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It's official. Car performance/ Team performance/ Driver performance will "currently" not be fixed in F1 2019!

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12 hours ago, Gr8_Lakes said:

Just to add my $0.02 worth, As a long time F1 fan that's new to the game, I found it strange to need to slightly lift for some corners that I've known to be flat IRL. I attributed it to a lack of proper setup, but also needed to use those setups to qualify well. So, there was something not quite adding up. This thread explains a lot. 

here's a question for those of you that are experienced in the past several year's versions: If I we were planning on exclusively racing in GP or career mode for the next couple months, would any of you recommend reinstalling the game and not uploading the updates? 

Or, would any of you recommend a buying a cheap, used copy of F1 2018 for the same purpose? 

I can't comment on the 2019 patch situation as I avoided buying the game. I can say though that 2018 is pretty enjoyable for 2 or 3 seasons in Career. Things get REALLY silly after that so you will stop playing. If you do get 2018 and want more than 2 or 3 seasons close racing either do not do 2/3 of the practice point sessions or only spend 1/3 of the upgrade points you receive on actual upgrades. It's absolutely clear they no one at CM tested 2018 career mode fully to see what would happen if you earn and spend maximum points wisely. 

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On 10/5/2019 at 12:05 PM, sloppysmusic said:

I can't comment on the 2019 patch situation as I avoided buying the game. I can say though that 2018 is pretty enjoyable for 2 or 3 seasons in Career. Things get REALLY silly after that so you will stop playing. If you do get 2018 and want more than 2 or 3 seasons close racing either do not do 2/3 of the practice point sessions or only spend 1/3 of the upgrade points you receive on actual upgrades. It's absolutely clear they no one at CM tested 2018 career mode fully to see what would happen if you earn and spend maximum points wisely. 

I'm guessing here, but does your car become over developed compared to the AI, basically making races too easy to win?

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14 hours ago, Gr8_Lakes said:

I'm guessing here, but does your car become over developed compared to the AI, basically making races too easy to win?

Yes and ridiculously so. By the 3rd season you will be 5 seconds ahead per lap of the next guy behind you and 5 seconds behind your team mate who is uncatchable. If you lower the ai so you can compete with your team mate the rest of the pack will be 10 seconds behind per lap. So immersion killing to be passing Hamilton and Verstappen who get blue flagged to pull over for you! Several times a race if you go full distance! 

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2 hours ago, SturmDesTodes said:

Here's a picture to a official answer we got towards Car Performance in Time Trial Mode by @Hoo who was kind enough to give away a little bit of info:

Screenshot_20191014-120505_Chrome.jpg

 

This confirms that in Time Trial we should always be able to get the fastest laptimes in the game, which begs the question:

 

Why are some tracks slower in the game compared to real life?

 

This thread is dedicated to this question and a few issues have been found out, mainly a lack of downforce and the suspicion that drag needs to be adjusted too to have less drag in general to get better acceleration, @Hoo @RedDevilKT:

 

1. Would you kindly, please have a look and give us some clarification and tell us whether or not the dev team will investigate the lack of downforce compared to real life? 

 

I strongly believe the game needs around at least 20% - 30% more downforce to be able to replicate the real life performance around fast corners such as Turn 9 at Spain at appropriate wing settings (no team in real life runs maximum downforce at Spain, so using 11/11 wings in the game for that track is insane just to be able to get similar performance and speed around fast corners as irl), tried modifying on PC and this little change (+30% downforce) worked wonders to make the cars go faster and hit real life perfomance easily at 7/7 or 8/8 wings.

 

Meanwhile through modding, i also altered the drag level of the car to be around 3% less and it gave the cars the needed acceleration.

 

All in all, at the moment the cars are not in sync with real life performance on patch 1.12 and this needs fixing as you were too gentle with the 1.05 patch which did not give us enough downforce unfortunately.

 

2. Would you kindly, tell us if we are ever going to get another car performance update to make the cars faster?

 

Car, team and driver performance deperately need another update.

 

Cars need more downforce, +30% and around 3% less drag.

 

Teams need to be adjusted accordingly, eg.

-Racing Point needs to be slower than McLaren and Ferrari needs to have much faster acceleration and straight line speed than Mercedes.

-The car ride height of each individual team needs to be homogenized, as at the moment some teams such as Ferrari do not create any sparks even at the lowest ride height of 1/1 on specific tracks, whereas others such as Mercedes create a pyrofestival at 3/5 ride height.

 

Also, the drivers need to be adjusted accordingly as well, eg. Ricciardo getting a buff, Gasly getting a nerf etc.

 

3. Would you kindly, tell us if anything asked in this thread will be looked at / fixed and or will be left untouched, so that we can stop posting about the same issue over and over again and finally move on?

 

It is frustrating and disappointing to not get any official answer by Codemasters on this subject.

 

 

 

Edited by SturmDesTodes
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22 hours ago, SturmDesTodes said:

 

This confirms that in Time Trial we should always be able to get the fastest laptimes in the game, which begs the question:

 

Why are some tracks slower in the game compared to real life?

 

This thread is dedicated to this question and a few issues have been found out, mainly a lack of downforce and the suspicion that drag needs to be adjusted too to have less drag in general to get better acceleration, @Hoo @RedDevilKT:

 

1. Would you kindly, please have a look and give us some clarification and tell us whether or not the dev team will investigate the lack of downforce compared to real life? 

 

I strongly believe the game needs around at least 20% - 30% more downforce to be able to replicate the real life performance around fast corners such as Turn 9 at Spain at appropriate wing settings (no team in real life runs maximum downforce at Spain, so using 11/11 wings in the game for that track is insane just to be able to get similar performance and speed around fast corners as irl), tried modifying on PC and this little change (+30% downforce) worked wonders to make the cars go faster and hit real life perfomance easily at 7/7 or 8/8 wings.

 

Meanwhile through modding, i also altered the drag level of the car to be around 3% less and it gave the cars the needed acceleration.

 

All in all, at the moment the cars are not in sync with real life performance on patch 1.12 and this needs fixing as you were too gentle with the 1.05 patch which did not give us enough downforce unfortunately.

 

2. Would you kindly, tell us if we are ever going to get another car performance update to make the cars faster?

 

Car, team and driver performance deperately need another update.

 

Cars need more downforce, +30% and around 3% less drag.

 

Teams need to be adjusted accordingly, eg.

-Racing Point needs to be slower than McLaren and Ferrari needs to have much faster acceleration and straight line speed than Mercedes.

-The car ride height of each individual team needs to be homogenized, as at the moment some teams such as Ferrari do not create any sparks even at the lowest ride height of 1/1 on specific tracks, whereas others such as Mercedes create a pyrofestival at 3/5 ride height.

 

Also, the drivers need to be adjusted accordingly as well, eg. Ricciardo getting a buff, Gasly getting a nerf etc.

 

3. Would you kindly, tell us if anything asked in this thread will be looked at / fixed and or will be left untouched, so that we can stop posting about the same issue over and over again and finally move on?

 

It is frustrating and disappointing to not get any official answer by Codemasters on this subject.

 

 

 

@Hoo @RedDevilKT @jennyannem @David Greco

 

???

Edited by SturmDesTodes

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This time i did some testing around the glorious Japan GP, same story as usual: 

 

Lack of Downforce / Too much drag.

 

First of all real life data based on Vettels pole lap of 2019 which was a 1:27:064.

Topspeed:

Highest measured 333kmh

Cornering Speed:

Highest measured 256kmh

 

Here are two car setups one for high aero downforce and one in brackets for low aero topspeed:

 

Aerodynamics: 11/11 (3/4)

 

Transmission: 70/60

 

Suspension Geometry: -2.6/-1.3/0.11/0.44

 

Suspension: 4/5/7/10/4/5 (with the Ferrari the ride height can be lowered to 2/3 or 1/2, because Codemasters messed up the overall ride height of all teams, eg. at 6/6 ride height none of the teams will be equal in that aspect for whatever reason and some will naturally be lower than others like the Alfa Romeo whereas Ferrari is set too high)

 

Brakes: 92/56 (92/54)

 

Tyres: 23.8/21.1 (24.2/21.9)

 

Now the comparison of speed between real life and the two car setups i posted here (IRL means "In Real Life"):

 

Finish Start Line = IRL 284kmh / high aero 274kmh / low aero 284kmh

 

Topspeed before T1 = IRL 333kmh / high aero 313kmh / low aero 333kmh

 

T2 = IRL 176kmh / high aero 164kmh / low aero 159kmh

 

S-Section

T3 = IRL 253kmh / high aero 239kmh / low aero 229kmh

T4 = IRL 232kmh / high aero 220kmh / low aero 204kmh

T5 = IRL 232kmh / high aero 222kmh / low aero 214kmh

T6 = IRL 198kmh / high aero 190kmh / low aero 170kmh

T7 = IRL 246kmh / high aero 236kmh / low aero 228kmh

 

T8 Degner = IRL 256kmh / high aero 264kmh / low aero 262kmh

 

T9 before the bridge tunnel = IRL 152kmh / high aero 142kmh / low aero 137kmh

 

T11 Hairpin = IRL 73kmh / high aero 78kmh / low aero 76kmh

 

Topspeed before Spooncurve T13/T14 (Vettel very likely did not run a higher ERS deployment setup before Spooncurve, hence why the topspeed is lower there) = IRL 293kmh / high aero 294kmh / low aero 311kmh

 

Spooncurve

T13 = IRL 256kmh / high aero 220kmh / low aero 201kmh

T14 = IRL 170kmh / high aero 173kmh / low aero 159kmh

 

Topspeed before 130R T15 = IRL 319kmh / high aero 300kmh / low aero 320kmh

 

130R

T15 = IRL 316kmh / high aero 298kmh / low aero 317kmh

 

Final corners

T16 = IRL 91kmh / high aero 100kmh / low aero 100kmh

T17 = IRL 94kmh / high aero 108kmh / low aero 106kmh

T18 = IRL 151kmh / high aero 160kmh / low aero 167kmh

 

As we can see the same results as previously are the case here, meaning that there is a lack of downforce and too much drag.

 

In real life teams do not run maximum aero settings around Japan, a medium setup is more common, so having to use 11/11 wings just to get close to real life cornering speeds is ridiculous, especially as we lose all time on the straights.

 

In the contrary, in real life teams do not run extremely low aero settings around Japan too, so having to use 3/4 wings just to get close to real life topspeeds is ridiculous as well, especially as we lose all time in the corners.

 

At the moment, as usual, the top E-Sports drivers use a lower aero setup for Japan whilst maximizing stability with a slightly oversteery touch to the overall handling to get their laptimes, but none of them is able to reach real life high downforce demanding cornering speeds and get the same laptimes as IRL whilst doing that.

 

E-Sports drivers make most of their time on the straights by maximizing corner exit and having higher topspeed instead of going for cornering speed.

 

Top Guy on PS4 uses the following setup:

3/6

60/70

-2.5/-1/0.05/0.2

2/4/6/10/1/4

94/54

23.8/21.9

 

Codemasters, please give us another car performance update where you increase downforce by another 30% and decrease drag by at least 3%, else your F1 2019 game will never be able to match real life telemetry data and laptimes will always be skewed.

 

@Hoo

@RedDevilKT

@jennyannem

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by SturmDesTodes
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15 minutes ago, SturmDesTodes said:

 

 

 

 

i think you invest more time in analysing those things then CM and they get paid for it.

Thats the frustrating thing. The chance they will do something about it is not there. They will let this game as it is which is a shame.

Edited by KiLLu12258
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Did the same test on PC with modified car values for downforce +30%, drag -3% and engine power -5% with the following car setup,

Aerodynamics: 6/7

Transmission: 70/60

Suspension Geometry: -2.6/-1.3/0.11/0.44

Suspension: 4/5/7/10/4/5 

Brakes: 92/56 

Tyres: 23.8/21.1,

and i was able to get the exact cornering speeds and topspeeds as Vettel whilst posting a 1:26:8 as laptime, which is extrenely close to real life car performance.

 

On the vanilla version of the game, PS4 patch 1.12, i was able to do a 1:27:3, but most of my time i made in the straights not in the corners.

 

Also, i suspect that the engine power of each team is a bit too strong, whilst drag levels only need a minor alteration for less drag -3%, engine power needs to be lowered by around 5% too as IRL 2019 F1 season shows that currently time is made in the corners and not on the straights.

 

If Codemasters does not fix this issue officially themselves, my friend, who was working on a mod to fix car performance as well as team performance and driver performance for the past couple of weeks, might upload it on Racedepartment in the foreseeable future.

 

It's small changes in the database, nothing too difficult to do.

 

Hope this issue will be fixed officially by Codemasters in one of the next patches.

 

#MakeF1GamesGreatAgain

 

 

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Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

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18 minutes ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

Thanks for answering, at least we now got some closure and can move on.


 

 

 

 

 

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Still, this is very disappointing news, as the game came out in June 28th, which was already 8 races into the 2019 F1 season in real life, so it doesn't make any sense especially as it is so easy to fix.

 

We saw Australia, Bahrain, China, Azerbaijan, Spain, Monaco, Canada and France before the official game released for the Austrian GP, especially the Spanish GP should have been a massive indicator about the discrepancy in car performance.

 

We got a official statement by Codemasters, pre 1.05 patch, that you were "unable" to realize that the cars were actually not negatively impacted by the 2019 aero regulation changes and that the cars in real life got even faster than the ones in 2018, but only after people massively complained about the ridiculous understeer of the 2019 game.

 

This sounded like a big excuse because we all saw the real life car performance before release (EIGHT RACES!), and there was no reason to think differently, except maybe a lack of time or the possibility that something else went majorly wrong at the process of developing the game.

 

So what did Codemasters do after being called out?

 

They acknowledged their "error" and promised to fix this issue with the 1.05 patch.

 

How did they "try" to do it?.

 

They simply increased front wing downforce by 20% to make the cars around 1 second faster.

 

But it was not enough.

 

Since the 1.05 patch dropped, this thread was posted to showcase that the 1.05 patch did not homogenize the ingame car performace to the real life telemetry data as Codemasters insisted and that downforce needed another 30% increase.

 

What did we get in the end?

 

Nothing.

 

Meanwhile it takes amateur hobby modders less than 30 minutes to access and alter the database to not only change and fix the car performance, but also the team and driver performance respectively.

 

It is not as if it takes a whole lot of time to do some testing and fix the database, so why Codemasters refuses to officially patch this is beyond comprehension, especially as Codemasters are paid professionals who do this for a living and very likely would take less than 10 minutes to fix this simple issue.

 

Why can't Codemasters rebalance the car performance / team performance / driver performance as a live service during the season to reflect real life performance more accurately?

 

Other officially sponsored sports games such as FIFA do this all the time.

 

So now not only F1 2015, but also F1 2016, F1 2017, F1 2018 and F1 2019 will be abandoned for this particular issue of wrong performance data and it's once again the amateur hobby modders "job" to fix the game themselves, even though they paid for the game and excpect it to be up to date, meanwhile Codemasters could officially fix this issue for all platforms in no time.

 

I'm done.

 

Issues fall on deaf ears and even worse Codemasters refuses to implement industry standardized features into their F1 franchise whilst abandoning each title prematurely to work upon the next years "copy&paste" product.

 

Farewell, on posting about issues with feedback.

 

Better luck to mod it ourselves, ridiculous.

 

Posting any topics or comments about feedback is, quite frankly, futile and a waste of time, unless it's a glitch or bug, oh wait... lighting issues got ignored as well.

 

#MakeF1GamesGreatAgain 

 

Screenshot_20191015-152413_Formula 1.jpg

Screenshot_20191015-161115_Chrome.jpg

Edited by SturmDesTodes
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1 hour ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

you just lost a customer. you are so incapable. 10 years same problems themselves bugs. do tenderness.

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the game came out with pre season testing performances (what they thought). The Performance Patch updated it to melbourne, but was still far off.

 

Its quite surprising to see that someone can fix the performance of the cars in a few mins and for CM it is not possible to do it in a few months. (Hey we paid for a official f1 game and not playing a mod which you can understand those things.)

 

The only thing that helps is to stop buying this game, and dont let you fool, when they tell us they are working for years on the next game. We can see the result in f1 2019. 

Edited by KiLLu12258
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3 hours ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

@RedDevilKT this comes across one of the following:

1. Codemasters don’t care 

2. Lazy

3. Do not have enough re$ource$ to care or not seem so f-ing lazy. 

4. Resources are tapering off to start developing F1 2020

Regardless, I am not wasting my time next year, unless they will make some significant improvements in regards to FFB/wheel and physics modeling. 
 

i don’t care about Jeff, story mode, flying helicopters, or making pad users feel good. 

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Maybe some should finally learn not to buy the product for the premiere. When it's far from finished. As always. Then there will be fewer complaints. When will people learn to vote with a wallet? Is it possible? :classic_rolleyes:

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4 hours ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

I did say this 2 months ago,

all of our postings are from 1000 of hours racing testing, 

I firmly got the message that nothing else will be done to fix problems that codemasters added to patches themselves,

from dayone release they had a super racing game, ,part sim and small part arcade,

they completly changed the dynamics of f12019 to accommodate for arcade hence pad users,

had wheel users known that from dayone I doubt wheel users would gave invested from full price and waited till game was a knockdown price of £20 ,

still we will know for next year , and thankyou for an honest answer that you could have told us 2 months ago,  

my assumption was right,. And I thank the boss of Codemasters who doesn't have a clue on customer support or what customers or future customers want ,

thankyou for wasting our limited time on planet earth.

 

Edited by senna94f1
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8 hours ago, SturmDesTodes said:

If Codemasters does not fix this issue officially themselves, my friend, who was working on a mod to fix car performance as well as team performance and driver performance for the past couple of weeks, might upload it on Racedepartment in the foreseeable future.

Please do, will download it ASAP when it's up since I don't care for multiplayer or achivements. I feel sorry for console users though, they can't rely on modders fixing all

Edited by Erudain
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12 hours ago, SturmDesTodes said:

 

Error

Edited by Hygradeb
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12 hours ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

If that means the force is on how the car feels when driving FFB in fact any feedback is a good step. If they are trying to get the base right before improving the speed ok , who's doing that others things can be fixed. 

But if that statement dont mean that then we will see what if any improvements arrive ... Before I say anything negative no matter how late.

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16 hours ago, SturmDesTodes said:

If Codemasters does not fix this issue officially themselves, my friend, who was working on a mod to fix car performance as well as team performance and driver performance for the past couple of weeks, might upload it on Racedepartment in the foreseeable future.

Let us know when it's ready, would you? 

Sadly with all these fixes, we won't be able to play MP.  

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16 hours ago, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

Current performance of the cars is Melbourne spec. Do you even watch how teams are evolved throughout the season in real F1? 

Edited by KulishS
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On 10/15/2019 at 3:06 PM, RedDevilKT said:

Hi, we are not currently looking at adjusting the performance of the cars, teams or drivers again. While we try to tune the cars as close as possible to real life, it is not always possible as a result of the constant improvements the teams are making as well as the increasing skill of the real life drivers pushing themselves to the very limit. 

@RedDevilKT

@Hoo

@jennyannem

@David Greco

@PJTierney

 

Why can't Codemasters rebalance the car performance / team performance / driver performance as a live service during the season to reflect real life performance more accurately for each single race weekend until the end of the season?

 

Other officially sponsored sports games such as FIFA do this all the time and update the team and player performances on a regular basis to reflect real life as close as possible.

 

"Live Performance Updates" should be a standard feature in a supposed "officially licenced" sports game.

 

Disappointing that Codemasters won't fix this simple issue.

 

 

Edited by SturmDesTodes

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4 minutes ago, SturmDesTodes said:

@RedDevilKT

@Hoo

@jennyannem

@David Greco

@PJTierney

 

Why can't Codemasters rebalance the car performance / team performance / driver performance as a live service during the season to reflect real life performance more accurately for each single race weekend until the end of the season?

 

 

 

 

We are dumb enough to buy the game, so they give a f. about it.

Thats it.

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