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MTOJay said:
EDDSkitz said:
MTOJay said:
the start crowdfunding.

i am 100% positive that vr simracers would support that.

heck make a freaking vr dlc and make it 40$ i dont mind. i would be buying it in an instant if its properly supported.

there is no reason not to support it, all their games would benefit from them doing the work once for their "new" engine.

there has been demand since every codemasters release after dirt rally and yet they never did anything.

just do something and dont pretend that there wouldnt be demand. they playing the same record with the "we see if there is demand" they played with dirt4. there was demand, a lot of people wwant it, yet they never did anything.
I think the only thing you'll find that does is prove just how small of a market VR really is. 
i think the exact opposite would happen. in iracing about 10-20% are running vr exclusively. 

there are more vr headsets on the steam hardware survey then there are steering wheels. just to put it in perspective.

https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/steamcommunity/public/images/Steamworks/controller/ownership/German.jpg

i honestly have no idea why people who dont own vr are against it?! its not hurting you that other people has options. just as i want full vr support i think the same goes for full 3screen support. i want that everybody can enjoy it in the way he desires.

To be fair, triple screens have been around for almost a decade and it still has pretty much no support other than AC and iRacing. I mean overall, in all games. The most games do is allow you to place the hud elements on center screen.
Widescreen and ultrawidescreen isn't supported much either, but it has tended to create a shift from vert- FOV to horiz FOV so we can hack the sys files and .exe to try and get things working ourselves. And that's on monitors, which are already supported.
Fun fact, I still buy games and play them on triple monitor, even though they don't work properly, like DiRT titles. I still buy games and play them even if it doesn't support it at all like Yakuza 0.
VR right now is a burgeoning gimmick.

That also being said, you're taking that number of VR to steering wheel owners a little strangely.
1. not everyone who has VR will buy the game. This should be obvious. Same is true for people with steering wheels.
2. There's a lot of people even here on the forum that use KB+M of Xbox controller since they can't afford VR
3. Maybe this is just my logic, but how many people are really going to play DR2 with a VR headset and a Xbox controller, other than to check it out? So it seems like to me their market is really actually whittled down to the overlap of VR and steering wheel users, which is quite low. I don't know where you pulled that 10-20% of iRacing users, but even if that were true, think about the flipside. There's 80-90% of users that don't benefit from it at all.That's also within iRacings bizarre world where people spend thousands of dollars maxing out credit cards to build a Dominos Pizza Nascar rig in their basement. That's also on PC alone. Considering DR2's obvious move into consoles that makes the VR userbase absolutely minuscule, but they sure shout loud.

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JZStudios said:
EDDSkitz said:
MTOJay said:
the start crowdfunding.

i am 100% positive that vr simracers would support that.

heck make a freaking vr dlc and make it 40$ i dont mind. i would be buying it in an instant if its properly supported.

there is no reason not to support it, all their games would benefit from them doing the work once for their "new" engine.

there has been demand since every codemasters release after dirt rally and yet they never did anything.

just do something and dont pretend that there wouldnt be demand. they playing the same record with the "we see if there is demand" they played with dirt4. there was demand, a lot of people wwant it, yet they never did anything.
I think the only thing you'll find that does is prove just how small of a market VR really is. 
You can look up the Steam user charts and only like 2% of steam users have a VR headset.
JZStudios said:
EDDSkitz said:
MTOJay said:
the start crowdfunding.

i am 100% positive that vr simracers would support that.

heck make a freaking vr dlc and make it 40$ i dont mind. i would be buying it in an instant if its properly supported.

there is no reason not to support it, all their games would benefit from them doing the work once for their "new" engine.

there has been demand since every codemasters release after dirt rally and yet they never did anything.

just do something and dont pretend that there wouldnt be demand. they playing the same record with the "we see if there is demand" they played with dirt4. there was demand, a lot of people wwant it, yet they never did anything.
I think the only thing you'll find that does is prove just how small of a market VR really is. 
You can look up the Steam user charts and only like 2% of steam users have a VR headset.
You guys forget that PS4 has at least as much players as Steam... And i bet there are a lot of psvr users in DR.
Maybe codies should skip multimonitor, wheel and UDP support at launch, so they can focus their efforts on the Core game and possibly release the game before christmas... We can have these options which, by the way, are niche markets, in future dlc's.

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JZ maybe you should try VR. The difference between looking at a monitor or being IN the car is really adding a lot. That ix why VR users say 'no way back'.

I just hope dirt rally 2 is a better dirt rally 1 and not like dirt 4.
And I guess us VR users by now gave enough feedback to codemasters to decide VR needs to come. Maybe notvon launchdate but I hope they make it happen with first dlc.

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SamRWD said:
With mod support, I don't understand why games like AC can allow mods but other games don't allow it, can someone explain it like I'm 5?
First of all, mod support is basically exclusive for PC- so CM probably wants to develop features that will work cross platform. Then usually there is a fear that people will rather make mods than buy next installment (there are great examples proving that to be a bad idea- AC, or Arma being prime examples). Finally it depends on the game engine- some are more easy to modify assets and add new ones than other- it depends on how it was developed.

I just hope CM knows that community is really good with creating assets even for games that are not meant to be modded. With SDK great things could be done. We will still buy DLCs if the core game is good enough. 
AC doesn't have a new game though... and the one their working on is GT3 only as far as anyone knows. I won't buy it because I don't like the devs AND because I'm not that interested in GT3. Porting over to UE4 and having a better graphics engine is enough to buy my vote if it weren't for those 2 things.
People have also been begging for a new Arma or at least some major overhauls and optimizations for years. Seems to be working for Bohemia to just keep making DLC though.
Neither of your examples is a "prime example" since neither one has a new game and both are still developing and selling DLC, which people are buying. The mods have enabled the games to last as long as they have. Arma is also a fairly small community of dedicated players and it's AFAIK the only game like it so there's no alternative.
Unless you meant that AC and ARMA prove that idea wrong and your wording was just weird. XD

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VR guys. If you want VR to be added to the game I'd suggest making a poll thread and letting people vote on it here http://forums.codemasters.com/categories/suggestion-box

If your idea is as popular as you think it is, it'll soon have enough numbers to make Codies include it.


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Keko55 said:
That would be awesome that Porsche RWD. And the heavenly sound to which we are accustomed to CM. 
I still have to confirm, but I'd put money on it being the Tuthill Porsche that was scanned and then recorded for audio.
wonder if its the same as the one in WRC7                                                         

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versedi said:
bogani said:
I have to say, the purist in me is not very fond of a fantasy Camaro rally car, but I guess it could be.. fun?  :#

Dear god I hope that's not the one... That Camaro body style sucks. XD
Opassac said:
JZStudios said:
EDDSkitz said:
MTOJay said:
the start crowdfunding.

i am 100% positive that vr simracers would support that.

heck make a freaking vr dlc and make it 40$ i dont mind. i would be buying it in an instant if its properly supported.

there is no reason not to support it, all their games would benefit from them doing the work once for their "new" engine.

there has been demand since every codemasters release after dirt rally and yet they never did anything.

just do something and dont pretend that there wouldnt be demand. they playing the same record with the "we see if there is demand" they played with dirt4. there was demand, a lot of people wwant it, yet they never did anything.
I think the only thing you'll find that does is prove just how small of a market VR really is. 
You can look up the Steam user charts and only like 2% of steam users have a VR headset.
You guys forget that PS4 has at least as much players as Steam... And i bet there are a lot of psvr users in DR.
Maybe codies should skip multimonitor, wheel and UDP support at launch, so they can focus their efforts on the Core game and possibly release the game before christmas... We can have these options which, by the way, are niche markets, in future dlc's.
Codies doesn't have multimonitor support. Point invalidated.
Steering wheel support at its base is just controller configurations and button binding with some analog axis, which the Xbox and PS4 controllers also require. Point invalidated.
Steering wheels have FFB, which is kind of just a fancier version of rumble on controllers so... point invalidated.
UDP support I genuinely don't know nor frankly care about and I don't think anyone would really care if it left.
Even implementing all of these properly requires less work than implementing VR.

As for PS4, it does have a higher percentage since the headsets cheaper, but some of the sold headsets have also been hacked for PC use, so there's some variability.
https://blog.us.playstation.com/2018/08/16/celebrating-3-million-ps-vr-systems-sold/
So 3 million sold and...
https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/7/16745752/playstation-4-70-million-sales
70 million PS4's sold. That was also a report from 9 months ago, so I'm sure that numbers climbed. PSVR at that time was also only 2 million.
So... using basic math that number is SHOCKINGLY close to Steams user base at 2.857%
Let's assume that PS4 sales stopped at 70 million for 9 months and use the newer figure of 3 million PSVR units and we get 4.285% of users.

So at best, between PC and PS4 users the total userbase population is 6%.
SIX. Add in the Xbox which has no VR support and again that number drops.
In no fashion does including VR, unless it's exclusive, ever get you a bigger userbase than a potential of 6%, whereas just about everyone who DOES have VR also has a screen of some kind and can play games normally without it.

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Well well, I think some lobbying for VR has been done and Codies realizes the 'no way back'-feeling increasingly more sim racers get.
Anyway moving on for now, I am still very stoked about Argentina being a thing in DR2! And that leaked footage looks quite good, narrow, fast and slow, but always super precise on the hardest terrain. So, I took a real onboard and started some comparison:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g68fbvOQBLk

It seems to be indeed El Condor, found the corner at 0:30 (DR2) in the onboard at 0:28, and I followed it from there.
The road itself seems to be quite the accurate representation (I'm not 100% sure at some stretches though)
But they took some liberties in the surroundings, some rocks are higher, some places are rocks, where they shouldn't, etc. You can see yourself.
Maybe this is the way of avoiding legal stuff with FIA, since this is a WRC-Stage?
What this confirms is, that DR2 will indeed feature stages modelled after real roads! What this also means (if the "inacuracies" are deliberate), is that none of the DR stages can simply be copied over. They would at least need a minor rework, if FIA legal stuff is an issue, before we would see any as dlc.

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Jes_s christ. Almost 100 posts since I last visited this thread this morning and it’s nothing but bitching about VR support.

I got excited for nothing. Oh well.

Excuse me while I keep daydreaming about ripping Poland and Spain a new one with the Porsche 911 RGT rally car.

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JZ maybe you should try VR. The difference between looking at a monitor or being IN the car is really adding a lot. That ix why VR users say 'no way back'.

I just hope dirt rally 2 is a better dirt rally 1 and not like dirt 4.
And I guess us VR users by now gave enough feedback to codemasters to decide VR needs to come. Maybe notvon launchdate but I hope they make it happen with first dlc.
I've tried VR and I wasn't that impressed by it. It certainly didn't make me feel anything much more than my triple monitors do, except I don't look like an idiot sitting at my desk and my face doesn't get sweaty.
When I'm driving around I don't really look around the car that much, I look at the road ahead of me. Triple screens already enable me to look more into the apex of corners and pull the handbrake if I need to.
VR is neat, but it's way overhyped.

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VR is great and is the future in one form or other, but I would rather wait another 3 years when they will be comming for free with my cereal, or at least will cost 1/4th of the current price. And also when graphic cards will run it smoothly without requiring getting top models.

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dgeesi0 said:
Keko55 said:
That would be awesome that Porsche RWD. And the heavenly sound to which we are accustomed to CM. 
I still have to confirm, but I'd put money on it being the Tuthill Porsche that was scanned and then recorded for audio.
wonder if its the same as the one in WRC7                                                         
Which one does it have?  This one should be the 997 Tuthill.

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Add new locations, cars, improve physics, add features that everyone can use rather than move to implement VR for couple of people. 

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CMMcBabe said:
Dytut said:
Just as a side note, but is Stuart Ross making the soundtrack for DR 2.0? I loved the music from DR and hope the sequel can get the same vibe.
I didn't see anyone answer this, but Mr Ross is indeed making some new music (also, it is really good so far).
@CMMcBabe Oh, I'm really glad about it. I assume he also worked on the DR 2.0 trailer, since it does have similar vibe to early DR trailers.
PS: I also hope DR 2.0 will have a proper soundtrack release. DR actually had soundtrack available, but it was pulled from bandcamp soon after its release.

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Didzis said:
Well they've had some 4wd models in the past. But I guess RWD is more fun anyway. But still I'd imagine it'd have to sit in an RGT class or something similar.
There's plenty of 4WD stuff already, so some high powered modern RWD cars is a welcome addition. Would be great if there was also something like a BRZ, don't know what class that is (R3?), but modern, RWD and around 200 bhp
Yeah it’s an R3 car, but it’s the Toyota gt86 that’s used not the brz, and we know the history of Toyota and codemasters!
Didn't Dirtfish use BRZ's? But that could be a way around the whole Toyota thing.

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JZ maybe you should try VR. The difference between looking at a monitor or being IN the car is really adding a lot. That ix why VR users say 'no way back'.

I just hope dirt rally 2 is a better dirt rally 1 and not like dirt 4.
And I guess us VR users by now gave enough feedback to codemasters to decide VR needs to come. Maybe notvon launchdate but I hope they make it happen with first dlc.
Yeah, because that's why race teams with unlimited budgets use VR.... oh, wait... they don't. 

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Didzis said:
Didzis said:
Well they've had some 4wd models in the past. But I guess RWD is more fun anyway. But still I'd imagine it'd have to sit in an RGT class or something similar.
There's plenty of 4WD stuff already, so some high powered modern RWD cars is a welcome addition. Would be great if there was also something like a BRZ, don't know what class that is (R3?), but modern, RWD and around 200 bhp
Yeah it’s an R3 car, but it’s the Toyota gt86 that’s used not the brz, and we know the history of Toyota and codemasters!
Didn't Dirtfish use BRZ's? But that could be a way around the whole Toyota thing.
Could be, but I'm betting the BRZ specifically has Toyota involvement re licensing.

What they could do is get the Fiat 124, as it also fits in that class.  They are regulated by weight per KG.

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JZStudios said:
I've tried VR and I wasn't that impressed by it. It certainly didn't make me feel anything much more than my triple monitors do, except I don't look like an idiot sitting at my desk and my face doesn't get sweaty.
When I'm driving around I don't really look around the car that much, I look at the road ahead of me. Triple screens already enable me to look more into the apex of corners and pull the handbrake if I need to.
VR is neat, but it's way overhyped.
I really would like to know what kind of VR did you try, because claiming that triple screen setup is almost as good as VR in racing is kind of odd. The sens of speed and 'feeling' the car is just amazing. I have had both, I know that some doesn't get the same effect from VR, so it's maybe just something to you. 

I also don't get the hate towards asking for the VR support? As many of VR supporters said, we'll gladly pay for DLC if it's ever gonna be available, that means it can be done with separated budget so you would not miss anything important because of it? So why the hate?

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No real hate, however the people screaming for VR support are doing the following (not everyone)

1) demanding day 1 or no buy
2) stating how easy it is to implement
3) trying to state how widespread its use is.

None of those help the case.
Number 1 is fine, but we don't care to have it yelled every two posts.
Number 2 isn't true.
Number 3 also isn't true.

I get the impression that many would buy it as DLC, that's good.

But other than saying you would support it as DLC as it's not going to be day one, there isn't anything else to say right now.

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SkyRex said:

It seems to be indeed El Condor, found the corner at 0:30 (DR2) in the onboard at 0:28, and I followed it from there.
The road itself seems to be quite the accurate representation (I'm not 100% sure at some stretches though)
But they took some liberties in the surroundings, some rocks are higher, some places are rocks, where they shouldn't, etc. You can see yourself.
Maybe this is the way of avoiding legal stuff with FIA, since this is a WRC-Stage?
What this confirms is, that DR2 will indeed feature stages modelled after real roads! What this also means (if the "inacuracies" are deliberate), is that none of the DR stages can simply be copied over. They would at least need a minor rework, if FIA legal stuff is an issue, before we would see any as dlc.

I don't think this has anything to do with legal issues. Codemasters always takes liberties with the roads' surroundings. For example Spa-Francorchamps never looks like the real thing.

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http://forums.codemasters.com/discussion/140708/dirt-rally-2-0-vr-support

I made a poll regarding the VR support so this thread isn't filled with VR support discussion.

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Didzis said:
Didzis said:
Well they've had some 4wd models in the past. But I guess RWD is more fun anyway. But still I'd imagine it'd have to sit in an RGT class or something similar.
There's plenty of 4WD stuff already, so some high powered modern RWD cars is a welcome addition. Would be great if there was also something like a BRZ, don't know what class that is (R3?), but modern, RWD and around 200 bhp
Yeah it’s an R3 car, but it’s the Toyota gt86 that’s used not the brz, and we know the history of Toyota and codemasters!
Didn't Dirtfish use BRZ's? But that could be a way around the whole Toyota thing.
Could be, but I'm betting the BRZ specifically has Toyota involvement re licensing.

What they could do is get the Fiat 124, as it also fits in that class.  They are regulated by weight per KG.
How about the Scion FR-S? XD

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LOL

So, Scion is (was) the "trendy" brand of Toyota, think Lexus being the luxury version of Toyota.

The BRZ exists because it was part of the engine deal Subaru has with Toyota for the FRS.

It's basically (is) a Toyota with a Subaru engine.

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juu1ius said:
JZStudios said:
I've tried VR and I wasn't that impressed by it. It certainly didn't make me feel anything much more than my triple monitors do, except I don't look like an idiot sitting at my desk and my face doesn't get sweaty.
When I'm driving around I don't really look around the car that much, I look at the road ahead of me. Triple screens already enable me to look more into the apex of corners and pull the handbrake if I need to.
VR is neat, but it's way overhyped.
I really would like to know what kind of VR did you try, because claiming that triple screen setup is almost as good as VR in racing is kind of odd. The sens of speed and 'feeling' the car is just amazing. I have had both, I know that some doesn't get the same effect from VR, so it's maybe just something to you. 

I also don't get the hate towards asking for the VR support? As many of VR supporters said, we'll gladly pay for DLC if it's ever gonna be available, that means it can be done with separated budget so you would not miss anything important because of it? So why the hate?
Tried the Oculus CV1. Wasn't amazed. Like I said, it was neat, but using triple screen with proper FOV also allows for realistic sense of speed and the ability to look in corners. The "feeling" of the car is pretty close. I didn't get any sense of being teleported in the world or feeling like I was actually there or anything. It was neat, that is all.
I can also use those monitors for literally everything else. Even things that don't support triple monitor because I can always resort to single screen. It's also higher res and I can see more detail which is frankly more important.

I also don't hate VR, but the way you guys are "asking" cough demanding cough for it is something like this:
GIVE US OUR VR!
WE ARE THE MAJORITY!
YOUR COMPANY WILL FAIL!
ANYONE WHO DISAGREES IS BACKWARDS!
IT'S SO EASY TO DO!
IT'LL ONLY TAKE 2 WEEKS TO IMPLEMENT!
WE ARE THE FUTURE!
WE DEMAND IT!
Just gets annoying in our little forum to goof off and make crazy accusations and conclusions about the number 13. This is our fun place, our happy place, say, if you will, or safe space. Our DiRTy little safe place with a bunch of conspiracists.
And remember, you can't spell conspiracist without Racist.

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By opposition, I look for triple screen support in games, and if I can't find it, I might ask the devs, who usually don't respond and then I just play the game normally anyways.
To say you "Can't go back to normal gaming" is actually aggravating.
Fun fact, I've also got 5.1 set up, but I don't throw a huge hissy fit whenever something doesn't support surround sound (Which is a lot.) I just play the game in stereo. For example, the recent Burnout Paradise remaster. Did I say remaster? I meant retexture mod. Anyways the retexture only supports stereo, where the original supported surround through a config, which is just... not present on the remaster. So consoles get surround, but PC doesn't.. which is super dumb, considering it's literally the exact same engine and everything, they just didn't "port" over the config.

So to sum up, I have triple screens and surround, which frankly the majority of games don't support. Would I prefer the games to have full surround audio/visual support? Sure, hell yeah, but when they don't I don't flail around about it and shout about how many billions of people and dollars use them. I just play the damn game like normal.

Since it's also related, Nvidia made some technology that helps set up both VR and multi-screen setups since both require multiple game cameras, but I sure as hell don't expect any company to ever actually make use of it, or for it to catch on at all. Just like every other Nvidia technology besides tesselation.

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