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The Formula 1 Stuff Thread


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It's such a shame this has happened, now to all three of the newer teams! 18 cars isn't healthy and I can see another team, most likely Sauber, folding quite soon. What a shame, don't know what to say to be honest. It's odd how both Marussia and Caterham have gone into administration within three days of each other though.
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It's such a shame this has happened, now to all three of the newer teams! 18 cars isn't healthy and I can see another team, most likely Sauber, folding quite soon. What a shame, don't know what to say to be honest. It's odd how both Marussia and Caterham have gone into administration within three days of each other though.
yeah the only good news is that Marrussia might still be saved as there are some people interested in buying that team according to Sky Sports unfortunately we can't say the same for Caterham right now.
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formula 1 should adapt the rules and aim the championship at car manufacturers instead of these poorly funded privateer teams who always go bust and leave or morph into another team that folds 2-3 seasons later. good to see Honda coming back next year and hopefully other companies  like bmw, audi, vw, Toyota, ford, Vauxhall, Nissan etc could be attracted to the sport with these hybrid cars.

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@SamuelTrautman I actually kind of agree with you. I hope we have more manufacturer teams entering the sport in the next few years. As Mercedes have dominated this year it will hopefully prove that a car manufacturer can win in F1.

it's a shame it didn't work out for Toyota, Honda or BMW, but at least Honda are having another crack with McLaren, and if Audi got involved then that would be great.

But at the same time, the small privateer teams have always been a part of F1 and it would be a shame not to have them.
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The main problem aren't the new engines but the way the money which comes in through TV-righs  is being distributed. The richest teams get the most money, the teams at the back end don't get enough to even survive.
With the current system it's like sitting in a train which is heading towards abysm and instead of pulling the safety brake (in other words: make sure the money is being distributed in a way that keeps smaller teams alive) we're discussing how to change the color of the seats (in other words: introduce 3 car teams).
A third car won't solve the main problem, it'll only create a fake fullness of the grid. As soon as world famous brands find themselves in last place, they'll pull out of F1. We've seen that in the past with Honda for example. That's why those typical backmarker-teams are important. Apart from the fact that they add something in the sense of David vs Goliath and it's amazing to see them succeed every once in a while in beating more established teams. And sometimes they add magical moments which we keep talking about for a long time.

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The main problem aren't the new engines but the way the money which comes in through TV-righs  is being distributed. The richest teams get the most money, the teams at the back end don't get enough to even survive.
With the current system it's like sitting in a train which is heading towards abysm and instead of pulling the safety brake (in other words: make sure the money is being distributed in a way that keeps smaller teams alive) we're discussing how to change the color of the seats (in other words: introduce 3 car teams).
A third car won't solve the main problem, it'll only create a fake fullness of the grid. As soon as world famous brands find themselves in last place, they'll pull out of F1. We've seen that in the past with Honda for example. That's why those typical backmarker-teams are important. Apart from the fact that they add something in the sense of David vs Goliath and it's amazing to see them succeed every once in a while in beating more established teams. And sometimes they add magical moments which we keep talking about for a long time.

Exactly! Bernie needs to read this thread and view my TV money distribution figures :p 
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It's all fine and well saying make the money distribution more fair (that is the clear and obvious solution) but as I said at the bottom of page 78, while the strategy group exists, money distribution will never be fair. And considering the strategy group has an arrangement to be in place till 2020 don't hold your breath. Ferrari, Red Bull, Mercedes and Mclaren aren't going to give up their financial advantage while they're deciding the rules. From what I read Williams and Lotus are nothing more than participants - while they are involved in the group, they really don't get much say in anything. 
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formula 1 should adapt the rules and aim the championship at car manufacturers instead of these poorly funded privateer teams who always go bust and leave or morph into another team that folds 2-3 seasons later. good to see Honda coming back next year and hopefully other companies  like bmw, audi, vw, Toyota, ford, Vauxhall, Nissan etc could be attracted to the sport with these hybrid cars.

Honda is only supplying engines to McLaren, the only new team coming to F1 is Haas. (At the moment)
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I'd argue that for the sake of argumentative balance, it's fundamentally a good thing for smaller teams to fold. Less cars, through Darwinian principles obviously, would leave a much higher standard of cars on the grid. No more of these four-second slow cars who end up being lapped every race. Less pay drivers would mean that drivers are selected based on the quality of their driving, rather than how much money they can bring to the team. An exciting race on track could potentially open up the sport and competitors to a wealth of commercial opportunities too. After all, doesn't Formula One market itself as the pinnacle of motorsport?

Of course, the major drawback of this is that an over-commercialised sport could potentially become polarising to the core fan base as well as inaccessible to any new teams that are not backed by a major car firm or wealthy investor.
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I'd argue that for the sake of argumentative balance, it's fundamentally a good thing for smaller teams to fold. Less cars, through Darwinian principles obviously, would leave a much higher standard of cars on the grid. No more of these four-second slow cars who end up being lapped every race. Less pay drivers would mean that drivers are selected based on the quality of their driving, rather than how much money they can bring to the team. An exciting race on track could potentially open up the sport and competitors to a wealth of commercial opportunities too. After all, doesn't Formula One market itself as the pinnacle of motorsport?

Of course, the major drawback of this is that an over-commercialised sport could potentially become polarising to the core fan base as well as inaccessible to any new teams that are not backed by a major car firm or wealthy investor.
If the money was evenly split, teams wouldn't need to use pay drivers.

I've found out Marussia have £30 million worth of debt. If they stay in 9th place in the WCC, they get £35 million in prize money. This therefore means that a new buyer could potentially sort the debt out easily...
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Another stunning piece of journalism by sniffpetrol.com

http://sniffpetrol.com/2014/10/28/f1-retro-grid-filling-plan/#.VE-P25YgHCR

'With Caterham and Marussia out of this weekend’s US Grand Prix, Formula 1 bosses have come up with a radical plan to fill the vacant grid spots using sh*t teams from the past.'
If Super Aguri come back for the a couple of races then i'm all for it haha ;)
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So I've been plugging a few numbers based on a blog from Joe Saward, theses are the ESTIMATED values of prize money for each, 2013 & 2014.

All values in dollars

RBR:          2013: 200m, 2014: 167m
Merc:         2013: 105m, 2014: 154m
Ferrari:       2013: 185m, 2014: 185m
Lotus:         2013: 85m, 2014: 60m
McLaren     2013: 110m, 2014: 98m
Force India: 2013: 70m, 2014: 70m
Sauber:       2013: 65m, 2014: 50m
STR:          2013: 60m, 2014: 65m
Williams     2013: 55m, 2014: 95m
Marussia:   2013: 50m, 2014: 55m
Caterham:   2013: 10m, 2014: 10m

Total Prize Money/year: $1bn

A full breakdown of where all the money comes from will be posted later.

Appalling isn't it...
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So I've been plugging a few numbers based on a blog from Joe Saward, theses are the ESTIMATED values of prize money for each, 2013 & 2014.

All values in dollars

RBR:          2013: 200m, 2014: 167m
Merc:         2013: 105m, 2014: 154m
Ferrari:       2013: 185m, 2014: 185m
Lotus:         2013: 85m, 2014: 60m
McLaren     2013: 110m, 2014: 98m
Force India: 2013: 70m, 2014: 70m
Sauber:       2013: 65m, 2014: 50m
STR:          2013: 60m, 2014: 65m
Williams     2013: 55m, 2014: 95m
Marussia:   2013: 50m, 2014: 55m
Caterham:   2013: 10m, 2014: 10m

Total Prize Money/year: $1bn

A full breakdown of where all the money comes from will be posted later.

Appalling isn't it...


from what I can see it seems fair, if you finish the championship higher up you get more money, just like in other sports. with the exception of Ferrari who have always got a little bit more as they are the only team still in the championship since the beginning and are the best supported team in f1, bringing much needed revenue to the sport themselves
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So I've been plugging a few numbers based on a blog from Joe Saward, theses are the ESTIMATED values of prize money for each, 2013 & 2014.

All values in pounds

RBR:          2013: 123.8m, 2014: 103.4m
Merc:         2013: 65m, 2014: 95.3m
Ferrari:       2013: 114.5m, 2014: 114.5m
Lotus:         2013: 52.6m, 2014: 37.1m
McLaren     2013: 68.1m, 2014: 60.7m
Force India: 2013: 43.3m, 2014: 43.3m
Sauber:       2013: 40.2m, 2014: 31m
STR:          2013: 37.1m, 2014: 40.2m
Williams     2013: 34m, 2014: 58.8m
Marussia:   2013: 31m, 2014: 34m
Caterham:   2013: 6.2m, 2014: 6.2m

Total Prize Money/year: £624.5 million

A full breakdown of where all the money comes from will be posted later.

Appalling isn't it...
I've changed your figures into pounds for reference.

Now, a while ago you might remember that I came up with my own figure based on F1's 1.5 billion turn over. Below are the figures I came up with and the sums that each team would receive.

Rules (based on £1.5 billion per year income)

£600,000,000 prize pot

£600,000,000 split between 11 teams is £54545454 standard amount per team per year (for an 11 team championship)

WCC is a guaranteed £25,000,000 pay out, WDC a £10,000,000 pay out to the team and £5,000,000 to the driver.

Retaining the title adds £7,000,000 to both constructor received figures for each year, up to 3 bonuses (i.e. a maximum of £21,000,000 added to both figures before the amount is frozen)

A team finishing first and second in the WDC receives a £5,000,000 pay out.

Gaining 1 place in the constructor championship earns £3,000,000 bonus to the default pay out

Gaining 2 earns a £5,000,000 bonus

3 earns a £6,500,000 bonus

4 a £8,000,000 bonus

5 a £10,000,000 bonus

Plus £1,000,000 for each additional place.

Dropping places costs the team the same amount.

 

A team involved in the sport for a long time receives an additional £10,000,000 per decade they have been in the sport (without withdrawing). This is known as a dedication reward.

 

£150,000,000 of the remaining money will be given to the F1 Strategy Group (which would contain every team) to spread between the teams for them to spend on road car development.

The remaining cash is used to pay FOM’s bills, to allow CVC to make a profit and any more remaining cash goes into a fund that helps keep race tracks on the calendar until their contracts (e.g. Nurburgring) as well as a chosen selection of charities.

Now, for last year the teams would have got:

RBR: 131.5 m
Merc: 61m
Ferrari: 111.5m
Lotus: 54.5m
McLaren: 89.5m
SFI: 57.5m
Sauber: 71.5m
STR: 57.5m
Williams: 81.5m
Marussia: 57.5m
Caterham: 51.5m

Which is £825.5 million total

And this year, provided the WCC stays as it is:
Merc: 97.5m
RBR: 61.5m
Williams: 95.5m
Ferrari: 111.5m
McLaren: 94.5m
SFI: 54.5m
STR: 57.5m
Lotus: 46.5m
Marussia: 57.5m
Sauber: 68m
Caterham: 54.5m

Total payout is £794.5 million.

Whilst some of the big teams get a lot more, take into account that Sauber get more than Red Bull and Marussia and Caterham aren't all that far behind them. It does seem a lot fairer!

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