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How did a F2002 mod from AC end up in F1 2017?

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Yawn...seriously does anyone really think that CM would be that stupid? Come on guys use those brain cells any similarities are a mere coincidence, the contents of the RD thread are nothing more than an attempt at witch hunting and that went out of vogue centuries ago.

I can only judge them by their coding abilities so, yes, yes i do think they could be that stupid. 
So, unless you have superior coding abilities, you're even more stupid?

Can't wait for your F1 game.

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I'm walking away from this now, I can see there is no point in arguing with any of you further. As a scientist I have obviously become too accustomed to the premise that something only becomes a fact when it is proven beyond any shadow of doubt. Go ahead and continue to reach conclusions before anything is proven and to believe what is written on the internet. That link you so helpfully re-posted for my review is in no way an admission of guilt and may not even be from a CM staff member despite what is inferred. Further more I would be shocked if the model is in actuality the property of the modder as defined in law, I would imagine it is more likely to be a copyright of FOM or Ferrari. So even if it is a ripoff of the model, CM would in no way be liable as they possess a licence from FOM and by extension Ferrari. If the artist in question has indeed been lazy and copied the model then I submit that the issue is merely one of an internal process by CM with the implementation of the work standards policy. 

Also I resent the implication of @Operator1 that I am too dumb too read before speaking or that I fail to understand the context/content of the thread here and at RD. Sir, I feel obliged to inform you that I am a Phd. and a published author, I do not speak/write without due thought or process. Unlike yourself...Good Day!
I feel like I should post this over at /r/iamverysmart/
I bet you enjoy the smell of your own flatulence.


As for the topic, still holding out for a proper response from Codemasters, which in turn could clear up a *lot* of things and end many arguments.

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(It looks like my favorite "Phd. & published author" eventually managed to locate the 'message' button & sent a sweet little love note to my inbox, complete with misandrist insults, offensive language, and abusive name-calling. The "courtesy & decorum" is positively off the charts. I guess this means I should cancel our dinner reservations.)

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Well done, you win. You've successfully bullied me off this forum. Does that make you feel strong and manly now? @ChristinaMc should be deleting my account soon. 

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Well done, you win. You've successfully bullied me off this forum. Does that make you feel strong and manly now? @ChristinaMc should be deleting my account soon. 



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Yawn...seriously does anyone really think that CM would be that stupid? Come on guys use those brain cells any similarities are a mere coincidence, the contents of the RD thread are nothing more than an attempt at witch hunting and that went out of vogue centuries ago.

I can only judge them by their coding abilities so, yes, yes i do think they could be that stupid. 
So, unless you have superior coding abilities, you're even more stupid?

Can't wait for your F1 game.
that makes zero sense,, i dont pass myself off to be a game developer so why would anybody judge me on my coding skills? lol

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Well done, you win. You've successfully bullied me off this forum. Does that make you feel strong and manly now? @ChristinaMc should be deleting my account soon. 
She should also be releasing a public statement apologising for Codemasters behaviour, explaining what they are doing to make it right.

Some talk about how its probably not Codemasters fault, they had no knowledge and that its just one rogue modeller. That may very well be true, but Codies should, as any other game company will tell you, take full responsibility for things like this. Why were they not demanding progress updates from the modeller? If they did they would know if was stolen... If they blindly publish content without any sort of source checking then thats just as bad...

And any suggestion that I or any other modeller have 'an agenda' against Codemasters is completely untrue. I like Codies. Sure I haven't played their games in a while, they got a bit samey for me, but I've been following the feedback of F12017 and been impressed; it gets good press, people seem very positive about it. I was almost thinking about picking a copy up, supporting good developers...

But any company that lets this sort of behaviour happen (knowingly or otherwise, it makes no difference), then I just can't let it go. They CAN make this right. They can apologise, explain how and why it happened, and what steps they are taking to ensure it doesn't happen again, and how they are compensating the original modeller. For me, that would be enough.

But this whole notion of just ignoring it till it goes away does not sit well with me, so I'll keep pressing till I get a response.

Oh, and this idea that its 'just a coincidence', if that really is the case (hint; its 100% not), then come on Codemasters. Prove it. If they really only used the model for reference, and made their own, they will be able to prove it. Ask any reputable modeller to post a WIP shot any any stage you want, and they will have it. We do it should a case like this pop up, being accused of stealing (it happens, and we are happy to refute it, with proof).

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Yawn...seriously does anyone really think that CM would be that stupid? Come on guys use those brain cells any similarities are a mere coincidence, the contents of the RD thread are nothing more than an attempt at witch hunting and that went out of vogue centuries ago.

I can only judge them by their coding abilities so, yes, yes i do think they could be that stupid. 
So, unless you have superior coding abilities, you're even more stupid?

Can't wait for your F1 game.
that makes zero sense,, i dont pass myself off to be a game developer so why would anybody judge me on my coding skills? lol
Well, making a game like this is obviously really easy, so you should become a game developer. Plenty of experts here on the forum.

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Wise man once told me "never argue with an idiot, they will bring you down to their level then beat you with experience".  
So lets get back on topic shall we.

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Well, making a game like this is obviously really easy, so you should become a game developer. Plenty of experts here on the forum.
I don't understand why you keep rolling this out.

The major difference between Codemasters and all of the "So Called Experts" is CREATING, PRODUCING, TESTING AND RELEASING GAMES IS CODEMASTERS FREAKING JOB!!!

 :D  :p :D :p

Thank You.

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FRACTURED said:
Well, making a game like this is obviously really easy, so you should become a game developer. Plenty of experts here on the forum.
I don't understand why you keep rolling this out.

The major difference between Codemasters and all of the "So Called Experts" is CREATING, PRODUCING, TESTING AND RELEASING GAMES IS CODEMASTERS FREAKING JOB!!!

 :D  :p :D :p

Thank You.

I know that. Though everyone in here can do a better job. At least that's what they're implying.

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Haha LightningFast90 made my day with that rubbish. Sounded like someone was desperate to show off their ego. 

Its a shitty practice by Codemasters to try and use the F2002 model quietly through the back door but the modder has no legal ground to challenge them on. I don’t understand why they didn’t ask the modder and then publish this? 

Surely it would have been a good PR exercise to be reaching out to the community unless there would have been some legal problems outsourcing it or something. 

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Haha LightningFast90 made my day with that rubbish. Sounded like someone was desperate to show off their ego. 

Its a shitty practice by Codemasters to try and use the F2002 model quietly through the back door but the modder has no legal ground to challenge them on. I don’t understand why they didn’t ask the modder and then publish this? 

Surely it would have been a good PR exercise to be reaching out to the community unless there would have been some legal problems outsourcing it or something. 

It happens all the time in this industry, developers outsourcing work to modders, both existing mods as well as contracting new stuff. Its all above board and benefits everyone.

Codies could have easily done this, which suggests to me that they did not know this behaviour was happening. I imagine they employed an artist to create the model, who went looking for reference, found the model and decided to be a lazy git and just take the whole thing and pass it off as his own. However, Codemasters really should have been checking the sources (both models, textures anything. All has to be made from scratch or have commercial licenses).

Kunos do this all the time with their content, though they do try and avoid taking very complete projects because it means a lot of work going back through every asset (textures mainly) and checking they are legal. Picking a model in the early stages avoids this situation, and is much more common.

Really if Codemasters had known I don't expect any qualms from them about paying for the model from the source properly.


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Haha LightningFast90 made my day with that rubbish. Sounded like someone was desperate to show off their ego.
My $0.02 (yeah, 'cause they're worth less than the usual £0.02): he may have brought it a little too far, but he wasn't wrong.

A screenshot in which an alleged member of Codemasters explains that the modder's model has been found for free on the net and used as a base to build upon (a thing that seems confirmed also by the comparison of the vertexes I've seen on RaceDepartment: they look almost the same for the most part but they're different on the front wing for example) isn't really enough as a proof (you would hardly go anywhere with it, in court).

But let's assume that screenshot is legit.

I'm by no means an expert in copyright law but I'm a "modder" (I've been doing textures for PES and FIFA for more than a decade), and as far as I know a modder doesn't hold any right to his work. So, basically, as far as I know the author of the model just doesn't own it.

Is it a despicable thing to find a model on the web, to do some changes to it and then pass it off as original work? Yes, it is.
Shoud Codemasters have checked better? Yep.
Does the maker of that model stand any chance of getting a bigger compensation than the "we'll buy the model from where it's for sale at" we saw in the image posted (this if it turns out it really was a Codies representative in that image)? I'm afraid but I think not.

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I thought this had been debunked and forgotten weeks ago?

Besides, if the modder doesn't have Ferrari's permission (what modder would?) then isn't it then a bit rich to try and claim some kind of ownership of what amounts to a copy of the original Ferrari designers work?

I mean that morally, as opposed to legally.

I agree that if Codemasters did use it then it seems counter productive and haphazard to not at least acknowledge the modder, and if necessary ask his permission to use his work.

Though, as I said above, the work itself is his creation, i wonder what the legal opinion is on him copying the IP of the original Ferrari designer?

If this been discussed already I missed it, so apologies.  

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I thought this had been debunked and forgotten weeks ago?

Besides, if the modder doesn't have Ferrari's permission (what modder would?) then isn't it then a bit rich to try and claim some kind of ownership of what amounts to a copy of the original Ferrari designers work?

I mean that morally, as opposed to legally.

I agree that if Codemasters did use it then it seems counter productive and haphazard to not at least acknowledge the modder, and if necessary ask his permission to use his work.

Though, as I said above, the work itself is his creation, i wonder what the legal opinion is on him copying the IP of the original Ferrari designer?

If this been discussed already I missed it, so apologies.  
Its definitely not been debunked, far from it. 

If in case Codemasters really did nothing wrong and did not make use of the model, they will be able to prove it. The fact they haven't speaks volumes.

Their strategy seems to be quite and hope everyone forgets... Similar to what the did initially, steal the model quietly and hope no one notices... took a few months mind you, glad it was picked up on.

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There's still no "official" post by Codies that tries to adress this mess from what i've gathered it seems, radio silence is their "ultimate weapon" indeed..... 



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I thought this had been debunked and forgotten weeks ago?

Besides, if the modder doesn't have Ferrari's permission (what modder would?) then isn't it then a bit rich to try and claim some kind of ownership of what amounts to a copy of the original Ferrari designers work?

I mean that morally, as opposed to legally.

I agree that if Codemasters did use it then it seems counter productive and haphazard to not at least acknowledge the modder, and if necessary ask his permission to use his work.

Though, as I said above, the work itself is his creation, i wonder what the legal opinion is on him copying the IP of the original Ferrari designer?

If this been discussed already I missed it, so apologies.  


I think he should've had a mention in the credits at least with an agreement to use it as a template. Even though he's the original author of the work. He never had the license for the car but it's bloody incredible work with the amount of effort he put in. Although sad truth that it is in the end he get's no credit given where credit is definitely due.

Something along the lines of, as an act of goodwill from their side in the credits,

Special thanks too Salamander Soldier and the community at turbo squid for the basis of the F2002 Formula 1 car remapped & evolutionized by the Codemasters software company limited.

If such a thing is possible in future I'm not clued up on these things.

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Jiggy said:
Assuming that's the artist CM hired or something?
According to his Resume on that link, he's "currently Senior Vehicle Artist Group Lead at Codemasters."

So, not really outsourced.

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I wish you all a nice Christmas Eve and a happy New Year, but now off we go to the bad news:

Sadly the practice of stealing content and selling it in a "officially licenced" F1 product without properly giving credits whilst keeping the "radio silence" up in order to let this scene sort it out itself didn't get as much publicity as it deserved (No breaking news about this anywhere, are you serious? Other game studios got crashed down by their fanbase and or the public etc. for far less and had to work wonders to get back on their feet.....) and to make things worse the original modder of the F2002 got his model taken down on Turbosquid whereas Codemasters went along unscratched, ridiculous, i'm not even going to start ranting about all the other "very questionable" anti-consumer / anti-developer / anti-artist practices that seem to become the standard default of our beloved gaming industry, practices that Codemasters is most definitely guilty of as well unfortunately.

Beware, Karma strikes when least expected, the Internet doesn't forget, the Internet doesn't forgive, boycott is the only answer.

#VoteWithYourWallet

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