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Hi everyone,

Quick question for people playing with a wheel and no assists. How do you deal with the total absence of front lock or wheel spin feedback?

I just got a thrustmaster TX (playing F1 2019 on Xbox), and I used to play with the pad, no assists. I absolutely loved the vibrating triggers on the pad, telling you when you are applying too much accelaration or braking. I just switched to a wheel, hoping to get better lap times, but without feedback it's just terrible, spinning and locking everytime. I used to play at 90 AI, now I had to go back to 60.

- Is it a bug? I mean why wouldn't they implement some kind of feedback directly in the wheel? That would do the trick

- Did I just get a bad habit playing all those years with a pad? Should I just be patient and keep practicing until I can just "guess" the moment I'm going to lock or spin?

Thank you guys for your feedback

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Just keep practicing mate.  I used to rely on the trigger feedback when I was playing on a pad to.

You get used to it after a while.  You'll stop waiting for the rumble on the trigger, and start making decisions based on how fast you're going and how much of either pedal you're applying.

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@Ccassel the wheel is giving you all the information that you need. You're just not understanding it, and it all depends on where you have the wheel set at. How much feed back the wheel will give you. I've been using wheels for more than thirty years. 'Old arcade racer here' along with a pad when I didn't have a wheel to use. You just started using the wheel, just be patient. I'm currently using the G29 and even though it's a cog geared wheel it's still gives good info, not the best. During your short time with the wheel you've have noticed the wheel getting light or heavy on one side or a slight vibration. That's the information you must pay attention to. I'll wait for your reply on what I've just explained about the information. If you have felt this I'll will continue explaining what you're feeling.   

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6 hours ago, Striker_703 said:

@Ccassel the wheel is giving you all the information that you need. You're just not understanding it, and it all depends on where you have the wheel set at. How much feed back the wheel will give you. I've been using wheels for more than thirty years. 'Old arcade racer here' along with a pad when I didn't have a wheel to use. You just started using the wheel, just be patient. I'm currently using the G29 and even though it's a cog geared wheel it's still gives good info, not the best. During your short time with the wheel you've have noticed the wheel getting light or heavy on one side or a slight vibration. That's the information you must pay attention to. I'll wait for your reply on what I've just explained about the information. If you have felt this I'll will continue explaining what you're feeling.   

In a sim world where people seem obsessed with expensive wheels, the G29 is such an underated wheel.

  • Agree 2

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On 8/11/2019 at 5:58 AM, Ccassel said:

Hi everyone,

Quick question for people playing with a wheel and no assists. How do you deal with the total absence of front lock or wheel spin feedback?

I just got a thrustmaster TX (playing F1 2019 on Xbox), and I used to play with the pad, no assists. I absolutely loved the vibrating triggers on the pad, telling you when you are applying too much accelaration or braking. I just switched to a wheel, hoping to get better lap times, but without feedback it's just terrible, spinning and locking everytime. I used to play at 90 AI, now I had to go back to 60.

- Is it a bug? I mean why wouldn't they implement some kind of feedback directly in the wheel? That would do the trick

- Did I just get a bad habit playing all those years with a pad? Should I just be patient and keep practicing until I can just "guess" the moment I'm going to lock or spin?

Thank you guys for your feedback

Mess around with your FFB Damper settings in game. I have mine at 4, sometimes off. Some have theirs very high. You'll just have to see what feels right and make sure you're not clipping. 

45 over FFB is perfect with no clipping on a Fanatec CSW. I'm not sure on yours what it should be. Unless it is a very weak wheel, it should be nowhere near 100 or all the forces will mesh together.

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Well thanks all of you. Been practicing the whole week now using low ffb damper and trying to notice the small vibration it gives you. And yup, you definitely get valuable feedback on corners. What I miss from the pad is the feedback it gives you in straight lines, but with training you get used to it. I still suck a lot at race starts and rain races, but it is so much more enjoyable with the wheel I would never go back to the pad.

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On 8/12/2019 at 6:37 AM, DaleRossi said:

Mess around with your FFB Damper settings in game. I have mine at 4, sometimes off. Some have theirs very high. You'll just have to see what feels right and make sure you're not clipping. 

45 over FFB is perfect with no clipping on a Fanatec CSW. I'm not sure on yours what it should be. Unless it is a very weak wheel, it should be nowhere near 100 or all the forces will mesh together.

Interesting. I have my FFB settings as this. 110, 20, 20, 5, 2. 
you are saying I should keep it as 45? 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/12/2019 at 4:37 PM, DaleRossi said:

Mess around with your FFB Damper settings in game. I have mine at 4, sometimes off. Some have theirs very high. You'll just have to see what feels right and make sure you're not clipping. 

45 over FFB is perfect with no clipping on a Fanatec CSW. I'm not sure on yours what it should be. Unless it is a very weak wheel, it should be nowhere near 100 or all the forces will mesh together.

What exactly do you mean by clipping? The forces meshing together?

I use a G29 with high wheel damper settings (50) to get a better feel for the car. The handling model is such that it feels like the car floats on the tarmac, so that's why I suppose I've had to do it. However, there are corners where the wheel suddenly starts vibrating like crazy for no reason every lap - is this what you mean by clipping?

 

On 8/11/2019 at 1:58 PM, Ccassel said:

Hi everyone,

Quick question for people playing with a wheel and no assists. How do you deal with the total absence of front lock or wheel spin feedback?

I just got a thrustmaster TX (playing F1 2019 on Xbox), and I used to play with the pad, no assists. I absolutely loved the vibrating triggers on the pad, telling you when you are applying too much accelaration or braking. I just switched to a wheel, hoping to get better lap times, but without feedback it's just terrible, spinning and locking everytime. I used to play at 90 AI, now I had to go back to 60.

- Is it a bug? I mean why wouldn't they implement some kind of feedback directly in the wheel? That would do the trick

- Did I just get a bad habit playing all those years with a pad? Should I just be patient and keep practicing until I can just "guess" the moment I'm going to lock or spin?

Thank you guys for your feedback

Even though I've been playing with a wheel for over 20 years I still struggle with the same things in this game. Hard braking zones and low traction acceleration zones are where I lose time. Really, the only thing that helps is practice. If you use the cockpit cam you could try to add some camera shake, I believe it works in the same way as the triggers on the pad, only exception being that the cues are visual. I suppose it's quite rare for an (ex) pad driver to drive in the cockpit cam, but hey, what would be a better time to make the switch than now?

Edited by janbonator

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1 hour ago, janbonator said:

What exactly do you mean by clipping? The forces meshing together?

I use a G29 with high wheel damper settings (50) to get a better feel for the car. The handling model is such that it feels like the car floats on the tarmac, so that's why I suppose I've had to do it. However, there are corners where the wheel suddenly starts vibrating like crazy for no reason every lap - is this what you mean by clipping?

 

Yes, it is where FFB is so high that you can't feel the difference in forces anymore.

50 is probably fine with your wheel. I think I'm at 45 with a Fanatec Clubsport base.

If this is the only game that gives you these issues, maybe your in game forces are out of balance.

Ross feel, curbs etc I keep at about 1/3 of the FFB setting. Understeern effects Off and Damper at 2 or so. 

If this is the only game you're playing with your wheel, it may be something messed up in your driver or wheel settings.  The overall FFB in the game isn't great, but what you're getting definitely isnt normal.

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18 minutes ago, DaleRossi said:

Yes, it is where FFB is so high that you can't feel the difference in forces anymore.

50 is probably fine with your wheel. I think I'm at 45 with a Fanatec Clubsport base.

If this is the only game that gives you these issues, maybe your in game forces are out of balance.

Ross feel, curbs etc I keep at about 1/3 of the FFB setting. Understeern effects Off and Damper at 2 or so. 

If this is the only game you're playing with your wheel, it may be something messed up in your driver or wheel settings.  The overall FFB in the game isn't great, but what you're getting definitely isnt normal.

What about the Thrustmaster ts-xw? Thoughts on the FFB strength?

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I have the thrustmaster t3pa pedals with a squash ball behind the brakes and they're still too light.  A lot of muscle memory to get good with it.  So I just went with ABS cuz I don't have the time.

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Way back on the Xbox 360 wheel and pedals, you could cut and inch or side oval strip off a squishy foam coozie and put that behind the brake pedal.lol Forgot about that until you said this, but it worked well.

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On 8/28/2019 at 10:05 AM, ShelbyUSA said:

What about the Thrustmaster ts-xw? Thoughts on the FFB strength?

I havent used one, but generally the very fast guys, whether in iracing or whatever, use very light settings. Having FFB jacked all the way up is fun, be it makes it much more difficult to differentiate forces. 

Your wheel isnt cheap, so turn off Understeer effects and maybe start at 50 overall FFB and see how that goes. 

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57 minutes ago, DaleRossi said:

I havent used one, but generally the very fast guys, whether in iracing or whatever, use very light settings. Having FFB jacked all the way up is fun, be it makes it much more difficult to differentiate forces. 

Your wheel isnt cheap, so turn off Understeer effects and maybe start at 50 overall FFB and see how that goes. 

I will try the “no understeer,” but will my wheel give me that feedback associated with understeer? Fyi, I did try FFB at 50, and it feels “floaty.” Do I jack the other FFB numbers up too?
 

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1 hour ago, DaleRossi said:

Way back on the Xbox 360 wheel and pedals, you could cut and inch or side oval strip off a squishy foam coozie and put that behind the brake pedal.lol Forgot about that until you said this, but it worked well.

True. I have a Fanatec Club Sport pedals on the Xbox 360. They had FFB on the brake and it was controlled independently from the game I think. For example, you can adjust 70% pressure to start rumbling. 

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13 minutes ago, ShelbyUSA said:

I will try the “no understeer,” but will my wheel give me that feedback associated with understeer? Fyi, I did try FFB at 50, and it feels “floaty.” Do I jack the other FFB numbers up too?
 

You will still feel it, it just won't be overly pronounced.

50 FFB, road feel, curbs, and off road would be around 20 or so as a good starting point.

Wheel rotation also matters. 360 degrees is a good rule of thumb. Some adjust it tighter for tracks like Monaco. I've gone as low as 270 in PCars open wheel, but like 360 in this game. I assume you have it set right, but if not, that will make a big difference.

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13 minutes ago, ShelbyUSA said:

True. I have a Fanatec Club Sport pedals on the Xbox 360. They had FFB on the brake and it was controlled independently from the game I think. For example, you can adjust 70% pressure to start rumbling. 

If you still have those, they will be a lot better than the Thrustmaster pedals you are using! Set those up. May need some grease if they're been sitting for a while, but they should be good to go.  Pedals make a bigger difference than the wheel, IMO, in overall sim racing. 

Also, what size is your wheel rim? If it's not a 270 or 290 on the large side, that will make it tough to get a great feel.  Granted, I did race Formula cars with a Fanatec Clubsport 330 rim for quite a while before I got my F1 rim and it was fine for the time.

 

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18 minutes ago, DaleRossi said:

If you still have those, they will be a lot better than the Thrustmaster pedals you are using! Set those up. May need some grease if they're been sitting for a while, but they should be good to go.  Pedals make a bigger difference than the wheel, IMO, in overall sim racing. 

Also, what size is your wheel rim? If it's not a 270 or 290 on the large side, that will make it tough to get a great feel.  Granted, I did race Formula cars with a Fanatec Clubsport 330 rim for quite a while before I got my F1 rim and it was fine for the time.

 

I have the F1 open wheel with the ts-xw and I love it. The sparco wheel that it came with was super nice but u struggled with the buttons, as the lacked feedback when pressed. 
 

i don’t think there is compatibility with my Thrustmaster and the clubsport pedals on the Xbox. Agreed with pedals. More important than a wheel. 

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23 hours ago, ShelbyUSA said:

I have the F1 open wheel with the ts-xw and I love it. The sparco wheel that it came with was super nice but u struggled with the buttons, as the lacked feedback when pressed. 
 

i don’t think there is compatibility with my Thrustmaster and the clubsport pedals on the Xbox. Agreed with pedals. More important than a wheel. 

Interesting on the Sparco. I'm looking for a new rim for GT cars in the 300mm range.  The problem with the Sparco was the button presses or the wheel was too heavy for good FFB?

Sucks you can mix match pedals. It's definitely not a cheap hobby.lol

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42 minutes ago, DaleRossi said:

Interesting on the Sparco. I'm looking for a new rim for GT cars in the 300mm range.  The problem with the Sparco was the button presses or the wheel was too heavy for good FFB?

Sucks you can mix match pedals. It's definitely not a cheap hobby.lol

The buttons don’t really have a “click”. Also, you got to wear gloves with it, because it’s suede and it will matte from the oils from your hand. 
however, the wheel is good looking. The wheel is heavy compared to my open wheel. 

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1 hour ago, ShelbyUSA said:

The buttons don’t really have a “click”. Also, you got to wear gloves with it, because it’s suede and it will matte from the oils from your hand. 
however, the wheel is good looking. The wheel is heavy compared to my open wheel. 

Yep, same with the Formula rim. I had an Alcantara wheel in my last car and it was a nightmare to keep remotely clean. So I just got some cheap gloves for the Formula rim.

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On 8/28/2019 at 5:46 PM, DaleRossi said:

Yes, it is where FFB is so high that you can't feel the difference in forces anymore.

50 is probably fine with your wheel. I think I'm at 45 with a Fanatec Clubsport base.

If this is the only game that gives you these issues, maybe your in game forces are out of balance.

Ross feel, curbs etc I keep at about 1/3 of the FFB setting. Understeern effects Off and Damper at 2 or so. 

If this is the only game you're playing with your wheel, it may be something messed up in your driver or wheel settings.  The overall FFB in the game isn't great, but what you're getting definitely isnt normal.

Hey, thanks for the response. I play on a PS4 so drivers etc. are out of the question. I also drive Assetto Corsa and Dirt Rally and I have no such issues in them, just this game. FFB settings are quite similar to what you described. This week I actually tried turning on Understeer effects and to be honest I feel like it helped my driving in the dry but slowed me down in the wet. It helped a bit with the enormous difficulties in mid-corner understeer I've been having in this game.

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3 hours ago, janbonator said:

Hey, thanks for the response. I play on a PS4 so drivers etc. are out of the question. I also drive Assetto Corsa and Dirt Rally and I have no such issues in them, just this game. FFB settings are quite similar to what you described. This week I actually tried turning on Understeer effects and to be honest I feel like it helped my driving in the dry but slowed me down in the wet. It helped a bit with the enormous difficulties in mid-corner understeer I've been having in this game.

Drivers, I meant for your wheel. But yeah, playing Assetto F1 cars and then this and the FFB is definitely not great in F1 2019. 

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