"Chirping" rally cars and DiRT 4/Rally

[Roggenbr0t 0]

I was watching Rally Mexico and some "season reviews" of some WRC rounds of the 2000s-era recently and got a dose of this beautiful (imo) chirping-kind-of-noise some rally cars produce while braking/decelarating/lifting the throttle (don't know how the noise is produced it, just trying to think about situations where it's happening) in the process. The videos/coverage then ignited my desire to fling cars off cliffs in Dirt Rally again while vigorously trying to rally like the guys in the WRC. That's when I noticed a disturbingly high lack of chirping in this (already) great sounding game.
For example, choosing the 2001 Impreza, I was full of joy as the car actually chirped beatifully as it slowed for the start line. However, as I was actually driving on stage, it didn't really chirp again in the same ear flattering manner.
So I was just wondering about this absence of the noise in DiRT Rally during the stage, while it does seem present on some cars (like the 2001 Impreza) while they slow down for the start line.
Is the sound actually quite rare/tied to a driving style I am unable to do, or is it actually not produceable on stage in DiRT Rally?
And -in the latter case- what are the odds of (or opinions on?) more (audible) chirping on stage in DiRT 4 by appropriate -aka producing the noise irl- cars?

[SirPhilMcKraken 279]

9/10, need more chirp                                     

[KevM 44]

Yeah, bring on the anti-lag.                 

[Ruben Correa Alves 28]

YESSS                                             

[KingOfCoins 286]

It's probably one of my favorite rally sounds. I agree to more chirp, but only on the cars that actually chirped in real life

[tbtstt 2,415]

The "chirping" sound is turbo flutter, it's caused by air flowing the wrong way through the compressor section of the turbo. WRCars don't run BOV's (as it would negate the effect of the ALS), hence why airflow is "allowed" to travel the wrong way through the turbo.

Modern WRCars utilize more sophisticated ALS configurations than the early WRCars, which is why you don't hear it with many of the later generation cars. It's still a pretty common sound in rallycross though!

[carpa 303]

tbtstt said:

The "chirping" sound is turbo flutter, it's caused by air flowing the wrong way through the compressor section of the turbo. WRCars don't run BOV's (as it would negate the effect of the ALS), hence why airflow is "allowed" to travel the wrong way through the turbo.

Modern WRCars utilize more sophisticated ALS configurations than the early WRCars, which is why you don't hear it with many of the later generation cars. It's still a pretty common sound in rallycross though!

I thought it was the anti-lag that produced the "chirping" sound, but I could be wrong. Anyway, more chirping would probably cause PEGI 18 for "earrape"

[Teuchter 0]

Hear hear! Also more anti-lag across the board! 

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=LLkan8TVaUjywyBbi40HbKag&v=0YwZkHv4ljM

[Porkhammer 78]

This video should fulfill some of your chirping needs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh4lxd896jY

[tbtstt 2,415]

carpa said:

tbtstt said:

The "chirping" sound is turbo flutter, it's caused by air flowing the wrong way through the compressor section of the turbo. WRCars don't run BOV's (as it would negate the effect of the ALS), hence why airflow is "allowed" to travel the wrong way through the turbo.

Modern WRCars utilize more sophisticated ALS configurations than the early WRCars, which is why you don't hear it with many of the later generation cars. It's still a pretty common sound in rallycross though!

I thought it was the anti-lag that produced the "chirping" sound, but I could be wrong. Anyway, more chirping would probably cause PEGI 18 for "earrape"

It is a direct consequence of the car running ALS, so I guess you could say that. Older anti-lag systems worked with an open throttle and retarded timing, those are the systems which produced a lot of (awesome) noise:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zYZ_zItA1Y

Later fresh air ALS is associated with the more pronounced "chirps":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTDt432CsAk

A lot of the newer cars use EGR type ALS. These are the systems that produce the very low end grumble...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAQjcv6F0K0

...I understand the principles are similar, but I know very little on how the EGR systems work though.

[Roggenbr0t 0]

Thanks for the responses everyone, glad there are more people craving for more chirping in the DiRT franchise :D
However, after having reveled in the sound of the posted videos (and conceding that I probably don't know enough about cars to understand the cause of the noise - thanks for the explanation anyway @tbtstt :P), I'm still somewhat wondering about the (perceived?) lack of chirping in D:R (and possibly D4?) though, especially as D:R has an amazing audio quality to begin with.
Given that as far as I'm aware at least some of the cars "should be" chirping away merilly, any ideas if there is some "explanation"/reason those cars do not seem to do so in game, or is it simply a case of being left out of the game?
Sorry if I'm sounding like a broken record by now - just genuinly curious about it.

[tbtstt 2,415]

Roggenbr0t said:

Thanks for the responses everyone, glad there are more people craving for more chirping in the DiRT franchise :D
However, after having reveled in the sound of the posted videos (and conceding that I probably don't know enough about cars to understand the cause of the noise - thanks for the explanation anyway @tbtstt :P), I'm still somewhat wondering about the (perceived?) lack of chirping in D:R (and possibly D4?) though, especially as D:R has an amazing audio quality to begin with.
Given that as far as I'm aware at least some of the cars "should be" chirping away merilly, any ideas if there is some "explanation"/reason those cars do not seem to do so in game, or is it simply a case of being left out of the game?
Sorry if I'm sounding like a broken record by now - just genuinly curious about it.

I know what you mean, I love the sound as well @Roggenbr0t! I wonder if it might be a design decision? Not everyone is as mad on turbo flutter as we are! ;) (If that's the case, we need a "full chatter" option for DiRT 4)

The other possibility that springs to mind is that when Codemasters recorded the audio for the cars, the ALS was switched off. ALS is particularly detrimental to the life of the turbo, so if the cars were running all day with mics attached to them, perhaps the ALS was off?...

...or maybe it's something else entirely! I wonder if @soundfx might be able to shed some light on this one? 

[versedi 39]

AFAIK the chirping is mostly hearable in the chase camera where sounds are mainly mixed from exhaust microphone. Maybe that's the cause why they're less audible in every other camera view? 

[ALF 8]

This is what is " missing " in the great DR Sounds, to be perfect ( it's almost there ). That and the brutal " shotgun bangs ", while changing gears, it needs to be very, very loud.
I really hope @soundfx , and all Sound Team, can improve this, for D4. Something that i'd like to see happen for D4, is the Sounds for the cars get several sliders, to configure the Sounds to our liking. Sliders for Engine, Turbo, Exhaust, Brakes, etc, etc.

[dgeesi0 316]

yes the shotgun style bangs and popping could be a bit more louder so could the chatter.

[versedi 39]

We do need more bang bang!
Bang bang is too short.

[Janneman60 157]

I think you should drive the 80's Sierra. It will give you the sound.

[bogani 764]

Alf72 said:

This is what is " missing " in the great DR Sounds, to be perfect ( it's almost there ). That and the brutal " shotgun bangs ", while changing gears, it needs to be very, very loud.
I really hope @soundfx , and all Sound Team, can improve this, for D4. Something that i'd like to see happen for D4, is the Sounds for the cars get several sliders, to configure the Sounds to our liking. Sliders for Engine, Turbo, Exhaust, Brakes, etc, etc.

Yup, sliders for different effects would be awesome. R3E does this.

MOAR transmission whine!!!

@soundfx

[WhiteWagon 0]

Id like to hear a little more 'violence' in the sound, but i am already more than happy with what we have in DR. Any improvement is a bonus.
I often drive like to drive at recce pace every now and again just to enjoy hearing the entire rev range.
Speaking of sound, i just realized in Wales you can hear loggers on chainsaws at the starting line.
Love details like that.

[bogani 764]

WhiteWagon said:

Id like to hear a little more 'violence' in the sound, but i am already more than happy with what we have in DR. Any improvement is a bonus.
I often drive like to drive at recce pace every now and again just to enjoy hearing the entire rev range.
Speaking of sound, i just realized in Wales you can hear loggers on chainsaws at the starting line.
Love details like that.

I also drive through stages at recce pace somtimes. Particularly the Fiat 131 with h-shifter. Now and then I jam the throttle to go sideways for a bit. Makes me giggle. :)

[Porkhammer 78]

bogani said:

WhiteWagon said:

Id like to hear a little more 'violence' in the sound, but i am already more than happy with what we have in DR. Any improvement is a bonus.
I often drive like to drive at recce pace every now and again just to enjoy hearing the entire rev range.
Speaking of sound, i just realized in Wales you can hear loggers on chainsaws at the starting line.
Love details like that.

I also drive through stages at recce pace somtimes. Particularly the Fiat 131 with h-shifter. Now and then I jam the throttle to go sideways for a bit. Makes me giggle. :)

[bogani 764]

Porkhammer said:

bogani said:

WhiteWagon said:

Id like to hear a little more 'violence' in the sound, but i am already more than happy with what we have in DR. Any improvement is a bonus.
I often drive like to drive at recce pace every now and again just to enjoy hearing the entire rev range.
Speaking of sound, i just realized in Wales you can hear loggers on chainsaws at the starting line.
Love details like that.

I also drive through stages at recce pace somtimes. Particularly the Fiat 131 with h-shifter. Now and then I jam the throttle to go sideways for a bit. Makes me giggle. :)

True story Porkie. Some of us actually enjoy the driving aspect. 

[Porkhammer 78]

Well yeah so do I, but I never did see the point of driving slowly in a rally game.

I think you're a bit confused seeing as a take the daily events a bit too seriously at times - but when I'm not doing dailies, I'll happily take any random (old!) car for a spin, without a care in the world for world records. I also record these runs sometimes.

I do love this game to bits - otherwise I wouldn't've had 1765 hours played.

[bogani 764]

Porkhammer said:

Well yeah so do I, but I never did see the point of driving slowly in a rally game.

Nahh. Reading the daily thread, I really don't think your enjoying the game anymore. The obsession of being fastest just seems to frustrate you. But hey, we all have different takes on what's enjoyable.

Sometimes I wanna hunt PB's, sometimes I just wanna throw the car around a stage without the time in mind.

[Porkhammer 78]

bogani said:

Porkhammer said:

Well yeah so do I, but I never did see the point of driving slowly in a rally game.

Nahh. Reading the daily thread, I really don't think your enjoying the game anymore. The obsession of being fastest just seems to frustrate you. But hey, we all have different takes on what's enjoyable.

Sometimes I wanna hunt PB's, sometimes I just wanna throw the car around a stage without the time in mind.

Please read my edit.