F2 feature race stragety

[BarryBL 4,314]

Hi @ojhowells,

I can see how the switching of AI strategies would make it more interesting for the player.

I'll raise it to the development team for something to consider moving forward with future projects.

[ojhowells 9]

Thanks @BarryBL

would the future project be for F1 2019 or next f1 games 

[ojhowells 9]

Hi @BarryBL

i have one more question if possible 

will changing ai strategies be added to f1 2019 or not thanks ? 

[BarryBL 4,314]

Hi @ojhowells,

To be honest, I wouldn't expect an update to this in F1 2019. However, we have taken your feedback onto the development team for consideration in future titles.

[ojhowells 9]

Thanks for the reply @BarryBL

[GioProductions 204]

I hope that F2 returns next year, i am really enjoying it!! The Force Feedback on my Thrustmaster T-GT and sound are superb!! For myself i hope that the careermode for F2 is longer going into F1. And as mentioned here above, some more different F2 strategy.

[Currriss 3]

Sorry for dragging up and old thread, I googled something F2 related and this came up and found it quite intriguing.

I only bought the game about a month ago as it was going cheap and my desire to play the game has fallen flat over the last few years. I've spent most of the time playing F2 on grand prix mode, both the regular season and now the F2 World Tour. I'm not really one for single player however there's only so much **** I can take from Mario Kart racers online, and getting the blame/penalties for being brake-checked or wiped out at 200mph.

 

First impression is that not much thought has gone into F2, it's as though they've plonked different cars onto the game with a few rule changes unique to F2 and thats that. I completely agree with OP that strategy variations are desperately needed to keep it interesting, and can't for the life of me understand what that chap on the other page is struggling to understand himself. I've watched F2/F3 for a good number of years now and didn't realise how tight they were with tyres and how they were restricted with what they could use in each session. However you would think those who have been part of creating F2 on here would note that the feature race usually has a handful of drivers starting on the harder tyre, which is on occasions actually the better strategy. I read the staff member on the other page they are programmed to get to the end in the quickest time possible. Why is this? In real life if you start last you're going to need to gamble and try something different, Makino at Monza in 2018 comes to mind. You could follow the crowd with the "best" strategy and finish where you started. Hopefully this is something fixed for next year

Perhaps the rest have been answered elsewhere (can't admit to looking), however what is the reason for not being able to change the fuel load/mix? Before and after  practice, quali and pre-race of the finale in Abu Dhabi, i'm being told I have wrapped up the title when I hadn't. I also have Jeff on the radio telling me giving me information about Devon Butler who needless to say isn't in my season. Jeff also encourages me to go onto intermediate tyres in certain conditions when intermediates don't exist in F2. They're such basic errors.

I can assume the next one is a gameplay issue more than an F2 issue since it's been the same on every single Codemasters F1 game there has ever been, and that is braindead AI drivers. Going back to reality, in F1 qualifying, most drivers will come out near the start of the session and do two outlaps to warm the tyres up, and then go on to do one, sometimes two and perhaps 3 flying laps before returning to the pits. This process is repeated with about 10mins of the session remaining. The handful of drivers who don't go out at the start will go out once, in the middle of the session or when the track has quietened down, for that reason exactly. I believe this is something that should be programmed into the session, however it's just a mix of cars coming out willy-nilly, being on the track virtually all session and thus causing traffic issues because they never, ever want to get out of the way. Most recent examples are me starting my final lap(s) of qualifying with a few minutes to spare and a line of AI cars are streaming out the pitlane at exactly the same speed, with exactly the same distance between them on exactly the same line. I've had my laps wrecked at Japan and USA lately because I meet them right on the inside at T1, it's pathetic. I'm no expert at making games but I can't imagine it is that hard for an AI to be programmed to get out of the way if they are on an outlap (or even an inlap), and there is a car on a flying lap behind them within so many metres or within so many seconds? As soon as a quick car enters the "red zone" the car should immediately pull over off the racing line. I'm also having cars turn into me in the race as though i'm not there when going for an overtake.

Like I said it is the same on every single game they make and I doubt i'm the only one to ever have raised it with them.

 

 

[Falstojudilofa 115]

10 minutes ago, Currriss said:

I can assume the next one is a gameplay issue more than an F2 issue since it's been the same on every single Codemasters F1 game there has ever been, and that is braindead AI drivers. Going back to reality, in F1 qualifying, most drivers will come out near the start of the session and do two outlaps to warm the tyres up, and then go on to do one, sometimes two and perhaps 3 flying laps before returning to the pits. This process is repeated with about 10mins of the session remaining. The handful of drivers who don't go out at the start will go out once, in the middle of the session or when the track has quietened down, for that reason exactly. I believe this is something that should be programmed into the session, however it's just a mix of cars coming out willy-nilly, being on the track virtually all session and thus causing traffic issues because they never, ever want to get out of the way. Most recent examples are me starting my final lap(s) of qualifying with a few minutes to spare and a line of AI cars are streaming out the pitlane at exactly the same speed, with exactly the same distance between them on exactly the same line. I've had my laps wrecked at Japan and USA lately because I meet them right on the inside at T1, it's pathetic. I'm no expert at making games but I can't imagine it is that hard for an AI to be programmed to get out of the way if they are on an outlap (or even an inlap), and there is a car on a flying lap behind them within so many metres or within so many seconds? As soon as a quick car enters the "red zone" the car should immediately pull over off the racing line. I'm also having cars turn into me in the race as though i'm not there when going for an overtake.

Like I said it is the same on every single game they make and I doubt i'm the only one to ever have raised it with them.

 

 

I can not relate to this really. Usually the cars go out at the start of the session and in the end. The track is mostly empty between this two time frames. The AI goes out 2,5 to 3 minutes before the session is over. So you either have to make sure you are ahead of them when starting your last lap, or wait until the very last moment, so you will be the last on track.

 

The most annoying thing about qualifying to me is that the AI does to much effort not to overtake me when I am not in a flying lap. When I drive very slow, multiple cars will stay behind me and refuse to overtake unless I completely stop.

[Schneko 167]

Yeah I agree, F2 needs a bit more work, obviously it is more like side-feature, but still I mostly agree with @Currriss and @Falstojudilofa. I love watching F2, honestly maybe even more than F1 in terms of exciteness.

There are a lot of things which make this game mode a bit dull. Such 'simple' things like, as Currriss said, strategy and tyre choices. In terms of strategy, we need to see a lot more variation in terms of alternate strategy ofc and also when the AI pits, it's mostly only two laps in which all drivers do their stop. Also we should have different levels of tyre saving in the game, some AI should just loose their pace when the tyres are gone, MotoGP '20 is an example for this - it is simulated there, it just cannot be that every driver just goes the same pace, lap after lap, this is not F2. The same obviously goes for me as a player, actual tyre saving needs to be a much bigger factor in this game mode, going slower by 2s or so than the usual racepace, as in real, must be represented in the game.

The tyre choice, well, when do you see a F2 driver qualifying on the prime tyres? Just doesn't make sense, we need to have two sets of options in qualifying. Obviously the tyres will then be used in the race, but this is what makes F2 kinda unique and I think it can be easily explained to casual players via special F2 tutorials. Qualifying in general should get an extra length, 15min. To only be able to choose between One-Shot and 30min, and then only having one set of options, idk. Doesn't really make sense to me.

The AI, yeah well, is special. But what bothers me the most, are the static driver performances throughout the season. Always the same guys at the top, always the same at the back (T18 upwards - CAL & RAG are obviously last, but with far too small gaps). For example Ilott and Mazepin, they are basically never in the Top 15. IRL, Ilott got pole in Monza and Mazepin had a steady progress, getting better and better. In the game we don't have any surprises in the results or so, it's just very very static and no fun.

So yeah, hopefully the F2 mode gets a bit of a revamp. And maybe it is also in the beta, so a few testers can give direct feedback with the developers and maybe have a chat with them about it.

[Currriss 3]

1 hour ago, Falstojudilofa said:

I can not relate to this really. Usually the cars go out at the start of the session and in the end. The track is mostly empty between this two time frames. The AI goes out 2,5 to 3 minutes before the session is over. So you either have to make sure you are ahead of them when starting your last lap, or wait until the very last moment, so you will be the last on track.

 

The most annoying thing about qualifying to me is that the AI does to much effort not to overtake me when I am not in a flying lap. When I drive very slow, multiple cars will stay behind me and refuse to overtake unless I completely stop.

It's all very well saying I should make sure i'm ahead of them before the 10+ car train spanning 30 seconds comes crawling out the pit lane, or wait until the very last moment, however I would think it might be beneficial if the game actually just made the drivers behave like they would in real life? i.e get out of the way. Like I said they just have no knowledge of the fact that I am there. At Japan yesterday I had Latifi come out of the pits as I was starting my lap. He beat me to T1 comfortably but I caught him by turn 2 (the 2nd part of the long right hander where it's much tighter). I had a few flashbacks to see if I could bring it back and dive up the inside, nope he cuts me off. I tried a different line to see if I could go around the outside, nope he squeezes me off track on the exit of the corner. A lap wasted on tyres already starting to go off. .

59 minutes ago, Schneko said:

Yeah I agree, F2 needs a bit more work, obviously it is more like side-feature, but still I mostly agree with @Currriss and @Falstojudilofa. I love watching F2, honestly maybe even more than F1 in terms of exciteness.

There are a lot of things which make this game mode a bit dull. Such 'simple' things like, as Currriss said, strategy and tyre choices. In terms of strategy, we need to see a lot more variation in terms of alternate strategy ofc and also when the AI pits, it's mostly only two laps in which all drivers do their stop. Also we should have different levels of tyre saving in the game, some AI should just loose their pace when the tyres are gone, MotoGP '20 is an example for this - it is simulated there, it just cannot be that every driver just goes the same pace, lap after lap, this is not F2. The same obviously goes for me as a player, actual tyre saving needs to be a much bigger factor in this game mode, going slower by 2s or so than the usual racepace, as in real, must be represented in the game.

The tyre choice, well, when do you see a F2 driver qualifying on the prime tyres? Just doesn't make sense, we need to have two sets of options in qualifying. Obviously the tyres will then be used in the race, but this is what makes F2 kinda unique and I think it can be easily explained to casual players via special F2 tutorials. Qualifying in general should get an extra length, 15min. To only be able to choose between One-Shot and 30min, and then only having one set of options, idk. Doesn't really make sense to me.

The AI, yeah well, is special. But what bothers me the most, are the static driver performances throughout the season. Always the same guys at the top, always the same at the back (T18 upwards - CAL & RAG are obviously last, but with far too small gaps). For example Ilott and Mazepin, they are basically never in the Top 15. IRL, Ilott got pole in Monza and Mazepin had a steady progress, getting better and better. In the game we don't have any surprises in the results or so, it's just very very static and no fun.

So yeah, hopefully the F2 mode gets a bit of a revamp. And maybe it is also in the beta, so a few testers can give direct feedback with the developers and maybe have a chat with them about it.

The middle bit about tyres I'm confused about, are you venting your anger at the game or at the FIA's regulations? 😛 I think its quite cool, I have no idea if it is that restricted in real life but i'd like to assume it is if Codemasters are going with it. It took me half a season to realise that using the 2nd set of harder tyres in practice was the reason my tyres for the sprint race were already quite worn haha.

Hmm in F2 it usually is the same drivers at the top really. They have got a few wrong, particularly Ilott. King seems a bit overrated and Geleal had a knack of getting 7th/8th in the feature race and causing traffic from pole in the sprint race. Calderon and Raghunathan were a bit too quick despite never threatening the points but I guess they can't put them stupidly off the pace even if that does reflect real life!

[Schneko 167]

1 hour ago, Currriss said:

 The middle bit about tyres I'm confused about, are you venting your anger at the game or at the FIA's regulations? 😛 

More at the game, IRL the drivers do use two sets of fresh options in qualifying. In the game we have only one option tyre and one prime. 

 

1 hour ago, Currriss said:

Hmm in F2 it usually is the same drivers at the top really.

Yeah of course, drivers like DEV, LAT, SET, GHI, and so on. But sometimes we have also surprising results IRL, when for example the above mentioned drivers can only qualify in the midfield and a normal midfield driver, like e.g in the game Zhou or Hubert, may get a pole or podiums. And I feel like the game lacks those "surprising results" a bit, it is never mixed up, you can divide the field into three or four groups and you can always say that this driver finishes in the Top 5, the other driver will be outside the points and so on.

[Currriss 3]

21 minutes ago, Schneko said:

More at the game, IRL the drivers do use two sets of fresh options in qualifying. In the game we have only one option tyre and one prime. 

 

Yeah of course, drivers like DEV, LAT, SET, GHI, and so on. But sometimes we have also surprising results IRL, when for example the above mentioned drivers can only qualify in the midfield and a normal midfield driver, like e.g in the game Zhou or Hubert, may get a pole or podiums. And I feel like the game lacks those "surprising results" a bit, it is never mixed up, you can divide the field into three or four groups and you can always say that this driver finishes in the Top 5, the other driver will be outside the points and so on.

 

That makes sense I guess, as drivers tend to improve their times later on in the session which would be harder to do with worn tyres. Do they start with a worn soft tyre in the race though, does that explain why they usually pit ASAP? I was hoping it would be like that on the game but usually you can go almost halfway on the soft tyre.

Yeah thats fair enough. I completed my F2 2019 season a week ago and and more in sync with the 2018 drivers right now haha. Looking at a list i'd say they could be split into these categories (based on how the game sees them)

Sette Camara, Latifi, De Vries

Deletraz, Matsushita, Ghiotto, Zhou, Aitken, Hubert, King

Schumacher, Gelael, Boccolacci,

Ilott, Mazepin, Boschung

Correa, Calderon, Raghunathan

I raced as Alesi, I imagine he'd slot in on Ilott's row. If I had to sort them into what my opinion is of them, I would remove the 3rd row and put those drivers with Ilott's row and add King and Correa to it. But yeah it does seem to me the game has sort of categories the drivers and the top tier will always lap at X pace, 2nd tier will be .2 slower per lap for example and so on. I raced at USA earlier in a sprint race and won by 35s (AI is on 101) because Aitken was disgustingly slow and blocked the field from 2nd for 15/22 laps.

It would be even better if they could throw in a few crashes (and I don't mean slight taps), or driver errors like spins or going well wide off track. I accept that would be difficult to throw in, like how or why or what forces a driver into that mistake? Does each driver need to be given concentration/skill etc. settings amongst other things that, when put into certain situations, make the driver tip over the edge and force a crash/spin?

[Currriss 3]

And for what its worth in my final race of the season yesterday at Brazil, it started raining about halfway through, I pitted for wets and I was held before my pitbox for about 2mins before driving in and the mechanics fitted my tyres. Norris who was 2nd behind me pitted a lap before for wets, and then came in the next lap aswell to re-fit more wet tyres.

A few times earlier in the season aswell, I think where the race started wet had a couple of drivers pitting for about 6 or 7 laps in a row for wet tyres. Something is clearly a bit screwed up here

[steviejay69 1,100]

The issue Codemasters have is the tyre choice menu and restrictions by using different levels of session and qualifying.

F2 cars are allocated tyre sets for a weekend and barely have enough - but it's a budgetary consideration. 

It really doesn't account for track abrasion and the tyre allocation is predetermined (not by the teams).

So to compound it with inflexible AI just makes for the same scenario every race. Quickly got boring, a shame because the handling model didn't get broken.

[ojhowells 9]

Hi all 

is there now mixed strategy for the f2 cars in the feature race on F1 2020 or do the ai do exactly the same strategy and all start on the same tyre compound and pit on 2 laps or do we have mixed up strategies that add to replay value or is it the same as just racing the 2019 season on f1 2019 

[johnboy83 88]

29 minutes ago, ojhowells said:

Hi all 

is there now mixed strategy for the f2 cars in the feature race on F1 2020 or do the ai do exactly the same strategy and all start on the same tyre compound and pit on 2 laps or do we have mixed up strategies that add to replay value or is it the same as just racing the 2019 season on f1 2019 

I hope this is fixed. Although I’ve been too obsessed with My Team to try any other modes!

[ojhowells 9]

From doing a few races on the f2 part of f1 2020 it still appears to me that in the feature race all the ai still do the same strategy.

Maybe @BarryBL can tell us if the ai do different strategies or not 

Also the tyre compounds are wrong for Spain it should be the hard and soft tyres not hard and medium