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DiRTy Gossip about DIRT Rally Games

PJTierney

 

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dgeesi0 said:
why are people surprised about wrc 5 being arcade ?

its pretty simple most money comes from arcade type driving. they know they will make money and they will have to cause of the cost for the wrc license

why people think buisness people care what game you want. they care about money not if its arcade or not lol.
I don't think they're surprised that WRC 5 is an arcade game, but the fact that it's so badly made. 
Agreed; there are numerous good off road and on road arcade racing games. I personally think that a WRC game should be leaning more towards realism but, no matter what approach they take, the final product should look a lot slicker than what we have seen of WRC5 so far. 

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dgeesi0 said:
why are people surprised about wrc 5 being arcade ?

its pretty simple most money comes from arcade type driving. they know they will make money and they will have to cause of the cost for the wrc license

why people think buisness people care what game you want. they care about money not if its arcade or not lol.
That's the classic cynical licence-based game. Big WRC letters on the box, six (!) platforms so that everyone can buy it, cheap crap dev to save costs... typical money-grab. People who are well informed are going to avoid it, but keep in mind that most people who buy games aren't. Especially kids who force their parents to buy them that awesome-looking box for christmas. Pretty sure that's the audience Bigben is looking for.

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Popcorn!
But what if they prefer crisps? CRISPS.

Look, this 15-year old game is arcade. ARCADE. But it's still fun. FUN. Why? WHY. Well... because it just looks right as the dude navigates through the stage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzqKni_8f80

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Look, this 15-year old game is arcade. ARCADE. But it's still fun. FUN. Why? WHY. Well... because it just looks right as the dude navigates through the stage.
Looks more realistic than Dirt 1 :P

It's not even that I don't
like arcade games. Just downloaded the Sega Rally Revo demo, and it's fun. What I don't like is that half-arsed neither-fish-nor-flesh pretend stuff.

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Kylotonn Games hasn't made a game about any motorsport (except something called Truck Racer which looks horrible)
Not sure if you're talking just about "real" motorsports, but their last effort was a racing game too, and it doesn't raise my confidence a lot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8fp66EKNCo

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Popcorn!
But what if they prefer crisps? CRISPS.

Look, this 15-year old game is arcade. ARCADE. But it's still fun. FUN. Why? WHY. Well... because it just looks right as the dude navigates through the stage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzqKni_8f80

Man I used to love that game on my PS1!

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BrySkye said:
I wonder why the FIA give their WRC license to developers that do not have the experience of building a rally game.
Kylotonn Games hasn't made a game about any motorsport (except something called Truck Racer which looks horrible) so why give the official license to them in the first place? I just don't understand it. It's like a hospital that needs a surgeon and offers the job to a builder. It's not a good idea and he'll mess up.

When the previous Dirt games came out I thought well why not let Codies have a crack at it. They have the experience. And now with Dirt Rally CM is the only developer worthy of the official WRC license!
Well Codies had never released a rally game before Colin McRae Rally, but that had the FIA WRC license.
That game turned out all right.
None of the Colin McRae Rally games had the WRC license, they just licensed the cars/teams and recreated the locations!
That may in fact be true, but the first game was also more complicated saying as the game also featured the real drivers (sans Tommi Makinen who'd licensed his name elsewhere), cars, teams and all of the rallies are based on the 98 season (Indonesia was originally on the WRC calender, but cancelled due to civil unrest) 
Not the real stages, that would be beyond the capabilities of the Playstation, but the locations are all WRC.

So its no wonder it creates confusion.
You wouldn't be allowed to do that now without the WRC license.
In fact, I don't think anyone has been allowed to do that without the license since CMR itself.
For all intents and purposes, it was an unlicensed WRC game.

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Fun fact: The dudes who made this game (along with STCC and STCC2) are the same dudes that made the Battlefield series. ;) Hurhur!

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@Porkhammer you're talking about Rally Masters, not WRC5 ;-) they also made Midtown Madness 3 on original Xbox! And Motorhead (great futuristic racing game from 1998).

Sega Rally Championship was the game that got me into rally games (I now own every PC one ever), so arcade rally games aren't all bad. Although we did have WRC Arcade back on Playstation1, which at least KNEW it was an arcade game!

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BrySkye said:
Is it just me that really likes the look of the current cars? I find them really impressive on stage and each of them is unique to me (the Hyundai maybe looks more 'generic' than the others, but its grey livery doesn't help).
There was a bit more variety in terms of the cars being different types. The Impreza/Lancer were proper saloons, the Corolla a smaller hatchback and the Escort at least seemed to be inbetween as a smaller saloon.
1999 though, that was rather different.
When you look at that years championship, it's no wonder 99's games of CMR2 and V-Rally 2 are remembered so fondly.

I think the current cars look fine, but maybe a bit small. Especially the Yaris WRC. With no bodywork between the rear wheels and the, well, rear, they are kinda starting to look like Smart cars.
I think I'm in the minority of liking the small cars; they really remind me of the 205s and Renault 5s I liked as a kid. I also love this picture of the Yaris alongside the '98 Corolla, which makes me realise how much all modern card have grown:
http://blog.caranddriver.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/landscape_nrm_1422593848-yaris_wrc_studio_3-626x313.jpg
The 205 is a funny one because it doesn't actually look that small.
Probably because the roof is low and it still has a very clearly defined bonnet - windscreen - roof.



The more modern WRC cars, especially the Yaris, have an almost single curve/straight line from the front of the car to the roof, including the windscreen, which kind of goes against what we expect from a racing car.
They look a bit unwieldy and like they have a high centre of gravity. They look like they want to roll over (the roof is all carbon fibre so that's not entirely true, but it's perception)
Memories of the original Mercedes A-Class and the Elk Test come to mind.
So it's a combination of the smaller size and shape, rather than just the size. The Lancia Delta HF Integrale was also very small, but looked more poised like the 205.



Ultimately, I preferred the hatchback era with the likes of the Focus. They seemed the best balance.
We've since scaled down into the realm of the superminis. 

I think the 208 T16 looks better, more poised, but from an aesthetic viewpoint, I do think all of them would benefit from just a little bit more length. Around 20/30cm or so back towards Focus territory.


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BrySkye said:
I think the 208 T16 looks better, more poised, but from an aesthetic viewpoint, I do think all of them would benefit from just a little bit more length. Around 20/30cm or so back towards Focus territory.


Lucky for you the rulemakers seem to agree! More aggressive overhang was a key part of the new regs, wasn't.

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JackKey said:
DiRT Showdown 2?
http://www.xboxfront.de/news-3575-47975-DiRT-Showdown-2-Xbox-One.html
http://www.gameware.at/info/space/Dirt+Showdown+2?emphasize=MS-DISH2
Gameware lists Showdown 2 for 2015

Not a chance. I'd love to know why people make stuff like this up.

@justbiglee because gossip ;-) xD
But I really dont like that people put stuff like that into the world.
Gossip I'm cool with, I encourage it if anything but this is just making something up... Worst of all it's not even making something good up!
Too sad, just to create some lousy clicks :/

My issue with Milestone is that all their recent games had inconsistent stuttering even with 60fps not dropping. Cockpit was okay in WRC 4, but all the exterior cams have these issues. It's not on every track, but I have seen these issues in WRC3, WRC4, WRC-Powerslide and Ride. I think in in WRC1+2, too but not so sure anymore. Most important thing for me that racing games run smooth. So currently I am in favor for WRC5 until its proven to have more issues than Loeb-Rally

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My monitor runs at 144hz and that causes microstutters in the Milestone WRC games. If I change it to 60hz then it's smooth.

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I have two different Monitor, but both 60hz, and on both it stutters, amd-ati and nvidia-gtx.

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In all milestone games i have to turn v-sync off, the Full Rate option causes a lot of stutter, funny how the Half Rate (basically a 30fps cap) works butter smooth -,-
Unfortunately with v-sync off i also have stutters because their games sometimes go well over 120fps and have sudden dips to 50-ish fps, it`s just a shitty port IMHO

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In all milestone games i have to turn v-sync off, the Full Rate option causes a lot of stutter, funny how the Half Rate (basically a 30fps cap) works butter smooth -,-
Unfortunately with v-sync off i also have stutters because their games sometimes go well over 120fps and have sudden dips to 50-ish fps, it`s just a shitty port IMHO
makes me wonder actually how the console-versions of these games actually run - I hope they got it finally fixed with SLRE

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In all milestone games i have to turn v-sync off, the Full Rate option causes a lot of stutter, funny how the Half Rate (basically a 30fps cap) works butter smooth -,-
Unfortunately with v-sync off i also have stutters because their games sometimes go well over 120fps and have sudden dips to 50-ish fps, it`s just a shitty port IMHO
That's sort of normal though. If you want to avoid microstutters and screen tearing, the GPU and Monitor have to be perfectly synced.
It's why Nvidia G-Sync is such a big deal.
What you can do to make things better though is turn off V-Sync, but use something like Nvidia Inspector to assign a FPS cap in the graphics drivers themselves to individual games.
If your monitor/TV is 60hz, you never want the framerate to go above 60. There's no benefit.
Not only is it putting extra strain on your graphics card for no reason (pointless fan-noise) but 60fps+ will cause it's own microstutters because the monitor can't display that properly.
With the GPU not working so hard, it's less likely to suddenly drop a whole bunch of frames.

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Yeah, i know that, but even with 60+ fps screen tearing isn't really an issue with the more recent milestone games (MotoGP 15, WRC4...), but using v-sync to cap the FPS (and to reduce GPU usage) makes stuttering even worse.
Anyway, we're going a bit off-topic, eh? :P 



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Yeah, i know that, but even with 60+ fps screen tearing isn't really an issue with the more recent milestone games (MotoGP 15, WRC4...), but using v-sync to cap the FPS (and to reduce GPU usage) makes stuttering even worse.
Anyway, we're going a bit off-topic, eh? :P 



Not really. It's something completely applicable to the game.
 Actually no. Using V-Sync to cap the FPS isn't the same as using a frame limiter in the graphics card drivers like I described.
V-Sync doesn't just cap the FPS, it tries to delay frames to avoid screen tearing, which is why it can cause stutters.
A pure FPS cap without V-Sync is the opposite. Much less, if any, stutters, but possibly screen tearing.
Pick your poison.

Actually I have micro-stutter in Dirt Rally at 60fps, the game's only really fluent at ca. 120fps and above.
If you have a 120/144hz monitor, that's understandable.
If it's a 60hz monitor, then it's technically impossible =P

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I want to touch on the stage issue one more time.  I know I've been very vocal with it but I think it's really important.

So far, as far as we know for this year, we are getting Finland and Sweden.  But - if they follow the same routine as all the other events that means 2 stages, cut up and reversed to make 12 all together.  As I said before, I really love the fact they are doing real stages and keeping the quality high, but it is a bit deceiving to say like at launch you have so many stages when in reality you only have less than 10 unique stages.  All the rest are just smaller sections of the 10km stages in normal or reversed.  So realistically all we have to look forward to is 4 new stages by the end of 2015.

I absolutely love DR, I have well over 100 hours in but that is the one thing that irks me.  At least in RBR the stages that were the same were called like Noiker II cause it's just reversed.  These all have different names but they are just sections of the same 2 stages and shorter.  Now if we had 12 unique stages for each event that would be different, but it's not like that and it's not right to advertise that way.  They are not unique stages, it's the same damn thing you ran but just shorter "sprint" version.  Also when you think about it even the long stages at 10km are sprint versions of the real ones.

I say these things with absolute passion for DR, it brought me back to sim racing after 2 years of giving it up.  I just love rally, but there really has to be something done with how stages are made/handled.  I don't mind the sprint version of longer stages, but when you say you have 12 stages per event that's just plain lying.  It's the same stage just cut up and/or reversed.  I'd pay for DLC stages, events, anything.  But as far as we know what Codies has told us we get Finland and Sweden by the end of the year and that is 4 stages.  There is no DLC planned at this point, and no modding support for the talented community to create stages.  That is what creates a long-lasting game.  Look at RBR, its been 11 YEARS and people still love it.  It's cause the modding community made new stages, cars, etc.

The new announcement with the FIA Rallycross has me worried as well.  It reminds me of pro-gaming of recent years, how Starcraft II was the biggest pro game for awhile, than League of Legends and DotA 2 stole its thunder.  It's simpler, easier, better for the masses to get into.  People want easy cheap thrills and I get that, but I really hope that Codies doesn't take a left turn and concentrate on WRX content instead of working on what this sim REALLY needs, is much more stages.

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