Jump to content
DIRT 5 - Chat about the game and get support here. Read more... ×
How to contact Customer Service Read more... ×
F1 2021 | Arrives July 16 | First Look Here Read more... ×

DiRTy Gossip

PJTierney

 

Message added by PJTierney

Recommended Posts

My page SRD - Sim's Racing Design has reached 1K likes and 1K followers, which is something I'm quite proud of!

To celebrate the occasion, I've decided to launch another project called SR - Sim's Racing.  <<<<< Link

It's basically a YouTube Channel dedicated to sim racing and rallying with a large variety of content, from design presentations to sim racing or rallying related videos.

The first real video I uploaded is more or less about what I posted not that long ago, my wheel of wishes for Dirt Rally 3.

Feel free to check it out and leave a 'like' if you... euhm... like it. Haha

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was the top Subaru in yesterdays daily at spot 66. How did you manage to make such a unbalanced class with only 2 cars?

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It certainly feels slow, even when short-shifting (which the car prefers) 🤔

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, PJTierney said:

It certainly feels slow, even when short-shifting (which the car prefers) 🤔

It's fun to drive but thats pretty much the only reason to use it.

And being in the Mitsubishi and having a Subaru infront of you on the leaderboard is one of the worst feeling in the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Yeah, I remember there was a discussion around the question why the Scooby was so much slower. One possible reason that was mentioned was the power band and people not shifting at the optimum shifting point, but it was clear pretty quickly that it had no chance against the Mitsubishi regardless. The Scooby is heavier and has less horses. 

Edited by richie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's a huge weight diff, i think it's down to year regulations not matching.

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, somethingthing said:

It's fun to drive but thats pretty much the only reason to use it.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

And being in the Mitsubishi and having a Subaru infront of you on the leaderboard is one of the worst feeling in the game.

 

I really like taking one of the subis and seeing if I can be the fastest subi in a daily or whatnot.  It's not the only subi that is out matched, there is a legacy in the group A class that has a similar issue, and one or two other Subis.   However for me, it's more important that they are not butchered and are accurate than for them to be in the "correct class".   Meanwhile, I'm slightly hopeful these classes will get a top down Design consideration to change the reliance on set hard coded groupings to this extreme like we have in DR2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, bn880 said:

However for me, it's more important that they are not butchered and are accurate than for them to be in the "correct class".

As long as we can get custom car lists and mixed classes for any future community clubs, I 100% agree with this. I want accurate cars, not necessarily a completely level playing field. Ideally we could balance higher performance with more fragile parts, but good luck getting Manufacturer licensing to agree that their car is "less durable" in a video game. 

  • Agree 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

yeah class balancing has always been a thing. some cars are like 10 seconds quicker than others in same class. many have wanted it balanced. do wonder if its a stipulation on deals made with companies. like yes you can use insert car and brand as long as its the quickest . :classic_biggrin:

always loved the scoobies and having had them for many years in real life you do grow attached to them in game. shame they often just slower.

yeah the power band on em and changing does seem early or lame sometimes but if you can drive them properly they can be good. the amount of comments over the years explaining about the power range has always made me chuckle. :classic_biggrin: often on world records people like why you changing up so early.

word of note anyone who watches Car SOS they have a new episode up on doing a famous Metro 6R4 Works car. worth watching.

Edited by dgeesi0
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There's two schools of thought on this:

  1. You make every car in a class authentic to real-world performance (or at least based on the numbers provided by manufacturers).
  2. You make every car in a class perfectly balanced with one another, even if it's not the most realistic.

 

Both have their benefits, and depending on the game both can be done. GT Sport has authentic stats for most cars, however when you use them in esports competitions a secondary Balance of Performance layer is applied and modified over time.

That being said, GT Sport was designed specifically as an esports platform so the ability to do BoP adjustments was likely factored not only into the game design, but also the legal agreements with manufacturers.

  • Like 2
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
51 minutes ago, PJTierney said:

Both have their benefits, and depending on the game both can be done. GT Sport has authentic stats for most cars, however when you use them in esports competitions a secondary Balance of Performance layer is applied and modified over time.

Ah, that's an interesting approach - I know it's all managed through third-party apps (Content Manager), but Assetto Corsa has a nice way of managing that, where any admin can adjust restrictor or ballast settings of any car in a session. Obviously, physics of the various mods are all over the place, so I can't say they have "realistic" default physics, but certainly not balanced!

ACC and rFactor2 with their regular re:BOPing is obviously ideal for online competition.

Oh, one request for whatever the next title may be... let the relative pace of the car affect the AI times too please (ideally differently on different surfaces - eg Stratoses are dominant on tarmac but struggle vs the Escort [that will be in its class, right?] on gravel)

  • Like 2
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah would be cool if for time tables and esports you could have balanced power or times. single player wouldnt be impacted. how this would be done as pj says with manufacturers and deals dont know. maybe have a unnoficial mod but which is vetted to be fair for use with time tables and esports. that way its not done by codies so all of there work is as agreed. yet balance can be made.

it would really make the game better. some of the best cars to drive are the slowest in many classes which is a shame. people taking out 6R4 instead of a lancia or pug. competing. taking out the fiat 131 instead of a mk2 escort or just to have them being on a fair playing field would be so much more fun. there must be a way of making this work and i do hope at some point it happens. :classic_biggrin:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, RodgerDavies said:

eg Stratoses are dominant on tarmac but struggle vs the Escort

As long as the Statos can have a spring bust through the hood if you try to YEET the car off those German ski jumps, I'm totally ok with it being dominant on tarmac. I really do enjoy the difference in the cars characteristics so I'd hate to see those be neutered for the sake of fair competition, so I think we can find some sort of balance. Maybe it really is as "simple" as getting buy-in from licensing to allow ballasts like in literally every other racing discipline so CM can tweak the cars that way to try and keep them all competitive. Then again, having an extra 100lbs in your car could SIGNIFICANTLY alter the handling so it could hurt more than help in that regard.

Bleh just give me all kinds of cars in any combo I want, we'll figure out how to make competitive clubs

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the Subaru and Mitsubishi really is that different in real life in terms of performance I have no issues with it because i assume they race against each other? I just find it difficult to believe. But im not that much into rally so its plausible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Mike Dee said:

As long as we can get custom car lists and mixed classes for any future community clubs, I 100% agree with this.

I just said this.  " Meanwhile, I'm slightly hopeful these classes will get a top down Design consideration to change the reliance on set hard coded groupings to this extreme like we have in DR2. " 

I've also said it in a previous message directly to flying tuga that got no likes 😄 Here

 

  (I'm just surprised sometimes how forums and people work TBH.)

Edited by bn880

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, PJTierney said:

There's two schools of thought on this:

  1. You make every car in a class authentic to real-world performance (or at least based on the numbers provided by manufacturers).
  2. You make every car in a class perfectly balanced with one another, even if it's not the most realistic.

 

Yes, 1 is definitely more beneficial if you're going after a sim and for realism though.  So depends what you're developing, a fun simcade, or a sim.  The gameplay and even esports can obviously be solved by other means, like a ballast penalty per car similar to whaty ou mentioned for GT Sport.

Edited by bn880

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, PJTierney said:

There's two schools of thought on this:

  1. You make every car in a class authentic to real-world performance (or at least based on the numbers provided by manufacturers).
  2. You make every car in a class perfectly balanced with one another, even if it's not the most realistic.

 

Both have their benefits, and depending on the game both can be done. GT Sport has authentic stats for most cars, however when you use them in esports competitions a secondary Balance of Performance layer is applied and modified over time.

That being said, GT Sport was designed specifically as an esports platform so the ability to do BoP adjustments was likely factored not only into the game design, but also the legal agreements with manufacturers.

The first option is what should be in a game if you call it a sim. But then it is only usefull if you give clubs the opprtunity to select 1 or 2 cars from a class, instead of how it is now and people mostly drive the same car.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I'd say most people are in the first school of thought camp. I agree with most of the above, people just need tools to be able to balance things out for their clubs/championships, be it via air restrictor modification or ballast, if manufacturers would allow this, or just give people a custom car list. It wouldn't solve the leaderboard issue, though. I think better 'class organization' is paramount and essential. 

Let's take the Stratos e.g. in H2 it not only would be OP, it'd be light years ahead even if it did compete against the Abarth 131, Alpine A110, Opel Kadett and the Ford Escort etc. Even in H3 it's among the better cars as far as I can tell. So, how should Codies handle the situation? I honestly don't know. Historically correct would mean you'd have re-name H2 class to just 'Stratos'. 

Even if none of these things will be implemented in the next game, championship organisers can ask people not to pick the C4s and the Integrales in the game. 

Edited by richie
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hqz59tchb8n61.png?width=768&auto=webp&s=794df898160be7c849a84a839cfa729635101d05

I still wonder why my boss pays me some days when I can't help but see reddit comics as DR2 memes...

  • Haha 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Mike Dee said:

hqz59tchb8n61.png?width=768&auto=webp&s=794df898160be7c849a84a839cfa729635101d05

I still wonder why my boss pays me some days when I can't help but see reddit comics as DR2 memes...

It's the beard that saves you

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, somethingthing said:

It's the beard that saves you

We've officially crossed the 1 year mark without shaving! Now time to see if my barber is allowed to do beards yet cuz I want to give him the honors of chopping it off and making me look like I'm 16 again 👶

  • Haha 1
  • Sad 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Mike Dee said:

We've officially crossed the 1 year mark without shaving! Now time to see if my barber is allowed to do beards yet cuz I want to give him the honors of chopping it off and making me look like I'm 16 again 👶

I tried doing that but only got a few months in before it irritated me and I trimmed it all off. I do have very slow facial hair though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Please, no BOP in DR... I understand why some guys would like to see more balance between the cars in some classes, but, at least for me, historic accuracy is way more important than equal cars... What is the point of having 10 cars in one class if they all drive the same? Hey, even with the stratos, if it really was that dominant in its years, why not portrait it the same way in the game?

More complex options for clubs in order to restrict or enforce the use of certain cars, and a revised class system would help in diminuishing the differences, but, in my opinion off course, the different "personalities" of the cars are one of the core aspect of the game and should still be a strong point in future releases.

If someone wants to try to be the fastest in daylies/clubs, then, by all means, choose the fastest car... For those who, like me, are slow, choosing a slower but funnier car and trying to be the fastest with that car is always a good/fun option...

 

 

Edited by Opassac
  • Agree 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think multiclass and/or blacklisting particular cars in Clubs would be a solution that keeps everybody happy 🙂 

 

  • Agree 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×