing.
All I can say is....Awesome! :)

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@Kazzy

agree with all what ya say...and thanks for the damage feedback youve seen.

@Loore

Thats great news,, just the kind of update i needed on this grey, dank thursday...thx

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Goonertez said:


Thats great news,, just the kind of update i needed on this grey, dank thursday...thx
Move to holland no grey dark thursday here.   :D

ABout repair costs good news.  =D>

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How is it possible that this sort of issue happens and nobody noticed it before realease ?

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