Jump to content
DiRT Rally 2.0 - New Player Guide Read more... ×

GRID Graphics Discussion

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Miatakias_GR said:

This video looks good  but still night 

First video with normal lightning! This is the night but location is lightened enough to see backgrounds.

Also, colorful smoke at the finish line looks like a smoke, instead colorful sprites in previous videos.

dhh.gif.4c5aaa8a9ab482a81b0481e62358de4d.gif

Reflections still are fake.

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, lastbreath said:

First video with normal lightning! This is the night but location is lightened enough to see backgrounds.

Also, colorful smoke at the finish line looks like a smoke, instead colorful sprites in previous videos.

Reflections still are fake.

Totally agree. This night lighting looks decent and the finish line sparks look good now.

Reflections still horrible colored squares that don't make any sense. They don't match the environment at all. Even the colors are made up from nothing similar:image.thumb.png.6ab25d609b6d6447d7ca10d18879b7e0.pngimage.thumb.png.3df57bd8c00eb05305785b475675ae7a.png
image.thumb.png.3cb183c9ca8d373188e0418c558dfdb1.pngimage.thumb.png.62e6e8d1c152dafff5eccb79057f69ec.png
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For comparision.

F1 2015, great looking puddles and full reflections of cars and environment. 4 years ago:
image.thumb.png.37366816e2631a4214e822b467349c96.png

F1 2014. Full reflections of cars and environment. 5 YEARS AGO:
image.thumb.png.1690440585b98cf638c5a52639811caf.png

But wait, there's even more...   F1 2009, fuqing 10 years ago🤦‍♂️
image.thumb.png.08c8c336f3299bc17530dfd35c636cdb.png

And look at those trees and shrubs...  


Bonus track: F1 2001. PS2:
EA_Sports_F1_2001_Screenshot_1.jpgimage.png.af658c067aeff09cd1d1bba769bf1e0e.png 

Two generations ago, cars properly reflected on the wet asphalt. 😂

 

Edited by jesped
  • Confused 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, jesped said:

Can you post any of those videos with realistic reflections?

All I've seen so far are static cubemaps that doesn't match the environment and car lights. Neither the cars nor the scenery are reflected in the road. It's all fake and it shows. A lot.

Just check the latest video posted in this thread today, you will find plenty realistic light reflections on the wet road. But I agree, you can also find plenty which seem off... Not sure if those cases are just fixable bugs or "by design" problems, guess we will soon find out.

 

About being optimistic that we will see improvements in this area, it is because of the dev response here, saying that some of the feedback/critisism you guys posted is actually very helpful to them. If they did not respond at all, or said something along the lines of "nonsense, it's all fine", then I would be worried as well. Also seeing how some tracks (like China) look wonderful, makes me optimistic that those that do not look good can and will be improved as well.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I took my time and read through the thread, and what I noticed is a serious lack of whats important. 1st @ChrisGrovesMCM clearly stated they released unfinished footage and access to AT LEAST allow us to see whats to be expected. Yet some of u ignore this probably cause u no longer care. You say u care but in reality u dont cause caring requires faith, and some of u clearly have no faith they can make a quality game anymore. 2nd, if all u can point to is a few graphical mishaps then they are on the right track. 3rd, netcode, lag, glitches, crashes, racenet, wheel compatibility, controller adjustments, cheat prevention, leaderboard issues are FAR more IMPORTANT then some stupid reflections and trees. Goodness people wake up, its far better to have a smooth gaming experience void of issues then graphics. FYI, reflections and trees are an easy fix which they are probably saving til last. Fix the hard problems now, save the easy stuff for last.

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Gears4Brains said:

I took my time and read through the thread, and what I noticed is a serious lack of whats important. 1st @ChrisGrovesMCM clearly stated they released unfinished footage and access to AT LEAST allow us to see whats to be expected. Yet some of u ignore this probably cause u no longer care. You say u care but in reality u dont cause caring requires faith, and some of u clearly have no faith they can make a quality game anymore. 2nd, if all u can point to is a few graphical mishaps then they are on the right track. 3rd, netcode, lag, glitches, crashes, racenet, wheel compatibility, controller adjustments, cheat prevention, leaderboard issues are FAR more IMPORTANT then some stupid reflections and trees. Goodness people wake up, its far better to have a smooth gaming experience void of issues then graphics. 

This is a "Graphics Discussion", and you come here ranting about the importance of "3rd, netcode, lag, glitches, crashes, racenet, wheel compatibility, controller adjustments, cheat prevention, leaderboard issues"... ??

I don't play online, so most of those I don't care, but you don't play with your eyes closed, do you? 🤔

There are other threads for those topics (or you can create them), and many are things we can't possible know until we play the game ourselves at release. But we can discuss what we've seen so far regarding visuals.

They're not "a few graphical mishaps" or just "some stupid reflections and trees". It's plenty of bugs, problems and lack of features that have already been listed many times. It's a game looking clearly outdated, not up to 2019 standards. Not even up to 2015 standards.

"Faith"...   😂  really?   faith?   caring requires "faith"?  like it's a dogma or a blind religious belief?   well, that would make sense then, as for some people after so many bugs and problems reported all you have to cling to is "faith". As I stated before many times in this thread... ¿how much change did any of you see in Dirt Rally 2 or Dirt 4 from the videos 1 month before release to the final version? ZERONOTHING. They looked exactly the same. We are 1 week ahead of release ( Oct 8 ), so game is finished already, don't deceive yourself.

Having visuals that are worse than own Codemasters F1 from 5 years ago is important, and shameful. Losing features that were present in games 5, 10 and even almost 20 years ago is honestly pathetic.

If you don't care, that's on you.
 

57 minutes ago, Gears4Brains said:

FYI, reflections and trees are an easy fix which they are probably saving til last.

Easy fix? who are you kidding? you think switching from static cubemaps to full real reflections on a multiplatform game is "an easy fix"?   and you do that statement...     based on what? 🤷‍♂️
Same with trees...     they already have problems with stable framerates on consoles, even on top tier like Xbox One X...    do you think it's "easy" now to add detailed trees and solve that horrible LOD switch and fix the framerates?   again...   based on what? 🤷‍♂️

Edited by jesped
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cpcdem said:

Just check the latest video posted in this thread today, you will find plenty realistic light reflections on the wet road. But I agree, you can also find plenty which seem off... Not sure if those cases are just fixable bugs or "by design" problems, guess we will soon find out.

There are only reflections from cars lights and some of the track lights like yellow arrows, but all the rest is fake. Not just fake, it's fake in a way that doesn't match the environment at all. My captures in this post are from that video: https://forums.codemasters.com/topic/42209-grid-graphics-discussion/?do=findComment&comment=467366

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, jesped said:

I don't play online, so most of those I don't care

I figured as much. Cause online ur too busy trying to win to worry about some background details staring off into the abyss like "wow look at that" LOL. There has never been a game released in the last 20 yrs that didnt have some problems, everyone knows this. But u want things to be "perfect" from the start, who are u again ? The REAL fans know to reserve judgment til later. Even after each new video u still find something wrong, u dont even play online so i dont even know why Im talking to u lol. I suppose once u clear all the events thats all there is left to do is drive around and stare at stuff, lol good luck with that. As for being outdated, ur kidding right ? or just blindly delusional ? trolling maybe ?

Nothing about that is outdated by 2019's standards. It's like a Jedi trying to explain the force to a sith lol. U only see what u want to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Still waiting for your answer to these questions...   😉

1 hour ago, jesped said:

Easy fix? who are you kidding? you think switching from static cubemaps to full real reflections on a multiplatform game is "an easy fix"?   and you do that statement...     based on what? 🤷‍♂️
Same with trees...     they already have problems with stable framerates on consoles, even on top tier like Xbox One X...    do you think it's "easy" now to add detailed trees and solve that horrible LOD switch and fix the framerates?   again...   based on what? 🤷‍♂️

Again...  ¿how much change did any of you see in Dirt Rally 2 or Dirt 4 from the videos 1 month before release to the final version? ZERONOTHING. They looked exactly the same. We are 1 week ahead of release ( Oct 8 ), so game is finished already, don't deceive yourself.
 

1 hour ago, Gears4Brains said:

I figured as much. Cause online ur too busy trying to win to worry about some background details staring off into the abyss like "wow look at that" LOL. There has never been a game released in the last 20 yrs that didnt have some problems, everyone knows this. But u want things to be "perfect" from the start, who are u again ? The REAL fans know to reserve judgment til later. 

Sure, because offline you are not "too busy trying to win" the same... 😂
You are only a "REAL" fan 🤦‍♂️ when you have "faith", play online and submissively reserve judgment until after paying up.

Different people find different aspects important on a game. For me and many other people immersion is important, for you it seems it's not. You only seem to care for online competition... good for you, go play Fortnite or whatever ego clashing game you like. Considering yourself the only "REAL" fan because of this is childish.

ALL the other games we are comparing GRID 2019 to have online too, right?   happy then? 😂

Again...    this is a thread about "GRAPHICS DISCUSSION", got it?
 

1 hour ago, Gears4Brains said:

Even after each new video u still find something wrong, u dont even play online so i dont even know why Im talking to u lol. I suppose once u clear all the events thats all there is left to do is drive around and stare at stuff, lol good luck with that. As for being outdated, ur kidding right ? or just blindly delusional ? trolling maybe ?

Nothing about that is outdated by 2019's standards. It's like a Jedi trying to explain the force to a sith lol. U only see what u want to.

If you play online...   suddenly all problems disappear 🤣

Outdated, yes, outdated like this:

image.png
B2G0igv.png
image.pngdh.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.png

Outdated like this:

GRID 2019 Sepang:
image.png

F1 2016 Sepang:
image.png

OUTDATED, yes:
image.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.pngimage.png5c291633bcd25168007eba3df.png123.png

But hey...  keep having "faith", just playing online "for the win" and using "the Force" "like a Jedi" (really, how old are you? 🤦‍♂️ ), and everything will magically disappear and be fixed and alright in your little bubble of conformist fanboyism.

Edited by jesped
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Say what u will about the game but u will not disrespect Star Wars. That movie is over 40 yrs old is STILL better then most the junk made today, its about substance get it ? And who are you fooling really ? taking snapshots probably at lower res, and then zooming in that shows more pixels lol. I can do that for Forza too and make it look subpar, nice try though. If immersion is whats really important to u, u should know better then putting ur hopes on a semi-sim title. iRacing, Assetto Corsa, Assetto Corsa Competizione, Project CARS2 in VR are what u should be playing. Ur barking up the wrong tree for that.

Edited by Gears4Brains

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Gears4Brains said:

Say what u will about the game but u will not disrespect Star Wars. That movie is over 40 yrs old is STILL better then most the **** made today, its about substance get it ?

Not disrespecting Star Wars, but your childish Jedi/Sith comparisions.
It is great for what it is. But yeah...   "substance". 😂
image.thumb.png.4883f7d127b3e89b94557590cbb0a9f0.png

 

45 minutes ago, Gears4Brains said:

And who are you fooling really ? taking snapshots probably at lower res, and then zooming in that shows more pixels lol. I can do that for Forza too and make it look subpar, nice try though. If immersion is whats really important to u, u should know better then putting ur hopes on a semi-sim title. iRacing, Assetto Corsa, Assetto Corsa Competizione, Project CARS2 in VR are what u should be playing. Ur barking up the wrong tree for that.

All captures have been taking from the maximun quality available on each video, some were 1080p and some 4K. Then this forum compresses the images more when posting them, and makes them a bit blurry. The only scaling I did was reducing some 4K captures to 1080 to avoid posting unnecesary 4MB attachments. We've been comparing GRID to all sorts of different games, with captures from those others also from YT videos at different qualities. We are not comparing if textures are more or less crisp or the compression artifacts of each format, we are comparing features (or the lack of), bugs, visual looks, art direction, ...   things that are perfectly comparable between each one of them.

I do play and have played AC, ACC, GT6, GT Sport, Driveclub, Forza, RBR...    and more similar titles like NFS and Forza Horizon. That's why so many comparisions with them have been made. Immersion doesn't mean "simulation". Those are two completely separated things.

I've been playing almost all Codemasters titles since the original Race Driver GRID: Dirt 2, Dirt Showdown, Dirt 3, Dirt Rally, Dirt 4, Dirt Rally 2, Grid 2, Grid Autosport, ...    and honestly, Race Driver GRID and Dirt 2 were the best of them. 10 years ago. Counting out rare exceptions like Dirt Rally, which was the only Early Access experiment from Codemasters, it has been pretty downhill from those days.

Now GRID 2019...    yeah, it looks fun. But outdated (F1 games from several years ago look better) , and very important too, lacking in content for a full price game, specially comparing to the previous entry in the franchise, GRID Autosport.

Edited by jesped

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, jesped said:

Race Driver GRID and Dirt 2 were the best of them. 10 years ago. Counting out rare exceptions like Dirt Rally, which was the only Early Access experiment from Codemasters, it has been pretty downhill from those days.

I don't get why so many people love Dirt 2. Gymkhana/Ken Block/Monster Energy - 🤢753570166_pepegame.jpg.4913e52b73526c423d26505dd3d94793.jpg

Dirt Rally (1.0) is much better game with classic rally experience like in CMR 1/2.0/3/04/2005. 

27 minutes ago, jesped said:

Now GRID 2019...    yeah, it looks fun. But outdated (F1 games from several years ago look better) , and very important too, lacking in content for a full price game, specially comparing to the previous entry in the franchise, GRID Autosport.

Yep, they need to heavily update their ego engine.

  • Disagree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, cpcdem said:

If they did not respond at all, or said something along the lines of "nonsense, it's all fine", then I would be worried as well

The funny thing is... they did not respond at all. Every moderator here is from DIRT team. There is literally noone from GRID team on this forum.

3 hours ago, Gears4Brains said:

some of u clearly have no faith

I have no faith because noone from GRID team cames here and says: "guys, don't worry, we know about graphics issues and will improve them". Developers keep silence and this isn't a good sign, you know.

Also, there is such thing as EXPERIENCE. And my experience easily kills my hope. Because as a rule games are already done before month to release. So last videos should be top notch. Instead they still have a lot of graphics issues. Also, as a rule, developers make super visuals and then downgrade them to optimize the game for multiplatform. Here we have crappy videos from the beginning.

And the last monent - we are whinning because we know developers can do better. They did stunning visuals 5 years ago, so what's the problem now?

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jesped said:

There are only reflections from cars lights and some of the track lights like yellow arrows, but all the rest is fake. Not just fake, it's fake in a way that doesn't match the environment at all. My captures in this post are from that video: https://forums.codemasters.com/topic/42209-grid-graphics-discussion/?do=findComment&comment=467366

No, I see plenty correct (mostly white light related) reflections which also look very nice. And I see wrong reflections as well, but I am not sure that they are fake, because for some of them I do see their source a little later on in the video, so I would not be surprised if there are just some bugs causing in some cases the reflection source to be but taken from the wrong spot (but still being realtime calculated). Not saying I am 100% sure about the above, but IF it is true, then those issues are of course (easily?) fixable.

 

Btw, I am also racing mostly online, but still good gfx is very important to me, as gfx problems ruin the immersion. So I also hope the final version will be much improved to what we've seen in some tracks. But, again, there are other tracks that have been looking fantastic already since months ago, which is very promising, you cannot overlook this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Dementiy said:

I don't get why so many people love Dirt 2

Cool atmosphere of extreme weekend.

But I like both DiRT2 and 3.

They were more arcade and easier to drive for an average gamer. For example for me it was really hard to drive and drift in Dirt Rally. And I'm not ready to buy gaming wheel to take 180 turns correctly. So, I respect Dirt Rally series but I dropped them to play.

Edited by lastbreath

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Dementiy said:

I don't get why so many people love Dirt 2. Gymkhana/Ken Block/Monster Energy - 🤢

Dirt Rally (1.0) is much better game with classic rally experience like in CMR 1/2.0/3/04/2005. 

Yep, they need to heavily update their ego engine.


Dirt 2 was much more arcade, yes. And all that dudebro attitude was lame. But it was fun as hell. It wasn't as frustrating as Dirt Rally is, it can be more rewarding but demands much more commitment. Not everybody can enjoy a Dark Souls or a Dirt Rally...    😂
And Dirt 2 was very good visually for 2009 standard.

The thing is...    it's not a problem of the EGO engine. Same EGO engine is used in F1 titles and they look simply great, it's how each dev team uses it:

GRID 2019 Sepang:
image.png

F1 2016 Sepang:
image.png

F1 2017 Sepang:
image.png

F1 2018...  👀
F1-Monaco_01_2018.jpg.bb47f7d146428c062f

F1 2019...   👀
F1-Singapore_01_2019-1024x576.jpg
image.thumb.png.a96a09d201528b1cbd7c4ba966d31bd4.pngimage.thumb.png.160f9551c8c1988ae7e4f6fab5d39551.png

Edited by jesped

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

Some moments related to reflections:

Only matching reflections are from car tail lights. Everything else is from a different reality. 🤷‍♂️

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While orange and green signs are reflected more or less, *** is this?

df.png.606f0e2a8c3ab4844e8883502d6771a7.png

Edited by lastbreath

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Next thing I can't understand:

1) absolutely beautiful fireworks

fdh.png.1f587a3da6df47cbb0de1ed0dee93750.png

2) absolutely disgusting smoke

dsfg.png.3083a284490542f452d7c0e6e0b16362.png

The same streamer. The same build...

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, lastbreath said:

Some moments related to reflections:

ghjk.gif.1e30fe7e0833b6449f989dab01821eb3.giffgjj.gif.7b191a594721ecf709c8f8d60e730052.gif

 

Exactly what I was referring to earlier. The reflections are not fake, they are reflections of real objects in the (nearby) scene, but in many cases they display in the wrong place and in the wrong way. Hopefully it's just a bug and not by design.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, cpcdem said:

Exactly what I was referring to earlier. The reflections are not fake, they are reflections of real objects in the (nearby) scene, but in many cases they display in the wrong place and in the wrong way. Hopefully it's just a bug and not by design.

What??  of course not. They just tried to match some colors at some places in the cubemap being reflected. The reflection is wrong because it is not reflecting the real object or light, but trying to simulate it with a map. It is the same for everything else. You're not going to see any object reflected at any frame, like they do in other games.

That's why you see these colored splotches:
image.png

Instead of this:
image.png.24d9514615ba2bf225e9708b675ce101.pngimage.thumb.png.d4cb3cbb1a36489e19e5a9bdbc6424e0.png

Edited by jesped

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@jesped Judging by other videos, those pink and orange reflections in your screenshot are reflections of real objects that appeared in the scene a few (or several) frames earlier in the video. Of course them still being visible at this point is completely wrong, but hopefully this will be fixed by release.

 

Edit: In case it's not clear what I am saying, here a couple stills from the videos shown above where the reflections are correct, or almost correct, but surely they are reflections of real objects. Problem is the reflections are still visible there also several frames later...

 

GRID2019_refl1.jpg.08b35c3c1eb5875a48a06efeefea6c62.jpg

GRID2019_refl2.jpg

Edited by cpcdem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, cpcdem said:

@jesped Judging by other videos, those pink and orange reflections in your screenshot are reflections of real objects that appeared in the scene a few (or several) frames earlier in the video. Of course them still being visible at this point is completely wrong, but hopefully this will be fixed by release.

Edit: In case it's not clear what I am saying, here a couple stills from the videos shown above where the reflections are correct, or almost correct, but surely they are reflections of real objects. Problem is the reflections are still visible there also several frames later...

Again...    those are not objects being reflected, they are just gross approximations painted on environment textures, which are what is really being reflected. That's why you can't see any definition in the reflection. And that's why it doesn't match the position of the real object in the track...   because they are not in the same physical (virtual) space, and are not the real objects being really reflected, like other games do (with different techniques, none of them doing real raytracing, I'm talking about results).

You don't see any of those light displays being reflected...  and on the road what you see is some white that comes from nowhere.
image.png.32debf1e9034f9555ced5bb631f9a795.png

and...
image.png.a2e8e956871fc7edfb26f93da290a808.pngimage.png.cc2490960e4897162a77b56115b60125.pngimage.png.759736ad0e2728b50408c90d0fe0454b.pngimage.png.901b4181c10e8247951ff49758ceecbf.png

These are problems derived from the simple technique being used, not proxy assets that "will be fixed later". We are 1 week ahead of release. Youtubers are doing the marketing campaign with REVIEW codes.

It's not gonna magically turn into these in a week:
image.png.2f3d0a0951b3883305a8370f2195fb8f.png

See this perfectly defined reflected scenery details and cars?...  these kind of real reflections is what you can't get anywhere in all GRID 2019 videos released so far.

That's why you can't see any reflected trees either, like here in Forza 6:
image.png

While in GRID's Brands Hatch and other circuit tracks the only reflections you can see on the road are a lower res version of the sky and the cars lights.

What is even more baffling is...   even Race Driver GRID's anisotropic fake reflections were a better match, 11 years ago:
image.png.c53ce4352be0faabeba25a10dc4d323b.png

Edited by jesped
  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×