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VetteIfan said:
Caterham going beyond the call of duty in terms of desperate-ness by trying to get fan funding to race in Abu Dhabi. Even under the slight chance that they might race, surely it's just borrowed time.  
Yea they are in a lot of debt, so that small amount they want is going to do F all. Doesn't make sense to me...
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http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2014/11/16598.html

Ahh. no Sam, you're again wrong

Q: (Dan Knutson - Auto Action/National Speedsport News) Sam, do you plan to be involved in racing when you get back to Australia? And would you consider being involved in the V8 series down there?
SM:
 Thanks Dan. I think at this point in time, the first thing I want to do is get back to Australia. I’m still on this side of the world (Europe)
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Well, that's one step closer to the end of F1.

Too many old-fashioned people with too much greed is never a good recipe for a successful product.
Agreed! I think everyone will thank Bernie for what he has done in the sport, so many good things you cant list them all but its time for him to step down and move on, the bad is starting show more than the good. You cant last in a business like this on past glory, Brawn leant that the hard way. :( Old school methods just dont work anymore.
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SASBlink said:
Well, that's one step closer to the end of F1.

Too many old-fashioned people with too much greed is never a good recipe for a successful product.
Agreed! I think everyone will thank Bernie for what he has done in the sport, so many good things you cant list them all but its time for him to step down and move on, the bad is starting show more than the good. You cant last in a business like this on past glory, Brawn leant that the hard way. :( Old school methods just dont work anymore.
Indeed I think F1 need some sort of Financial Fair play rules in place and fast.
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SASBlink said:

this is why we all will never agree, I don't like Hamilton but damn he's a good driver I would never take that away from him though he is erratic at times like everyone else under immense pressure.

 @sasblink I have a few answers for your last response to me and the one above, cant be bothered quoting you lol, anyways here we go

1, vettel won in a toro rosso, is that not a bad car? lol I cant ever remember Alonso winning in a "bad" car- except Singapore but we all know what happened there in 2008, cheating from the team to get safety car out.

2, Alonso paid to get into f1 and look at him now, he was paying minardi via a sponsor, exact the same as Maldonado is doing. in fact Alonso brings sponsorship to every team with the backing of the don Emilio the owner of Santander.

1Vettel, the win was more luck and good strategy from the backroom team than anything.... The rainy conditions plus the team got the strategy right, you see lots of people wining in those conditions, that why people call it a lottery when it rains :)

2 lol about the alonso part, darn cheaters, your right about that part to an extent :stuck_out_tongue: he also won races last few years in the Ferrari's which were 2 secs off the pace....  but everyone could see his potential from the day he started racing, everyone was saying he was a multipliable world champion in the making, even without the sponsors every team would have him but not many have said the same about maldonaldo, which brings me back to my original point, after a few years in f1 you should have a good enough reputation to get into teams without the effect of giving them money..... take the sponsors away and where would he be?

A 2 second pace defeciet in Alonso's Ferrari? Yeah OK mate.
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
It's especially funny because Mercedes has said they'd pull out of F1 if they have to go back to V8s.

I still rather rules that don't allow a single team to dominate everyone... but I can't remember the last time that really was the case.
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
It's especially funny because Mercedes has said they'd pull out of F1 if they have to go back to V8s.

I still rather rules that don't allow a single team to dominate everyone... but I can't remember the last time that really was the case.
Maybe that's what he wants? Either that or they just don't want a rubbish Renault anymore. What makes me laugh is that neither Ferrari nor Mercedes would be likely to supply Red Bull, so the only option they'd have left would be Honda in 2016, but maybe McLaren would attempt to block that?

2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2010, and the first half of 2012 ;) But honestly, Red Bull have had their time, stop whining Horner and let another team shine for a while. If it carries on for as long then sure we'll all get bored of it, but right now this season has been fresh to me after the Vettel years.
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I thought RedBull is now the works team for Renault. II don't see this partnership just dying out over a lacklustre season which is relevantly successful might you add, just not up too what RedBull have been accustomed too over the past few years. 

I expect Renault to at least match the Mercedes engine next year, if they don't and aren't even close Horner may have a right to complain. 
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
It's especially funny because Mercedes has said they'd pull out of F1 if they have to go back to V8s.

I still rather rules that don't allow a single team to dominate everyone... but I can't remember the last time that really was the case.

Which is also ridiculous.I'm sick and tired of this from the top teams. ''We'll pull out if we don't dominate '' ''It's bad for F1 if X team gets there way and our advantage is lost'' '' Get rid of the small teams and give us more money ,it's all their fault that F1 is turning to s**t.'' I'm sick and tired of these greedy b******s running F1 and running the top teams. They don't have a care in the world about F1 and only care about their own success and their own wealth a don't care about the small teams , the fans or the sport. I hope I didn't offend anyone in this post but to open up Autosport.com and read ''Horner calls for F1 to return to old V8 engines'' ''Mercedes fears rivals risk harming F1'' and ''Lotus:Small teams didn't cause crisis '' (About Gerard Lopez being furious that Bernie has blamed the smaller teams for F1's financial crisis when the bigger teams blocked cost-caps) is disheartening and seriously p****d me off.
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While that's maybe their responsibility to F1, it's not their agenda. You've got to look at it from their side. Companies like Mercedes and Red Bull don't enter F1 thinking "how are we going to make F1 as great as possible". They're going in to F1 thinking "how are we going to win championships". If I was spending hundreds of millions per year to go and win championships the small teams would be of little concern to me as well. No-one in F1 has ever made themselves an advantage over the rest by being "fair". The mistake has been in deciding to put the big teams in charge of everything, from regulations to money distribution so that they have been able to use it even more directly to their advantage. 

That said, a (small) part of me would really love to see Force India, Sauber and Lotus actually boycott the last race. Maybe a pathetic 12 car grid (4 of which would be Red Bull owned) will wake Bernie and the big teams up to what needs to be done. 
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VetteIfan said:
While that's maybe their responsibility to F1, it's not their agenda. You've got to look at it from their side. Companies like Mercedes and Red Bull don't enter F1 thinking "how are we going to make F1 as great as possible". They're going in to F1 thinking "how are we going to win championships". If I was spending hundreds of millions per year to go and win championships the small teams would be of little concern to me as well. No-one in F1 has ever made themselves an advantage over the rest by being "fair". The mistake has been in deciding to put the big teams in charge of everything, from regulations to money distribution so that they have been able to use it even more directly to their advantage. 

That said, a (small) part of me would really love to see Force India, Sauber and Lotus actually boycott the last race. Maybe a pathetic 12 car grid (4 of which would be Red Bull owned) will wake Bernie and the big teams up to what needs to be done. 
I am looking at it from their side , and to be quite honest I still don't really understand it. What's the point of winning in F1 if the sport is torn down to the ground in a couple of years ? Also , I'm not really saying they shouldn't be trying their best to win. What I was trying to say is we need people who are passionate about the sport to run it. I doubt that will ever happen though as people get greedy when money is flashed , even if they are passionate about it.
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Honestly, with the idea that Formula E is going to move away from a one make series in a couple of seasons time (next year, maybe?), and because it is cheap, accessible and relevant, I could well see it replacing F1 as the pinnacle of motosport because F1 (and some of the fans) wants to go back to using irrelevant & outdated tech, and are pricing themselves out of the sport in a push to win so they make a profit. Legitimately, FE is the next big thing...
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Honestly, with the idea that Formula E is going to move away from a one make series in a couple of seasons time (next year, maybe?), and because it is cheap, accessible and relevant, I could well see it replacing F1 as the pinnacle of motosport because F1 (and some of the fans) wants to go back to using irrelevant & outdated tech, and are pricing themselves out of the sport in a push to win so they make a profit. Legitimately, FE is the next big thing...
we want outdated tech because it was faster. It's was insanity to think in 2004 we were seeing the fastest cars ever, but now in 2014 it seems a reality. Year by year F1 is getting slower.
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Gui1 said:
Honestly, with the idea that Formula E is going to move away from a one make series in a couple of seasons time (next year, maybe?), and because it is cheap, accessible and relevant, I could well see it replacing F1 as the pinnacle of motosport because F1 (and some of the fans) wants to go back to using irrelevant & outdated tech, and are pricing themselves out of the sport in a push to win so they make a profit. Legitimately, FE is the next big thing...
we want outdated tech because it was faster. It's was insanity to think in 2004 we were seeing the fastest cars ever, but now in 2014 it seems a reality. Year by year F1 is getting slower.
Slower lap times this year have very little to do with the new engines. Marginally slower lap times have more to do with the restrictions on aero and fuel limits. In fact thing's haven't really been much slower than 2013, with some laps times and average speeds especially being quicker in 2014.

And if you really want "outdated tech" you're really missing the point of Formula 1...
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
It's especially funny because Mercedes has said they'd pull out of F1 if they have to go back to V8s.

I still rather rules that don't allow a single team to dominate everyone... but I can't remember the last time that really was the case.
Last single team to dominate (most of the season) was Brawn GP 2009.
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So he's all happy when Red Bull is dominating, but whines now that Mercedes are... Normally Christian Horner has a pretty decent opinion, but saying that F1 should consider scrapping the V6's and going back to the V8's (because the Renault V8 wasn't crap maybe?) is just stupid. The racing this season has been fantastic, better than it has been in any of the 4 seasons Red Bull dominated, so I say keep things as they are.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/116729
It's especially funny because Mercedes has said they'd pull out of F1 if they have to go back to V8s.

I still rather rules that don't allow a single team to dominate everyone... but I can't remember the last time that really was the case.
Last single team to dominate (most of the season) was Brawn GP 2009.
I wouldn't personally say Brawn dominated the season. Dominated the first third then didn't have the resources to develop the car and basically crossed their fingers they weren't going to get caught by the end
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