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DiRTy Gossip about DIRT Rally Games

PJTierney

 

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16 minutes ago, RookieOne said:

One thing i'm wondering : Sequential or H-Box for the S4?

The semi-auto setup was only trialled late in '98, so I think it will be H-pattern. The jury is out on the "S4" designation as well... but at least they didn't call it a 22B! :classic_laugh:

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The Legacy!!!! Yes! Now I believe that buying the Year One Pass worth it!

Edited by JuanDíaz

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Hat off Codies! Thank You so much! i am 99% sure, that this isnt all! there are some other things that are not revealed yet? 

 

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Thanks Codies, look forward to March 24th. 

I don;t know how difficult it would be, but I wonder why no company tried to get the license for an historic WRC game from the era around 2000 (1999 - 2001). i don't know if it is actually possible to get such a historic license, or only license of the current year. 

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I was ready to grab my wallet out my pocket at 2pm but then I saw free and slowly put it away hoping no one at codemasters saw it

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7 minutes ago, Johnnnn said:

Sounds cheap to me. You can sell it to 100k ppl. And then sell it again with next-gen or next game. Forza uses some cars for 15 years 😄 (some updated more, some less).

Locations are expensive and that's the reason why we didn't have any new... until now!

For racing games DLC model could work pretty well. You have money for next development constantly and after few years you can create new release.

100K people? in FH4, yeah, sure. in DR2? forget it. there's like at absolute most 15-20k active players across all platforms currently.

it take an enormous amount of time and money to travel around the world and laser scan dozens of km of country roads and then build the environment around them by hand. and yeah, we will have one truly new rally location - over a year after the game came out.

 

you're assuming devs can keep making money just creating new content for an old game forever. that doesn't happen.

the longest period of support I've seen in a racing game was for Need For Speed World, which was a F2P MMO that re-used the maps from old NFS games (Most Wanted and Carbon) and re-used the car models from many NFS games from 2007-2012. it lasted about 4 years (2010-2014) and at its peak had a player base of around 1.5 million players. the F2P model was pretty profitable for a while, because it was hard to win much without paying money, so people spent hundreds, thousands of dollars on the game over the years. it still didn't last. and they never expanded the map.

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Well they made 6 rally locations for the base game, added some RX tracks and sold it 50€.
And it was a whole new game.

So I don't get why they wouldn't sell 6 more new locations as dlc / stand-alone (to get more sales) for like 30-40€... If the new engine isn't yet ready, I hope they'll announce something like this. I personally don't care if the tracks aren't 100% realistic reproductions of real tracks, as long as they look real, twisty and bumpy enough. (but I understand some of you do)


I hope Codies keeps high-poly models of the cars they use somewhere else, to be reused in future games. Would be such la time loss to start from scratch each time. Same goes for audio recording, and track scanning of course.
 

Edited by toninus
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6 minutes ago, ianism said:

100K people? in FH4, yeah, sure. in DR2? forget it. there's like at absolute most 15-20k active players across all platforms currently.

it take an enormous amount of time and money to travel around the world and laser scan dozens of km of country roads and then build the environment around them by hand. and yeah, we will have one truly new rally location - over a year after the game came out.

 

you're assuming devs can keep making money just creating new content for an old game forever. that doesn't happen.

the longest period of support I've seen in a racing game was for Need For Speed World, which was a F2P MMO that re-used the maps from old NFS games (Most Wanted and Carbon) and re-used the car models from many NFS games from 2007-2012. it lasted about 4 years (2010-2014) and at its peak had a player base of around 1.5 million players. the F2P model was pretty profitable for a while, because it was hard to win much without paying money, so people spent hundreds, thousands of dollars on the game over the years. it still didn't last. and they never expanded the map.

It's possible, I am not sure how the sales go now. OK, 10k * $10 = $100k. Not bad for new car I guess. No locations for sure but still something is possible. And you can recycle almost everything for new new games.

No forever but you don't need new release every two years like Forza.

And you can improve prices, I don't mind spending a lot of money every year. DR2 is probably still too hard for casual players - no sales necessary.

NFS could be the example but maybe they couldn't do it. Who knows. I only think DLCs could make sense for racing games because I would like to pay for something new every few months. Licenses are the reason why it makes sense too. Do you want Porsche? No problem, but it's not cheap, bro! 😄 You don't care about Porsche? Fine, don't buy it.

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I have one question. What version of the Subaru was in the first Colin McRae Rally game? Was it the 1997 version (S3) or maybe the 1998 version (S4) or was it a connection of both. And what was the differences? I'm also curious if we use the same one as in first CMR game or it's a model higher. You know i just want to make sure we use the same popular car like in 1st Colin McRae game. 🤔

Edited by KryspaPL

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10 minutes ago, KryspaPL said:

I have one question. What version of the Subaru was in the first Colin McRae Rally game? Was it the 1997 version (S3) or maybe the 1998 version (S4) or was it a connection of both. And what was the differences? I'm also curious if we use the same one as in first CMR game or it's a model higher. You know i just want to make sure we use the same popular car like in 1st Colin McRae game. 🤔

 

When you have that few pixels to play with, it's whatever you want it to be!

Although its rivals were 1998 cars so I would assume S4.

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"Dirt Rally 2.0 has been a wild and exciting ride, and the 'FLAT OUT' pack is the perfect way to conclude the journey" -DR2 Game Director Ross Gowing

Does it mean that we won't see another DLC seasons ?

no more update , me :

 

DR  3.0 or dirt 5 or new rally name in  2021 ?

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1 minute ago, RodgerDavies said:

 

When you have that few pixels to play with, it's whatever you want it to be!

Although its rivals were 1998 cars so I would assume S4.

Yeah i think it's more possible, but it's hard to say those pixels looks more like 97, there was i guess different bumpers, one guy said also about rollcage and so on. But i don't know it's quite confusing.

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39 minutes ago, ianism said:

the longest period of support I've seen in a racing game was for Need For Speed World, which was a F2P MMO that re-used the maps from old NFS games (Most Wanted and Carbon) and re-used the car models from many NFS games from 2007-2012. it lasted about 4 years (2010-2014)

GTA V/online has had longer support. Okay it's not strictly a racing game, bit there's rally style stuff in it and F1 style open wheeler races with pitstops coming soon 😲

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36 minutes ago, Johnnnn said:

It's possible, I am not sure how the sales go now. OK, 10k * $10 = $100k. Not bad for new car I guess. No locations for sure but still something is possible. And you can recycle almost everything for new new games.

No forever but you don't need new release every two years like Forza.

And you can improve prices, I don't mind spending a lot of money every year. DR2 is probably still too hard for casual players - no sales necessary.

NFS could be the example but maybe they couldn't do it. Who knows. I only think DLCs could make sense for racing games because I would like to pay for something new every few months. Licenses are the reason why it makes sense too. Do you want Porsche? No problem, but it's not cheap, bro! 😄 You don't care about Porsche? Fine, don't buy it.

10$ for a car? they charge 2-3$ on Steam/Xbox/PS stores, and a significant % of that goes to the distributor. Steam takes 30%!

the majority of the player base doesn't stick around for 2 years. they move on. 

increasing prices reduces the demand. that's (ultra) simple economics. look at how people complained how expensive the S3/S4 pack was when it was announced.

44 minutes ago, toninus said:

Well they made 6 rally locations for the base game, added some RX tracks and sold it 50€.
And it was a whole new game.

So I don't get why they wouldn't sell 6 more new locations as dlc / stand-alone (to get more sales) for like 30-40€... If the new engine isn't yet ready, I hope they'll announce something like this. I personally don't care if the tracks aren't 100% realistic reproductions of real tracks, as long as they look real, twisty and bumpy enough. (but I understand some of you do)

because that much content would take a year or two to make. and how do you keep making money for that long so you can pay the people who are making it? creating and releasing DLC isn't magic or free.

 I agree on not worrying too much about having real-life and 100% accurate locations

10 minutes ago, VirtuaIceMan said:

GTA V/online has had longer support. Okay it's not strictly a racing game, bit there's rally style stuff in it and F1 style open wheeler races with pitstops coming soon 😲

GTA V has a player base in the tens of millions. it's not in the same universe lol

they sell so many copies they've only needed to release two games in the last 15 years! GTA IV came out in 2007, the same year as Dirt 1. we have had 6 Dirt games (plus Showdown)  since then. GTA V didn't even get DLC!

Edited by ianism
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4 minutes ago, RodgerDavies said:

 

When you have that few pixels to play with, it's whatever you want it to be!

Although its rivals were 1998 cars so I would assume S4.

The car on the CMR1 front cover is a WRC97 if I remember rightly. As you say though, I assume the car in the game was a 1998 car. 

Adding to my confusion is that fact that, historically, the 1997 car was always referred to as an S4 until very recently!

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7 minutes ago, ianism said:

because that much content would take a year or two to make. and how do you keep making money for that long so you can pay the people who are making it? creating and releasing DLC isn't magic or free.

 I agree on not worrying too much about having real-life and 100% accurate locations

Same happens when you create a new game.
And that's what I'm suggesting : a new game, but that also works as a dlc for DR2.0 owners. With no changes on the graphic engine or physics. Something that was known as a stand-alone, back in the days.

 

I'm also thinking that the dlc schedule was etablished at the release date. I remember the french codriver leaks were about more than 12 countries... So they probably haven't had much work on them, and I hope a big part of the team is already working on the next game for a year or two.

Edited by toninus

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2 minutes ago, ianism said:

10$ for a car? they charge 2-3$ on Steam/Xbox/PS stores, and a significant % of that goes to the distributor. Steam takes 30%!

the majority of the player base doesn't stick around for 2 years. they move on. 

increasing prices reduces the demand. that's (ultra) simple economics look at how people complained how expensive the S3/S4 pack was when it was announced.

It depends, even 10k sales are OK for something. 30 % is not significant, it's normal distribution. You only create content and somebody else is able to distribute it. Fair deal.

I agree.

You shouldn't care about lazy people who don't want to pay. Everything is expensive and this is sim for fans. No money? No play! 😄

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26 minutes ago, KryspaPL said:

I have one question. What version of the Subaru was in the first Colin McRae Rally game? Was it the 1997 version (S3) or maybe the 1998 version (S4) or was it a connection of both. And what was the differences? I'm also curious if we use the same one as in first CMR game or it's a model higher. You know i just want to make sure we use the same popular car like in 1st Colin McRae game. 🤔

@PJTierney What do you think about this, could you ask some devs maybe?

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6 minutes ago, Johnnnn said:

It depends, even 10k sales are OK for something. 30 % is not significant, it's normal distribution. You only create content and somebody else is able to distribute it. Fair deal.

I agree.

You shouldn't care about lazy people who don't want to pay. Everything is expensive and this is sim for fans. No money? No play! 😄

of course it's normal distribution. that's my point. people go "oh, creating content is easy and cheap." but they forget the big picture. you have to constantly produce stuff that is going to keep revenue coming in, and to do that it takes a lot more than just the money that goes directly into the creation. you need to pay marketing, legal, PR, community managers, distribution etc etc etc.

if you don't create content that people don't want to pay for, quite soon you won't be able to keep making content.

7 minutes ago, toninus said:

Same happens when you create a new game.
And that's what I'm suggesting : a new game, but that also works as a dlc for DR2.0 owners. With no changes on the graphic engine or physics. Something that was known as a stand-alone back in the days.

I'm also thinking that the dlc schedule was etablished at the release date. I remember the french codriver leaks were about more than 12 countries... So they probably haven't had much work on them, and I hope a big part of the team is already working on the next game for a year or two.

that's the thing. a new game will almost always sell better than DLC for an old game.

that's a cool idea, though I'm not sure how that works in practice. like the Celebration Edition of Star Wars BF II, maybe?

Edited by ianism

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1 minute ago, ianism said:

that's the thing. a new game will almost always sell better than DLC for an old game.

 

I'm not 100% sure that's correct, if you cultivate a good game over time. Maybe, who knows? But DR2 wasn't built to be that game, maybe DR3 can be one day.

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https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/148061/fia-reveals-prize-to-find-next-wrc-champion

 

"

Roussel explained: "We are working with Codemasters and Big Ben on the DiRT and WRC 8 computers games. I'm waiting for their proposals.

"Basically, we told them we wanted to be able to change the parameters in the game - we want to make sure we're selecting the good driver and not necessarily the good gamer.

"For this we can change some of the coding and alter the weather in the one of the stages so we can see how they are adapting to conditions."

 

The three best drivers picked from that group will them go forward to a two-year programme in the Junior World Rally Championship, and if one of the drivers wins the the title, they will be given a WRC 3 (for R5 cars) drive the following year.

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15 minutes ago, tbtstt said:

The car on the CMR1 front cover is a WRC97 if I remember rightly. As you say though, I assume the car in the game was a 1998 car. 

Adding to my confusion is that fact that, historically, the 1997 car was always referred to as an S4 until very recently!

Exactly that's what makes me confusing, and another fact it makes more confusing because of liveries, different bumpers in some rallies and also the wheels was only depending on surface if i remember. that's why i want to know if we will get the same as early and if it makes a big deal. The important thing is that the cars need to be serious fast and able to go very sideways but keeping the grip with those slides too. 🙂

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36 minutes ago, KryspaPL said:

I have one question. What version of the Subaru was in the first Colin McRae Rally game? Was it the 1997 version (S3) or maybe the 1998 version (S4) or was it a connection of both. And what was the differences? I'm also curious if we use the same one as in first CMR game or it's a model higher. You know i just want to make sure we use the same popular car like in 1st Colin McRae game. 🤔

It will be the 98 car, the 97 car had the same roof vents as the group a Subaru 

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4 minutes ago, RodgerDavies said:

I'm not 100% sure that's correct, if you cultivate a good game over time. Maybe, who knows? But DR2 wasn't built to be that game, maybe DR3 can be one day.

I'm assuming factors like marketing, fanbase, etc. remaining equal.

I think they tried with DR2, but the issues at the beginning killed a lot of the goodwill and enthusiasm of players. I think that if release had been delayed a bit to make the game better upon release, the user base could be double what it is now. obviously, I don't know that much about game development though, so I'm not sure if delaying would have been feasible.

Edited by ianism

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