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Pace times AI Legend vs Expert

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s1234 said:
Yep Im doing the career with McLaren, I'm not so fast than I want, but is a lot easier than a low car.
yeah that's why I chose the McLaren too middle of the road team as I didn't want to  start at the back with this game and didn't want to make things too easy on myself either. I've only got around to doing 4 races in my career mode so far   I've won 2. Bahrain which was faitly easy as I pretty much was the fastest guy out there all weekend there but that's always been a track I'm quite solid on. The other was China where I pretty much was fighting both Mercs and Vettel all the way. Was probably one of my favourite races I've ever had on that track. Not my favourite track but it was a massively fun race

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Not to blow my own trumpet here, but if any of you guys who find legend too fast but expert too slow, I'd advise you to pop over to racedepartment forum and download a mod I created today which narrows the time gaps for the difficulty settings between expert and legend. It made expert level a little faster than what it currently is, so hopefully you won't be finding expert level too slow anymore.

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TL77 said:
Anyone else notice the AI pace difference on certain tracks? So far I've found Spain to be the most difficult, on Expert AI I couldn't even make it into Q2 in a McLaren when normally I qualify in the top 6. I just wish the AI difficulty was consistent on every track.
Yes, certain tracks are coded at different difficulty levels than others. I've seen in the games database.

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Not to blow my own trumpet here, but if any of you guys who find legend too fast but expert too slow, I'd advise you to pop over to racedepartment forum and download a mod I created today which narrows the time gaps for the difficulty settings between expert and legend. It made expert level a little faster than what it currently is, so hopefully you won't be finding expert level too slow anymore.
Damn I wish I had pc so I could make carrer more enjoyable. Just done 2 races now on legend and went backwards the whole race :( yet in gp mode I can match them. Nice job tho as think few are finding expert to easy so havent got a difficulty that suits them. Every year there are ppl who cant get the pace that suits them thats why I hope codies put in a slider next year with 10-15 sec between slowest and fastest times, least then we can all find a difficulty that suits. Surely cant be to hard to programme such a feature but then again im no dev.

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s1234 said:

I think 4 seconds slower are too much gap. I think 2 seconds slower with each mode are enough.
Yep, this is BY FAR my biggest problem with the game right now.  It's almost impossible to dial in the AI difficulty so it's not extremely easy or extremely hard.  I can dominate a race winning by 30 seconds on expert (in a Williams), then on legend I struggle to even stay in the points.  There really needs to be some sort of middle ground.

Right now the only way to make the single-player/career interesting is to lower the difficulty and drive for Marussia/Caterham, which isn't exactly what most F1 fans dream of.  I do like how much more difficult the cars are to drive though and online mode is fun.

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mmpaw37 said:

I can tell everyone it is down to setup...FACT!.

I only have been using Legend difficulty since 2010, I use the hardest settings because I like a challenge, and this year, I believe Codemasters have done a sterling job!(apart from the first corner AI).

I am on PC and have been doing modding since release day of this years title, so I haven't had much racing time, basically just doing my mods and testing them in time trial.

HOWEVER..., I did my first full 100% race at Bahrain the other day and was blown away by the pace in this years Legend difficulty!. I had a very good race and without question, it was without doubt the best racing experience I've had.

Now, what I can say is that, it took me quite a while to fine tune my qualifying/race setups. I was having particular problems in qualy, where at first I couldn't get any better than 10th...Using the MERCEDES!                      

But after many tweaks, I managed to acquire a time in which I could've managed pole, and its all a matter of technique I believe. I was around a tenth slower than Rosberg who beat me to pole, pole time was roughly around a 1m33.7.

So, all in all, I understand people have their thoughts and opinions about this and that but, in light of my experience at Bahrain, I am now 1000% convinced its all down to setup!.

What is your setup?

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mmpaw37 said:

I can tell everyone it is down to setup...FACT!.

I only have been using Legend difficulty since 2010, I use the hardest settings because I like a challenge, and this year, I believe Codemasters have done a sterling job!(apart from the first corner AI).

I am on PC and have been doing modding since release day of this years title, so I haven't had much racing time, basically just doing my mods and testing them in time trial.

HOWEVER..., I did my first full 100% race at Bahrain the other day and was blown away by the pace in this years Legend difficulty!. I had a very good race and without question, it was without doubt the best racing experience I've had.

Now, what I can say is that, it took me quite a while to fine tune my qualifying/race setups. I was having particular problems in qualy, where at first I couldn't get any better than 10th...Using the MERCEDES!                      

But after many tweaks, I managed to acquire a time in which I could've managed pole, and its all a matter of technique I believe. I was around a tenth slower than Rosberg who beat me to pole, pole time was roughly around a 1m33.7.

So, all in all, I understand people have their thoughts and opinions about this and that but, in light of my experience at Bahrain, I am now 1000% convinced its all down to setup!.

The problem is not everyone is as good at the game or making setups as you.  If someone is say 2 seconds off your pace for example, their choices are legend difficulty where they will lose 2 seconds per lap to the AI, or expert difficulty where they will be 2 seconds per lap faster than the AI.  Neither one is very fun, and it sort of defeats the purpose of having multiple difficulty levels in the first place.

It's fine that they made legend harder for people who want a serious challenge, I just think there needs to be a much smaller gap between difficulty levels for those of us who aren't quite as good.  4 seconds slower each time you drop one difficulty level is just way too much.

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travbrad said:
mmpaw37 said:

I can tell everyone it is down to setup...FACT!.

I only have been using Legend difficulty since 2010, I use the hardest settings because I like a challenge, and this year, I believe Codemasters have done a sterling job!(apart from the first corner AI).

I am on PC and have been doing modding since release day of this years title, so I haven't had much racing time, basically just doing my mods and testing them in time trial.

HOWEVER..., I did my first full 100% race at Bahrain the other day and was blown away by the pace in this years Legend difficulty!. I had a very good race and without question, it was without doubt the best racing experience I've had.

Now, what I can say is that, it took me quite a while to fine tune my qualifying/race setups. I was having particular problems in qualy, where at first I couldn't get any better than 10th...Using the MERCEDES!                      

But after many tweaks, I managed to acquire a time in which I could've managed pole, and its all a matter of technique I believe. I was around a tenth slower than Rosberg who beat me to pole, pole time was roughly around a 1m33.7.

So, all in all, I understand people have their thoughts and opinions about this and that but, in light of my experience at Bahrain, I am now 1000% convinced its all down to setup!.

The problem is not everyone is as good at the game or making setups as you.  If someone is say 2 seconds off your pace for example, their choices are legend difficulty where they will lose 2 seconds per lap to the AI, or expert difficulty where they will be 2 seconds per lap faster than the AI.  Neither one is very fun, and it sort of defeats the purpose of having multiple difficulty levels in the first place.

It's fine that they made legend harder for people who want a serious challenge, I just think there needs to be a much smaller gap between difficulty levels for those of us who aren't quite as good.  4 seconds slower each time you drop one difficulty level is just way too much.
they tried to make the gaps smaller in 2013 tbh and screwed up the easier levels because of it what they probably need is another setting in between expert and legend and then hopefully that should solve the problem. TBH I think the problem with these F1 games is that it needs 1 or 2 more difficulty settings at the higher end than it currently has. Not the ones that exist being messed with otherwise we risk ending up with another F1 2013 mess that nobody is happy with. 

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mmpaw37 said:

I can tell everyone it is down to setup...FACT!.

I only have been using Legend difficulty since 2010, I use the hardest settings because I like a challenge, and this year, I believe Codemasters have done a sterling job!(apart from the first corner AI).

I am on PC and have been doing modding since release day of this years title, so I haven't had much racing time, basically just doing my mods and testing them in time trial.

HOWEVER..., I did my first full 100% race at Bahrain the other day and was blown away by the pace in this years Legend difficulty!. I had a very good race and without question, it was without doubt the best racing experience I've had.

Now, what I can say is that, it took me quite a while to fine tune my qualifying/race setups. I was having particular problems in qualy, where at first I couldn't get any better than 10th...Using the MERCEDES!                      

But after many tweaks, I managed to acquire a time in which I could've managed pole, and its all a matter of technique I believe. I was around a tenth slower than Rosberg who beat me to pole, pole time was roughly around a 1m33.7.

So, all in all, I understand people have their thoughts and opinions about this and that but, in light of my experience at Bahrain, I am now 1000% convinced its all down to setup!.

Soz but if you only raced bahrain then you cant really say it is down to setup! It is one of the AI slowest tracks (legend) along with monty and the other new track's. Try a race at spain in carrer then tell me that my setup is wrong! Any track with med speed traction zones the AI are so op in carrer (my opinion) that even the top youtube guys struggle to match there sector times. If you want to share your setups with all us struggling to find the sec needed in carrer then pls do as right now expert is far to easy but legend is bit to much for some of us to match our team mates pace. Btw I assume you were racing GP mode if thats the only race that you have done? Gp mode is easy to match and beat there pace but when the car is 2 sec slower in carrer imo its not just down to setup! I did quali at china after practicing for hour and got a 1.40 something which only got me p11 (might have been 12) so went to GP mode and my first lap was a 1.38! Same setup used and same car so clearly it is NOT just down to setup why some of us are struggling in carrer mode.

Edit: Btw not saying my setups are optimal but there is a huge difference to GP mode grip and carrer mode. Try to get a setup where you can live with them out of the last corner of australia for 58 laps then tell me its JUST my setup is the point im trying to make. Basically dont base your opinion on GP/online as half the time It feels like last years game it so much easier than carrer mode. I love the challenge of driving the cars in carrer but when I need 1.2 sec on most tracks with med speed traction zones im left frustrated as im going backwards half the time. Tracks like bahrain, monty, canada, austria are quite easy for me to match them but sometimes I loose up to half a sec on one corner in tracks like aus, spain, china and thats not just down to how im driving as other top guys are loosing time also (although they make up more time in other corners so they dont loose so mush time over a lap I do) Love the game and pace of the AI but in carrer Im left with 2 difficultys that are not fun racing.

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Im doing the mid races of the season, Canada, Austria, Monaco... and did the pole position in this three circuits, and podium in two of them. I think the difficulty between tracks is very variable, so Australia is difficult (traction problems), and Austria is easy because traction is not a key factor. The last corner of Silverstone is very difficult because traction. The A.I. did it as they has Control Traction.

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As others already mentioned, I the gap is too big in my opinion.

I started my Career on Expert as I found out that the AI were too fast on Legend with a steering wheel. I joined Caterham, as I prefer working myself up during some seasons. Anyway, here are the first race details: Australia - qualifying: 21st, race: last position (20 seconds gap to the car in front).

As you might understand I was not quite enjoying the race. Therefore, I dropped the difficulty level by one to Professional. Long story short: I passed Q1 in 5th, with my Caterham.

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mmpaw37 said:
vtidixon said:
 

Soz but if you only raced bahrain then you cant really say it is down to setup! It is one of the AI slowest tracks (legend) along with monty and the other new track's. Try a race at spain in carrer then tell me that my setup is wrong! Any track with med speed traction zones the AI are so op in carrer (my opinion) that even the top youtube guys struggle to match there sector times. If you want to share your setups with all us struggling to find the sec needed in carrer then pls do as right now expert is far to easy but legend is bit to much for some of us to match our team mates pace. Btw I assume you were racing GP mode if thats the only race that you have done? Gp mode is easy to match and beat there pace but when the car is 2 sec slower in carrer imo its not just down to setup! I did quali at china after practicing for hour and got a 1.40 something which only got me p11 (might have been 12) so went to GP mode and my first lap was a 1.38! Same setup used and same car so clearly it is NOT just down to setup why some of us are struggling in carrer mode.

Edit: Btw not saying my setups are optimal but there is a huge difference to GP mode grip and carrer mode. Try to get a setup where you can live with them out of the last corner of australia for 58 laps then tell me its JUST my setup is the point im trying to make. Basically dont base your opinion on GP/online as half the time It feels like last years game it so much easier than carrer mode. I love the challenge of driving the cars in carrer but when I need 1.2 sec on most tracks with med speed traction zones im left frustrated as im going backwards half the time. Tracks like bahrain, monty, canada, austria are quite easy for me to match them but sometimes I loose up to half a sec on one corner in tracks like aus, spain, china and thats not just down to how im driving as other top guys are loosing time also (although they make up more time in other corners so they dont loose so mush time over a lap I do) Love the game and pace of the AI but in carrer Im left with 2 difficultys that are not fun racing.

Hey chill out, I never said your setup was bad, far from it. And, unlike some others here on this forum, I try to help people if I can, not try to belittle them when they are having issues.

Anyway, yes I only did my first GP at Bahrain and obviously not in career mode, if I don't have the facts then obviously I can't just make an assumption. However, to be quite honest with you, even though my race at Bahrain was probably the best race I've had in these titles, I must admit it took a very long time to get a setup where I was actually able to compete with Rosberg using the sister car.

Like I said, until I start a career for myself I can't give any opinions, and therefore you are most likely right. I think Codemasters did a bad thing in taking the other 2 practice sessions away, and as it stands now, it very clear these are very much needed and DO play a big part in the overall experience of the game.

Also, I would like to add that although I finished second on the podium, I think I would've been able to win the race if it were not for the A.I.'s none existent fuel consumption, I did manage to pull some seconds back to Rosberg but I think they need some adjustment, it appeared as though it wasn't effecting them really.


No need to chill out :) just correcting you as you said you are 1000% sure its down to setup when It clearly isnt just that why some of us struggle in carrer mode. Ill give your setup a go in the morn and see what time I can get in gp with it. I know you trying to help I just think that you should do some carrer races against legend before telling ppl they are setting the car up wrong thats all as the cars are 2 sec slower so going off that you would be in the same boat as many of us in carrer if you werent able to beat rosberg in GP mode. What do you mean dont suffer fuel consumption? They run mix 3 for a long time at the start off the race but often suffer big at the end as they are fuel saving (engineer tells me) Ive made up to 1 sec a lap (GP mode) sometimes as ill often save fuel in the middle of the race so I can run mix 3 when the car is lighter as I feel thats the quickest way for me to race. Wasnt having pop mate just think you need to do more than 1 race with the AI before making any decisions. 

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mmpaw37 said:
scfreak21 said:
 
What is your setup?

Here is my setup for Bahrain:

WINGS:    6  Front  /   2  Rear

BRAKES:    52% Front  /  48%  Rear: High Pressure: Standard Size

ANTI-ROLL BAR:  6  Front  /  8  Rear

SUSPENSION:   Height: 1  Front  /  2  Rear: Stiffness  10  Front  /  8  Rear

CAMBER: Front  -3.50  /  Rear  -1.40

               Toe:  Front  -0.05  /  Rear  -0.20

I just gave your setup a try and it was about .3 quicker than the standard setup.  I was able to do a 1:33.7 with your setup, and a 1:34.0 with the standard setup.  An improvement, yes, but not enough to make up the 2 seconds that I am behind the CPU in Australia.  I haven't done any race besides AUS so maybe the CPU is easier at Bahrain, which has been mentioned in this forum, but it doesn't seem like tweaking the setup is enough to compete on legend.  I am still open to the fact that with enough practice and the perfect setup maybe legend can be done, but the difficulty settings need to be adjusted.  Legend could maybe left alone, but expert needs to be harder, or they need to make an entirely new level (which won't happen).  Hopefully they don't sit on their thumbs for too long cause I'm getting tired of driving around tracks by myself because I'm lost between difficulties.  It's rather lonely...

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scfreak21 said:
mmpaw37 said:
scfreak21 said:
 
What is your setup?

Here is my setup for Bahrain:

WINGS:    6  Front  /   2  Rear

BRAKES:    52% Front  /  48%  Rear: High Pressure: Standard Size

ANTI-ROLL BAR:  6  Front  /  8  Rear

SUSPENSION:   Height: 1  Front  /  2  Rear: Stiffness  10  Front  /  8  Rear

CAMBER: Front  -3.50  /  Rear  -1.40

               Toe:  Front  -0.05  /  Rear  -0.20

I just gave your setup a try and it was about .3 quicker than the standard setup.  I was able to do a 1:33.7 with your setup, and a 1:34.0 with the standard setup.  An improvement, yes, but not enough to make up the 2 seconds that I am behind the CPU in Australia.  I haven't done any race besides AUS so maybe the CPU is easier at Bahrain, which has been mentioned in this forum, but it doesn't seem like tweaking the setup is enough to compete on legend.  I am still open to the fact that with enough practice and the perfect setup maybe legend can be done, but the difficulty settings need to be adjusted.  Legend could maybe left alone, but expert needs to be harder, or they need to make an entirely new level (which won't happen).  Hopefully they don't sit on their thumbs for too long cause I'm getting tired of driving around tracks by myself because I'm lost between difficulties.  It's rather lonely...
I really struggled at oz, china and spain mate but had alot easier time at bahrain and monty (which I won) :) so maybe drop diff for those or skip and do the others later in the season as im now at canada and got p3 (team mate p6) only 2 tenths of the mercs in quali and when I do my race later I think ill be able to fight for that podium till the end finally! The next few tracks I think will even things out abit as there not many med speed corners so should be able to match alonso's pace?? the next track im worried about is suzuka really but havent raced there yet so not sure how my grip will be compared with the AI. Hope thats the case anyway as those races I mentiond I was about 1.2 off alonso and was either going backwards or had a train behind me in the race :( Ill be happy if I can be within half a sec of alonso's pace each race so me fingers are crossed for some good races now on my nights off ;)

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