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1fastben said:
.....

Ok i repeat, it's made to be a sim, it's written sim on it, most of us want physics and ffb improve and wants it look like RBR.
Not funny for you ? Sorry . You don't want games you bought turn out sim like ? We neither want our just born sim to turn arcade because you or people find it too difficult. You have tons of it : NFS,1,2, 7,4839, gran turismo, AC, Pcars. We are running on an old and mario 64 graphic's like 2004 game called RBR ! SIM GAMERS WANT A GAME DESIGN FOR THEM ONCE !

SamRWD said:
OK I've tried to stay away from a RBR discussion here, but I need to adress this topic. I will actually start with another example to begin with:

I've been "playing" flying simulators (rotary wing is my thing, fixed wing aircrafts are boring for me) since I got my first computer. Actually, there were helicopter "simulators" made for Amiga before, so it began even earlier for me. I've been playing pretty much RBR since it's release date (I was enjoying CMR series before). Now there is one common issue with all true, realistic simulators that makes them enjoyable for simulators enthusiasts, and makes them unnaproachable for everyone elese unless certain features are introduced. The term is:

LEARNING CURVE.

It takes a lot of time to learn how to fly (controll) a virtual helicopter. It is actually arguably more difficult than driving a car in RBR. It is certainly much more difficult than flying a real thing (as was mentioned by all real life helicopter pilots I came across). It takes just as much time to learn all the aircraft systems, instruments, procedures. It take................................
Your economic model could be interesting, but lacking identity. Bad thing for a united community and for time...as time is money...

STOP COMPARING FLIGHT SIMULATORS or other non sense... You right about one thing, RBR is not as easy as Gran turismo, or Dirt. It took me an hour on RBR and 10 min on other,  to understand cars,  RWD, AWD, braking. This time scale can change up or down from a people to another...anyway But don't compare it to land a boeing 747. We all drive in real life,  most have done karting once, a bit less went  fast on road, and a few had done real life races. So yes, SIM RACING like RBR must be approach with the brain. What's difficult ?
We all have done it with a car no ? And the pleasure is naturally there, driving is something pleasant, so why twist it and make it bizarre, non intuitive, false ?! People racing on RBR are not rally drivers but they could do it.
I must say, it gonna be much more easy to approach with triple screen thing and better graphics, because seeing your environment clearly help very much to feel thing. The representation of a long road down a valley at sundown is bad with old graphics, and other things.For standart gamer RBR immersiveness is average, i recognize. But with graphicsl like that, gameplay facility, 'grand public' setting ... you must admit it gonna be immersive and much more easy to take on, (even with 747 physics in  quattro...)

So get back to simple life driving pleasure DEVS PLEASE, and put tons of aids we can turn on and off. Make us feel, just not see.
That's what im talking about : FEELING ! The only game we can approach like real life is fps or flying with an DK2 stuff & co or simrace driving. Because the wheel is provides to give you sensation, the game to immerge you and then comes the sensations, anf a fabulous game.

Driving is not fast driving, driving fast is getting more and more difficult the more we are approaching the limit of the car.
Anyone could set a limousine handling on cars with all AIDS on, auto-clutch, auto-countersteering, traction control, ESP.
This is simple, take less time than making two identity of a same game, and everybody is happy even those fo paid for game named sim and still expecting arcade like.


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Just because it's a sim doesn't mean it has to be miserable to play and require a cliff-face of a learning curve. Driving a rally car isn't as impossible as RBR makes it seem, and that's what I'm trying to say. To me, a good sim will give you the FEEL of driving without actually being in a moving car as well as realistic physics that FEEL like real life, so it's natural to pick up, yet still very, very hard to master. I want it to be a sim as much as everyone else, so chill the hell out, people. We're all here to try throw our opinions in to help the final product, so why not be constructive instead of abrasive?

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Anyway! 

Championship series idea I had that I think would immensely help replayability and player retention by adding three randomized series to choose from in each season. This, naturally, requires more events and cars. :p 

If you're curious, click the link, as the pic doesn't seem to want to work. It's a diagram of how I kinda envision it, and a light explanation.


(If image doesn't pop up) 
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o165/1fastben/Dirt-Rally-Championship-Series.jpg
 

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-I was thinking about this as I watch S.Loeb video, some time he ask his co-pilot to repeat the segment again. It could be really helpful to have a button to repeat the last pace note.

-The co polite fumble his note or having hard to to read the note to you when the turn/landing is to hard.

-Cosmetic wise, I would love to have some haze/heat wave for those hot stages. It give you that nice dry and hot weather feeling.


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Very excited about what you guys have done so far. Congratulations!

My wishlist includes the following

1 More options/settings for Wheel Calibration/Support for 900 Degree rotation
2 More FFB settings
3 More FOV adjustment and SEAT position adjustment
4 Triple screen support for sided screen angle/FOV/distance/size etc

Love the simple elegant UI. Love the visuals and lighting. Love the sounds. The only thing ATM that IMO could do with some improvement is Characters (resolution)and character movement.

But love it so far overall.

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I've found the co-driver timings to be a little inconsistent at times. Some calls are made much earlier (not really a problem), but occasionally he calls them very, very late, as in last second or once I've already reached the apex of the turn.

Most the timings are fine, but these late calls can be a nuisance, especially since they're usually at sharp turns just after a fast segment.

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Disclaimer: I am sure all of these have been mentioned...I'm merely dog-piling to stress stuff I'd hope for.

In no particular order:

1) More unique stages per rally.  A rally should be able to consist of 15-18 unique stages (even if we count reverse stages).  Right now the rally gets a little stale at round 10-12.

2) I have difficulty hearing the co-driver even when all other settings are 50% and he is 100%.

3) Gravel against the tub/car could be boosted a good bit.  It's one of the overwhelming sounds from my limited experience in a rally car.

4) Tires, headlamps, wipers etc.  These should be controllable and players should be able to decide on tire compounds (even mixing them front to back as desired...make your decision and cope with it).

5) Offer a stronger damage mode.  I've taken some serious shunts and done no more than 5-10% damage to radiators etc.  Maybe not lock it in as default, but allow a more dangerous setting for damage to the car.

6) In addition to the damage...make your mechanics more worthwhile.  It's a bit silly to fix something 5-10% and take 15 minutes.  I understand you're supposed to train your team, but they're pretty crap at fixing cars.

7) A few more long stages, and a few stages with a little less difficulty.  As it stands now, most of the stages seem really aggressive and difficult, almost like you're trying to cram too much into some of the stages.  Consider some stages with a little less constant hairpins etc.

8) I do think the levels of traction need a lot of work.  I can't even begin to explain all of it, but the car doesn't feel "right" most of the time.  I spent way too much time hauling tail off-road, and it simply doesn't feel right in the game.  I look forward to the updates Kevin is working on with you guys.

9) Work on the leagues tabs on the web-page.  They're very spotty and random, frequently locking up and not creating seasons or events.  I like this idea though.  It's fun and provides a good MP option.

10) A few more slower cars.  I'd like to see more entry level FWD or slower AWD cars.  Something to learn on.  Right now it seems your options are "slow...or fast" with nothing in the middle.

11) The liveries are pretty terrible in the game right now.  Would love to see some work (even by volunteers) in producing better looking, realistic liveries.

...there's more but it's time to pass out for the evening.  I'm loving the game, but I'd say it's only 75-80% of what I wanted in a rally game (read: 10x better than the other Dirt games).  Here's hoping it continues developing into a damn proper and sustainable rally game.  It's started in the right direction! 

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Devs has to ee that !!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKseyeKW4QE

Another video to show what can be done, what should be done, what will be do 
...
It's seems a bit magic to mee, devs has to see that ! 2011 !

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You said it , it makes it seem.. but it's not .

My Girlfriend , she has no licence, never touch a wheel, affraid of speed, and she's learning on RBR with me.

ABOUT THE LEARNING CURVES, it's not the same with 4k graphics, better visibility, faster and easier gameplay, rally school, Intuitive FFB, and ALL ESP, TC, ABS calibration you should have... Mate,  if you got your driving licence one day i bet a million $ you'd be able to run RBR, if you cannot just follow the road in RBR, for god sake never take your car on real road, but I'm surely mistakin..

 If you're saying "No don't make it too Sim's like because it's undrivable " ?
 -1 :Then it's false, simple. You find it difficult, that is true. We , simracers, bought a sim, that is true as well...
- 2  It's your right to prefer Gran turismo or latest PC or AC ! you have thousand games with astonishing graphics, thousand cars with 2015 gameplay, so play it and leave us with our maybe only "one in 10 years " rally game we all expected since 2004.


1fastben said:
Just because it's a sim doesn't mean it has to be miserable to play and require a cliff-face of a learning curve. Driving a rally car isn't as impossible as RBR makes it seem... 

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You're misunderstanding what I'm saying. I'm not saying they shouldn't make a sim, I WANT IT TO BE A SIM. I ONLY play racing games that are sims.You can say Forza (NOT Horizons), DiRT, and GT aren't sims, and granted, they're not as straight-up sim as something like iRacing or whatever, but they still are, by definition, racing sims. They aren't arcade games, like you accuse me of preferring. They're more like Sim-lite or sim medium. Granted, though, GT's rally mode is awful. 

WHAT I AM SAYING is that if it's too unapproachable as a sim it will turn players away, and without players, the developers make no money to continue to support the game and the existing players. So it needs to be approachable to multiple levels of SIM FANS, sim lite and sim hardcore like yourself, and still challenging on all levels. You have to understand that this game cannot just appeal to the hardcore sim people, it also has to appeal to the sim-lite crowd. I really like the idea that the one guy had a page back(?) that the final game include variable grip levels for different player types. Not anything outside the realm of simulation, but just enough to make the majority happy.

RBR is very difficult if you don't use a steering wheel setup, and I bet you're right that with that setup you listed, it makes the game MUCH more fun and approachable. I'd love to try that and get seat time on that, it sounds like a blast! But I use a game pad controller because it's what I'm comfortable with for gaming and don't feel like forking over the cash for a wheel setup and all that goes with it. A sim shouldn't require a steering wheel to play it adequately and enjoy, BUT a special mode for it would be cool for those who prefer it.

As for real driving, I have actual rally experience, and it's not very hard to stay on the road, and yet, in RBR, it is. No matter what anyone says, the sensation of driving in video games still only lightly translates to anything in the real world; ask someone who has ran Nurburgring a million times in their favorite racing sim and then tried it in real life. They'll be blown away at how very different it is. But real life to video game translation does seem to work alright when the game is built properly to the perceived or felt physics of real life. I'm really glad the dev of DiRT has started codriving and has gotten what rally feels like inside the car, the experience shows through well in this game so far. 

If would you, please inform me of this link you posted above?  Is that an actual game mod that's available? I've played RBR with the 2013 update pack, and obviously, didn't enjoy it... But a combo of Dirt 1 and the driving mechanics (sort of) of RBR is actually something I'd really like to try. 

So if it floats your boat, you can keep on being insulting and belligerent to me; I literally can't do anything to stop you. I don't want to argue with you at all. But please try to take a step back and look at the this in the big picture for what Codemasters has ahead of them. They're doing their best to make this game the best rally game for all the people that want a rally sim, that includes the sim-lite and sim hardcore players. And like it or not, we're on the same team here. 

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1fastben said:
Just because it's a sim doesn't mean it has to be miserable to play and require a cliff-face of a learning curve. Driving a rally car isn't as impossible as RBR makes it seem, and that's what I'm trying to say. To me, a good sim will give you the FEEL of driving without actually being in a moving car as well as realistic physics that FEEL like real life, so it's natural to pick up, yet still very, very hard to master. I want it to be a sim as much as everyone else, so chill the hell out, people. We're all here to try throw our opinions in to help the final product, so why not be constructive instead of abrasive?
RBR is EASY!  It is HARD to go really really fast without crashing, just as in REAL life, but just driving the car in RBR is incredibly easy, because the physics are so realistic.

It is totally natural, just like a real car is very easy until you start pushing the speed beyond your capabilities/ talent as a driver.

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I personaly think dirt 4 is getting to easy as stated above RBR easy? euhm i think not.Dirt 4 is getting easy as i said earlier in another post its getting easier and easier car grips roads like they stick on it like glue.As someone else posted if you drive a high performance car on gravel roads you can't go full throttle everywhere.If you push a little on the brakes the car just throws itself sideways.Also the Escort Cosworth drives like it has 500bhp.


ps i leave all assist on off.

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great potential this sim and u guys nailed the sounds great , needs more reverb in the wooded areas the cars.
but over all fantastic.

player control of all the car functions as a option lights wipers etc hazzards everything.
also realistic crashes u hit a ditch boom tires gone thats it , engine damage and over heating also needs to be added.
out the race as in real life. arcade mode we can damage maybe but keep going.

want to see a online replay system added people can share race footage , more camera angles and free roam camera view track side.
maybe introduce multiplayer viewing watch other players drive around.

would like to see test track straight section to test cars speed.

also multiplayer rallyecross new mode , also spectate as well othe rpeople can come in watch races.

more world locations and a concrete test circuit for all the cars.

player added content in the future new cars tracks.

but codemasters is finally going in the right direction with this.


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Just my opinion with the physics:
Please, fix that horrible understeer. It's very annoying that amount of understeer/rear grip when you are through the corners. Almost no saves are needed because the cars don't slide in the enter/middle of the corner. And in corner exit, suddenly the car lose the rear and it's very hard to save it due to the lack of power at low speeds. The physics itself are funny, by they are frustrated when you try to go faster sliding the car through the corners. 

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BWX said:

RBR is EASY!  It is HARD to go really really fast without crashing, just as in REAL life, but just driving the car in RBR is incredibly easy, because the physics are so realistic.

It is totally natural, just like a real car is very easy until you start pushing the speed beyond your capabilities/ talent as a driver.
Anyone who disagrees on this post has never driven a real car or has some kind of fault in some of their senses !
So many rally experts here. RBR isn't realistic. I think you lot seem to underestimate how much grip gravel tyres have these days. 

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BWX said:

RBR is EASY!  It is HARD to go really really fast without crashing, just as in REAL life, but just driving the car in RBR is incredibly easy, because the physics are so realistic.

It is totally natural, just like a real car is very easy until you start pushing the speed beyond your capabilities/ talent as a driver.
Anyone who disagrees on this post has never driven a real car or has some kind of fault in some of their senses !
So many rally experts here. RBR isn't realistic. I think you lot seem to underestimate how much grip gravel tyres have these days. 
So many experts here. RBR is the most realistic rally sim. I think You lot seem to overestmate how much grip tyres have this days because You are used to DiRT grip levels instead to get familiar with real life onboards rally fans are watching all the times. I'd forward You to "does the game have too much grip" discussion, You can find all the evidence there- not personal opinions, but raw video footage showing You're wrong. RBR is not 100% accurate, but real life is, so if RBR is not realisic, then DiRT Rally is Mario Kart.

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When was the last time you actually went to a rally instead of watching videos @SamRWD?
Two years ago. It doesn't matter. We've had many fake rally drivers here. Real life video is a solid proof independent on personal feelings and opinions. I'd like to forward You to the topic I've mentioned above, You will find my take on real life drivers input including Robert Kubica's.
EDIT: Unless You mean as spectator- if so, then it was 4 months ago.

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I cannot believe they didn't release a FFB fix patch before all this other content patch and fixes. The one thing the game seriously needs, and they ignore it.

Well, it is CM after all, I guess I can believe it :-/

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BWX said:
I cannot believe they didn't release a FFB fix patch before all this other content patch and fixes. The one thing the game seriously needs, and they ignore it.

Well, it is CM after all, I guess I can believe it :-/
Stop being so impatient. They're working on the FFB fix, and they want to test it throughly before releasing it to the public, so that people like you don't then moan that it's still broken or something stupid. 

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BWX said:
I cannot believe they didn't release a FFB fix patch before all this other content patch and fixes. The one thing the game seriously needs, and they ignore it.

Well, it is CM after all, I guess I can believe it :-/
Stop being so impatient. They're working on the FFB fix, and they want to test it throughly before releasing it to the public, so that people like you don't then moan that it's still broken or something stupid. 
Stop defending the indefensible. If CM were some brand new company I would feel completely differently.
We all know their track record of leaving in huge, glaring, game breaking bugs in games long  after they say they will fix it.  Therefore, I distrust them and don't believe the hype as you do.

Stop whining and crying about my posts.

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Hey guys, I absolutely love this game, the direction it's going, a; but, I'm still having problems with H-Shifter assignments.... I'm using a Logitech DFGT with the Basherboards FL2 adapter for a G27 Shifter, I don't have a clutch pedal, but that's not the problem. I can map all gears to their respective positions on the shifter, except for reverse. The reverse position on the shifter is working, I can map it to any other button, but I can't map anything to use for reverse, Please Help!!!

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BWX said:
BWX said:
I cannot believe they didn't release a FFB fix patch before all this other content patch and fixes. The one thing the game seriously needs, and they ignore it.

Well, it is CM after all, I guess I can believe it :-/
Stop being so impatient. They're working on the FFB fix, and they want to test it throughly before releasing it to the public, so that people like you don't then moan that it's still broken or something stupid. 
Stop defending the indefensible. If CM were some brand new company I would feel completely differently.
We all know their track record of leaving in huge, glaring, game breaking bugs in games long  after they say they will fix it.  Therefore, I distrust them and don't believe the hype as you do.

Stop whining and crying about my posts.
Do you not understand what early access is? The game is a WIP, they might just leave the FFB issue until November for all I know! Hopefully they do, you might continue crying to mummy then. 

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