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Dirt Rally 2.0 is wonderful. Stop complaining!

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10 hours ago, Mastoideu said:

@Fizzlenog I’m also struggling with that same problem, specially with the 80’s FWD cars but I just assumed that the culprit was my feeble driving skills so I kept on trying with different driving techniques but to no avail. Maybe someone more seasoned could jump in and either confirm that it is a problem with the game or give us some clues on how it’s done...

FWD naturally understeer most of the time, but at least with this game Unlike dirt 4 it's possible to tune a car to oversteer and it helps combat the understeer with lack of ffb problems

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7 hours ago, SimVansevenant said:

@Fizzlenog and @Mastoideu, what techniques have you been using (in detail)? 

I do realise that many set the car up nicely for a corner and then just floor the throttle. That was possible in e.g. Dirt Rally but not in Dirt Rally 2.0. If you are indeed doing that, it's no surprise that the car just spins out and you are facing the wrong way. That's how it is in real life as well, more or less. I'm not saying that it is a complete replication of sliding in real life but it's closer than ever before in many ways, especially on gravel. We know tarmac physics have undergone improvements but it is still a weak point. 

A combination of adjusting the amount of steering input while cornering and feathering or playing on the throttle and brakes until you reach that point you can floor it again, is quite the art style that takes many, many attempts to get right. Practise is key here so keep trying and don't give in. 

Tuning for oversteer helps but it's hard to pendulum flick with the ffb where it's at right now. Without a focused oversteer tune it's too easy to overturn the front wheels and understeer everywhere. I'm basically trying to say it's hard to say how good the physics are until the ffb is 100% like Xbox doesn't have any tire friction so it feels like driving a hovercraft. It is still possible to tell that there is great potential with this game when it's fixed and I can't wait.

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For the most part I agree with the OP. So far I am thoroughly enjoying the game and, most crucially, I think it's an improvement on it's predecessors...

...that said, I know bugs can be bothersome and, as others have already said, the risk of losing all your progress in the career is a bit more than an annoying glitch. I am not a fan of online dependant games but, if you are going to go that way, then a thorough testing of the system behind it seems like a obvious move to me. For whatever reason it seems like something was overlooked there and, like others, I am very reluctant to explore the career in any detail until the Racenet issued are addressed. 

For me though the above is a minor issue as, personally, freeplay offers much more to me than the career. I am really glad that CM have designed the game in such a way so, if you don't want to get bogged down finding funds for cars, you can just jump in and get on with it. Ease of (gameplay) accessibility is definitely one of the better things learned from DiRT 4!

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I need this for me: FFB ( of the terrain, you only hear the landing from the bumps after a jump, the crossing of metal gratings in Australia. you do not hear the irregular background, the stones ect.) - improve asphalt (today you already feel better than the first Dirt rally) - improve lighting and additional lights (too dark light, headlights made in the 80s?) - sore note: the notes translated from English to Italian are really very ugly (many words do not exist in the Italian pacenotes) - RWD cars: good on the asphalt, on the ground seem to run with asphalt tires, without guide aid I find them almost unworkable, even on RBR never so in difficulty.
there are many improvements compared to the first DR, some small steps back, all remediable. I hope the codies work well to fix. the base is good. criticizing constructively is good. There are many good simulators for those who love grand tourism, it is right that even the rally has its counterpart worthy of having a more than good level of simulation. one who has the rally in the blood asks for the best. and for the best, willingly pay.

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That fundamental problem which made D4 undriveable for me is sadly still present in DR2. Now you can break lateral grip under braking into the corner and induce a slide, but after you have reached the drift angle you wanted you can't transition into a throttle driven powerslide seamlessly. As soon as you hit the throttle magically a force awakens which makes the car want to go straigth again, this is even present in the FFB, where you have to steer again into the corner at that phase and fight against this pretty strong force. This is very unnatural, in DR1 this aspect was just fine, beside of the other disturbing problems (mostly the inaccurate weigth), but at least it was fun. For me now it is a struggle to fight against this lateral grip which is exactly the opposite of what should really happen, when the rear wheels loose traction. I mean they tried to overcompensate for this with the weight transfer, maybe this is a bit to much already, but not the biggest problem. This weird behaviour causes that you simply can't steer the car intuitively with the throttle, which actually would be the most important fun factor for me in such a game. It is simply unpredictable. Very sad, had high hopes in this title since real life drivers were involved in the development. The game doesn't have to be perfect for me, but this is a game changer factor in a rally game and because of it i feel again let down by codemasters. Oh and this is present with all the cars, but most noticeable with RWD. Rallycross is the worst in my opponion because of the very high grip levels. A 600 HP beast is way more nerveus to drive even on asphalt, they are all over the place if you kick the throttle down, you have to modulate it together with the steering to balance between under and oversteer through a corner. In this title they behave like they were guled to the track, and additionally they are also suffering from the same symptom which i described in the first place. Let's hope Project Cars 3 will have rally content, they nailed the physics in PC2 already, RX physics is simply perfect in it.

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1 hour ago, eckertb said:

Now you can break lateral grip under braking into the corner and induce a slide, but after you have reached the drift angle you wanted you can't transition into a throttle driven powerslide seamlessly. As soon as you hit the throttle magically a force awakens which makes the car want to go straigth again, this is even present in the FFB, where you have to steer again into the corner at that phase and fight against this pretty strong force.

I wish I could have said it this clearly!

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Well guys I may have a change in heart. While I didn't totally disagree with the op I hated the ffb(still a problem) and the understeer but I continued playing a lot. It was hard because it was boring, unforgiving, and just didn't feel right for a good while. Tuning and technique change both started to help my understeer issues. I decided to quit the multiplayer lobbies and dedicate to tuning and seat time on one track. I'm driving class A probably one of the more understeer AWDs in the game. Well something clicked and I CANT STOP PLAYING NOW. I just set a wr by over 2 secs on an Australian track and this game is actually amazing. Still improving and finally having a blast and when the update comes out this may be one of the greatest rally games ever; it's already close. Sorry for the rant but if you keep trying you'll see the light at the end of the tunnel and keep going you'll make it.

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49 minutes ago, Fizzlenog said:

Tuning and technique change

C’mon, help a brother out! I also want that click! What and how did you do it?

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1 hour ago, Fizzlenog said:

Well guys I may have a change in heart. While I didn't totally disagree with the op I hated the ffb(still a problem) and the understeer but I continued playing a lot. It was hard because it was boring, unforgiving, and just didn't feel right for a good while. Tuning and technique change both started to help my understeer issues. I decided to quit the multiplayer lobbies and dedicate to tuning and seat time on one track. I'm driving class A probably one of the more understeer AWDs in the game. Well something clicked and I CANT STOP PLAYING NOW. I just set a wr by over 2 secs on an Australian track and this game is actually amazing. Still improving and finally having a blast and when the update comes out this may be one of the greatest rally games ever; it's already close. Sorry for the rant but if you keep trying you'll see the light at the end of the tunnel and keep going you'll make it.

Of course one get used to it, but analog to this we could also have the physics of a hovercraft or a space shuttle and sell it as a state of the art rally sim game and say: get used to it!

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@eckertb You didnt mention which car you can't powerslide.  I've been messing with the Fulvia (FWD) and R5 Fiesta and they seem good and challenging like they should be.  I'm not sure why you think any car or any setup can transition into a power slide easily.  It really depends and can be very tricky IRL especially on tarmac.  What you describe literally is usually the norm and takes skill to hold a slide.  my2c

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6 hours ago, eckertb said:

Of course one get used to it, but analog to this we could also have the physics of a hovercraft or a space shuttle and sell it as a state of the art rally sim game and say: get used to it!

I think a problem some have is the stock cars are neutral or maybe a little on understeer side. Try to tweak a few things here and there and see how it works for you. If you are in a fwd car you could have the front camber around -1.25 and the back close to 0 which gives more front traction than rear when turning and stiffin up the rear anti roll bar. Dirt rally had everything setup for oversteer. I still would like the base physics to have a little more oversteer but it's hard to have exactly what one player wants and the challenges of batting both over and understeer is quite the fun challenge!

You can tweak the diffs in the awds but getting more oversteer results in very sketchy straight line stability in those 5 and 4 turns that requires off throttle or light braking.

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DR2 is of course a great game. No doubt.

The problem remains; Codies were making better games in 1997.

So, obviously those games weren't better in a technical sense, but they still hold up today. They were more consistent in design and rarely flawed in any particularly area for the time. So why is these days, games from Codemasters, are always great in most areas and completely lacking in other areas?

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2 hours ago, Fizzlenog said:

I think a problem some have is the stock cars are neutral or maybe a little on understeer side. Try to tweak a few things here and there and see how it works for you. If you are in a fwd car you could have the front camber around -1.25 and the back close to 0 which gives more front traction than rear when turning and stiffin up the rear anti roll bar. Dirt rally had everything setup for oversteer. I still would like the base physics to have a little more oversteer but it's hard to have exactly what one player wants and the challenges of batting both over and understeer is quite the fun challenge!

You can tweak the diffs in the awds but getting more oversteer results in very sketchy straight line stability in those 5 and 4 turns that requires off throttle or light braking.

Tweaking the car's setup could of course be a possible workaround, but it would probably result in weird behaviour, just in a different way. There should be no possible setting of any kind in terms of diff or suspension which results in improved lateral grip when spinning the rear wheels...

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What I still find very sketchy is that Codemasters never mentioned this Career-Online-Requirement before Release. And even sketchier that there is still no mentioning of this Requirement on the Steam Storepage. The least Codemasters could do is make the customer aware of this before purchasing the game.

 

I said this once before (more as a joke back then), but with all these big and little quirks surfacing maybe Codemasters should really go down the Early Access-Route again for a potential follow-up. I´m pretty sure the game could only benefit from this on release at this point.

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6 minutes ago, Civarello said:

What I still find very sketchy is that Codemasters never mentioned this Career-Online-Requirement before Release. And even sketchier that there is still no mentioning of this Requirement on the Steam Storepage. The least Codemasters could do is make the customer aware of this before purchasing the game.

 

I said this once before (more as a joke back then), but with all these big and little quirks surfacing maybe Codemasters should really go down the Early Access-Route again for a potential follow-up. I´m pretty sure the game could only benefit from this on release at this point.

when someone has steam i presume he has internet, if not how should someone download any game? 😄

that rant about online carrer is really annoying  tbh

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I'll start buy saying I've had a fun time so far and haven't had any racenet issues.  As a former Raceroom beta tester I fully understand the reasoning of always online....to protect it's content from being ripped, cheaters, and make esports events fair.

My issues on PC:

The FFB is pretty bad, yes it may have improved in ways like the feeling of weight transfer....but you also get weight transfer in a hovercraft, which is what this title currently feels like for wheel users.

The new track degrading system....

It's not dynamic like PC2 or iRacing and just seems to be 3 baked presents based on your starting position. Wet tracks in RX have little to no grip effects for the user while the ai struggles.

Ai...needs alot of work with it's lines and positional awareness as well as it's level of fairness based on setting of difficulty.

MP...is it broken or is no one playing? Nearly 30hrs in game and the most I've seen is 2 servers with 8 users.  8/10 times no servers are found.

Audio...random loud pops that cause the audio to cut out putting an end to the session.

Tuning...no tire pressure adjustments?  Tuning is pretty simplistic with it's slider system that has large gaps between each adjustable point.  Regarding tuning, why are rain tires available sometimes but not always during wet sessions?

Hardcore damage...not very hard when only visual damage is effected.  Make my wheel be off centered so it at least gives me a challenge to finish and remove the ability of restarts.

My team...was hoping for it to be a bit more in-depth.....basically paying to reduce your penalty times

Option Menu's...some have informative info for the sliders while others (ffb + graphics) have zero options of what the sliders do.

100% CPU usage in some of the menus/replays causes stuttering and fps drop.

IMO Dirt 2.0 still caters to the console pad user with simplistic user controls.....which makes sense as consoles is where the $$$$ is at.

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On 2/27/2019 at 9:57 PM, austinb said:

The only issues I've had is the "connection failed" screen after finishing an event. However, each time this happens, it works properly when I click "Retry".

How bad is the issue for you? Can you actually not play it at all?

It deletes the saves if it can't connect. I've tried for 15 minutes and gave up. Don't want to start career again until this isn't fixed. What makes me mad is that this game is amazing, i love it, but i don't want my progress deleted randomly.

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How could be a racing game "wonderful" if it has no FFB Effects (yet)?
Go back to your mobile phone and play Asphalt...

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30 minutes ago, mesa said:

How could be a racing game "wonderful" if it has no FFB Effects (yet)?
Go back to your mobile phone and play Asphalt...

T150 + Jon's settings and the FFB is already better than, for example, in WRC7. Of course it still needs tweaks, but what on earth are you talking about?

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On 3/1/2019 at 1:35 PM, andmcq said:

DR2 is of course a great game. No doubt.

The problem remains; Codies were making better games in 1997.

So, obviously those games weren't better in a technical sense, but they still hold up today. They were more consistent in design and rarely flawed in any particularly area for the time. So why is these days, games from Codemasters, are always great in most areas and completely lacking in other areas?

Better how?

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13 minutes ago, mumblesh said:

Better how?

As I said, better design. A more complete package. 

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2 minutes ago, andmcq said:

As I said, better design. A more complete package. 

Oh right, better design. More complete. What are you missing that was in Colin McRae then? Seeing as this is the only direct comparison. I'm curious.

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2 minutes ago, mumblesh said:

Oh right, better design. More complete. What are you missing that was in Colin McRae then? Seeing as this is the only direct comparison. I'm curious.

Well, it's not much what's missing from Toca/CM it's more that there's additional things in Codies games nowadays that don't exactly add to the experience in a positive way. For example;

- Broken FFB systems
- Save game bugs
 

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9 hours ago, andmcq said:

Well, it's not much what's missing from Toca/CM it's more that there's additional things in Codies games nowadays that don't exactly add to the experience in a positive way. For example;

- Broken FFB systems
- Save game bugs
 

So it's quality control that's your beef. I'd say the games are better but still not pushing the boundaries as much as we'd like. But then CM seem to have a philosophy of providing racing that tries to capture the excitement of the sport and usually do it in an ”accessible” way. Presentation has been hit and miss but I like the clean front end they use in DR. But the fun factor is always most important.

FFB was not too bad in DR and yet instantly in 2.0 we have something not feeling right. That's got to be a quality control issue because sliders are greyed out that weren't before and some seemingly do nothing. Save bugs and tweaks to the network structure cause issue without public beta testing, this is bad for their PR no doubt.

Since CM moved to include PC gaming in their multi platform mix there have always been compromises. When they only had playstation to deal with, sure, maybe the quality will have been higher. I feel CM are stretched and it shows. It's not got the budget of the big boys and maybe that rears its ugly head a little. More focus on its key IP's would really bring the company to the fore to a select group of diehards, but running a business is a juggling act. Catering only for the hardcore will not bring in the kind of cash this old school developer now surely needs. Something has to give.

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It's also the fact that due to the budget being lower than other studios that I have a tremendous apreciation for what's been done and what's being done. But not many people know that, or knew the recent past of CM, and more particularly the DiRT department situation.

With conditions like these, they still manage to pull off the best rally game to date once again. That's why I think we should support this project if we want to play a quality game that best represents the sport we love.

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