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F1 2019 PC - CTD issue still happening with patch 1.22

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Posted (edited)

Installed patch 1.22 and read the changelog for the patch.  Played the game on Steam but I'm still experiencing crash to desktop issues, no errors, it's just crashing.  It doesn't seem like this issue been resolved with this new patch and I don't understand why.  It's been reported enough times, surely something should have been done about it, yes? @BarryBL

Edited by RickFlare96

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Can you provide the below @RickFlare96 to correctly report a bug. 


1.       A description of the issue. Please include any error codes here. 
2.       What version of the game you are using (Shown on the start screen in the bottom left corner of the screen) 
3.       Game-mode? 
4.       Are you able to recreate the issue? If so, please include recreation steps on how you encountered this issue. 
5.       How often do you see this problem? Is it the only time or does it always happen? 
6.       Have you tried any troubleshooting? We recommend the steps here as a starting point for any issues. Please let us know what troubleshooting methods you have tried while creating this post. 
7.       Any accessories you are using (gamepad, wheel etc) 
8.       Any screenshots or video of the issue? If the video is long, please include a timestamp for when the issue appears.   

Also can you post a DXDiag when possible, should you be on PC

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Same for me...

1.       A description of the issue. Please include any error codes here. 

None, game just crashes to desktop.
2.       What version of the game you are using (Shown on the start screen in the bottom left corner of the screen) 

1.22
3.       Game-mode? 

problem occurred in career (no matter the running session) and also time trial
4.       Are you able to recreate the issue? If so, please include recreation steps on how you encountered this issue. 

not exactly but mostly starting the game and just driving for a couple of minutes does the trick
5.       How often do you see this problem? Is it the only time or does it always happen? 

roughly 50% - 75%, sometimes the game continues just fine
6.       Have you tried any troubleshooting? We recommend the steps here as a starting point for any issues. Please let us know what troubleshooting methods you have tried while creating this post. 

different sound drivers, any radeon driver published in the last 6 months
7.       Any accessories you are using (gamepad, wheel etc) 

see dxdiag
8.       Any screenshots or video of the issue? If the video is long, please include a timestamp for when the issue appears.   

nope

DxDiag.txt

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22 hours ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

Same for me...

1.       A description of the issue. Please include any error codes here. 

None, game just crashes to desktop.
2.       What version of the game you are using (Shown on the start screen in the bottom left corner of the screen) 

1.22
3.       Game-mode? 

problem occurred in career (no matter the running session) and also time trial
4.       Are you able to recreate the issue? If so, please include recreation steps on how you encountered this issue. 

not exactly but mostly starting the game and just driving for a couple of minutes does the trick
5.       How often do you see this problem? Is it the only time or does it always happen? 

roughly 50% - 75%, sometimes the game continues just fine
6.       Have you tried any troubleshooting? We recommend the steps here as a starting point for any issues. Please let us know what troubleshooting methods you have tried while creating this post. 

different sound drivers, any radeon driver published in the last 6 months
7.       Any accessories you are using (gamepad, wheel etc) 

see dxdiag
8.       Any screenshots or video of the issue? If the video is long, please include a timestamp for when the issue appears.   

nope

DxDiag.txt

You need to update your UEFI BIOS to F50 via F32, then EC Firmware Update. Please take care to update the AMD chipset driver first.

Chipset driver, F32, EC FW, F50. That order. Your CPU and GPU combo is very similar to mine R7 2700/RX580 and I have zero issues with the game crashing on DX12.

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Hey steviejay69,

thanks, just updated my system as adviced. I will go ahead for a 100% race tomorrow (yeah, it would have been watching the real one first and than going for my own 2020 season) and let you know. 

 

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So I started the GP and up until lap 53 of 58 everything was fine. At that point unfortunately a CTD occurred again. Luckily I kept saving and could finish from lap 50 onward but none the less the issue is still there.

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2 hours ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

So I started the GP and up until lap 53 of 58 everything was fine. At that point unfortunately a CTD occurred again. Luckily I kept saving and could finish from lap 50 onward but none the less the issue is still there.

Memtest and Samsung Magician would be your first port of call.

After that kind of time I would be looking at temperatures. Do you have the Wraith Prism cooler? It is a sufficient solution if the paste is applied and the clip tension is correct. If looking to check or reapply, take care to twist the heatsink gently and carefully off the Ryzen CPU. Sometimes attempting to lift the cooler up directly away from the board can cause the CPU to be lifted from the socket breaking the pins. 

GPUs - similarly look at GPU temperatures and / or modified fan curves. There are teardowns for many GPUs and often it is simply a matter of removing the heatsink or via the backplate and unplugging fans. Very few screws involved and little can go wrong.

If you run diagnostic software you can often see what is occurring at the point of the crash - GPU-Z will tell you if you are hitting thermal throttling / limits or maximum power draw.

A 590 will probably need a very decent 500W+ PSU, so that is also something you could look at if there are no clues in software.

Good luck.

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I can exclude all of these pretty much right away. First of all because F1 2019 did not show those problems before 1.18 (maybe one update before, not entirely sure about this one). In addition to that other games run for hours and don't show that behavior. The system itself is also not crashing or misbehaving. GPU never exceeds 75 degree celcius. CPU is also kept at reasonable levels. No temperature issues at all. Too lazy to check for the PSU but it is way above 500W. Please don't get me wrong, I appreciate the effort but I think the hardware is really just fine in this case.  Will check just to be safe but it would seriously surprise me if either of the diagnostic tools finds something. 

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For F1 2019 it actually got worse. Apart from the "regular ingame crashes" it now crashes within while loading after a practice session or while being in the motorhome. Which never ever happened before... 

I would also appreciate a response from Codemasters. Are there more patches coming or am I stuck with what can be considered a non working version? 

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20 minutes ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

For F1 2019 it actually got worse. Apart from the "regular ingame crashes" it now crashes within while loading after a practice session or while being in the motorhome. Which never ever happened before... 

I would also appreciate a response from Codemasters. Are there more patches coming or am I stuck with what can be considered a non working version? 

Definitely corruption going on dude. Clean install of Windows is the only way to find out what the issue is. 

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Posted (edited)

Completely reinstalled windows... crashed before I could roll out of the garage. 

 

edit: of course without any sort of error message

Edited by HamilkarBarkas

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5 minutes ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

Completely reinstalled windows... crashed before I could roll out of the garage. 

edit: of course without any sort of error message

Is this Career or any mode?

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Ahem... seriously? Yes, I did. I did that long before and certainly more than once before reinstalling Windows and by doing so also making sure that everything is up to date and not fragmented in any way.

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2 minutes ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

Ahem... seriously? Yes, I did. I did that long before and certainly more than once before reinstalling Windows and by doing so also making sure that everything is up to date and not fragmented in any way.

No problem, just didn't mention it in your troubleshooting feedback, got to cover that off

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Maybe the career save is corrupt between different versions of the game? 

Wouldn't explain the crashing in other modes. 

@HamilkarBarkas I know you're reluctant but;

a) thanks for reinstalling Windows (I hope it was clean and not 'Reset My PC')

b) we can't assume the hardware is good (especially given a) ) and I'm sorry, but "all my other games work fine" isn't definitive. Memory loading is different and files are stored on different parts of a drive. 

One last thing to try before I'm going to insist on hardware checks - Start|Control Panel|Power Options|Choose what the power buttons do|Change settings that are currently unavailable|Shutdown settings and UNCHECK 'Turn on Fast Startup'

More assumptions, Steam and game installed to C:\ and you are using an Administrator account (not running as Admin).

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I am beginning to think it could be a corrupt save game file. Maybe there were other issues as well but so far no crash aside from career mode (meaning since the win reinstall today). And strangely enough 3 crashes in career mode while being pushed into the garage or leaving it. If those crashes would appear randomly that would be an unlikely distribution. Also the save game is kind of a constant here. 

 

All of the other stuff is checked. That actually includes hardware tests. So we can assume it is good. Just ran a GP and will let the replay run multiple times. The engine still needs to render the whole thing so if that doesn't crash it would also point at the save. 

  • Agree 1

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... and it still crashes... in other modes as well and still really randomly. One time you get to lap 28 without issues, the next time it stops after 2 laps. 

However, one oberservation on Civ VI (yeah, turns out that one crashes too but at least points at display driver while doing so) and some digging made it appear to me that B450 and RX580/590 combo is quite a tricky thing. Situation made even worse by faulty AMD drivers. Actually many people report problems and already did a lot of testing and nothing ever helped. Unless a radical change: replacing GPU with a Nvidia one.

https://community.amd.com/thread/239328

 

Unfortunately none is available to me right now but I think I will order one very soonish. 

 

What really pushed me into the direction of the GPU being faulty (or at least the driver causing issues since multiple versions) is that one time Civ VI and F1 2019 showed a very similar graphic error where the game kept running but everything was saturized with yellow colors. Vanished after restarting the game but still an interesting thing to see. I can't really pinpoint this one but somewhere between GPU, driver, maybe also DX something goes wrong. RAM is something I do rule out by now, firstly because RAM fails mean usually BSOD and not CTD. Secondly no issues were found while testing and thirdly changes applied to the settings did not change anything for worse or better. 

 

Corrupt save game file would have been "nice" as it means that it could have been solved easily by starting a new career. But that does really not explain the random crashing while driving. If the save were to blame and should crash while loading or saving, not while running and not minding the save game at all. The good news might be that it is not a F1 2019 issue.

 

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3 minutes ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

... and it still crashes... in other modes as well and still really randomly. One time you get to lap 28 without issues, the next time it stops after 2 laps. 

However, one oberservation on Civ VI (yeah, turns out that one crashes too but at least points at display driver while doing so) and some digging made it appear to me that B450 and RX580/590 combo is quite a tricky thing. Situation made even worse by faulty AMD drivers. Actually many people report problems and already did a lot of testing and nothing ever helped. Unless a radical change: replacing GPU with a Nvidia one.

https://community.amd.com/thread/239328

 

Unfortunately none is available to me right now but I think I will order one very soonish. 

 

What really pushed me into the direction of the GPU being faulty (or at least the driver causing issues since multiple versions) is that one time Civ VI and F1 2019 showed a very similar graphic error where the game kept running but everything was saturized with yellow colors. Vanished after restarting the game but still an interesting thing to see. I can't really pinpoint this one but somewhere between GPU, driver, maybe also DX something goes wrong. RAM is something I do rule out by now, firstly because RAM fails mean usually BSOD and not CTD. Secondly no issues were found while testing and thirdly changes applied to the settings did not change anything for worse or better. 

 

Corrupt save game file would have been "nice" as it means that it could have been solved easily by starting a new career. But that does really not explain the random crashing while driving. If the save were to blame and should crash while loading or saving, not while running and not minding the save game at all. The good news might be that it is not a F1 2019 issue.

 

I've read the thread and can categorically say this is not hardware.

My system specs:

AMD Ryzen 7 2700

16GB Corsair Vengeance (2x 8GB, DDR4-3200)

Gigabyte B450M H (UEFI r1.0)

8GB XFX RX580 Black Edition

512GB Silicon Power NVMe

750GB Seagate Momentus XT SSHD

2TB Seagate Barracuda HDD

550W EVGA Supernova G2 (80 Gold) PSU

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The fact that this setup works for you does not imply that it has to for everybody. I think we all know that there is such a thing as malfunctioning hardware. Unfortunately it does not always stop entirely or appear in a way that it becomes quite clear what the issue is.

 

After all you were insisting in this thread for a long time that it is a hardware issue. And by now I honestly think it has to be as it is persistent for several months and I went through multiple driver version, game versions, Windows versions / installations, BIOS versions, different settings an nothing has changed. 

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8 minutes ago, steviejay69 said:

I've read the thread and can categorically say this is not hardware.

Ok, so what is the issue?

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Just now, HamilkarBarkas said:

Ok, so what is the issue?

You're saying the B450/AMD RX combo is the problem. That is exactly my setup. 

I have built 4 top to bottom different PC systems and the only issue I have had that was persistent in this game was the DX12 fogging not working. That would cause a lockup (CTRL-ALT-DEL, kill process.) It was fixed around 1.06 or 1.07 I think, fairly early on. 

I have had less CTD issues than I can count on 1 hand. None of them replicable, most occurred after testing a patch without restarting or as a result of buggy online sessions. 

I have used Nvidia previously (GTX970, GTX770, GTX650Ti) and I can safely say that the GTX970 was by far THE most problematic to get working and keep working and not have terrible frame rate issues or frequent random CTDs or drop from fullscreen, stutter, etc. We are now going back through various iterations to F1 2014 with those GPUs (possibly apples and oranges).

One thing I have done with the AMD GPUs is strip the heatsink off and renew the TIM - it's fairly simple to do.

I do agree that the AGESA and chipset drivers are a minefield for AM4. But I have built only on B450 and only used Ryzen 2xxx. All I do is follow the OEM recommendations for the particular AM4 CPU that I have with respect to whether I install updates or not (UEFI or chipset drivers and I follow SOP as outlined). I also ONLY use Gigabyte boards - I have had issues with MSI, ASRock and ASUSTek and I find their support not as good, IME. Memory I stick with Corsair or Crucial (Micron).

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With all due respect. That is not an argument. When I built this system I decided for AMD and Gigabyte Mainboard due to good experiences in the past. mostly because I did not encounter issues with those manufacturers. Until I did. I think I switched from NV to AMD more than 10 years ago due to drivers being a mess and the hardware failing on me two times shortly after the warranty was up. Well, maybe it is time for the next switch. 

 

While I still appreciate your help I have to say that your attitude of "nothing can be wrong with B450 /RX combos or this particular manufacturer" is an issue. I have tried really a lot and nothing has shown any kind of result. I complained about a lot of graphic errors before in F1 2019. That was before crashing became an issue. After all, if one experiences graphic errors the GPU is the thing that should be checked.

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2 hours ago, HamilkarBarkas said:

With all due respect. That is not an argument. When I built this system I decided for AMD and Gigabyte Mainboard due to good experiences in the past. mostly because I did not encounter issues with those manufacturers. Until I did. I think I switched from NV to AMD more than 10 years ago due to drivers being a mess and the hardware failing on me two times shortly after the warranty was up. Well, maybe it is time for the next switch. 

While I still appreciate your help I have to say that your attitude of "nothing can be wrong with B450 /RX combos or this particular manufacturer" is an issue. I have tried really a lot and nothing has shown any kind of result. I complained about a lot of graphic errors before in F1 2019. That was before crashing became an issue. After all, if one experiences graphic errors the GPU is the thing that should be checked.

If the B450/RX combo were bad, I should have issues. I don't.

Yes, it wasn't me that wanted it both ways, first of all denying it could be faulty hardware, which is exactly where I directed you after all the easy avenues were exhausted. You simply can't start any support assuming the hardware is faulty otherwise there is a lot of needless time spent checking for something which should not exist statistically 97% of the time in all the individual components.

But the easy checks proved faultless, so the next avenue is to reset the software. This is where the 'fun' begins.

A clean install methodology is not observed by many (and Microsoft is to blame here with it's always connected philosophy and it's driver base of 'do no harm' - there is a distinct difference between WHQL drivers that do not crash a system and OEM drivers (or reference drivers) that actually make the device PERFORM as intended (or should, given the competence of the driver developers).

Great tools like Wagnard's DDU fill this problem by running scripts to remove old files and registry entries that poor installers do not remove on uninstallation. He recommends the tool to be run in SAFE MODE without internet. 

When installing drivers, DO NOT connect the machine to the internet as there is a good chance a WU or W10 inbox driver will install silently WITHOUT removing a possibly conflicting OEM driver or overwriting key parts of it to revert the performance back to 'do no harm' rather than 'as intended'.

I always disable the 'hidden' Fast Startup option in the Power Options. I have seen it exhibit very strange behaviour with some drivers as the machine is not "Shut Down", it is suspended to disk. You may argue this is poor driver design or it is unexpected behaviour. If you were around in the Windows 98 era and onwards (as I was) you will know that suspension, hibernation and resumption thereof are one of the most frustrating experiences, given specifics of hardware. Disabling the Advanced System Setting of Hardware|Device Installation Settings can stop some 'bad' drivers loading, some need forcible blocking with the wushowhide.diagcab tool.

The next thing is proper testing of memory. Due to how Memtest works, memory must be tested in a minimum config scenario. That means individual banks of DRAM, current gen means one stick at a time, some older configs meant one bank at a time (sometimes a minimum of 2 modules were required). The amount of reserved memory when testing multiple banks at once can mean small areas are not tested and some channel timings mean that errors can escape detection. It is the only memory testing tool I trust and I know it is not 100% infallible, but it does detect obvious seating errors straightaway and some errors only occur after extended testing, so 4 passes are used. Even one single error bit means the memory is FAULTY.

Hard drives, most modern hard drives are only able to be diagnosed with manufacturer tools that will do their utmost to hide the fact that a drive is failing. SMART tests can only tell you the condition of a drive at the time of the test, they cannot detect imminent drive failure and they will not detect errors once the drive diagnostics and firmware have chosen to 'hide' errors in the hope that the drive will survive in a fashion until the warranty has expired (usually well before the MTBF under normal usage).

SSDs are different but here the manufacturers will use TLC and QLC with over-provisioning. Same applies.

These caveats aside, generally firmware updates are not visible unless using the manufacturer diagnostic / monitor tool. These are a dual-edged sword, sometimes shortcomings in either the design or component quality is masked by firmware or occasionally reliability and performance is revised and optimised. I prefer to remain optimistic and update, but many users never run these tools and therefore may suffer errors or small data losses because of the lack of that very update.

Motherboards are the final piece of the jigsaw. The same thing applies. Firmware is crucial. AMD AGESA and Intel microcode. Hugely important in correcting CPU errata and the way the chipset integrates with the CPU and hardware features. AM4 is without a doubt the most ambitious technology ever attempted. Intel just release minor revisions to CPUs (Tick-Tock) and issue new chipsets each time. AMD picked an architecture that they knew was scalable (and shrinkable) and enabled a chipset so "open" that it supported those revisions and refreshes at a time when Intel's release cadence dropped (failure to hit yield on 10nm and 7nm).

So I 'get' that the drivers and firmware updates were going to be not only necessary, but need the inevitable and ubiquitous bug-fixing and tweaking.

So I reiterate that it *must* be something causing corruption or faulting in your setup.

It is possible that anything you've done hasn't met the process I describe with the experience I have. You can see why I have to be 'to the point' as much as possible (it gets lengthy).

I know you are grateful for the help, but equally I have the courage of my convictions because I back it with experience; six years of these games and many more years dealing with general PC issues.

I have never said the game does not have issues, but I don't encounter the majority of issues that people bring to the TA forums repeatedly. TA would benefit from concentrating on gameplay bugs or 'proven' graphical or controller issues.

I certainly can't agree with the view expressed in that Reddit thread that there are fundamental issues with B450 / RX. I have unearthed a specific flaw in another ASUS B450 board that I PMed the owner with, it was specific to that ASUS board.

The RX cards (like any) aren't without their issues. There are 'Known Issues' relating to Polaris in each driver release that go unfixed, but I don't encounter them and certainly not in the context of this game. When trying to solve issues I load the latest releases (optional or otherwise). When my issues are resolved, I stick until the base recommended driver overtakes my build (as I have nothing to fix) and as long as nothing new breaks that's good for me. But I know my regression point then for testing (generally the last recommended release).

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