Tyre life in qualifying programme

[Jocw 4]

Hi !

I'm having troubles with qualifying program in F1 2019 that I didn't experience in F1 2018. This program is supposed to last 3 laps, each one about 0.1 or 0.2 seconds slower than the previous one. I usually get the first one right, but at such a cost to my tyres that I lose about 1/2 second each lap, effectively making this a one-lap practice program. 

Am I the only one to experience this issue ? Do you push the car to the limit during this practice program or do you try to save some tyre life for your last 2 laps ?

Thanks !

[1henryw 66]

ERS ruins it for me. I get one hotlap ERS lap then its maxed out so I only get 1 decent lap to try and beat the target.

[Jocw 4]

i'm still using a few assists, ERS mode is one of them, so not an issue for me

Can't you recharge the battery on your 2nd lap and get full power back for the last one ?

 

Almost forgot, i'm on the pad + a few assists (anti-lock brakes, medium traction control)

[Worntoathread 435]

It's best to really give it everything to try and nail it the first lap. If you don't, you're better off selecting retry practice program from the pause menu instead of going for more laps on sub-optimal tyres. 

[kalamazoo123 127]

I usually find i can do 2 laps on hotlap mode (just about and varies slightly track to track).

You have to make sure to run no deployment mode on outlap to ensure a full charge at start of 1st flying lap.

The tires are usually good for 2 laps so thats ok.

No chance at all of ever getting the 3rd lap in though, so i think the practice prog should just be 2 laps.

[Worntoathread 435]

15 minutes ago, kalamazoo123 said:

I usually find i can do 2 laps on hotlap mode (just about and varies slightly track to track).

You have to make sure to run no deployment mode on outlap to ensure a full charge at start of 1st flying lap.

The tires are usually good for 2 laps so thats ok.

No chance at all of ever getting the 3rd lap in though, so i think the practice prog should just be 2 laps.

Well that depends a lot on your upgrades and race length settings as well; with enough ERS upgrades you can do two laps in a row on hotlap but not with the base performance.

For the tyres, if you do 25% races the wear will also scale like this in practice so for some tracks that means a 0.9 second drop off after 1 flying lap, while the target time doesn't adjust at all. In that case it's pretty much impossible to get it the second lap unless you're running at a very low difficulty.

 

Edited August 19 by Worntoathread

[Jocw 4]

20 minutes ago, Worntoathread said:

It's best to really give it everything to try and nail it the first lap. If you don't, you're better off selecting retry practice program from the pause menu instead of going for more laps on sub-optimal tyres. 

Yeah, that's what I've been doing but I'd like to stop using replays and restarts of possible

[Jocw 4]

5 minutes ago, Worntoathread said:

Well that depends a lot on your upgrades and race length settings as well; with enough ERS upgrades you can do two laps in a row on hotlap but not with the base performance.

For the tyres, if you do 25% races the wear will also scale like this in practice so for some tracks that means a 0.9 second drop off after 1 flying lap, while the target time doesn't adjust at all. In that case it's pretty much impossible to get it the second lap unless you're running at a very low difficulty.

 

I do 50% races

So maybe I need to prioritize tyre wear development

Or maybe pad + assists don't allow you to save enough tyre life

[johnboy83 31]

1 hour ago, kalamazoo123 said:

I usually find i can do 2 laps on hotlap mode (just about and varies slightly track to track).

You have to make sure to run no deployment mode on outlap to ensure a full charge at start of 1st flying lap.

The tires are usually good for 2 laps so thats ok.

No chance at all of ever getting the 3rd lap in though, so i think the practice prog should just be 2 laps.

I think 3 laps is fine as you have attempts if you make a mistake. If you  know you are not gonna make the lap back off save tyres, turn down fuel and ERS, and try again the next lap, and repeat if needed on the 3rd lap. If it’s touch and go and you are going full whack all lap, then you won’t get the 3rd lap. 

The thing that annoys me is that the hotlap mode runs out before the end of the lap on most tracks if you don’t fiddle with ERS around the lap. If hotlap mode is meant to be the best delivery of power across a whole lap, then it should last a whole lap. 

Edited August 19 by johnboy83

[Uppern 39]

I run full on hotlap-mode for first lap, then I do cool-down lap on lap 2 of the program to fully charge ERS and cool down tires (get them back into optimal temperature range) and then I go full blast on the third lap. I honestly don't have any big issues with my tires on the third lap, and a lot of the times I set my fastest lap in the program in the third lap. 

[kalamazoo123 127]

2 hours ago, johnboy83 said:

he thing that annoys me is that the hotlap mode runs out before the end of the lap on most tracks if you don’t fiddle with ERS around the lap. If hotlap mode is meant to be the best delivery of power across a whole lap, then it should last a whole l

Not really... you still only have a limited amount your are allowed to deploy over the whole lap. Hotlap mode optimises this deployment over the lap, so depending on track layout it may or may not save some till the end of the lap.

[kalamazoo123 127]

3 hours ago, Worntoathread said:

Well that depends a lot on your upgrades and race length settings as well; with enough ERS upgrades you can do two laps in a row on hotlap but not with the base performance.

For the tyres, if you do 25% races the wear will also scale like this in practice so for some tracks that means a 0.9 second drop off after 1 flying lap, while the target time doesn't adjust at all. In that case it's pretty much impossible to get it the second lap unless you're running at a very low difficulty.

 

Good point re scaling for tires. I do 100% distance so thats probably why i don’t see the same issues that others might here.

I dont have any ers upgrades though, and i still manage to get 2 consecutive hotlaps at most tracks.

[SIMRACER123 175]

Always do the outlap yourself rather than flying lap to get more heat in the tyres.

Always make sure the track is rubbered in too.

[ptank20 51]

Should be doable using medium ERS whilst turning it up to high or overtake on the straights?

[Jocw 4]

19 hours ago, SIMRACER123 said:

Always do the outlap yourself rather than flying lap to get more heat in the tyres.

Always make sure the track is rubbered in too.

That's why I usually keep the qualifying program for P3

[martbloke 329]

On 8/19/2019 at 7:54 PM, kalamazoo123 said:

Good point re scaling for tires. I do 100% distance so thats probably why i don’t see the same issues that others might here.

I dont have any ers upgrades though, and i still manage to get 2 consecutive hotlaps at most tracks.

 

I thought tyre wear scaling was fixed in a patch 2 patches ago? Either it should now show 100% distances in practice and qualy then scale accordingly for the race or should show the scaled distances in P & Q and should wear correctly i.e. 4 driven laps = 1 lap wear (25%) or 2  driven laps = 1 lap wear (50%) - should then resort to 1 driven lap = 1 lap wear for the race.

[Worntoathread 435]

52 minutes ago, martbloke said:

 

I thought tyre wear scaling was fixed in a patch 2 patches ago? Either it should now show 100% distances in practice and qualy then scale accordingly for the race or should show the scaled distances in P & Q and should wear correctly i.e. 4 driven laps = 1 lap wear (25%) or 2  driven laps = 1 lap wear (50%) - should then resort to 1 driven lap = 1 lap wear for the race.

Hey Martbloke, with that patch the scaling was turned off for qualifying so you don't have to start the race on worn tyres anymore when doing 25% races. The scaling still exists in practice though, which is a good thing as it allows you to determine the race strategy accordingly.

The issue here is that in the qualifying pace program the target stays the same for all three laps, even though on 25% scaling you can lose over half a second per lap. So I guess it's the target time that needs adjusting rather than the tyre wear or scaling.

Edited August 21 by Worntoathread

[Ho3n3r 115]

On 8/19/2019 at 4:39 PM, Jocw said:

This program is supposed to last 3 laps

Incorrect. It lasts as many laps as it takes you to do a lap faster than the requirement, up to 3 laps max. If you nail the first lap, no need to do lap 2 and 3.

Thus, it is a one lap practice program, if done properly.

Edited August 21 by Ho3n3r

[Jocw 4]

20 minutes ago, Ho3n3r said:

Incorrect. It lasts as many laps as it takes you to do a lap faster than the requirement, up to 3 laps max. If you nail the first lap, no need to do lap 2 and 3.

Thus, it is a one lap practice program, if done properly.

Just like every program. But it's supposed to give you 3 chances to get it right, so there's something wrong of you can't even get to the 2nd one without losing 1/2 second per lap

[Ho3n3r 115]

2 minutes ago, Jocw said:

Just like every program. But it's supposed to give you 3 chances to get it right, so there's something wrong of you can't even get to the 2nd one without losing 1/2 second per lap

Not every program - the race program is multiple laps.

Regarding the 3 chances - yes, but obviously your tyres will be worn after an outlap and 1 or 2 failed attempts. Are you implying that it should stay at 100% after failing on the first lap as well as an outlap?

[martbloke 329]

3 hours ago, Worntoathread said:

Hey Martbloke, with that patch the scaling was turned off for qualifying so you don't have to start the race on worn tyres anymore when doing 25% races. The scaling still exists in practice though, which is a good thing as it allows you to determine the race strategy accordingly.

The issue here is that in the qualifying pace program the target stays the same for all three laps, even though on 25% scaling you can lose over half a second per lap. So I guess it's the target time that needs adjusting rather than the tyre wear or scaling.

 

Ah OK, thanks for clarifying. I misunderstood the patch fix then.

Good way they've done it actually now you say this as it is good to understand in practice how the race wear will be but of course the qualy program is affected. Maybe they could put a fix in so that that program has 100% tyre life no matter race length so you can determine qualy time - OR fix the target time to show according to the scaled tyre wear per lap (I'd expect the target time to be like this across all programs tbh).

[Jocw 4]

1 hour ago, Ho3n3r said:

Not every program - the race program is multiple laps.

Not if you're quick enough, i've done it in one lap several times when I was struggling to find the right difficulty level

1 hour ago, Ho3n3r said:

Regarding the 3 chances - yes, but obviously your tyres will be worn after an outlap and 1 or 2 failed attempts. Are you implying that it should stay at 100% after failing on the first lap as well as an outlap?

Off course not, but maybe target times should be readjusted ?

As suggested here : 

5 hours ago, Worntoathread said:

Hey Martbloke, with that patch the scaling was turned off for qualifying so you don't have to start the race on worn tyres anymore when doing 25% races. The scaling still exists in practice though, which is a good thing as it allows you to determine the race strategy accordingly.

The issue here is that in the qualifying pace program the target stays the same for all three laps, even though on 25% scaling you can lose over half a second per lap. So I guess it's the target time that needs adjusting rather than the tyre wear or scaling.

 

[Ho3n3r 115]

20 minutes ago, Jocw said:

Not if you're quick enough, i've done it in one lap several times when I was struggling to find the right difficulty level

There is no possible way to pass the race strategy program in 1 lap, no matter what you do.

[Jocw 4]

4 minutes ago, Ho3n3r said:

There is no possible way to pass the race strategy program in 1 lap, no matter what you do.

You make me doubt, but i'm pretty sure it happened to me when I played on 70 difficulty (though 90 was closer to my true level) and started to win races with Renault

Anyway, we're drifting off-topic