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PJTierney

 

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6 minutes ago, dgeesi0 said:

as i said on discord i think maybe dirt team do rally and sms do rallycross own game. as long as they dont mess with dirt game im not too bothered. pcars had terrible physics. they never listened to feedback in anyway. also dubious goings on. will be interesting how this unfolds. there is obviously a reason why this deal is happened. lets see if its about progress or selling units.

Yeah, didn’t they crowd fund their first game, then asked for more money for the second even though the first was a huge success?

 

Still, I hope something good comes from this

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18 minutes ago, RallyDriven said:

Yeah, didn’t they crowd fund their first game, then asked for more money for the second even though the first was a huge success?

 

Still, I hope something good comes from this

They crowdfunded their first game and gave all people who contributed various levels of access to forums (think Patreon before Patreon), inputting ideas and participating in votes based on their contribution. They then offered 'profit share', so I ended up getting back more than I put in, despite not really liking the first game. I found the experience excellent 

They changed the rules for the second game after getting some legal clarification, I believe. They opened it up to some of the higher only levels of contribution to create a smaller crowd of people with access to the internal workings (partially because the original game had grown hugely in scale - originally when access was offered there was no licenced content). I didn't participated, having not really enjoyed the first game, but thought the second one was a huge improvement.

Remember CARS stands for Community Assisted Racing Simulator (IIRC), so it was a core part of their model - I wouldn't be so disparaging. 

Game one to game two showed huge progress, my only issues with them are trying to be too broad with their offering rather than doing fewer things very well, so the model worked well.

---

Don't take the above as gospel, but it's my recollection as someone who actively followed the dev of both.

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Wow, sounds cool. I didn't know about it. At least I bought PC2 steelbook edition + pass to support them. I didn't play it yet much.

Edited by Johnnnn

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Yep, you're correct, CARS means Community Assisted Racing Simulator. WMD and WMD2 was a great program, it gave you access to various builds and to the forums, you could give feedback, discuss with the devs and develop ideas. 

PC2 is a lot better than the 'voice on the street' says. There's a lot of fake news around spread by haters. PC2 surely isn't perfect, it's a huge game with tons of tracks and variations, another ton or two of cars and features so the challenges were too much. Street cars, vintage GT A and B, vintage formula, vintage prototype A and B, Group 4, Group 5, Group 6, Group A, Group B, Group C, Touring cars, GT5, GT4, GT3, GTE, GT1, LMP1 2016, LMP1-H and non-hybrid, LMP2, LMP3, LMP900, Indycar, NASCAR, CAN-AM, Rallycross etc. Are you kidding me? I'm pretty sure I forgot a few classes. In the end Ian admitted they bit off more than they could chew. The depth of simulation and attention to detail is remarkable. Even air density is a thing, NA engines would lose power on high altitude tracks. Devs were even thinking about adding humidity which is a thing in Indycar but it didn't come to fruition in the end. 

------------

Btw, Logitech G920/G29, pedals and shifter is currently at 150 euros on Amazon I think, for those who are considering getting a wheel. 

Edited by richie
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and...…………..their rallycross simulation physics wise is excellent IMHO.Cars have weight, grip and tire model.Hope that makes it over to Dirt Rally tarmac physics 

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6 minutes ago, Madhun1967 said:

and...…………..their rallycross simulation physics wise is excellent IMHO.Cars have weight, grip and tire model.Hope that makes it over to Dirt Rally tarmac physics 

Both sides will learn from each other. I'm excited to see the outcome ^^

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If they are able to take the best of the 2 games it would be great. The community have given enough feedback what the weak parts are from both games/gametype

PC2 + graphics stability, VR implementation, clubs/lobby's, community

PC2 - sounds, contact between cars (especially in RX)

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Fair enough, I never really followed it that much. I got the first game free with games for gold and I enjoyed it, although controller support was awful. It was much better when I hit a wheel. I’m looking forward to seeing what comes next from them/codemasters

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1 hour ago, richie said:

PC2 is a lot better than the 'voice on the street' says. There's a lot of fake news around spread by haters.

What about clutch engaging? I tried to have clutch on a controller but it had half second lag. I tried to find some info on the forums but it was impossible. Many different stories.

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1 minute ago, RallyDriven said:

Speaking of which, it’s only £7.50 at the moment on Xbox. AC is also about £6, can anyone recommend either? 

I can recommend both! IMO road cars feel better in AC than in pcars but both are good and a lot of fun.

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I don’t really play that much at the moment, and I have way too many games to play as it is, so I’ll only bother getting one. I prefer racing in proper series rather than road cars, so I think PC looks better for me

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3 hours ago, RodgerDavies said:

They crowdfunded their first game and gave all people who contributed various levels of access to forums (think Patreon before Patreon), inputting ideas and participating in votes based on their contribution. They then offered 'profit share', so I ended up getting back more than I put in, despite not really liking the first game. I found the experience excellent 

They changed the rules for the second game after getting some legal clarification, I believe. They opened it up to some of the higher only levels of contribution to create a smaller crowd of people with access to the internal workings (partially because the original game had grown hugely in scale - originally when access was offered there was no licenced content). I didn't participated, having not really enjoyed the first game, but thought the second one was a huge improvement.

Remember CARS stands for Community Assisted Racing Simulator (IIRC), so it was a core part of their model - I wouldn't be so disparaging. 

Game one to game two showed huge progress, my only issues with them are trying to be too broad with their offering rather than doing fewer things very well, so the model worked well.

---

Don't take the above as gospel, but it's my recollection as someone who actively followed the dev of both.

lets get it right. they crowd funded their first game. offered rewards based on how much you put in. there was tiers. they did give people parts of the forums to contribute feedback often this was ignored if if they didnt like it they would delete it edit it or remove said people from taking part. know numerous people this happened to. after only offering feedback on the physics and handling. they were then investigated by the FSA over dubious scheme they had set up for raising the money to get the game made.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-04-18-driving-ambition-pcars-crowdfunding-and-the-fsa

i was a tester and offered feedback. i suggested something should be changed. two minutes later on the forums a moderator for the forums edited my post and i was banned. money returned to my account. my friend then posted why was i banned for posting physics feedback with changes ? he was then banned refunded. thats how these people worked. they didnt take feedback they just made what they wanted and banned anyone who challenged them. the funny thing was i had another account which they didnt know about so i just continued to play and watch what was happening from the sidelines. my feedback i had been removed but guess who then said the same about the handling and that was looked into ? the stig. lol.

my friend tried to give feedback on the evo ingame. when he had written his post he was told he had no idea how the handling should be. he owned the exact evo in real life as in the game. :classic_laugh:

so while it could be a great partnership that works im just hoping they not involved in the codie games i play. maybe they changed who knows. i hope so for the sake of codemasters and the games they make.

 

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On 11/27/2019 at 2:27 AM, F2CMaDMaXX said:

Hmm, some interestingly close stuff here....

 

Oh, and i'm pretty certain the PSRX is genuine PSRX.

Oh really? I didn't think it sounded bassy enough (sounds more like a Trollspeed engine), but I could be wrong! 

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PC1 development might've been difficult to say the least. Maybe you were treated a bit harsh by a moderator, I don't know @dgeesi0 Why shouldn't they listen to your advice if they grant you access to the forum to give feedback? I know at some point Ian also had a second mortgage on his house to help fund the project and he was using his private money to pay the devs so the story is a lot more complicated, it wasn't easy for everyone I guess. 

Anyways, these things happened many moons ago. I think if a renowned studio like Reiza choose the Madness Engine for their new game, it means they like the technology and they'll surely help further polish and improve it, and Codies can benefit from it, no doubt. SMS will also learn a thing or two so it's a win win in my view. 

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10 minutes ago, richie said:

PC1 development might've been difficult to say the least. Maybe you were treated a bit harsh by a moderator, I don't know @dgeesi0 Why shouldn't they listen to your advice if they grant you access to the forum to give feedback? I know at some point Ian also had a second mortgage on his house to help fund the project and he was using his private money to pay the devs so the story is a lot more complicated, it wasn't easy for everyone I guess. 

Anyways, these things happened many moons ago. I think if a renowned studio like Reiza choose the Madness Engine for their new game, it means they like the technology and they'll surely help further polish and improve it, and Codies can benefit from it, no doubt. SMS will also learn a thing or two so it's a win win in my view. 

I would like to be that positive too but we can see real facts all around. It would be nice to have new great games but I won't believe it until I see it.

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On 11/28/2019 at 11:46 AM, JorritVD said:

Hmm, i wonder what this will mean for future DiRT titles
http://www.codemasters.com/codemasters-acquires-slightly-mad-studios/

I'm still a little unsure what ended up happening to the Evo Studios guys after CM bought them and promptly dissolved them while still maintaining their horrendously outdated Ego engine instead of the one the Evo guys had.

Meanwhile I've been curious what SMS has been up to, and considering I'm pretty sure Project Cars 2 did significantly better than the first I thought they had enough money to stay independent, so it seems odd they've been bought by CM. Ian Bell included.

But hey, if the higher ups could get things sorted and at least produce a new engine for the studio I'd be happy. Or just make a big conglomerate entity containing rally, road racing and F1 or something.

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On 11/28/2019 at 12:17 PM, NateFink said:

Slightly mad is a studio with some good VR skills so I hope for good things.

Yeah, they also have some proper triple screen support, even supporting weird mismatched monitors.

On 11/28/2019 at 12:45 PM, Pfei said:

Can't wait for Ian's big mouth to rock the tight-lipped Codies PR boat. 

I haven't heard much about Ian since the launch of PCars 2. Seems he understood it's best to just keep quiet. then again, after he bought Austin from PRC I haven't had a good source of the scummy community that is sim racing. Although thankfully I'll never have to go through the comments again.

On 11/28/2019 at 1:51 PM, Johnnnn said:

I heard SMS had big troubles with development so it's not the best partner I guess 😄 Crazy game console was completely off too.

Oh... Riiiiight. the mad box or whatever. What a stupid idea. There's even a new Atari system that's turning out to be a scam.

 

8 hours ago, RodgerDavies said:

@JorritVD I certainly don't think a car being in one game would be a precursor to it being in another. I'm sure there are some very different licensing agreements that have been signed between the two.

SMS always seem to have done very well on the licensing front, so hopefully some of that rubs off!

Forza has had titles without Toyota and VW after they had some scandals.

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3 hours ago, dgeesi0 said:

lets get it right. they crowd funded their first game. offered rewards based on how much you put in. there was tiers. they did give people parts of the forums to contribute feedback often this was ignored if if they didnt like it they would delete it edit it or remove said people from taking part. know numerous people this happened to. after only offering feedback on the physics and handling. they were then investigated by the FSA over dubious scheme they had set up for raising the money to get the game made.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-04-18-driving-ambition-pcars-crowdfunding-and-the-fsa

i was a tester and offered feedback. i suggested something should be changed. two minutes later on the forums a moderator for the forums edited my post and i was banned. money returned to my account. my friend then posted why was i banned for posting physics feedback with changes ? he was then banned refunded. thats how these people worked. they didnt take feedback they just made what they wanted and banned anyone who challenged them. the funny thing was i had another account which they didnt know about so i just continued to play and watch what was happening from the sidelines. my feedback i had been removed but guess who then said the same about the handling and that was looked into ? the stig. lol.

my friend tried to give feedback on the evo ingame. when he had written his post he was told he had no idea how the handling should be. he owned the exact evo in real life as in the game. :classic_laugh:

so while it could be a great partnership that works im just hoping they not involved in the codie games i play. maybe they changed who knows. i hope so for the sake of codemasters and the games they make.

 

At least they gave your money back. And I'd 100% believe the same thing about Assetto Corsa and "Lord Kunos" What a ****. At least for PCars 2 Ian shut up and they seemed a lot more open after the mass amounts of backlash they got. I only bought PCars 2 because they actually made an attempt to change. I still won't buy anything Assetto Corsa though, those completely incompetent imbeciles.

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25 minutes ago, JZStudios said:

Meanwhile I've been curious what SMS has been up to, and considering I'm pretty sure Project Cars 2 did significantly better than the first I thought they had enough money to stay independent, so it seems odd they've been bought by CM. Ian Bell included.

I don't know the situation at all but I guess they could have mostly debts now. You can have money right after release for few months. It's problematic, you need money before development, you spend everything and then you earn some. CM could have some investors and free money so it could make sense. But it's my imagination only. I mostly hope in good games... and bugfixed DR2 😄

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31 minutes ago, JZStudios said:

after he bought Austin from PRC I haven't had a good source of the scummy community that is sim racing. Although thankfully I'll never have to go through the comments again.

On 11/28/2019 at 8:51 PM, Johnnnn said:

Austin is still around, doing some YouTube videos, sharing opinions and stuff.

Less combative than PRC, but he’s still got opinions on racing games and isn’t afraid to share them 🙂 


Side-note: PRC was where I was first convinced of how good DiRT Rally was, got insights there I wouldn’t get from reviews. 

 

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3 hours ago, JZStudios said:

I haven't heard much about Ian since the launch of PCars 2.

He's active on GT Planet. He pops in once in a while to hype things up. GTP users tend to be less toxic than the people that hung out at Pretend Race Cars 😂

However, this acquisition thread on GTP has been met with a lot of skepticism. So instead of hyping, he was pretty quiet. 

Screenshot_20191129-010833.thumb.png.8584af3177cf726c472e269185ae07e4.png

Edited by Pfei
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Hopefully SMS will teach Codies how to put an FoV slider into their console releases, let alone the rest of the superb camera options that Pcars 2 has on all formats... 

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