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Edit: oops missed this yesterday :already posted New 'Cinematic' 4K trailer

 

Edited by torque99uk

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23 minutes ago, jesped said:

Don't confuse the tone with the substance of the critique. 😉
I may have been harsh sometimes out of frustration, but everything I've been point out still stands. Hard and detailed criticism is not "negativity".

Honestly, I just don't care that much anymore. Maybe the gameplay saves the game, but visually, I'm already convinced it's going to be disappointing overall. Not utterly "horrible" in general, you still are going to be able to cherry pick good shots, but visually underwhelming during real gameplay, mediocre and outdated in important aspects.

I can see that you are passionate about graphics and computers. I think you have much higher standards than the average arcade gamer which this is aimed for so it is understandable. Do you play games in 4K on PC I take it?

Edit: I am impressed with that trailer it looks great. Only thing I am not so keen on is the saturated sunset orange lighting but otherwise... 👏

Edited by torque99uk

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This topic is very hot but:

Tbh i think the main problem here is that people waited 5 years to see a successor of their favourite game series that uses the latest up to date version of Codemasters Ego engine. And it really is disappointing to see that the GRID 2019 Ego engine version lacks graphical details the predecessors Ego engine version had or are available with the latest Ego engine version as seen at the F1 games.

But in the end we are talking about details but details often make immersion and fans like details and immersion 😉

And its a bit weird that a current game lacks graphical details that were already present 5-6 years ago...

At least on PC i would like to be able to push the graphics settings to uberepic ^^

Edited by Ak1504
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42 minutes ago, torque99uk said:

New 'Cinematic' 4K trailer

Not new, already posted it myself here yesterday. 😂
 


Just check how much better it looks than real gameplay.

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6 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

Lol, those always offended pussies from resetera use hardcore language? :classic_biggrin:

Haha, not always. But there's some hardcore rivalries all around. GT Sport and Forza fanboys...   it's usually all out war between them. 😂

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1 hour ago, torque99uk said:

I think you have much higher standards than the average arcade gamer which this is aimed for so it is understandable. Do you play games in 4K on PC I take it?

I don't think I do, honestly. I just go on with a 1080 non ti for gaming on PC and have a PS4 Pro too. I have a 55" 4K HDR LG OLED display, but I use it mainly for work (CG 3D artist for 20+ years). For gaming I prefer to use an Epson 12bit color 3D projector with a 100" screen, which is 1080p60 but it gives you a much better experience overall. That's why I say that 4K is not magic. I played both PS4 and PC at 4K on the 4K HDR OLED and yes, it looks great, but let me tell you...    everything plays much better at 100" on the projector, even if it's not HDR and blacks aren't as good as the OLED tech.

I usually go for supersampling with 1440p or higher, and the icing on the cake is using Reshade to tune the visuals (to a point) to my liking and SuperDepth3D shader to make the games 3D for the projector. So far, Codemasters games have been compatible with Reshade and SuperDepth3D, which needs to be able to access the Depth buffer, and it's been a blast to be able to play all Dirts and Grids in 3D at 100" 👀

But now that they decided to ditch the DX11 support for GRID (even F1 2019 has the possibility of forcing DX11) and make it DX12 exclusive I really don't know if this is going to work. There is a DX12 version of Reshade already, but it doesn't work with all games. It is too soon and it is not as compatible with everything as the DX11 version.
 

1 hour ago, torque99uk said:

Edit: I am impressed with that trailer it looks great. Only thing I am not so keen on is the saturated sunset orange lighting but otherwise... 👏

Looks good but its a trailer, it's not gameplay. You can see all the differences in detail from my captures. I don't fall for any trailer ever. Too much disappointments all over the years to trust any of that trickery.

I trust only gameplay, and even then you can be deceived still, when the game released is downgraded, which is still a thing that happens far too often.

Edited by jesped
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New video just released. More proof of how bland the game looks overall. Specially bad Brands Hatch and Sydney Park, as usual.
 

 

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3 hours ago, jesped said:

Regarding that Havana night video...

Same LOD or lighting problem still there. Check the abrupt change in the Cathedral windows. This was reported by @lastbreath long time ago.
GRID_LOD.gif.0b8f6954678f110238756edf99e598e5.gif

 

Oh, come on, the part of the video in this track is 3.5 minute long, and you found ONE moment when ONE building has bad LOD switch (which very few people will notice while driving anyway), to prove your claim that the game has in general very bad graphics? I think there's need for some perspective... You can find such tiny problems in every single game out there, even after several patches. And Grid is not even released yet...

The glow/flare effects in general look fine to me, but this is of course also subjective. I agree about the brake lights having huge reflections in the tarmac, I do find this one thing annoying.

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2 hours ago, cpcdem said:

Oh, come on, the part of the video in this track is 3.5 minute long, and you found ONE moment when ONE building has bad LOD switch (which very few people will notice while driving anyway), to prove your claim that the game has in general very bad graphics?

Hold your horses, man. I'm just pointing out that this bug already was reported here and is still there, so the devs can fix it if they care to, not claiming that because of this particular ONE problem the game has in general very bad graphics.

My opinion on the game looking bland, being visually mediocre and looking dated has to do with it having a bunch of different problems, already listed, detailed and explained several times.

If I do a recap and post the whole stuff again there's some of you that are going to start to complain again: "here comes this guy again with his long string of pics pointing at everything wrong with the game"... 😂   so I'm not going to for now.

Edited by jesped

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@jesped Oops! I somehow missed your trailer post in between all the pages.🤦‍♂️

I totally agree about the experience using a projector. I also used to use a decent gaming projector set up 1080p 100" for all my games back in the day 🕹️and played the Original 'DiRT' and the original 'GRID Race Driver'  and many other games on this for many years and used to watch most new DVD films on it. At the time I was so impressed with it and no one believed me when I used to say it was better than my monitor/tv. It still had very dark black colours and quite high detail.

Since I got 4K etc years ago it got put away in the attic/loft along with all the old consoles and and I have never seen it since.

You have now tempted me to find it and set it all up again with hdmi and my PC to see it in action with more up to date graphics 📽️👾 Maybe try it with the new GRID next week for a comparison. 

Edited by torque99uk
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14 hours ago, torque99uk said:

I can see that you are passionate about graphics and computers. I think you have much higher standards than the average arcade gamer

As for me I never was mad about graphics. I love different games. Hotline Miami is one of my favourite series despite its pixelated style.

The problem is there was GRID2 6(!) years ago. It was amazing visually and remains stunning even nowadays. And after 6 years of waiting Codies show me the game which stucks in 2013. Even more - sometimes it looks worse than GRID2! I was waiting for new visuals, new technologies, new emotions..! Instead I have to pay for what? For the same game with downgraded graphics?

They literally could take Autosport, replace car models, add detailed cockpit and... the game would be better visually at the end! It drives me crazy that after 6 years of waiting we have to play so outdated game! GRID2/Autosport are beautiful even after 6 years. And what will be with GRID2019 after 6 years if it's already old?

Edited by lastbreath
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2 hours ago, lastbreath said:

As for me I never was mad about graphics. I love different games. Hotline Miami is one of my favourite series despite its pixelated style.

The problem is there was GRID2 6(!) years ago. It was amazing visually and remains stunning even nowadays. And after 6 years of waiting Codies show me the game which stucks in 2013. Even more - sometimes it looks worse than GRID2! I was waiting for new visuals, new technologies, new emotions..! Instead I have to pay for what? For the same game with downgraded graphics?

They literally could take Autosport, replace car models, add detailed cockpit and... the game would be better visually at the end! It drives me crazy that after 6 years of waiting we have to play so outdated game! GRID2/Autosport are beautiful even after 6 years. And what will be with GRID2019 after 6 years if it's already old?

Hmm, if you're not really "mad about graphics" then i'm not quite sure how you can base your argument on how Grid 2019 looks. Also, if you do intend to buy the game then you are doing it of your own free will so it's not really the best idea to give the impression of being forced into purchase. I make no secret of the fact that, after putting nostalgia (the worst possible reason to purchase a game because it nearly always leads to disappointment) to one side,  I cancelled my preorder on 19th september on the grounds that I didn't feel that Grid 2019 improved on Autosport enough to warrant a purchase. The enforced lighting was also a dealbreaker. Sure, it didn't help that I had quite literally just paid £4.00 for Autosport but unfortunately that's the way these things sometimes go. 

Graphics? Hey, I play NASCAR Heat (a lot) and as Jesped will testify, the game's graphical glitches reach new and previously unseen levels of bad, but because the gameplay is good and the visuals are borderline fit for purpose it really doesn't (shouldn't) matter so long as the game has desired levels of immersion.

Edited by _BorisTheFrog_

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9 minutes ago, _BorisTheFrog_ said:

if you're not really "mad about graphics" then i'm not quite sure how you can base your argument on how Grid 2019 looks

As I said earlier in comparison with old GRIDS there were no significant improvements. So, I was waiting for new emotions because to play 5 years the same game became borring a little. Instead they created the same game so I consider all this time is wasted for nothing at it dissapoints me, cause I won't get a NEW game.

Edited by lastbreath
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4 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

As I said earlier in comparison with old GRIDS there were no significant improvements. So, I was waiting for new emotions because to play 5 years the same game became borring a little. Instead they created the same game so I consider all this time is wasted for nothing at it dissapoints me, cause I won't get a NEW game.

Ah, sorry. I didn't fully understand what you were trying to say...but I see it a bit clearer now.

Ok....moving on 🙂

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1 hour ago, BRICKS44 said:

This guy is an amazing driver.

Agree, his Forza videos are simply amazing. I think @[SRS13]Rastus is going to like this one 😄

 

But going back to GRID, I still see the same problems we've been discussing:

Flat lighting and cartoony look with burnt skies and even track/scenery:
image.thumb.png.70d9207aeb9c51323505338c75fecd73.pngimage.thumb.png.0bcac5fb23e0785e7ca4025386b8a545.pngimage.thumb.png.81cbd4d3fdf59807762b0964f33a4784.pngimage.thumb.png.5861b43fb4b1c087d790cd4097039dad.pngimage.thumb.png.49357666c0609d5c670c05672e49638b.png

Solar flares that look like there's a nuclear explosion in the background and a ugly orange filter:
image.thumb.png.fb035240dbc87f7208282078e52296ed.pngimage.thumb.png.4e63fdeaa58397ba9a81a2553770e8d1.pngimage.thumb.png.0cf519a5be7d336b929e7a1ddabd098c.png

Same problems with shadows:
image.thumb.png.b2a7d3882bf22700b319723836dc9f3e.png
GRID_Shadows_2.gif.92472be6e3271e81900fcea0414e8b81.gif

Same flat and cartoony looking trees:
image.png.5dc7c92449bea34630c1ab43ee97426d.png

Same wrong reflections:image.thumb.png.e6fe449997c9d098c24950292986fda1.pngimage.thumb.png.912dc458497850b0a2e23929e0dbc72a.png

Same flat smoke:
image.png.9d0218672c4304491bcbe9459038e6f1.pngimage.png.f378f8c0bf90680b5ae87c461d55413f.png


Same loopy "garden irrigation system" rain:
GRID_Rain_Loop.gif.c627b7e845ccfca214110d798667e784.gif

Same lens flare fest:
image.png.59835c27e88cee57e18897ddf5e06313.png

Even on top of the windshield sun strip:
image.png.6142a85942c2942155dab558f1000907.png

 

Edited by jesped

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Flare fest has nothing with bad or good graphics. It's just a question of design. But everything else, yes. Complete disaster. Especially in comparison with Forza video above.

Frankly speaking, Forza also has shadow flickering on trees but it's an open world and still trees are way more natural.

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29 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

Flare fest has nothing with bad or good graphics.

Too strong, and they being present even on top of the windshield sun strip makes no sense.
 

29 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

But everything else, yes. Complete disaster. Especially in comparison with Forza video above.

Frankly speaking, Forza also has shadow flickering on trees but it's an open world and still trees are way more natural.

Yes. Worst things in forza are flickering shadows in the distance and dated MSAA tech. But it can be fixed using Supersampling with a higher resolution.
It should feature some kind of TAA by now, I guess upcoming games will fix that.

But yeah, trees and scenery (cities too) look vastly better than GRID's, and visuals are balanced, there is no burnt skies or pitch black areas, but a good dynamic exposure.
And not only it is open world, it features seasons, dynamic day/night cycles and dynamic weather, which is way harder and more limiting for tech than having closed tracks and routes with fixed lighting and weather like GRID.

 

Edited by jesped

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2 minutes ago, lastbreath said:

Specially for jesped lol:

😂 yeah, those were some JJ Abrams level of flares.

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4 hours ago, jesped said:

Agree, his Forza videos are simply amazing. I think @[SRS13]Rastus is going to like this one 😄 

Yeah seen it before as I subbed his channel a long time ago. been more into the Gymkhana side of things myself tbh though in Forza games doing stuff like this.

FH3.

FH4

I was hoping drift would come home to Grid but it wasn't to be.....😞

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You have to keep in mind that Codies have to develop these games to cater to lowest spec machines (OG Xbox's from 2013). So, the scaling of this Ego engine is pretty impressive. I think the game looks great and can't wait to be playing it during Bathurst weekend next week.

In future, I'd like to see Codies add some RT reflections to their car models that would be awesome.

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38 minutes ago, andmcq said:

You have to keep in mind that Codies have to develop these games to cater to lowest spec machines (OG Xbox's from 2013)

This I think is part of the perceived graphics problems us PC diehards have been spotting and moaning about. If Codies had waited till next year and made the game for the next consoles instead this thread probably wouldn't exist or certainly not be as negative, admittedly having said that doing so would limit the initial customer base to a large extent by excluding a large player base still using the older hardware.

I posted a long winded comaprison of the power of the base XBox, Xbox 1X vs my 6 year old R9 290X and newer Vega 64 and my current 5700XT. It's been a longtime issue for PC owners that games are made to function on the Xbox 1 look better on the 1X but never seem to truely make the best use of the hardware available to PC owners, leaving us feeling like there's little to no progression being made from where We sit at least (don't hate me for saying it it's only a personal observation).

When the next consoles DO arrive they'll for the very 1st time be using the same hardware technologies available to us PC owners thereby levelling the playing field for the 1st time, no longer will devs have to "dumb down" games for the older hardware allowing them to make 1 version of the game and instead devote the funds time and effort usually needed to port games left and right either stripping it back when going from PC to console (See Dirt Rally, developed for PC only and later ported to the consoles). Or worse porting from Console to PC without sufficiently pushing the hardware to the best of it's capabilities...

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4 minutes ago, [SRS13]Rastus said:

When the next consoles DO arrive they'll for the very 1st time be using the same hardware technologies available to us PC owners thereby levelling the playing field for the 1st time, no longer will devs have to "dumb down" games for the older hardware allowing them to make 1 version of the game and instead devote the funds time and effort usually needed to port games left and right either stripping it back when going from PC to console (See Dirt Rally, developed for PC only and later ported to the consoles). Or worse porting from Console to PC without sufficiently pushing the hardware to the best of it's capabilities...

Heh, I'm not so sure that's the case. As current and next-gen console make use of X86, we may well see developers continue to develop their games for XBX/PS4. Maybe not in every case, but why wouldn't they? There's about 50m XB's out there and 100m Ps4's.

Edited by andmcq
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