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MBKF1 said:
I was trying to think last night but I can't remember for the life of me, so maybe one of you lot can help.

Who was it that McLaren signed around 2 years ago, and was literally at the team for about 2 weeks? He was in a pretty top position, but left almost straight away, can't remember who it was.
Jost Capito.

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I've never heard of that name, must've been asleep back then.

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Jiggy said:
Meh, it happened to Lotus and Tyrrell and Brabham and Ligier. People couldn't believe it at the time either because they've known those teams when they were competitive and winning championships. Back then, those were the teams deemed too big to become backmarkers, but that's what they ended up being.

So with that in mind, when it comes to privateer-teams, it can also happen to the great British teams of our generation in McLaren and Williams. Maybe they won't even be on the grid in 5 years. Unless you're a factory team, it seems like your time in F1 is limited always. And that's even the case for factory teams, but they always are able to come back one day if they'd want it. Like Toyota or BMW. But for the privateers, when they're gone, they're gone forever. Unless the name gets bought by some dodgy Malaysian dude who needs a gimmick and drags it through the mud like Tony Fernandes and Lotus.
Lotus theoretically could return, as Lotus Cars exists - based in the same place as the old F1 team. But I doubt they make close to the money required, it would probably kill them as a company. F1 has just become far, far too expensive. Even a team like Force India, who came 4th last season is in trouble and scraping by race to race.

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I'm not sure that a budget cap would really help either because you still need to finish high enough to make the big bucks. I guess it would slow down the development of Mercedes and Ferrari but those teams have so many recesses and experience that they would still be able to make huge strides in development.

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I'm not sure that a budget cap would really help either because you still need to finish high enough to make the big bucks. I guess it would slow down the development of Mercedes and Ferrari but those teams have so many recesses and experience that they would still be able to make huge strides in development.
Well the pot would be more evenly shared, so those who finish last like Williams get more than they do now. And yes Ferrari and Mercedes would still have the advantage in terms of personnel for now, there is nothing saying that in future other teams couldn't spend more wisely and jump up to the front. It benefits teams that are more efficient with their spending! 

And if you're including the wages of your staff, which I assume we are, then you would have to seriously consider how much you spend on them anyway. Do you have enough cash left after you've bought the best aero team to actually develop other areas sufficiently, or have top level staff elsewhere? And of course this affects the drivers you choose, for smaller teams do you take a pay driver and totally free up part of the budget for R&D to push yourself up the grid car performance wise? Take a chance on a  rookie like Sirotkin, Harltley or Leclerc and hope your car is good enough to make up for any weaknesses? Or do you go for 2 world champions and hope you have a good enough car? 

I don't know how it treats engine manufacturers though, perhaps engine costs are written off as not everyone makes them in house? Instead I guess each engine department could have X amount to spend. FIA could even fully or partially subsidise the engines or something.

If nothing else it would make the sport more attractive for potential incoming teams and more sustainable for any teams currently in it. The turnover of teams is laughable in F1 history, how we have let some true giants of the sport die is a joke. Like Jiggy said, once a team dies, it's dead 99 times out of 100. And even the Lotus that came back into F1 in the 2010's was not the "real" Team Lotus of the 1960s-1990's.

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Didn't realise it was that serious.
https://twitter.com/f1enigma/status/1022054079785324549?s=19

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Hughesy said:
Didn't realise it was that serious.
https://twitter.com/f1enigma/status/1022054079785324549?s=19
Oh wow really RIP, you always saw him walking around the grid and pits from time to time.

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He always seemed like a nice bloke when interviewed.  He only went for shoulder surgery and died from complications, no idea what though.

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Hughesy said:
He always seemed like a nice bloke when interviewed.  He only went for shoulder surgery and died from complications, no idea what though.
A lot of sources suggest he was a heavy smoker and during the operation he developed a blood clot, which cut the supply to his brain and put him in a coma.

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Force India goes into administration but the team will be still racing at Hungaroring, hopefully their still racing for the rest of the year.

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Yep and it's Perez that has brought legal action against the team which had led to this. Must be pretty awkward. 

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Hughesy said:
Yep and it's Perez that has brought legal action against the team which had led to this. Must be pretty awkward. 
This mislead me a bit. Interesting thing though. I wonder if Force India will die like Manor GP.

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^Doubt it because Force India are a great team with fantastic potential for whoever picks them up whereas Manor were simply racing to stay alive, seems like they never had a direction coming into the sport. Just competing to try and make a quick buck

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Reub09 said:
^Doubt it because Force India are a great team with fantastic potential for whoever picks them up whereas Manor were simply racing to stay alive, seems like they never had a direction coming into the sport. Just competing to try and make a quick buck
Well currently Force India as it is will die and be reborn to my knowledge. If they get an owner that is.

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Uhh what the hell! He said his contract would be sorted next week, but now he's leaving? The only good team he could join is Ferrari. 

Edit: Nah he's gone to Renualt, this isn't going to be like Hamilton going to Mercedes, unless Renualt somehow get gud
https://twitter.com/redbullracing/status/1025336753530523648?s=19

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Massive surprise!! Don't think anyone was expecting that.. He must see something good behind the scenes at Renault, because that is a ballsy move.

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Lukedfrt said:
Massive surprise!! Don't think anyone was expecting that.. He must see something good behind the scenes at Renault, because that is a ballsy move.
Well Renault have won championships in the past obviously he feels he can drag them back up there either that or he thinks Renault are a better bet than Honda which wouldn't surprise me. Yes Honda are improving compared with how they were with McLaren but I think they still are in that improving phase. I have to admit though brave as it may be had I been in his shoes I might have made the same decision. I think the teams switch to Honda engines is what sparked this though

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Maybe that contract Max Verstappen was given, created more difference between him and Ricciardo in terms of status as we originally thought. This sounds like a move someone would do if he really wants to leave a team. Ricciardo might even be out before the end of the season in a straight swap with Sainz if Red Bull keeps flinging mud to Renault and vice versa.

The grid might really be shaken up, this cuts off the Ocon to Renault-rumors, which means Stroll might not join Force India after all or he will and someone that's legit good will be screwed, it opens up a Red Bull-seat that could go to Sainz or Gasly and if it's the latter, it could open up a Toro Rosso-seat, McLaren might keep both drivers after all..

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That's really a surprise. I get him being at Red Bull is probably a dead end as long as Max is there but Renault seems like a strange place to go, although he really had no other options. He's really banking on the new regulations making them good again, which isn't necessarily a bad bet but still. 

Honda currently isn't really up to it, but I figured if anyone can turn that around its Red Bull. I expect Red Bull to announce his replacement really soon. When Vettel left they didn't waste anytime. Sainz would make the most sense, but any delay kinda suggests that someone outside of Red Bull could come in. Since it's silly season it seems, possibly Kimi to Red Bull? 

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In the words of Stephen A Smith, "I like it but I don't love it"

I like it because in all probability it's a no lose situation for Ricciardo. Red Bull will not be contending for titles for the next two seasons, Ricciardo gets to prove his worth further against a strong driver in Hulkenberg and his options are still wide open for 2021. He's probably getting nicely paid too while he waits to see if Renault will turn in to a front runner. 

I don't love it though for the reason that this isn't a Hamilton to Mercedes, Vettel to Ferrari, Alonso to McLaren move. All those guys wanted to move to those teams and did so with varying degrees of success since. This just feels like Ricciardo wants a new scene and the actual teams he wanted a seat at aren't hiring, so Renault is his best bet of those left. I don't know if he truly believes that they'll be a front runner even when the 2021 regs come around. It's an out and out punt. 

I feel a bit sorry for Sainz. He hasn't done much wrong but it seems he was destined to lose his seat no matter what happened this season. If Gasly now gets promoted to the Red Bull seat ahead of him that will be a massive kick in the teeth. 

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Didn’t he try and force a move out of the Red Bull scene before they loaned him out to Renault, because if so I can’t see Red Bull taking him on. In saying that it is unfortunate his timing entering the sport as at Torro Rosso he was completely overshadowed by Max and his drives were belittled by the hype around Max

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Well if Renault didn't think Sainz was good enough for them, then I can't see Red Bull thinking he's good enough for them. 

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VetteIfan said:
In the words of Stephen A Smith, "I like it but I don't love it"

I like it because in all probability it's a no lose situation for Ricciardo. Red Bull will not be contending for titles for the next two seasons, Ricciardo gets to prove his worth further against a strong driver in Hulkenberg and his options are still wide open for 2021. He's probably getting nicely paid too while he waits to see if Renault will turn in to a front runner. 

I don't love it though for the reason that this isn't a Hamilton to Mercedes, Vettel to Ferrari, Alonso to McLaren move. All those guys wanted to move to those teams and did so with varying degrees of success since. This just feels like Ricciardo wants a new scene and the actual teams he wanted a seat at aren't hiring, so Renault is his best bet of those left. I don't know if he truly believes that they'll be a front runner even when the 2021 regs come around. It's an out and out punt. 

I feel a bit sorry for Sainz. He hasn't done much wrong but it seems he was destined to lose his seat no matter what happened this season. If Gasly now gets promoted to the Red Bull seat ahead of him that will be a massive kick in the teeth. 
I can see Gasly getting the seat because h ehas done quite well at Torro Rosso I'd certainly be tempted to promote him if I were Red Bull. Sainz is good but he hasn't shone as much as some of the other drivers RB have had.

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