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How's the Tire running distance?

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I always use soft in gravel I think up to 20k.

Wet only for asphalt with rain as any other thing will slide on the road. 

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You can get away on Soft tyres comfortably for ~3 Longs. The end of the 3rd might be getting rough, but the entire event between service stops is still faster that way.

So far in the club I run, the closest we've seen to Mediums becoming viable was a 5 stage split in Argentina with 2 Long/3 Sprints. It was still significantly faster to run Softs for it than go to Mediums because the time gained early more than made up for the time lost as they wore.

 

It is also way more important and impactful on tarmac stages than gravel. If you are drifting around Germany you will shred those tyres way faster than if you drove clean so they will give out much sooner - and losing grip on tarmac really hurts.

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oh, Just transfer some ToFu this morning.

Asking this question because the 5th Stage is dry, 6th Stage heavy rain, but I choose medium for Endure. 6th stage is painful, I've to slow my pace, lucky just lost 5 sec from leader, may be clubman level not difficult at all.

I think I need done some practice to learn tire life time

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If there is rain, you're better off choosing rain tyres, they're way faster in wet than Softs, not to mention Mediums and Hard. Even if earlier you have a dry stage. You might take a risk if you have 20 kms of dry and 5kms of wet, otherwise it's better to get wet tires. Same with Monte Carlo and ice sections, you'll lose so much time with slicks there.

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Little bit off topic but still about the tires - is carrying 2 spares going to cause more time loss than carrying only one? I couldn't figure it out to be honest. I just tested it on really short part of the stage and it looked like there was no difference in time. But maybe I am wrong. What do you think?

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Not off topic yet. Spare tire is used for replace worn tire.
More tire more weight to decrease Power and Weight ratio.
Good run are never make tires worn and stop to replace.

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tire wear is also affected by how you drive. if you're spinning tires, drifting, etc., a lot, then you will wear them out faster than if you driver carefully.

soft (and other low-durability tires, I think also wet) tires also puncture much more easily than medium or hard, which brings me to...

3 minutes ago, YukiEra Sakazuki said:

Not off topic yet. Spare tire is used for replace worn tire.
More tire more weight to decrease Power and Weight ratio.
Good run are never make tires worn and stop to replace.

1 hour ago, Snoopy43 said:

Little bit off topic but still about the tires - is carrying 2 spares going to cause more time loss than carrying only one? I couldn't figure it out to be honest. I just tested it on really short part of the stage and it looked like there was no difference in time. But maybe I am wrong. What do you think?

spare tires are not to replace worn/used tires. they are to fix punctures!

the weight difference isn't going to make a massive difference, but it depends how good you are. probably people who are pros will notice a difference, but not me.

I generally take just 1 spare tire unless I am driving super bad haha

if you use the spare tire on the stage to repair a puncture (which gives you a time penalty of 30-60 secs), you will get another spare automatically at the next service station, even if you don't change tires.

if you finish a stage with a puncture and there is a service station after, it'll get fixed and your spare will be replaced, even if you don't change tires.

if you finish a stage with a puncture but there is no service station after, it will still get repaired before the next stage - and there will be no time penalty! but to do this you must have a spare tire left. if you have no spare (if you used it already, or you didn't bring one) and there is no service station, you will start the next stage with a punctured or missing tire, which is really, really not good!

 

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2 minutes ago, ianism said:

the weight difference isn't going to make a massive difference, but it depends how good you are. probably people who are pros will notice a difference, but not me.

Don't have to be pro to notice it, just need to be really familiar with your car. The 01 Focus I've been playing with a TON lately has a very consistent powerband for me and I don't even need the RPM tach on screen to always be in the perfect power point. I joined a MP lobby the other night and got dropped into the middle of a event with the car - but that means you default to Mediums + 1 spare; I never carry a spare if given the option.

You could feel the difference on exit speed every single time you hit a 2 or tighter corner. You would carry a few inches, maybe a foot farther out than you'd expect, and the acceleration out of the corner was always a hair slower. I'd guess it felt like ~500RPM difference for every corner I'd try to stomp out of. If I was expecting to get through a hairpin at 6k in 2nd gear, I'd be closer to low-mid 5k range instead. Not huge, but definitely something you can feel if you've got a few dozen hours in a car.

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soft tyres are ideal for up to 15km but can be stretched to 20km. after around 15km you definitely get a drop-off in grip, although it's not too bad.

for anything over 20km total before a service, consider using mediums if you want more consistent grip. 

the hard tyre is basically useless. i think this was just included in the game for clubs/custom events if people want to go really long distances between services, i'm talking 30km or more.

for wet stages it's best to use the softs, i find the medium doesn't give enough grip. the tyres also seem to wear less in the wet, although can't confirm 100% has haven't done enough testing. 

except on wet tarmac where you need to use the wet tyre. the wet tyre gives much better grip in the dry than the dry tyre does in the wet, so if you have, for example, one dry stage followed by a wet stage then always choose the wet tyre, even if the dry stage is longer. 

carrying spare tyres definitely makes a difference to your time. 

hope that helps.

Edited by Tranzitive
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It's a bit odd, because from my experience it seems to be mostly gradual (after 10km softs are still very good but imo slightly worse than new), but there also seems to be a certain point of a relatively sudden loss of grip--from my testing, about 20km with soft, 30km with medium and 40km with hard.

There doesn't seem to be a lower limit where they stop getting worse, at least from my testing. I did a custom event without changing tyres, and after 8 stages with soft it was literally like driving on soap and they still kept getting worse. Hard kept up fairly well even after such a distance.

What I'm feeling best with is: up to 3 stages to next service -> soft, up to 6 stages -> medium, over 6 -> hard. Which basically means, always use soft, as more than 3 stages between services only happens if you deliberately do that in custom events. Even when soft tyres become worse on the 3rd stage, they still have as much grip as mediums have new, so even mediums are a complete waste of time imo.

As for rain tyres, I also had this situation in Spain where there are two stages until the next service, with the first being dry and the next wet, so I chose rain tyres. But even though the first one was a sprint stage, the tyres were completely destroyed after that, making the following wet stage like driving on ice anyway. So grip was sub-par on the first stage and terrible on the second--with soft tyres, grip would have been great on the first stage and terrible on the second, so overall it'd have been the better choice.

My conclusion: if in Germany or Spain the next stage is wet, use rain tyres, in any other case use soft. (this doesn't apply to Monte of course where you should always use winter tyres except for the very unlikely case that there are only ice-free sprint stages between services--the only case where soft is an option in that location). Never use medium or hard.

Edited by DocStrangelove
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3 hours ago, DocStrangelove said:

What I'm feeling best with is: up to 3 stages to next service -> soft, up to 6 stages -> medium, over 6 -> hard

I definitely know what you're talking about with the "driving on soap" feeling of softs, but I think it doesn't hit that bad until the 7th or 8th stage with them. And the time gain from the first 3-4 stages (before softs are worn enough to == medium tire grip) is a lot more than the time lost later on since the mediums don't have more grip until around stage 5-6. That stage 4-5 section, either 1 Long or 2 Sprints roughly, I honestly think softs and mediums are equal at that point. You have to remember mediums still are being worn down those first few stages too, just not as fast, so you aren't comparing worn softs to fresh mediums and you have to keep that in mind.

 

This next bit is pure speculation and theory on my part, but I also believe running softs is faster because of how your grip changes. Most of us are always used to running softs, so swapping over to mediums will mean you don't hit your groove right off the line most times; it will take you a stage or two before you're fully comfortable again. But softs are something everyone is used to losing grip on with passing stages. It is normal for us to change our style in line with the wear softs get over 2-3 stages. And because it is happening every stage, mentally you find a cadence and are adapting each run to fit the new wear that you are expecting. This is the key in my eyes, most of us have come up with a mental "curve" for tire performance with each stage even if we didn't consciously define it - we all have a general idea of the wear a soft will have on Germany stage 3 if we had a Long and a Sprint before it. So we can keep extending that expected wear further and it is more natural to us. Compared to mediums which most people don't have even a fraction of the same wear data in their heads. Consistency is king in rally, and having an expected consistent tire wear will do more for your times (imo) than having more actual grip sometimes.

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6 minutes ago, Mike Dee said:

I definitely know what you're talking about with the "driving on soap" feeling of softs, but I think it doesn't hit that bad until the 7th or 8th stage with them. And the time gain from the first 3-4 stages (before softs are worn enough to == medium tire grip) is a lot more than the time lost later on since the mediums don't have more grip until around stage 5-6. That stage 4-5 section, either 1 Long or 2 Sprints roughly, I honestly think softs and mediums are equal at that point. You have to remember mediums still are being worn down those first few stages too, just not as fast, so you aren't comparing worn softs to fresh mediums and you have to keep that in mind.

Yeah I think that was just what I was trying to say. At the point when softs lose so much grip that they're like mediums, mediums are beginning to fade as well, becoming even worse than the softs at that point. Only after 4 stages or so they're beginning to have similar grip, which pretty much renders mediums completely useless--you've gained many seconds by using softs in the first few stages, getting a few back in stage 4-5 with mediums isn't going to change that. I know what you mean, I guess even 4-5 stages are better with soft than medium. It's only in stage 5-6 that softs become so bad that medium might have been a better choice.

So, true, softs are best even after more than 3 stages.

As for getting used to them, well I actually like time trialling in the wet, so I have no trouble adapting to medium/dry. But even though I like driving in adverse conditions, I'm always faster with soft/dry. As for Germany, I don't like that anyway so I avoid it 😋

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