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What features do we want to see in a future DIRT Rally game?

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I think this is a good reference vid for developers working on the DR3 damage model https://www.reddit.com/r/dirtgame/comments/k8ztmw/surprisingly_i_was_able_to_shave_off_a_second/ that car should be smashed at the front left (suspension, cooling package etc) and be unable to continue. There are dozens of similar collisions where the car just barrel rolls instead of getting it's suspension and body trashed.

 

Then again there are a few spots occasionally on relatively smooth roads that have random collisions as if you drove into a hinckelstein , those are some kinds of bugs.

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Well for me I think the career mode needs to be harder and longer, its not to hard to jump straight through the ranks and have a top end car in no time. Need to bring in entry level rallys such as a 1 day event in a junior category as most national event do. Being able to modify road cars into rally cars,  eg building a evo 8 from road car to rally spec but It taken time to complete. Be nice to have a calendar with events so you can choose to compete in a certain championship or do one of events as test days for an upcoming championship. Rewards should be lower also need to make it hard to get the top cars in career with money. Having different tyre manufacturers to choose from and pay for tyres or try get a sponsor deal .pay to enter events . Unexpected parts failure and changing weather conditions too like dirt 4. Have stages that can be cancelled or blocked by crashed cars.  Be able to catch cars in stages or be caught if to slow/fast. Car category shouldn't be by year should be changed to power , drivetrain and modifications made to it. More interaction. Tyre wear needs to be improved and cold tyres at the start of stages too,  also stage degradation should be more simulated eg more gravel and roots on the stage that effect grip. More varierty of cars .Eg 106.l,civic,twincam, evo 8, sunbeam, mk2 2.5 Millington engine, darrian t90 and some more nationally used wrc cars like the fiesta,  imprezza s12b , mini Cooper, ds3 etc. New locations that haven't been used previously,  like ireland (yes I'm biased), belgium , France, azores, Hungary etc. Be great to see Toyota and hyundai back too but not sure if that's possible with wrc game rights. Yea so more of a national event feel to the game then progress to international level.but saying that codemasters are dominating the motorsport market at the minute.

 

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On 12/7/2020 at 4:17 PM, PJTierney said:

I thought the whole point of a videogame was to have fun 😉 

 

Some people are more comfortable with pad, keyboard or other unconventional setups and just want to drive the way the like and enjoy the experience.

That's not to say that having as authentic a rig as possible isn't fun, it certainly is, but how others enjoy games shouldn't impact how you enjoy them. 🙂 

 

DiRT Rally has always been challenging and I imagine future titles will continue to be so, though that won't limit what peripherals people can use. It's possible for a game to be difficult and accessible at the same time 😉 

Well sure, the vehicle (pun intended) of fun in a sim title is primarily the quality of the simulation. It's the idea of getting into the car and "actually" going McRae on a good stage that makes it fun. Then of course you have other aspects like competition, but surely that's secondary as you could compete in any old game.

And so, that's why I don't see the point of playing with a keyboard or controller. It's so... disconnected, and it's not like DR offers much in terms of career mode, story or other gameplay mechanics. All it's got is pretty much down to the driving experience, and you don't experience much of it through a keyboard. 

Now, obviously there are some who still see a point and if they're having fun then that's great. I'm just saying I don't get it. Thankfully I think it's possible to make the game drive well on both controllers and wheels without making compromises to the realism of the game. With keyboards I'm not so sure though.

I surely hope you're right that future titles with continue to be challenging. And I hope future titles will go further in the direction of realism, developing that as far as possible. Perhaps with the boom in sim racing even the suits could be convinced it's a good direction to take. Otherwise things often go in the opposite direction, where they get watered down.

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16 hours ago, Gregow said:

I surely hope you're right that future titles with continue to be challenging. And I hope future titles will go further in the direction of realism, developing that as far as possible. Perhaps with the boom in sim racing even the suits could be convinced it's a good direction to take. Otherwise things often go in the opposite direction, where they get watered down.

Given that there are now two DIRT studios and one is going very much in the opposite direction, I think there's a bright future ahead when it comes to Rally 🙂 

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20 hours ago, PJTierney said:

Given that there are now two DIRT studios and one is going very much in the opposite direction, I think there's a bright future ahead when it comes to Rally 🙂 

I think going in the opposite direction will not work that much, number don’t lie 😄

D30A529B-7953-4C54-8375-933CFD5557B9.webp

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Driving on ice in Monte Carlo is unrealistic. 

In real life, spinning your tires on ice brings your car to a smoking standstill, you need to slow down and get grip and focus on momentum. 

 

In the sim, the faster you spin, the faster you go. 

 

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On 12/14/2020 at 8:45 AM, ToMythTo said:

 

I think going in the opposite direction will not work that much, number don’t lie 😄

D30A529B-7953-4C54-8375-933CFD5557B9.webp

I guess that's promising. I don't mean to hate on Dirt just because it isn't my cup of tea but it's good to see more serious sims making financial sense. Seems like it could be the way the market is headed as well, which is great for everyone who loves sims.

2 hours ago, ZipZapKaZoom said:

Driving on ice in Monte Carlo is unrealistic. 

In real life, spinning your tires on ice brings your car to a smoking standstill, you need to slow down and get grip and focus on momentum. 

 

In the sim, the faster you spin, the faster you go. 

 

Not to say that Monte Carlo is realistic but it's an old myth that you shouldn't spin your tires on ice. That's in fact exactly what you should do, especially with AWD or RWD (FWD is trickier as you understeer a lot). Sure, you need momentum as well but if you don't spin the wheels you're not going to generate much force to push the car anywhere. 

I used to work at an airport many years ago. We were driving trucks, lorries and different machinery with trailers and heavily loaded wagons every day. In winter you always got stuck. Not like once in a while, but all the time every day. The old wisdom of feathering the throttle just doesn't work, at all. What you do is you floor it and when you get a little movement going you let up, so you rock back and forth - getting a little momentum going - while digging the wheels down until you find enough grip. 

Having driven on frozen lakes and many winters with a RWD car you pretty much find a sweet spot where you get the most speed, going comfortably sideways. 

Though I suppose patches of black ice on tarmac, like some places in Monte Carlo, would be more like "keep it steady and pray". 

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5 hours ago, Gregow said:

Not to say that Monte Carlo is realistic but it's an old myth that you shouldn't spin your tires on ice. That's in fact exactly what you should do, especially with AWD or RWD (FWD is trickier as you understeer a lot). Sure, you need momentum as well but if you don't spin the wheels you're not going to generate much force to push the car anywhere. 

I used to work at an airport many years ago. We were driving trucks, lorries and different machinery with trailers and heavily loaded wagons every day. In winter you always got stuck. Not like once in a while, but all the time every day. The old wisdom of feathering the throttle just doesn't work, at all. What you do is you floor it and when you get a little movement going you let up, so you rock back and forth - getting a little momentum going - while digging the wheels down until you find enough grip. 

Having driven on frozen lakes and many winters with a RWD car you pretty much find a sweet spot where you get the most speed, going comfortably sideways. 

Though I suppose patches of black ice on tarmac, like some places in Monte Carlo, would be more like "keep it steady and pray". 

The science for this is pretty clear for a uniform ice surface under rubber tyres.  And that is that you get very slightly more friction if you don't completely spin the tyres on ice but stay close to the optimal slip ratio.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Friction-coefficient-versus-wheel-slip-curves-for-various-surfaces-with-exaggerated_fig1_267941440

another reference under braking (similar to rally cars accelerating)  https://gyazo.com/e9af34c279668f4f7dca113b9e480104

However in reality several factors come into play, in most situations in the following order:

1. The surface will likely not be perfectly smooth hard ice.

2. The surface will likely not be uniform and icy under every wheel.

3. With a partially locked differential (s) the above 2 are bigger factors.

 

While driving a regular road car with an open diff, onto a small patch of ice you will be best served not to completely floor it, especially FWD, the story changes with partially locking diffs and varying road surfaces under each wheel.

What is true however; is that the ice in Monte is not slippery enough by a long shot, I think I've mentioned this in the past and it should be corrected/improved if it should be realistic.

 

Edit: If you look at all the slip ratio studies and charts, it is clear that the only place where significant slip ratio is helpful is on very loose surfaces like gravel or loose snow.  Otherwise you always lose grip if you exceed your optimal ratio.  So the initial post was basically correct, especially for older historics with open diffs, and 2wd if the wheels are on pure ice.

Edited by bn880
Gravel notes
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Ability to switch off pace note audio and a PDF download link of all pace notes, so a second person (navigator) can read the notes to the driver.

Seperate Rally trip meter showing meters traveled, ability to zero trip meter and start button for Navigator to work from.

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* After crossing the finish line, it would be great if player stays in full control.  If player does something unreasonable, runs into stewards or does not stop - disqualify him/her, but it would be great if there's no AI control/"guiding hand" ever.  EDIT: F2C corrected me - this works exactly as I want it to  if "Time Control Braking" set to off.  Amazing stuff.

* Codriver shouldn't praise driver, especially after 2 roll overs.

* VR: allow mouse

* VR: allow moving UI closer/further and curving

Greaty enjoying DR2, pleasant surprise.  Huge thanks.

Edited by TheIronWolf

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1 hour ago, TheIronWolf said:

* After crossing the finish line, it would be great if player stays in full control.  If player does something unreasonable, runs into stewards or does not stop - disqualify him/her, but it would be great if there's no AI control/"guiding hand" ever.

.....

That's how it is in DR2.....

Except in time trial, because, hot lapping.  Though i much prefer the way it was done in DR for the time trial, allowed for some nice exterior shots - it's so rare you see the beautiful car exteriors during normal running unless you're running chase cam.  Any way i can see my car from the outside (as i would if i were really driving it) during the rally experience is a plus.  Hopefully that can be worked in without extending the time you're waiting (it's why i liked the end of the time trial in DR as it switched to a slow-mo external view while it displayed your time)

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38 minutes ago, F2CMaDMaXX said:

That's how it is in DR2.....

 

No it is not.  In freeplay, my own championship, once I cross the finish line car is braking on its own (AI takes over, not entirely but to some extent).  All assists are off, hardcore damage on.  I know how to stop and properly park the car myself. Maybe I am missing some setting?  Are you saying that's how game works after finish line in offline sessions only?

Edited by TheIronWolf

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8 hours ago, TheIronWolf said:

No it is not.  In freeplay, my own championship, once I cross the finish line car is braking on its own (AI takes over, not entirely but to some extent).  All assists are off, hardcore damage on.  I know how to stop and properly park the car myself. Maybe I am missing some setting?  Are you saying that's how game works after finish line in offline sessions only?

It's an option in the menus.

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On 2/5/2020 at 12:43 PM, caerphoto said:

Stats, stats, stats! (@Mike Dee, @Philigula)
All the numbers! How many miles we’ve driven (in each car, and in total); how many times we’ve rolled the car, most popular stage, most popular car, how many posts we’ve knocked over, how many spectators we’ve killed avoided at the last second. And so on. Related to this, per @michaelf, is UDP support on consoles. It’s already on PC, and allows for cool things like bass shakers, external dashboard displays, and @bn880’s RDA application, so having it on consoles would be great too.

I love time trials. My wish would be that all driven miles / km with all cars used would be counted. Even if I restart a run because I had an accident or was just too slow.

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