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Achtung! Fix Ai before release!

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Posted (edited)

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how the AI times are generated in Rally? I mean, in RallyCross we have cars running and the AI doing it’s thing so it’s pretty obvious. I’m just wondering if there’s actually any AI doing virtual runs to set the times or if they are presets with random values within parameters for the chosen difficulty, so that for example in the default difficulty settings they are randomized between a minimum of “x” and a maximum of “y”.

Ps: I know this - although strangely within the topic of this thread - may sound irrelevant but in fact the chances of the AI times being corrected seem higher if they are presets. Otherwise the devs will have to fumble with the AI to get it right!

Edited by Mastoideu
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4 minutes ago, DieselPoweredJo said:

My suggestion:

Mk2 Golf
El Rodeo

Because it's short, I've been using this for testing times vs AI, and just because it was what happened to be the first combo I stumbled upon and stuck with it.

I hate those H2 FWD 😭 But I know that stage well from last week's WR challenge so I should be able to post reasonably fast times at least. I'll try to whip up a clip for you tonight when I get home

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1 minute ago, CatBadders said:

I hate those H2 FWD 😭 But I know that stage well from last week's WR challenge so I should be able to post reasonably fast times at least. I'll try to whip up a clip for you tonight when I get home

Thanks 🙂 Out of curiosity, why hate H2? Just a dislike of FWD?

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2 minutes ago, DieselPoweredJo said:

Thanks 🙂 Out of curiosity, why hate H2? Just a dislike of FWD?

For the most part, yeah. Honestly the H2 are turning out better and more fun than I expected, but I really just prefer the driving style of RWD/AWD. And the cars in all of those other classes are so much more fun. I'm also most comfortable at that point right after you break grip and start a slide - something that is basically the exact opposite of how to drive FWD lol. I'll still whip up a video though, it's always fun to force myself out of my comfort zone and see how far I can push it.

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Hmmm... I see notification "Catbadders mentioned you", but no post with mentioning I see. Looks like, its deleted... somebody afraid to converse with me?

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8 hours ago, LaPremierre said:

first of all, I can mention again, that in 15 years I could well teach myself to use arrows and oral notes. If you launched my recordings, you know, that I use NOT English. As for the arrows, they are necessary also, because co-driver notes sometimes too late and too early, and you must watch above for determine , whether 'cinq droute" which he tell correspond next turn or previous. For this game this problem is very actual. may be, even more, than Russian language support lack.

Pacenote call out timing can be changed in settings, you can make the co pilot call the notes earlier.

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21 hours ago, LaPremierre said:

Its strange to read. You can see well, that's me hold gas well, not less than Catbadders, but if even I hold it long time, I simply never reach that 160-170km/h, which he "keep". Nothing to keep for me.

But, then, while driving longer gears, I've not only lost generally in comparison with short ones, but also just the top speed was lower also! Its interesting paradox, which has to be discovered by developers.

And then again... in rally driving one of the main intakes for cornering fast is just to release gas without braking. Really, you can easy check it in this game also: you will keep speed better if you release gas, than if you continue to push it! Just such things are the criteria of rally simulator.

1. You can hear the engine and see your revs and speed drop as you lift off the throttle from 150kph to 130kph. Earlier in your run the car accelerated fast, are you just not pushing the pedal 100%?

2. Can you post a new video using default gears? (Longer gear ratios may not provide enough acceleration) The first video you posted is not a good comparison as the driving was poor compared to your later video. 

3. A popular technique in rally is to brake while holding full throttle, instead of lifting off the throttle. This keeps the revs high where there is more power. Your car appears to bog down at lower revs after you lift off.

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@LaPremierre make a video showing your input settings. Hold down your accelerator for 5 seconds, then hold down your brake for 5 seconds, then the clutch for 5 seconds, then turn the wheel fully to the left for 5 seconds and finally hold accelerator and brake for 5 seconds. This should show us if there is anything wrong with your inputs

Dirt Rally 2 2019.03.05 - 22.51.07.01.mp4_000000700.png

Dirt Rally 2 2019.03.05 - 22.51.25.02.mp4_000000766.png

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, DieselPoweredJo said:

Thanks 🙂 Out of curiosity, why hate H2? Just a dislike of FWD?

Drunk run for ya. wait for it to buffer. apparently IU can make top #13 while i'm durnk. @LaPremierre @DieselPoweredJo

 

edit - while watching the replay i realized my turn radius is half of what it normally is. I run 360° and this is definitely 180° :classic_laugh:

Edited by CatBadders
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Posted (edited)

@CatBadders Nice ethanol powered run!

My best attempt, same car settings (except for the alcohol) on PS4 Pro + T150.

 

Edited by Mastoideu
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7 hours ago, Mastoideu said:

@CatBadders Nice ethanol powered run!

My best attempt, same car settings (except for the alcohol) on PS4 Pro + T150.

 

much cleaner than mine well done :classic_laugh: 

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55 minutes ago, CatBadders said:

much cleaner than mine well done

Thank you but that was definitely not the intention. Just trying to reinforce your point in the argument with @LaPremierre. Unfortunately I cannot show my footwork.

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Posted (edited)

Eyb8MmL.png

 

Hey look we're 8 thousandths of a second off being time buddies @Mastoideu. I don't know the stage but damn, it's narrow and bumpy af. I reckon that record is up for grabs with shorter gears but I guess most of them are at the moment 😛

What was this thread about again lol

Oh what I meant to say was we clearly are playing 2 different games and your Golf is .008 faster than mine.

Got that record in the 205, it's betterrrr. I'm sure there's still a lot of time in there for the super fast.... or the sober lol

Edited by Cortextual
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For something actually relevant to the post the AI on 100% did a 2:22 so they actually destroyed us all. They used to cap the times based on a real fast driver but not sure how they do it now. If they still do he's pretty damn good.

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@Cortextual I believe that’s the reason why it’s called “El Rodeo” 😆. Lots of potencial to improve still. I may give it a try with the 205 just for fun. Unfortunately I don’t know jack about tuning so I’ll keep running with the defaults. Yep, the point is made (QED)... we have totally different games!!! 😂 

2:22 is surely out of my league 😞. Maybe if someone finds a nice tuning (and shares it)...

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1 hour ago, Cortextual said:

AI on 100% did a 2:22

Alright, I know I was drunk on my run and slower than I could be, but 2:22???? I was fighting for the WR in the R5 Fiesta with a 2:13.555

 

 Either we all suck at this game, or the AI needs some tweaking in the H2 FWD....

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22 hours ago, SkiddyMcCrash said:

Pacenote call out timing can be changed in settings, you can make the co pilot call the notes earlier.

As my friend confirmed for English nites, they are mostle too early, you simply forget them before reach what they mention, but when sharp 1-3 corner is in forward, it usually warns where you cannot do anything. Pacenotes sometimes help in such case. Generally co-drivers notes are really bad here.

 

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3 minutes ago, LaPremierre said:

they are mostle too early, you simply forget them

Remembering the notes is a skill. Making a map in your head of the next 2 or 3 turns is important in rally.

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22 hours ago, ark13700 said:

1. You can hear the engine and see your revs and speed drop as you lift off the throttle from 150kph to 130kph. Earlier in your run the car accelerated fast, are you just not pushing the pedal 100%?

2. Can you post a new video using default gears? (Longer gear ratios may not provide enough acceleration) The first video you posted is not a good comparison as the driving was poor compared to your later video. 

3. A popular technique in rally is to brake while holding full throttle, instead of lifting off the throttle. This keeps the revs high where there is more power. Your car appears to bog down at lower revs after you lift off.

So, unfortunately now it would be not so easy to make new recording: now I play usual game version, not deluxe (before I played with friend's one). So, its the problem.

But. looks like, I found additional part of solution: setting up accelerator saturation for 45% instead of 100 I go at straight much faster. May be, its also my fault, but nobody here didn't give me advise. And, of course, its brute mistake of developers: its their work to make workable default settings. I usually avoid to change such values because in different games "saturation" has simply opposite sense sometimes.

As for "popular technique"... I have doubts. May be, its work in some games, but generally its quite unnatural. Of course, sometimes I do similar things, but generally, if not to lock wheels, they keep their rotating without grip loss, and it helps much more.

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5 minutes ago, CatBadders said:

 Remembering the notes is a skill. Making a map in your head of the next 2 or 3 turns is important in rally.

No. Notes must correspond to visual info, otherwise they have not concrete sense. Of course, at high speed we need to receive early warning about sharp turn, but, as I mentioned, just this option missed in this game. In case of complex virage we really need hole packet of notes, but if co-driver mention 3 turns, devided with 300 metres on from another, it for nothing and only spoils. 

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40 minutes ago, LaPremierre said:

Notes must correspond to visual info

We just don't agree on this then. I don't care if I can see the turn when the co-driver calls a note. I can remember 3 or 4 notes ahead and I use that to drive faster. If you only drive by what you can see you can't push the limits.

 

If notes call "5 Right 6 Left Tightens 4" I use that to go faster. I will sit on the right side of the road and ignore the "5 Right", instead pretending it is a "6 Left Long". I then wait to downshift until the "Tightens" part. You can't do that if you only have notes you can see.

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3 hours ago, LaPremierre said:

As my friend confirmed for English nites, they are mostle too early, you simply forget them before reach what they mention, but when sharp 1-3 corner is in forward, it usually warns where you cannot do anything. Pacenotes sometimes help in such case. Generally co-drivers notes are really bad here.

 

 

3 hours ago, CatBadders said:

Remembering the notes is a skill. Making a map in your head of the next 2 or 3 turns is important in rally.

 

Interesting quote from @KickUp " The reason for co-driver calls is to describe the road ahead so that despite having not driven the stage before you can confidently attack the stage. Listening to the calls gives you a mental picture of the road ahead allowing you to approach corners with an understanding of the challenges they will present. "

http://blog.codemasters.com/dirt/04/co-driver-calls-explained/

 

That's a real rally co driver, explaining what his job is.

 

Now, a real rally driver explaining how he uses those pacenotes. (I know you don't speak English, so I'll type out what they are saying to each other), you can get your English speaking friend to verify what I type.

 

Woman - "So how far ahead of a corner do you need a pacenote then?"

Colin - "It depends on the speed of the car. At the moment we are going at very slow speeds, so we call the corner just before we get to it. At a higher speed we obviously we want the corners quite a bit further in advance. Sometimes at real high speed stuff, especially if it's very fast into a slow corner then we'll have maybe 3 corners in advance, which makes concentration very difficult. You're driving the car and you've got to remember what the last corner is, before you even get to the first corner that's been called".

 

 

And here is another professional co driver (and President of the Canadian Association of Rallysport)

"I always think of the co-driver as almost providing a sixth sense in the car,” says John Hall, president of the Canadian Association of Rallysport and professional co-driver. “When (the driver) is coming down the road, if there’s a crest he can’t see over, the co-driver has already said to him that there’s a tight right corner on the other side of that crest. So, that mental picture is already building in his mind ahead of time.

“That’s what the co-driver does, and it becomes an integral part of (the driver’s) ability to go fast.”

 

https://www.wheels.ca/news/what-makes-rally-racing-an-extreme-sport/

 

So that's DiRT Rally's Head Designer and in game co driver, the head of the Candian Association of Rallysport, and former WRC World Champion Colin McRae all agreeing with us and completely disagreeing with the following statement made by you.

 

2 hours ago, LaPremierre said:

No. Notes must correspond to visual info, otherwise they have not concrete sense. Of course, at high speed we need to receive early warning about sharp turn, but, as I mentioned, just this option missed in this game. In case of complex virage we really need hole packet of notes, but if co-driver mention 3 turns, devided with 300 metres on from another, it for nothing and only spoils. 

Are you saying that they are all newcomers who don't know what they are talking about?

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