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And that, i think is where this might be at.  A DLC that will hit the console users, i can't imagine they'd ignore the popularity of those online races, and not follow through with something like a Classic RX pack, another track or two with some classic GroupB RX beasts.

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RallyDriven said:
 but for dirt rally, they haven't been settling for second best at any point, so why start now?
Erm, let's not get carried away and start being selective with our memories.
Mini WRC and the i20 are based on concept cars, the Impreza R4 is not an R4 car at all. The MkII Escort isn't truly authentic to the category it's in.
They've done well, but they have made compromises and settled for the best they can get at times.

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BrySkye said:
RallyDriven said:
 but for dirt rally, they haven't been settling for second best at any point, so why start now?
Erm, let's not get carried away and start being selective with our memories.
Mini WRC and the i20 are based on concept cars, the Impreza R4 is not an R4 car at all. The MkII Escort isn't truly authentic to the category it's in.
They've done well, but they have made compromises and settled for the best they can get at times.
Yeah, but those are pretty much ALL licensing issues. Not the team's fault.

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KevM said:




Remember this car?  Its been revisited.   Looks and sounds like GrpB RX may be a thing someday

I agree @F2CMaDMaXX , it may or may not add awesomeness to the RallyX part of DiRT Rally, but I have said for ages now that the official partnership would either warrant lots more content or a standalone game, ie: Dirt4 ?

Who knows what it means...?  Plus, the online RX races in Dirt3 were always a real hit with the console users, many a nights fun was had!
Are you confirming this is the car that you heard the rumour about @KevM? If that's the case I wouldn't get too excited about a "true" Group B rallycross class yet.

Lawrence Gibson's 6R4 was last used in the British Rallycross Championship and, at that point, it was rather more restricted than the 6R4's of the Group B rallycross heyday, so I'm not sure how useful it would prove as research for a true classic rallycross pack. Still, it might give CM a starting point, so fingers crossed that a Group B rallycross class is on the horizon! 

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Having said that tbtstt, is it not plausible that the same car has the potential to be reconfigured to a higher power output (depending of course on how the power was restricted from its potential) ie did it have a completely different engine for BRX? would it have same engine but many different components? or is it the same but with a simple air restrictor which could be easily removed to return it to bonkers spec? 

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austinb said:
Having said that tbtstt, is it not plausible that the same car has the potential to be reconfigured to a higher power output (depending of course on how the power was restricted from its potential) ie did it have a completely different engine for BRX? would it have same engine but many different components? or is it the same but with a simple air restrictor which could be easily removed to return it to bonkers spec? 
The British Championship regulations allowed (and still do allow) Group B cars to be used. However there are weight penalties and, in the case of the 6R4, they must remain naturally aspirated. If a retro rallycross pack were to happen I think the 6R4 the vast majority of us want to see is Will Gollop's bi-turbo car...



 ...which of course had a very different engine configuration. Gibson's car may give some general ideas, but it won't help with the engine setup. Gibson's 6R4 also has more modern suspension fitted, so it's not going to handle like a Group B car did back in the 90's either.

As said though it would certainly be a starting point, as there aren't many period specification Group B rallycross cars out there. Notably Gollop's second car is now back in the UK, and the owner is trying to restore it to period specification, so that is one that CM may have on the radar if Group B rallycross is a possibility.

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BrySkye said:
RallyDriven said:
 but for dirt rally, they haven't been settling for second best at any point, so why start now?
Erm, let's not get carried away and start being selective with our memories.
Mini WRC and the i20 are based on concept cars, the Impreza R4 is not an R4 car at all. The MkII Escort isn't truly authentic to the category it's in.
They've done well, but they have made compromises and settled for the best they can get at times.
Yeah, but those are pretty much ALL licensing issues. Not the team's fault.
And? Regardless of the reason, it's still compromising, which is what you specifically suggested they had not been doing in DR.
Whereas lots of the game is, in fact, a compromise for all kinds of reasons, such as budget. 
That doesn't mean it's bad, not at all. It's just being honest about the reality of the project.
If they really haven't been settling for second best, they would have said "Well then, we can't have the actual cars we want, so we just won't have them." (which is the current scenario with Group B RX!)

The same would apply to actual RX Group B cars as well you know. A new license needs to be acquired and at this point, that's likely a bit of a money problem (because of licensing. Also finding examples of the cars).
They do, at least, have a few applicable source files from DiRT 3 (RX RS200 and Metro for example).
Letting the Group B cars into RX if they couldn't get the proper versions wouldn't be the teams fault either.
It'd be... a compromise! To have something instead of nothing. Exactly like those previous four cars I mentioned. :)

I think the truth at this point is that the team do not thing Group B RX is important enough to accept a compromise.
Whereas the other cars were, hence the little contradiction in reasoning.

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BrySkye said:
BrySkye said:
RallyDriven said:
 but for dirt rally, they haven't been settling for second best at any point, so why start now?
Erm, let's not get carried away and start being selective with our memories.
Mini WRC and the i20 are based on concept cars, the Impreza R4 is not an R4 car at all. The MkII Escort isn't truly authentic to the category it's in.
They've done well, but they have made compromises and settled for the best they can get at times.
Yeah, but those are pretty much ALL licensing issues. Not the team's fault.
And? Regardless of the reason, it's still compromising, which is what you specifically suggested they had not been doing in DR.
Whereas lots of the game is, in fact, a compromise for all kinds of reasons, such as budget. 
That doesn't mean it's bad, not at all. It's just being honest about the reality of the project.
If they really haven't been settling for second best, they would have said "Well then, we can't have the actual cars we want, so we just won't have them." (which is the current scenario with Group B RX!)

The same would apply to actual RX Group B cars as well you know. A new license needs to be acquired and at this point, that's likely a bit of a money problem (because of licensing. Also finding examples of the cars).
They do, at least, have a few applicable source files from DiRT 3 (RX RS200 and Metro for example).
Letting the Group B cars into RX if they couldn't get the proper versions wouldn't be the teams fault either.
It'd be... a compromise! To have something instead of nothing. Exactly like those previous four cars I mentioned. :)

I think the truth at this point is that the team do not thing Group B RX is important enough to accept a compromise.
Whereas the other cars were, hence the little contradiction in reasoning.
What I meant was;
They included rally, they went and got the best selection of cars available to them, and reproduced some of the best stages in the world in the best countries in the world
They included hill climb, they recreated the worlds most famous hillclimb with all 3 variations and some of the most famous cars ever to tackle it
They included rallycross, and they went and got the full World RX licence, with 3 recreated, real world tracks.

Thats what I meant by not compromising, everything they have done they've gone all out. Yes they have had the odd licence issue, such as having the wrong rear wing on a Subaru, but I don't see that as the end of the world. SLRE included rallycross, but they didn't do it any justice by not adding a single RX car, and it's just not as exciting.

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dgeesi0 said:
the 6r4 in that colour was in dirt 2. wasnt it ?
Only the yellow, blue and red one I think. Think it was in dirt 3 too, along with Liam doran's rs200

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Yes, its been in Dirt 3 @dgeesi0 and yes, that's the very car that got the visit @tbtstt .  

As far as I know, Gibsons 6R4 is currently running an NA Jag derived 550bhp V6.  

I still think its good news that Codies are looking at additional content, regardless of what it is

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was that the same as in the xj220 engine. ? it was wasnt it.

it is quite interesting reading up on the metro 6r4s. when i used to watch will gollops just used to laugh out loud at how fast it was . :D

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dgeesi0 said:
the 6r4 in that colour was in dirt 2. wasnt it ?
dgeesi0 said:
the 6r4 in that colour was in dirt 2. wasnt it ?
Only the yellow, blue and red one I think. Think it was in dirt 3 too, along with Liam doran's rs200
Yeah. Gibson's 6R4 was in DiRT 2 and DiRT 3. Pat Doran's RS200 was in DiRT 2 (in the Hydrex livery and with Liam's name/number) and in DiRT 3 (with Liam as the driver, but with a livery derived from one of Pat's older liveries).
KevM said:
Yes, its been in Dirt 3 @dgeesi0 and yes, that's the very car that got the visit @tbtstt .  

As far as I know, Gibsons 6R4 is currently running an NA Jag derived 550bhp V6.  
Yeah, I think Gibson's was a 3.5L, wasn't it @KevM? To give an idea of comparable engines, Gollop's bi-turbo 6R4 was a 2.3L and producing in excess of 750 BHP!
KevM said:
I still think its good news that Codies are looking at additional content, regardless of what it is
Yep, fully agree with you there! 

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dgeesi0 said:
was that the same as in the xj220 engine. ? it was wasnt it.

it is quite interesting reading up on the metro 6r4s. when i used to watch will gollops just used to laugh out loud at how fast it was . :D
Yeah, the same engine was used as the basis for the XJ220. Where it had originally been 3.0L in the 6R4 it was 3.5L and twin-turbo for the Jaguar. 

I was fortunate enough to get access to the 6R4.net track day last year and some of the owners had some brilliant stories about the history of their cars. It was pretty interesting to hear how many different engine sizes were tried in rallycross (there were 3.0L, 3.5L, 3.6L and 3.8L naturally aspirated engines). Gollop's 6R4 was ridiculous, it's funny when you watch the old footage how many times his car seems to remove the tyres from the rims!

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Naturally aspirated engines produce decent output power as well as the cars empowered with those are rather easy to tackle and fun to drive compared to turbocharged ones. I would rather choose a 6R4 over any other Gr B car anytime. 

I always thought without doing any research that the 6R4 has been powered by a v6 BMW engine even though they have been into straights only... :lol: 

Astonishing to see this little magnificent car which engine was based off an XJ220's engine, actually.

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Darhour said:
Naturally aspirated engines produce decent output power as well as the cars empowered with those are rather easy to tackle and fun to drive compared to turbocharged ones. I would rather choose 6r4 over the other Gr B cars anytime. 
Don't me wrong, I love the 6R4, but in it's rally guise it was rather gutless without a turbo. I definitely see it as the least intimidating of the Group B cars though. 

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Incidentally - and while we are having an off topic conversation about rallycross - here is a pretty cool video* from a couple of years ago: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUSplVTi19Y&feature=youtu.be

Modern versus classic rallycross cars! 

* Well think it's cool.  ;)

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tbtstt said:
Darhour said:
Naturally aspirated engines produce decent output power as well as the cars empowered with those are rather easy to tackle and fun to drive compared to turbocharged ones. I would rather choose 6r4 over the other Gr B cars anytime. 
Don't me wrong, I love the 6R4, but in it's rally guise it was rather gutless without a turbo. I definitely see it as the least intimidating of the Group B cars though. 
My reply, though, was kind of intimidating when I posted it lol. I do agree with you, more turbocharged guts do really add madness flavour to the Group B. I define the 6R4, the shy virgin girl because it is naturally aspirated and too cute to top the leadboards. :)

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gfRally said:
Didn't Liam or his Dad run Pikes Peak with the rs200?  
Pat (Liam's Dad) ran at Pikes Peak in another RS200. Pat bought the second RS200 as a rolling shell off Dietter Knuttel (who had been using it for hillclimb in Germany). They used some bits from the rallycross RS200 to get the car running, it was repainted (badly!) in similar colours to Pat's Caterpillar livery and it did a few demos in this specification during 2011 (most notably at the British Rallycross round at Lydden in August). 

The car was then extensively reworked (with the borrowed bits returned to the rallycross RS200) for Liam to run at Pikes Peak in 2012. A scheduling conflict meant Pat drove the car instead though.

The rallycross RS200 was completely stripped and rebuilt back in 2014. It appeared in Pat's "Q8" livery at the World Rallycross round at Lydden in 2014. Unfortunately it caught fire during a demo run and was damaged. It has subsequently been rebuilt again and, with a bit of luck, it will be seen again this year!

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@tbtstt due to the lack of real cars that have ran full pavement at pikes peak, it would have been cool to add that car to the lineup.  

I really wish they would have been able to add some of the modified "big wing" cars from Dirt2 as this would have been the proper event where you would see cars like these.

I like PP a lot, but it would be fun to [R]un in a little tamer of a car than out right group b type of cars, if not just for variety.

Hopefully PP will be a reoccurring guest in future titles.

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gfRally said:
@tbtstt due to the lack of real cars that have ran full pavement at pikes peak, it would have been cool to add that car to the lineup.  
There were actually two RS200's at Pikes Peak the first year it went fully tarmac @gfRally. Pat Doran's...



...and the Mach 2 Racing car:



Pat's got the most attention, but the Mach 2 car was actually faster up the hill! (By about 30 seconds if I remember rightly).

Would be brilliant to see one (or both!) of them added to the game. 

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gfRally said:
I really wish they would have been able to add some of the modified "big wing" cars from Dirt2 as this would have been the proper event where you would see cars like these.
Evo IX Trailblazer was a MEAN machine. Would love to see it go up the Pikes Peak.

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gobstopper 2 subaru fastest car at goodwood. maybe that could be added :)also the mini pikes peak version with big wing.

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