Jump to content

How do I shave those last seconds?

Recommended Posts

I need some really good tips on how to sqeeze the cars to the max.

Playing mostly daily, weekly and monthly races, Im now experiencing that the gap to the lead is increasing.

In the beginning I was around 6seconds behind the lead pr split, but now Im around 10seconds behind. Mostly ending between tier 3-2

So where should I start, trying to improve?

-I play on regular ps4, with the g29 wheel,

-use cockpit view,

-use semi auto gear (as Im not good enough yet to drive stick, but Im practicing), with downshift in the left paddle, and upshift on the O button

-I use the right paddle as handbrake

-I have no idea on how to tune my car, so I have to rely on my chief engineer. I really wish there was a way to upload/download settings here CM. 

- I myself feel that Im starting to get the hang of the driving part, with the right speed in to corners, momentum and so on. And the car is usually in good shape, crossing the finish line. But tips is very welcome

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The differences you are seeing are from people memorizing the stages like tracks basically.  For the most part.  Also lots of those people have been attempting time trials and that gives you a boost of speed (and hence also the memorization)

 

Your crew chief does tuning?  wow.  Please explain as I don't know how that works.  (the default setups are just default AFAIK) 

Edited by bn880
  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, bn880 said:

Also lots of those people have been attempting time trials

Honestly I hate to admit it, but I think this is really helping the top times. When I do my unfamiliar Longs that don't have a Sprint where I've been chasing WR recently, my times take a noticeable hit because I'm not being as flatout ballsy as I can be. But when the next daily is on a Long where I've been chasing a GprB RWD Sprint WR the night before, I find I can match/beat the pace time pretty easily. Seat time just really seems to add up =/

 

I think the other big thing to keep in mind, is that as time goes on people are maxing out the upgrades on their cars. A T5 engine tune can go a long way to making a car faster than a T2 tune. 

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly I don't understand what fun people find in chasing world records in time trials. Okay, for some time you are at the top of the leaderboards, but you effectively strip yourself from the fun that comes with rallying. Once I spent one evening compulsively trying to beat H2 FWD AI on one Australian track, and now whenever it comes up in a daily or championship, I don't feel like driving it because it's too familiar and I'm sick of it.

  • Agree 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, danielofifi said:

Honestly I don't understand what fun people find in chasing world records in time trials

Same kind of people who just have an unnatural obsession with being more efficient and enjoy chasing a perfection they can never reach. I get how it can make a stage boring or old for people, but for me that really never happens. I can sit on a stage for 2 hours one night, and do it all again the next night having just as much fun. But I've been this way since I was 12 on a Gamecube playing 1080 Avalanche or GT back on my PS1, or even doing Sonic speed runs against my brother back on the Sega. I may attack the same corner 100 times, but I never will attack that corner and the previous/next one the exact same way that 100 times - every run is different from the last and squeezing out 100ths of a second gives a sweet satisfaction.

Edited by Mike Dee
  • Like 3
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Apart from memorizing tracks you really need to know how to tune, if you want to fight for top positions, and even that might not be enough since cutting corners/cheating is very much allowed in some locations, as of now. Not to mention skipping entire sections of road in Argentina by teleportation bugs.

  • Sad 1
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Pistro said:

you really need to know how to tune

While I think this can help a tremendous amount in making your car more consistent, I (personally) don't believe it makes you any faster outside of Poland where you have no choice but to extend the final gear if you want a chance. Now the cut-resets are a killer and so are some sections where you can literally drive 50ft off the stage without any penalty as you ignore 3 corners. But with those, nothing you can really do unfortunately =/

Doesn't really sound like that is OP's problem though since they are consistently losing a small amount of time each split which sounds like someone just running flatout or making smart cuts. @Grimstreaker999's best bet is probably just doing some time trial runs on any stage so that they can begin to learn how to really attack. Until you know a section decently well, you can't push the car to its limits and until you can push a car to the edge of those limits you can't actually figure out what it is capable of. A large chunk of the time OP might be losing could just be as simple as braking too early/too weak, not throwing the weight around enough, or just small little things someone who "lives" in that specific car knows and abuses every run. Kind of like me in the E30, I can mindlessly post top #10 times in that car, but I also have over 300 hours in it just between DR1 and 2.0 so I tend to do things most people wouldn't attempt in it... Same can be said for any other car.

  • Agree 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tuning does matter. While I'm no expert on tuning and too impatient to tinker around with settings instead of just driving, when really pushing it it definitely makes a difference. I only touch differential settings but finding the sweet spot between too little and too much traction in different situations definitely helped me shaving off a few seconds on a stage in time trial (and that wasn't Poland, it was NZ and Argentina).

The chief engineer's "recommendations" aren't recommendations at all. They're just default setups. Against all common sense, he even keeps recommending medium tyres.

Another matter is car choice, obviously. If you drive the DS, Ascona, Metro or NR4 Subaru you're going to lose a lot of time. Same for engine tuning, you will lose precious seconds if your engine isn't on maximum*.

*I'd finish in the top 3 all the time if I had the best car maxed out. Sadly, I can't max out the best car because then I wouldn't have this excuse anymore, would I.

Edited by DocStrangelove
  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, DocStrangelove said:

when really pushing it it definitely makes a difference.

I will give you that at the absolute limits, against the top 0.01% of drivers, that tuning can finally be the deciding factor. But absolutely everything before that moment can be simply overcome with changing the driving technique to be faster and cleaner. I hold a few WRs myself in everything from H2s to Group Bs (both 4WD & RWD), 2000cc to R5. I refuse to change from stock setup with soft tires. 

I used to tune the hell out of cars back in DR1 and eventually I took a break from the game for a bit. Came back months later and couldn't deal with my old setups anymore, they were just too specifically tuned for the "old" me. I then went back to stock and started messing around; by the end of the week I was crushing my old PB's which were already top #100's. Fully stock.

I realized that while I was able to tune the car to fit my style, by doing so I was actually tuning to compensate for my flaws and not adjusting to fix them for the car. That is why I say tuning doesn't matter. It makes you more consistent with your style when setup properly, no arguing that, but the car itself isn't any faster - consistency is what brought your times down.

 

I personally feel that tuning is used too much as a crutch, and while that is good people can lean it, a lot of the time it hurts them in the long run. You get to reinforce "bad" habits for longer because your times are getting faster so you don't stop to look for other areas of improvement, you end up focusing 100% on the car. It blinds people from changing their driving style to be more consistent itself which is where the real time comes from. Tuning might be able to shave you 4 or 5 seconds, but overcoming your own bad habits and getting more mechanically consistent yourself can net you 8 or 9 seconds before even getting greasy

 

/steps-down-off-soap-box =P

Edited by Mike Dee
  • Like 2
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Mike Dee

I understand what you mean, and generally I agree with it. By far the most important thing is good and consistent driving. I also generally ignore tuning and use the default setup unless I'm really struggling to beat a time trial WR.

I actually tried to get into tuning in DR1, I tried for hours but nothing good ever came of it, except for the Group A Subaru which I could make more tail-happy by using extreme differential settings. In DR2 I recently got into it again and it seems like I'm doing better this time.

It also greatly depends on the car you're driving. If I drive e.g. the 2000cc Skoda or the R5 Polo, there's not much I can do with tuning. This probably applies to most cars. Only when I had real trouble with the car's behaviour I could fix some of it with tuning. The two examples I'm speaking about are the Group A Cossie in NZ and the 911 in Argentina. The Cossie was too grippy, it gained too much traction mid-slide which I could fix by making it more slidy, which helped me gain a few seconds. In Argentina with the 911, there's this high-speed section where I always had to feather the throttle in the 90-95% area in 5th and 6th gear to keep the rear in line. After some setup changes, I could do most of it flat out which again gained a few seconds and eventually helped me breaking the WR (I have no doubt that one of the aliens will do it in half the time eventually).

In other cases like the Stratos, I love it the way it is, but it's set up for insane oversteer. Most people hate it because of that. I tinkered around a little with the setup, shared my humble "stable Stratos" tuning and a more normal player than me told me he quickly gained 30 seconds in NZ because it was so much easier to drive.

What I'm trying to say: yes, good driving is the most important thing, and if you're finishing in tier 2 or below better driving is key. Still tuning can make a difference depending on car and other circumstances.

  • Agree 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Grimstreaker999 said:

So where should I start, trying to improve?

1. Don't try too hard. Just enjoy and try to find a good flow. 

2. Brake. Everyone can stomp the loud pedal to the floor, but when you know where and how much to brake, you get way much better results. 

Practice makes perfect. 

Also about tuning. It's important to figure out how you actually drive the car, as there is no one size fit for all tuning setup (IMO). When you figure that out, you can tune the car to suit your driving style. 

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, DocStrangelove said:

Another matter is car choice, obviously. If you drive the DS, Ascona, Metro or NR4 Subaru you're going to lose a lot of time.

That's true, and it's a shame. I tend to limit myself by not choosing the fastest cars, take the underdog and try to place it as high as possible on the leaderboards. That gives me a greater satisfaction tbf. Some NR4 leaderboards are so boring to watch to me. In most cases I couldn't take the WR anyways because cross platform leaderboards are pretty competitive and some times are really crazy, so I take the Scooby and see what I can do. 🤓

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I'm quite happy to have the best Ascona time on a stage for example. Too bad the aliens can't beat that because they've already done it in the Stratos or BMW 😀

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DocStrangelove said:

Yeah, I'm quite happy to have the best Ascona time on a stage for example. Too bad the aliens can't beat that because they've already done it in the Stratos or BMW 😀

I thought the Datsun would be the slowest. In fact I read on the forum that some people would like to see it in H2. Maybe it's on par with the Ascona. Just checked the stats, the Ascona is heavier by 150kg, but has a bit more power. 

Edited by richie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/19/2019 at 1:38 AM, Mike Dee said:

I realized that while I was able to tune the car to fit my style, by doing so I was actually tuning to compensate for my flaws and not adjusting to fix them for the car. That is why I say tuning doesn't matter. It makes you more consistent with your style when setup properly, no arguing that, but the car itself isn't any faster - consistency is what brought your times down.

So what you are essentailly saying is that, in some cases, tuning a car to your liking can hinder it's actual potential, which I absolutely agree with, but I think you are missing the fact that certain settings have very little to do with personal preference and make a car faster regardless of your driving style. You yourself mentioned gear ratios, in an earlier post, saying that it helps only in Poland, which is simply untrue as it might have an even bigger effect in Argentina, since this rally requires, in my experience, a bigger final ratio decrease, from default setting, than Poland's required final ratio increase. Another example of such setting is suspension. I'll use Argentina as an example again, because of it's extreme characteristics, compared to other rallies. A fine tuned suspension can make a car seemingly float over bumps while if you leave tuning at default settings it usually bounces around uncontrollably, which results in a lot of time being lost. Another such setting is camber. Leaving aside changing it's default front/rear balance, there is very little leeway in choosing a value which will result in the biggest, overall ammount of grip on a given stretch of road. Not to say that this value is easy to determine, but it certainly isn't subjective. Obviously these changes won't have as big of an effect as improving your driving technique, if you are far from your own and car's maximal potential, but if you are close to it, then learning how to tune, in my opinion, will have the biggest, immediate impact on your stage times.

But coming back to OP's question, I didn't understand it correctly as I thought he wrote that he's losing 6 to 10 seconds per stage, not per split. In that case Mike Dee's advice is more appropriate, although learing how to tune, at least the settings I mentioned above, can only help you improve, without gaining any "bad" habits mentioned by Mike.

Edited by Pistro
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/19/2019 at 12:17 AM, Grimstreaker999 said:

I need some really good tips on how to sqeeze the cars to the max.

Playing mostly daily, weekly and monthly races, Im now experiencing that the gap to the lead is increasing.

In the beginning I was around 6seconds behind the lead pr split, but now Im around 10seconds behind. Mostly ending between tier 3-2

So where should I start, trying to improve?

-I play on regular ps4, with the g29 wheel,

-use cockpit view,

-use semi auto gear (as Im not good enough yet to drive stick, but Im practicing), with downshift in the left paddle, and upshift on the O button

-I use the right paddle as handbrake

-I have no idea on how to tune my car, so I have to rely on my chief engineer. I really wish there was a way to upload/download settings here CM. 

- I myself feel that Im starting to get the hang of the driving part, with the right speed in to corners, momentum and so on. And the car is usually in good shape, crossing the finish line. But tips is very welcome

Beats me, I always finish in the top tier in daily events, but I get my butt handed to me in Career Mode at Elite difficulty so I mean I can't even imagine what some people must be able to drive like..... 
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, richie said:

I thought the Datsun would be the slowest. In fact I read on the forum that some people would like to see it in H2. Maybe it's on par with the Ascona. Just checked the stats, the Ascona is heavier by 150kg, but has a bit more power. 

Just tried it a bit again on my "home" track Hancock Creek Burst (which I like for testing because A) it's a sprint stage B) It's got a nice mix of high-speed sections and slidy corners and a few hairpins and C) I almost know it inside out so there's less room for mistakes to tarnish my results). I didn't do competitive runs but I managed to drive consistently. The results:

1st tier: Stratos and Renault 5. Pretty much equal.

2nd tier: BMW and Sierra (3 seconds behind). BMW is surprising, I probably could have done better with more tries. Sierra was surprising too, I hate that car with its on/off power curve, but on straights it's a beast.

3rd tier: Datsun (5 seconds behind). Definitely easier to drive and more agile than the Ascona in my opinion.

4th tier: Ascona (7 seconds behind). Even though I had 5 successful runs with it and the fastest was probably the cleanest/least mistakes one of this entire endeavour. You can feel its weight, it goes wide, it's sluggish and it lacks acceleration. Which is disappointing because emotionally I really like this car.

After that, I tried the H2 Escort and was 5 seconds behind on first try even though it was a less clean stage than with the Ascona.

So I think in terms of performance Datsun and Ascona are rather H2 than H3. And I do think the Ascona is the slowest of its class. I'd love to hear other players' opinions on this.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, just from looking at the stats you can tell the Stratos and the Renault 5 should be top tier. I've only driven the Ascona once when I was going through all cars right after release of DR2.0. I'll give it another try I think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 I do my unfamiliar Longs that don't have a Sprint where I've been chasing WR recently, my times take a noticeable hit because I'm not being as flatout ballsy as I can be. Apart from memorizing tracks you really need to know how to tune, if you want to fight for top positions, and even that might not be enough since cutting corners/cheating is very much allowed in some locations, as of now. But if you try online tool to download soundcloud mp3 it might work for you too. Not to mention skipping entire sections of road in Argentina by teleportation bugs.

Edited by audreycrist

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/20/2019 at 5:58 PM, DocStrangelove said:

Just tried it a bit again on my "home" track Hancock Creek Burst (which I like for testing because

Tried this track, it's really fun. Haven't done much USA in general so far, just the occasional daily, but will spend more time exploring. I've probably missed out on some awesome stages so far. 

Edited by richie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am also searching for this problem. Whenever I will get the solution, then surely I will share.

Edited by usameja

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Time trials and making a good setup. When practicing on time trials don't restart after the first spin or roll-over! If the car is fine finish the stage. If you restart too often you wont learn the later parts of the stage as good as the beginning.

  • Agree 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, redriot77 said:

Time trials and making a good setup. When practicing on time trials don't restart after the first spin or roll-over! If the car is fine finish the stage. If you restart too often you wont learn the later parts of the stage as good as the beginning.

Not only that but you will also learn to drive recklessly and it will become extremely hard to unlearn it for community events, where there are no restarts. Obviously if time trials are your priority then do them as much as possible, but if you care about weeklies or monthlies more then play career instead, without using restarts.

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/20/2019 at 5:58 PM, DocStrangelove said:

Just tried it a bit again on my "home" track Hancock Creek Burst (which I like for testing because A) it's a sprint stage B) It's got a nice mix of high-speed sections and slidy corners and a few hairpins and C) I almost know it inside out so there's less room for mistakes to tarnish my results).

 

haha, it's the same for me!! 😄

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×