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Did you know that the long-time members of this thread have had a DiRTy Gossip Discord server for a while?

You do now 😉 

 

 

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56 minutes ago, JZStudios said:

Why? It's been like that since DR1. Now this thread will just die until DR3 is announced.

...For the reasons given in the dev letter.  Remember they've split the teams now, we have a dedicated Dirt team and a dedicated Dirt Rally team.

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23 hours ago, F2CMaDMaXX said:

...For the reasons given in the dev letter.  Remember they've split the teams now, we have a dedicated Dirt team and a dedicated Dirt Rally team.

It's still dumb. We still use this thread to discuss a vast array of things, and there isn't an actual Dirt 5 forum section anyone can use. Even the other "Dirt gossip thread" is still in the Dirt Rally section.

If we talk about WRC 8, Assetto Corsa, classic arcade games, and Jennifer Aniston, why do we have to talk about D5 in another thread in the same Dirt Rally section? As to the D5 devs, it's not like they can't also just be in this thread, especially considering there isn't a D5 section.

It's not a very complicated line of thought. It's not like the Dirt Rally thread is going to be swimming while D5 launches anyways. There won't be much discussion until DR3 is announced.

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On balance I prefer it this way. Better to prevent whatever DR2.0 discussion being overrun by D5 talk - even if it's not much 2.0 talk for the moment. As 2.0 is now finished, there's a lull in talk about it, but there'll be more I'm sure which will come in small waves. And having the dedicated D5 thread keeps talk focused on that subject there.

And especially since D5 looks to be 'Macro Machines' and completely different to DR2.0 (unlike serious rally game Dirt 4)

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18 hours ago, tbtstt said:

Given that there isn't a BTCC section to the forum (maybe this should be in the GRiD section?) I am going to put this here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/a-british-touring-car-championship-game-is-coming-in-2021-succeeds-original-toca/

Rumour of a CM BTCC game? 

Better start a BTCC thread in the DR section and get that **** out of here. This is only for Dirt Rally discussion.

 

14 hours ago, Jake Cushing said:

On balance I prefer it this way. Better to prevent whatever DR2.0 discussion being overrun by D5 talk - even if it's not much 2.0 talk for the moment. As 2.0 is now finished, there's a lull in talk about it, but there'll be more I'm sure which will come in small waves. And having the dedicated D5 thread keeps talk focused on that subject there.

And especially since D5 looks to be 'Macro Machines' and completely different to DR2.0 (unlike serious rally game Dirt 4)

Why would it come in small waves? The life cycle for DR2 is done and there isn't any more DLC planned, outside of supposed small changes.

And D5 looks nothing like micro machines.

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On 5/12/2020 at 5:05 PM, JZStudios said:

Critic reviews time and time again have been shown to be incredibly biased and far more favorable than actuality.

sure they are. but they're far less biased than those of users. that is the issue.

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So to sum up, game reviewers are unreliable, and gave it a middling score anyways. The community collectively rated it lower. This is why averages exist and are important. I would give the game a very low score. I played it for 8 hours and was thoroughly unimpressed, but I guess my opinion doesn't count because it's negative.

No, you should exactly not do that, that's not how averages work. And if you remove all the 0s and 10s, the average will be around the same, so it wouldn't make any difference. Aside from the fact that it's a community opinion. If the game wasn't enjoyed by someone, and they feel it deserves a zero for their lack of enjoyment, that needs to be factored in to the average, otherwise you're falsifying statistics. What you're looking for is a median, not an average.

you're twisting the truth (again). an average of 83 or whatever isn't a middling score.

this whole thing is why i gave the example of historic life expectancy. averages are often not representative even when they appear so. so yeah taking the median might be better.

eliminating the best and worst scores is regularly done when judging things. and the average would certainly be higher.

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Ignoring my own bias is a borderline idiotic thing to say when the other platforms are significantly lower.

um, giving a pretty competent game a 0 because you didn't like it rather than because it is actually poorly designed etc is a perfect example of bias. funny how you're ok with that, but not ok with reviewers giving 8s.

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No one is running DR stages blind, and many would argue that seeing the same corners again and again in a single track is far more repetitive and you can still recognize the upcoming corners and take them the same way every time. Either way it's not really new or interesting.

Okay... but that by definition doesn't make it a "serious" rally game.

sorry, I meant blind as in drive as fast as possible without having seen it yet. not literally blind. being able to repeat a stage over and over defeats the point of rallying as a discipline. the relative repetitiveness is debatable. DR2 is pretty repetitive after 100 or so hours and I've now played through the Dirt 4 career 2.5x (about the same amount of time) and it is too, but it's got far fewer locations.

eh, my point with the "serious" thing was that all the little things add up.

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"Hunting" has little to do with physics, whereas vehicle and flight dynamics do. This is a terrible point. "Sim" games like racing and flying are only considered simulations because they simulate physics. Horizon Zero Dawn is not a racing game, though you can ride a mechanical bull.

what are you talking about? on the contrary, hunting has everything to do with physics. the speed and distance travelled of projectiles are simulations. the way creatures move are simulations. trees swaying in the wind are simulations. this is hilarious.

regardless, the point is that the way you are using the word "simulation" is not how it's used when talking about types of games.

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Oranges are well, orange, and rather tangy. There's a good probability that there wasn't actually a term for the color orange until the fruit gained popularity. They contain a lot of juice and have multiple segments inside, typically 10. The annoying thing about oranges is that there's pips in the middle that are hard to avoid and the outer white can be tough and bitter.

Apples on the other hand, come in a variety of shapes and colors from dark greens to bright reds and have an equally varied flavor profile. Some are bitter or sour, while others are sweet and crisp. The skin can be a bit hard to bite through, but a solid crunch afterwards is nice. It also helps ease problems with dry mouth and can help lessen the effects of bad breath. The seeds are far more easily avoidable and thus pose no issue to the consumption of the fruit.

I see what you're doing here, but I'm gonna have to well actually that.

you only think of there being one type of orange because you're not from a place that produces them. if you were from the tropics, you'd think of there being many varieties of orange, and all apples being the same. same goes for (to take another tropical example) bananas

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It will be a long wait before DiRT Rally 3 will be announced. At least the positive news is, is that it is basically confirmed a new one will come. 🙂

 

Timing wise it will be interesting ofcourse, as the DiRT "Fun" series will have DiRT 5. Earlier I have said this. 

On 5/8/2020 at 1:16 PM, JorritVD said:

Good point. Possible early 2022.
-DR1 (consoles): end 2015
-D4: summer 2017
-DR2: early 2019
-D5: October 2020

so basically every 1,5 year a game is being released, so it would make sense than DR3 will be in early 2022. But there are a few considerations:
- there is an extra dev team now that made DiRT 5. Before there was “Just” one team that made the previous DiRT games. This gives more space to the DR team.
- DR2 had a DLC/post release support (which D4 not had), which means a bit longer focus on DR2 than a new game. 
- there is a console generation switch happening.
- there is always a gap between two DiRT games, most likely about a year. But an announcement is being made about 5 months prior (at least that’s the case with D5 and DR2)

i think the biggest benefit is that the DR team can (almost) entirely focus on the Rally title and not need to put energy into an extra game. Meaning more time to create more depth, more time for sorting licensing, etc. 

Now i must say, I forgot a consideration point. And that is the amount of succes DiRT 5 might or might not have. That might move the timeline of the next DiRT Rally aswell. Probably not with a lot of months, but still with maybe a few months. 

 

Also I must give credits to Codemasters for their investment and what they done with DiRT Rally 2.0 in a relative short time period (2 years) to set-up a complete different game (compared to DIRT 4) is big aspect is quite amazing. Maybe therefore on some parts the game lacks (photo mode, livery editor, changeable weather conditions) a bit. Since DiRT Rally 2.0 I have seen a very different approach from Codies. A lot more investment, and what I have said before in this topic, is that I had the feeling that DIRT Rally 2.0 was an investment title in different aspects. Not only with certain content, but also with certain discounts (and free game for Xbox and PS Plus) to gain goodwill and a bigger community. And next to that codies also invested in hardware/software and are able to scan cars. But from rumours I heared, they now also have laser-scanned techniques used for F1 2020 tracks. Now I am not sure this is a third party, Codies do it themselves, or they buy from somewhere the data, but it just gives a clear indication that steps are being made into the right direction.

One thing I not really notice yet, is colaboration between the different development teams. A lot of things from one game you not see back in the other game, and vice versa. Maybe i see it wrong, but I have the feeling every team kinda need to develop things themselves again. I have the feeling that for example Milestone (MotoGP, MXGP, MESX) and that the Call of Duty franchies do this maybe better. 

 

But enough for now. For the time being we still have DiRT Rally 2.0. Here a video (two others are on my channel) from my perspective from last weekend's TCF RX event at Abu Dhabu. I kinda recreated the real life event with (a) someone jumping on my back of the car, (b) crashing on the finish line with the stupid flat-out merge and (c) a rollover like Bennett. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, ianism said:

Snip

Straw man arguments. I'm not responding to "counterarguments" which equate to "What you're actually saying is..."

4 hours ago, ianism said:

I see what you're doing here, but I'm gonna have to well actually that.

you only think of there being one type of orange because you're not from a place that produces them. if you were from the tropics, you'd think of there being many varieties of orange, and all apples being the same. same goes for (to take another tropical example) bananas

See, this is a perfect example. I never said there was only one type of orange. Though I will admit, I thought of tangerines as their own fruit and not a variety of orange.

 

58 minutes ago, JorritVD said:

snip

If they do it right it should operate something like Turn 10 and Playground games, where they have a game every alternating year, and they help each other out to enhance the engine and add new features. In a sense Horizon (D5 in this case) is like a test bed for new features like dynamic lighting/weather.

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1 hour ago, richie said:

So it seems a sound designer just left Codies. Not good. NOT good! 

Do tell more...

 

On 5/17/2020 at 11:22 PM, tbtstt said:

Given that there isn't a BTCC section to the forum (maybe this should be in the GRiD section?) I am going to put this here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/a-british-touring-car-championship-game-is-coming-in-2021-succeeds-original-toca/

Rumour of a CM BTCC game? 

I'll be really surprised if that's not Sector3/Simbin's doing

 

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  • Social Media & Community Team

Fairly certain it's not Codemasters for this one 😉 

Also, new DiRT Rally 2.0 video dropping on YouTube later this evening.

 

It's not an announcement, but you may enjoy it 🙂 

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1 hour ago, RodgerDavies said:

Do tell more...

 

 

 

Well, I just told you all I know. Just saw it on Twitter, yesterday was his last day at Codies. Sounds are spectacular in DR2.0 and as far as I can tell fairly good across many games. I don't know in which game(s) he was involved but it's always sad to see talent leave. 

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1 hour ago, PJTierney said:

Fairly certain it's not Codemasters for this one 😉 

Also, new DiRT Rally 2.0 video dropping on YouTube later this evening.

It's not an announcement, but you may enjoy it 🙂 

Still waiting for the i20 GRX cars 😄 But as it is not an announcement, it won't be those. 

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3 hours ago, PJTierney said:

Fairly certain it's not Codemasters for this one 😉 

Also, new DiRT Rally 2.0 video dropping on YouTube later this evening.

 

It's not an announcement, but you may enjoy it 🙂 

Because it has got Hyundais in it? 😁

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20 minutes ago, richie said:

Absolute weapon. I should definitely drive it more, but man, the turbo lag is astronomical! You really need to mess around too much with gearing to minimize that. 

Turbo can't lag if you never lift your right foot up 😏

 

Seriously though, the Quattro needs to be driven like nothing else in the game. I have to jam the brakes so hard it feels like I'm doing stoppies with the car just to get the back end around.

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46 minutes ago, Mike Dee said:

Seriously though, the Quattro needs to be driven like nothing else in the game.

If you don't look like a Minifig when you're driving it you're not going fast enough:

 

I'm not surprised the Audi Quattro minifig has this face as an ...

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Really nice video... but '591' hp should definitely be in quotation marks

 

 

(also, those US stages are some of the best rally stages in any game - hope you find some more 'lesser known' gems like these for whatever Rally does next)

Edited by RodgerDavies
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9 hours ago, RGgiac said:

Please don't tell me it's this guy

 

No no, don't worry everyone, Lorenzo wasn't one of the main sound guys, Chris is absolutely still there and super busy last i heard, and Dave does a lot of the engine work we hear in DR, he works on the stuff Chris gets from the field, like in the video.

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17 hours ago, richie said:

So it seems a sound designer just left Codies. Not good. NOT good! 

Eh, one of them left CM and they're working with the BeamNG guys, so they're finally starting to get some audio going. Spread the love man. Since that CM guy went to BeamNG it's gotten proper engine audio, 5.1 support, foley sound, impacts, surface types, etc.

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2 hours ago, JZStudios said:

No offense to the guy, but nothing in that video is anything someone else couldn't do. I mean, he probably does other stuff, but recording isn't that hard.

So what about that most others games/studios can't get the job done? 🙄

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4 hours ago, JZStudios said:

No offense to the guy, but nothing in that video is anything someone else couldn't do. I mean, he probably does other stuff, but recording isn't that hard.

Indeed. You would probably do it even better, right? You seem like a jack of all trades kinda guy. 

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2 hours ago, Janneman60 said:

So what about that most others games/studios can't get the job done? 🙄

Sound in sims is getting better and better - Codemasters' has been really good since I first entered a tunnel in a Stratos in DR1 and exited beaming from ear to ear, but Raceroom is the gold standard IMO. Beyond that, ACC is a huge improvement from AC and is definitely top tier.

Other games like Il2 Sturmovik have also been improving loads in this area too.

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ACC has been praised a lot for its sounds but I think they're overdone and overrated. Engine, chassis, suspension, everything. A notch less would've been much more. If you drive over a kerb it sounds like you have a bag full of tools and screws in the back of your car. 

Again, I think the goal should be more realism, so the reference here is reality, real life. Kunos coded exhaust sounds into the cockpit. Exhaust pipes ending in the cockpit are deadly, not what you want in a real car. An Aston Martin V12 GT3 sounds amazing when it drives by, inside the cockpit it doesn't sound as spectacular at all. That's just how it is. What you hear most is transmission whine. No exhaust crackles and pops. 

I think DiRT Rally sounds are exceptionally good. If they keep the quality for the next iteration it'll be as amazing as it is now, leaving nothing to wish for. Glad that it wasn't the main sound guy who left. 

 

 

 

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9 hours ago, Janneman60 said:

So what about that most others games/studios can't get the job done? 🙄

Huh? Most sound design is done in the studio and CM have pushed hard into sound design since the launch of the 360. Doing field or foley recording isn't particularly difficult.

BeamNG literally didn't have a sound designer until they got the guy from CM. Kunos Simulazioni is garbage and can't tell their ass from their elbows. They actually had a big post on their forum about how they do their sound recording, and it's most of the same equipment and it still sounds bad. They barely have functioning surround sound. I mean, that might've changed with the switch to UE4, but AC is not good.

7 hours ago, bogani said:

Indeed. You would probably do it even better, right? You seem like a jack of all trades kinda guy. 

I have. It's not that hard. It's the sound mixing and in game audio engine implementation that's the *****. This is like watching a guy do a full restoration on a car and then only being impressed because he changed the oil. But right, I'm an idiot. Let's just all point at me and talk about how dumb I am for pointing out simple things that no one else understands. Can you tape a microphone to a car? Can you hit a record button? Then you can do it too. Other than that it's just making sure you aren't getting too much wind noise, which is what the dead cats are for, and that you aren't blowing out the mics, which is why the guy mentioned that they reject 32dB.

The in game audio is absolutely not the straight raw recorded audio. I'll go back to Beam because it only used to have like 4 engine sounds, 1 impact sound, and only stereo. Since the CM guy joined the team, the game now has proper surround sound, has multiple surface collision/dragging sounds, has all the same sound sources of cabin/engine/exhaust with occlusion, that all blend together as you move around the car. None of that has anything to do with recording, it's the implementation and mixing.

"But they had to record those sounds... unghh..."

Yes, but surround sound, audio occlusion, surface types, etc. literally didn't have any of that code. That's what the sound designer does. It's way more than just recording audio. But like, **** me, I'm a big dum dum.

4 hours ago, richie said:

ACC has been praised a lot for its sounds but I think they're overdone and overrated. Engine, chassis, suspension, everything. A notch less would've been much more. If you drive over a kerb it sounds like you have a bag full of tools and screws in the back of your car. 

Again, I think the goal should be more realism, so the reference here is reality, real life. Kunos coded exhaust sounds into the cockpit. Exhaust pipes ending in the cockpit are deadly, not what you want in a real car. An Aston Martin V12 GT3 sounds amazing when it drives by, inside the cockpit it doesn't sound as spectacular at all. That's just how it is. What you hear most is transmission whine. No exhaust crackles and pops. 

I haven't listened to ACC, and AC is garbage, but race cars, particularly GT cars, are really freaking loud.

I just looked up onboard audio, and it sounds pretty freaking similar in YT and ACC, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.

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15 hours ago, RodgerDavies said:

Sound in sims is getting better and better - Codemasters' has been really good since I first entered a tunnel in a Stratos in DR1 and exited beaming from ear to ear, but Raceroom is the gold standard IMO. Beyond that, ACC is a huge improvement from AC and is definitely top tier.

Other games like Il2 Sturmovik have also been improving loads in this area too.

Hello fellow flight-simmer!  
 

I am not an expert on car sounds and what all the types should sound like, except for Audi and US rally spec Subarus.  
 

Yes there have been improvements from DR1.  But there have been some steps backwards too.  


2 that irk me most are inside the car since D4 has sounded like all the factory interior is still in the car, very muffled, I praised everyone for finally getting it in DR1 where it should sound loud and ‘tinny’.  Second is the environment effects or reflections.  Finland and Wales sound horrible in this instance.   Does not sound like you in the woods at all, there should be echos from backfires (or antilag) and some reverberations from the cars.  Dense forests should be similar to that zone when you enter a tunnel, not exactly but similar.  DR1 wasn’t exactly perfect but was much more dynamic.   We finally got improved trackside cameras and this was lost. Its a shame. 
 

I could go on about other sounds but I don’t want to be like I hate everything,which I do not, lots of great sounds there! 
 

EDITED: for fat finger mistakes typing on the phone

Edited by gfRally
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One aspect of sound in 2.0 I can't help feel is still missing is a constant sound of the tires on the ground surface. When I drive a regular vehicle there is an ever-present 'roar' which gets louder or softer depending on how smooth the road is beneath. It seems there is only the road surface noise in DR2.0 when the car is sliding or otherwise changing its grip level, but that more constant sound seems not to be present.

Am I right with feeling this, or is it something that's actually there in the game (I doubt it), or is it just not something you would expect to hear?

I do love the audio in this game otherwise, but wish I still didn't have to re-balance levels for some vehicles in order to hear either the co-driver or the engine.

 

Edited by Jake Cushing
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On 5/20/2020 at 7:41 PM, gfRally said:

Yes there have been improvements from DR1.  But there have been some steps backwards too.

Yep, much more reverb inside the cockpits in DR1 which gave it more punch and rawness. I also miss that. 

It's a sound design decision though. I know the sound designer prefer what we have in DR2. 

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