Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez Aero - Question

[FOneFanatic 181]

With the Mexican GP upon us with teams focusing on car setups loaded with down force, the question is: Does this game simulate the thin air environment that is Mexico city or are all air uniform in composition throughout all tracks? 

[Chromatic 127]

6 hours ago, FOneFanatic said:

With the Mexican GP upon us with teams focusing on car setups loaded with down force, the question is: Does this game simulate the thin air environment that is Mexico city or are all air uniform in composition throughout all tracks? 

I reckon it's the same for all circuits I'm afraid. The only way that could work is if the components started slightly hotter at the start of a race around Mexico than usual due to the low atmospheric density as you say. If codemasters could achieve this it might open a new can of worms. Or it's probably not possible for them at present to have it included.    

[DaleRossi 619]

I am pretty confident say that considering even the most basic tuning was phoned in, there is no way they're going to code something like this.  

[tarrantino 120]

Haha no way is this coded in! They can’t even get the tyres looking right.  

[TheEmpireWasRight 871]

2 hours ago, tarrantino said:

Haha no way is this coded in! They can’t even get the tyres looking right.  

They can't even fix the lighting issues (no illumination in the mirrors during night races| streetlights are turned on during daylight), or the wrong car performance/team performance/ driver performance (cars lack 30% downforce| teams and drivers are in the wrong order performancewise), or the wrong rainlight blinking rate (the red rainlight at the back of the car is blinking at the wrong rate), or the wrong rainspray density (rainspray is way too light and small compared to real life)...

 

 

[will54 8]

or get the DRS zones correct

[TheEmpireWasRight 871]

7 hours ago, will54 said:

or get the DRS zones correct

If i remember correctly, Germany, Singapore and Mexico did not get updated yet to represent the original new drs zones.

 

What a shame.

[sergey_blackbird 144]

10 hours ago, will54 said:

or get the DRS zones correct

Or get the pitlate speed limit at Silverstone correct.

[FOneFanatic 181]

I'm sure that air atmospherics are simulated in this and other major driving games or else the cars will not be able to move through the ether and downforce will not work and tail pipes will not combust nor will we get kick plate sparks or rain for that matter. I recall when Playground Games made FH2 there was much talk about earth atmospherics being a major part of the construct of the that game. One of the devs even discussed the emulation of  "Rayleigh scattering" being responsible for the color of the sky.  So I'm thinking that the composition of air ( 78.09% nitrogen, 20.95% oxygen, 0.93% argon, 0.04% carbon dioxide, and small amounts of other gases) is simulated in this game and that changing the composition of it  for Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez due to its elevated sea level would be second nature. Wind and air atmospherics should definitely be part of this game, if isn't already, which I'm kind of sure it is. 

[tarrantino 120]

10 hours ago, FOneFanatic said:

I'm sure that air atmospherics are simulated in this and other major driving games or else the cars will not be able to move through the ether and downforce will not work and tail pipes will not combust nor will we get kick plate sparks or rain for that matter. I recall when Playground Games made FH2 there was much talk about earth atmospherics being a major part of the construct of the that game. One of the devs even discussed the emulation of  "Rayleigh scattering" being responsible for the color of the sky.  So I'm thinking that the composition of air ( 78.09% nitrogen, 20.95% oxygen, 0.93% argon, 0.04% carbon dioxide, and small amounts of other gases) is simulated in this game and that changing the composition of it  for Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez due to its elevated sea level would be second nature. Wind and air atmospherics should definitely be part of this game, if isn't already, which I'm kind of sure it is. 

I can’t tell if you actually believe this or you’re trying to troll us all! 

[sloppysmusic 1,650]

3 hours ago, tarrantino said:

I can’t tell if you actually believe this or you’re trying to troll us all! 

He's obviously way too smart NOT to be trolling! That's the giveaway! 

[DaleRossi 619]

2 hours ago, sloppysmusic said:

He's obviously way too smart NOT to be trolling! That's the giveaway! 

lol True. I would bet my left nut they didnt code **** to do with atmospheric pressure. They barely even coded camber. 

[FOneFanatic 181]

So i guess you guys haven't heard of physically-based materials when developing video games where rubber is rubber, steel is steel, tires are tires...how do you think they measure the heat of the tire carcass? There must be AIR for heat to be generated - hello...anyone home?!  It all works with AIR which is modeled into the atmospherics if you want to get anywhere close to real-world simulation. This is why we play these game folks, because it brings us as close to real world racing as we can possibly fanasize.  To underestimate the enormous programming genious that is incorpoerated into this racing game on an annual basis is really a show of just how knowlegeable some of you are. Do I need to say more? Yes!  And I quote from the article below regarding Forza Horizon 2 development by T10 and Playground Games: " In terms of system development, we continued the attention to physically-based rendering into all of the new features that we developed for Horizon 2. For instance, this involved simulating the physical interaction of water with the materials used in the game to support our weather features. We also took a physically based approach to features such as the sky simulation, which accurately models the interaction of light with particles in the atmosphere to produce realistic results."  These are development techniques know the world over and are the basis of advanced video racing games such as F1 20xx series by this studio. 

See this link about the development of Forza Horion 2 over 5 years ago. https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-the-making-of-forza-horizon-2

[FOneFanatic 181]

On 10/26/2019 at 10:40 AM, DaleRossi said:

I am pretty confident say that considering even the most basic tuning was phoned in, there is no way they're going to code something like this.  

Well they should be, especially if the thining of the air has an effect on just about all things moving on this track. Each track should be its own atmospheric microcosm where the pecularities of each region as it affects the race are simulated in the physics engine of the game.  Come on Lee - help me out here. 

 

[sloppysmusic 1,650]

You mention some high tech dev speak from Forza then cut the quotation marks and immediately assume the whole world of racing games knows about it and uses such physics in their games. Gaming studios are notoriously secretive regarding there bespoke in house tech and rightly so. I come from the flight sim world where air pressure is always modeled as without it planes couldn't fly at all! Plus they are harder to take off at higher altitudes with less air pressure. 

Never seen it in a racing game myself though, havent played Forza as I'm not a Microsoft fan. 

Air resistance and drag play a part for sure, obviously, or else cars would be able to do 400mph easy. Except I don't believe that air resistance is modeled in the F1 games or most others at all. They just SIMULATE it by programming a logarithmic acceleration curve into the game and simply add lateral wheel grip when you increase downforce.

The same goes for ground effect as well. Once again in advanced add on planes in flight simulators the actual piston engines are modeled working simulations. If the air is thin they can't produce the same power. No way are piston engines in F1 games actually mixing virtual gas and oxygen together in live, ever changing atmospheric conditions! Would be mind blowing yes but nah it ain't happening folks (yet!) 

[DaleRossi 619]

6 hours ago, FOneFanatic said:

Well they should be, especially if the thining of the air has an effect on just about all things moving on this track. Each track should be its own atmospheric microcosm where the pecularities of each region as it affects the race are simulated in the physics engine of the game.  Come on Lee - help me out here. 

 

I agree with you and don't think anyone really would disagree. Codemasters don't even use laser scanned tracks, though. For all the shiny stuff with this game, it is MAYBE on the level of Gran Turismo A Spec when it comes to realism. Seriously. That was a release title for PS 2.

Look at leaderboards and you will see the same camber and toe on every single track. Monaco, Monza, it doesn't matter.  

Tracks are a mess..Spa and Catalunya look like they were done by a police sketch artist rather than actual data, much less being laser scanned. 

No way they have atmospheric pressure in the game. I'm not even sure cold vs hot weather has any effect on tires. 😕

[Ho3n3r 122]

On 10/30/2019 at 4:05 AM, FOneFanatic said:

I'm sure that air atmospherics are simulated in this and other major driving games or else the cars will not be able to move through the ether and downforce will not work and tail pipes will not combust nor will we get kick plate sparks or rain for that matter. I recall when Playground Games made FH2 there was much talk about earth atmospherics being a major part of the construct of the that game. One of the devs even discussed the emulation of  "Rayleigh scattering" being responsible for the color of the sky.  So I'm thinking that the composition of air ( 78.09% nitrogen, 20.95% oxygen, 0.93% argon, 0.04% carbon dioxide, and small amounts of other gases) is simulated in this game and that changing the composition of it  for Autodromo Hermanos Rodriguez due to its elevated sea level would be second nature. Wind and air atmospherics should definitely be part of this game, if isn't already, which I'm kind of sure it is. 

Flat earther?

[FOneFanatic 181]

On 10/30/2019 at 3:23 PM, sloppysmusic said:

You mention some high tech dev speak from Forza then cut the quotation marks and immediately assume the whole world of racing games knows about it and uses such physics in their games. Gaming studios are notoriously secretive regarding there bespoke in house tech and rightly so. I come from the flight sim world where air pressure is always modeled as without it planes couldn't fly at all! Plus they are harder to take off at higher altitudes with less air pressure. 

Never seen it in a racing game myself though, havent played Forza as I'm not a Microsoft fan. 

Air resistance and drag play a part for sure, obviously, or else cars would be able to do 400mph easy. Except I don't believe that air resistance is modeled in the F1 games or most others at all. They just SIMULATE it by programming a logarithmic acceleration curve into the game and simply add lateral wheel grip when you increase downforce.

The same goes for ground effect as well. Once again in advanced add on planes in flight simulators the actual piston engines are modeled working simulations. If the air is thin they can't produce the same power. No way are piston engines in F1 games actually mixing virtual gas and oxygen together in live, ever changing atmospheric conditions! Would be mind blowing yes but nah it ain't happening folks (yet!) 

So how in the game is rain emulated and why do we hear the wind whistle increase when you hopen DRS and the drag is reduced? You of all people should know better than to gainsay the physics and atmospheric engines in this game.  Of course they exist! And I'm sure in the future games we'll see more effects of the atmosphere on the drivability of cars. 

[tarrantino 120]

On 11/2/2019 at 4:17 AM, FOneFanatic said:

So how in the game is rain emulated and why do we hear the wind whistle increase when you hopen DRS and the drag is reduced? You of all people should know better than to gainsay the physics and atmospheric engines in this game.  Of course they exist! And I'm sure in the future games we'll see more effects of the atmosphere on the drivability of cars. 

It ain’t hard to incorporate a wind sound affect when the DRS is open is it. It’s the same sound every time. Much like the pit stop. Car comes in and regardless of team same sounds are played and off you go. 
 

I saw no difference in any circuit re performance and if there was wouldn’t we be given air temp and track temp in a lot more detail? 
 

Rain is just a model with a scripted drying up phase which is way too fast IMO. 

[FOneFanatic 181]

I think Lee Mather needs to do a vidoe about how F1 XXXX is made to clear up this post, as I know I'm right about my stated position here.