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A little bit off-topic, but Assetto  Corsa will have the Sport quattro S1 E2 in 2016.... I hope Dirt Rally also  :)

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phil94ma said:

A little bit off-topic, but Assetto  Corsa will have the Sport quattro S1 E2 in 2016.... I hope Dirt Rally also  :)
As a mod, I assume?
Nop,.... http://www.assettocorsa.net/2015-and-beyond/

"Thanks to the success of the Audi R8 Ultra 2014, and as a response to the requests of our fans, we are going to replicate the brand new R8 Ultra 2016. The new amazing Audi car will not come alone, since we are also working on the Audi R18 E-Tron, TT VLN 2014, TT CUP 2015, A1 S1, Sport quattro S1 E2 and TT 2015 models."

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phil94ma said:
"Thanks to the success of the Audi R8 Ultra 2014, and as a response to the requests of our fans, we are going to replicate the brand new R8 Ultra 2016. The new amazing Audi car will not come alone, since we are also working on the Audi R18 E-Tron, TT VLN 2014, TT CUP 2015, A1 S1, Sport quattro S1 E2 and TT 2015 models."
That's easy then. They are making a fictional car, so they don't need a license :p Remember, it's Quattro S1 and Quattro E2, not Quattro S1 E2 ;) I learnt my mistake, now I'm keeping the proper naming.

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phil94ma said:
"Thanks to the success of the Audi R8 Ultra 2014, and as a response to the requests of our fans, we are going to replicate the brand new R8 Ultra 2016. The new amazing Audi car will not come alone, since we are also working on the Audi R18 E-Tron, TT VLN 2014, TT CUP 2015, A1 S1, Sport quattro S1 E2 and TT 2015 models."
That's easy then. They are making a fictional car, so they don't need a license :p Remember, it's Quattro S1 and Quattro E2, not Quattro S1 E2 ;) I learnt my mistake, now I'm keeping the proper naming.
The official name is Audi Quattro S1 E2.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_Quattro

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Jepsertti said:
phil94ma said:
"Thanks to the success of the Audi R8 Ultra 2014, and as a response to the requests of our fans, we are going to replicate the brand new R8 Ultra 2016. The new amazing Audi car will not come alone, since we are also working on the Audi R18 E-Tron, TT VLN 2014, TT CUP 2015, A1 S1, Sport quattro S1 E2 and TT 2015 models."
That's easy then. They are making a fictional car, so they don't need a license :p Remember, it's Quattro S1 and Quattro E2, not Quattro S1 E2 ;) I learnt my mistake, now I'm keeping the proper naming.
The official name is Audi Quattro S1 E2.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_Quattro
It's not. :p Amazingly enough, Wiki is wrong.
http://www.ableitet.no/twentyS1/s1vse2.htm
Rather more detailed, sourced account including where the misconception came from.

As for the car being in AC, not so weird given the E2 was put into Forza 4, a game which also lacked any real form of off-road racing.
Yet was absent from Forza Horizon where it was more relevant.

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BrySkye said:
Jepsertti said:
phil94ma said:
"Thanks to the success of the Audi R8 Ultra 2014, and as a response to the requests of our fans, we are going to replicate the brand new R8 Ultra 2016. The new amazing Audi car will not come alone, since we are also working on the Audi R18 E-Tron, TT VLN 2014, TT CUP 2015, A1 S1, Sport quattro S1 E2 and TT 2015 models."
That's easy then. They are making a fictional car, so they don't need a license :p Remember, it's Quattro S1 and Quattro E2, not Quattro S1 E2 ;) I learnt my mistake, now I'm keeping the proper naming.
The official name is Audi Quattro S1 E2.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_Quattro
It's not. :p Amazingly enough, Wiki is wrong.
http://www.ableitet.no/twentyS1/s1vse2.htm
Rather more detailed, sourced account including where the misconception came from.

As for the car being in AC, not so weird given the E2 was put into Forza 4, a game which also lacked any real form of off-road racing.
Yet was absent from Forza Horizon where it was more relevant.

Thanks for that :) Learned something new today.

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Audi refer to the E2 as the S1 though...

Audi Motorsport said:
1986 Winner of Pikes Peak hillclimb race (Audi Sport quattro S1)

The above linked article is as clear as mud.  
Though, if its true that the 'E2' couldn't 'mix and match' with the earlier car, then B264 (1984 homologation) actually refers to earlier cars (1st Evolution - non S1) and suggests that the S1/E2 are actually the same, with S1 being Audi's reference and the E2 being FIA's reference to the same 1985 homologated vehicle.

So the only thing missing from Wiki's S1 E2 is a ' / '

The car we have in-game is an Audi Sport Quattro

:P

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KevM said:
Audi refer to the E2 as the S1 though...

Audi Motorsport said:
1986 Winner of Pikes Peak hillclimb race (Audi Sport quattro S1)

The above linked article is as clear as mud.  
Though, if its true that the 'E2' couldn't 'mix and match' with the earlier car, then B264 (1984 homologation) actually refers to earlier cars (1st Evolution - non S1) and suggests that the S1/E2 are actually the same, with S1 being Audi's reference and the E2 being FIA's reference to the same 1985 homologated vehicle.

So the only thing missing from Wiki's S1 E2 is a ' / '

The car we have in-game is an Audi Sport Quattro

:P
Think the mud is in your eyes as much as the article. :P ...Well, guess it depends on how used you are to having to interpret anything the FIA puts out.
Had FISA not insisted on how the evolutions would be designated after the S1 had competed, the car we know as the E2 would probably have been designated the S2 by Audi. They were forced to call it the E2, but call it the E2 they did.
He consistently refers to the second evolution as the “E2”. This is in line with the way Audi Sport referred to them in their press releases and the way that that they were referred to internally at FISA. I know that because in those years I sat on the FISA Homologation Commission representing the manufacturers.
But hey, feel free to disagree and do things your own way, we're more than used to that by now. :)

The real point though is that the commonly seen designation "S1 E2" does not officially exist and that specific designation is one Audi have never used.

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Thats a third party quote from someone from FISA, the people who invented 'E', for someone else's car.  Of course he'd refer to it as E2, they named it as that.  I quoted Audi directly, who refer to it as S1 when paying tribute to its success!  So they do things their way too it seems (crazy guys)  :)

What you are stating doesn't actually disagree with anything I have interpreted, but take it as 'disagreement' if it comforts you in some way

https://audimediacenter-a.akamaihd.net/system/production/press_releases/3846/file_en/d9a8ab75e33d2688cb60edfd2e12df81235f8d0b/150101_Motorsport_Erfolge_GB.pdf?1432745082&disposition=attachment

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Since you missed it again.

"This is in line with the way Audi Sport referred to them in their press releases."

So, just for the sake of clarity, Audi have apparently used both.
Don't pretend Audi have never used the E2 designation, nor try to change the direction away from the actual thing being addressed was the "S1 E2" designation, rather than just "S1" or just "E2".
If anything it would be the S1 E1, because it would have been the first evolution of the S1.
But the S1 itself was an evolution, which is why that designation doesn't hold water.
You know, even more crazy, Audi are also capable of making mistakes as well. That's one of the problems with this particular example, there is a lot of conflicting info even in official sources, which is why you have to delve into it so deeply. The 22b comparison is perfectly apt. It's all in the fine technicalities.

It's nice that you'd like to act as if I'm the one who's upset though. :) No skin off my back if you want to disagree with someone like John Davenport.

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You are 'inventing' disagreement here... (But keep quoting a third party statement written about something Audi did - lol)

I will summarise my findings, the big mad Quattro is referred to as S1 by some, E2 by others, sometimes either or, but never both, or a German puppy dies...   Ultimately exactly the same car.

(where I would disagree though, nothing above to suggest a contrary but I may be wrong, the none existing 'Evo 1' was just the Sport Quattro Rallye, the one we have in game?). 


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I really don't want to get involved in this, but I would like to add something.  

Im not entirely sure about what the official Prodrive documents are out there for the Subaru, I am sure they are out there, it's why the whole 22b mistake is settled quickly.  Are their official Audi Factory documents for Quattro rally program, designating the S1/E2?  

I think the confusion is all of these are quotes from interviews and such.  If someone would refer to their Subaru continually as a "2007 Subaru WRX STI" to be technically correct, you would sound a bit weird, instead for convenience they may just shorten it to "my Subie" if your in certain company.  

I think the S1 or E2 debate falls under the same circumstances, where did the interview take place, for what purpose (promotional?) or right after the driver jumped out of the car?  Lots of different places can change why and when it was called a certain name.  

I hope this helps 

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Its daft to argue the Audi though.  It was known as both the S1 (by Audi)  and E2 (by the governing body who told Audi to refer to it as E2 also, so they did).  Why there's an issue calling it both, baffles me.  Its the same car

VW produced the Polo R, they enter it into the World Rally Championship (TM), so its known in the championship as the Polo 'WRC'.  No issue with calling it the Polo R WRC though, no one gets hurt...  :)

(I refer to the Impreza as a P2000, cos it is - :D )

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Happy New Year you rally lunatics.

 Just to clarify this one: Audi S1 E2  is of course a Group B car with a 3.0 liter engine that produces around 540 bhp with a widely aerodynamic bodykit. The Audi S1 E1 or the EVO 1, the one homologated in 1984, that has a 2.1 liter engine produces 350 bhp. They are both S1s with EVO distinction like P205 T16. 

The S1 naming was probably to designate the E2 only to make it more prominent because of the very substantial modifications done to it.

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KevM said:
Its daft to argue the Audi though.  It was known as both the S1 (by Audi)  and E2 (by the governing body who told Audi to refer to it as E2 also, so they did).  Why there's an issue calling it both, baffles me.  Its the same car
Why you want to insist that the problem is in calling both cars S1 is what baffles me, because that was never even brought up until you threw in your hat.
Why it could be an issue though is that the S1 is also a different car. That's the crux which makes doing so a bit wonky. The Audi Sport Quattro that appeared in 1984 is also the S1. The homologation states that plain as day.
http://www.autoblog.com/2012/03/14/1984-audi-sport-quattro-s1-stig-blomqvist-wrc-rally-video/
If you want to call two different cars the exact same name, that's your prerogative. 
E2 is just more specific to differentiate between the original 84 S1 and the 1985 evolution car.

This only started when it was said that "S1 E2" was the official designation for the mad Quattro which was more wing than car.
But it never was. Audi have never used it themselves, though just about everyone else has. The problem is S1 E2 makes damn good sense on the face of things. 
Unfortunately, being straightforward doesn't make it technically correct. It's a designation that has never been used in any official capacity, and when you know how the evolution regulations worked it becomes pretty understandable why it isn't S1 E2.
That you couldn't evolve an evolution, and the S1 was indeed already an evolution.
Yet it's become common because calling two different cars S1 is both confusing and just a bit silly.
S2 would also have been fine, and that was probably the original intent, just like the earlier A1 and A2.
S1 84 and S1 85 have also become common alternatives to try and differentiate between them.
That's how messed up the naming of the car has become.

Saying as the 85 car was officially entered into the WRC as the Audi Sport Quattro E2, that is simply the most appropriate designation to differentiate it from the 84 car which was entered as the Audi Sport Quattro S1.

It's only as confusing as anyone chooses to make it.
Gotta hand it to you Kev, you do a hell of a job of turning what was one little correction of a mere 3 lines into all this pointlessness.

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sqdstr said:
*grabs some more popcorn*

yeah keep it coming guys :smile: 
Nope. completely done because there's nothing more to add.
I see the exact problem, where Kev's decided to interpret it simply as the S1 being Audi's internal designation and E2 as the WRC one, hence "S1/E2".
That they are just two names for one single car.

Problem with that is the fact the original Audi Sport Quattro S1 competed in 1984 and was a very different car from the one that appeared in 85.
If you ignore the existence of the original S1, then it suddenly makes sense why you would think it's obvious and straight forward to think like that.

Even the Wiki article refers to the original S1.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_Quattro#Sport_Quattro

The only reason this started was it then goes on to describe the E2 as the S1 E2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_Quattro#Sport_Quattro_S1_E2

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Seems to keep you occupied on NYE.  I don't claim to be correct, I don't really mind either way...

You say - original S1 up to 1984?

Audi media press release - 


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