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KevM said:
Low wheel rotation & bonnet cam - complains it's not sim enough....  ??
What a clever argument.

No it isn't.

Because, whoa, get this, even if I were to use cockpit cam and, in your opinion, a valid wheel rotation, the 2000's cars are still stuck with too much grip and too effective brakes. How does a bonnet camera and 270 degrees of rotation change the way the cars handle? Oh wait... it doesn't.

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KevM said:
Low wheel rotation & bonnet cam - complains it's not sim enough....  ??
What a clever argument.

No it isn't.

Because, whoa, get this, even if I were to use cockpit cam and, in your opinion, a valid wheel rotation, the 2000's cars are still stuck with too much grip and too effective brakes. How does a bonnet camera and 270 degrees of rotation change the way the cars handle? Oh wait... it doesn't.
I've just tested it. The bonnet cam seems to give a feeling that the overall grip's better. The sounds better. The pacenotes are louder. There's no wiper sound and no distraction from wipers...I think it does change the way you feel how it handle.

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versedi said:
I've just tested it. The bonnet cam seems to give a feeling that the overall grip's better. The sounds better. The pacenotes are louder. There's no wiper sound and no distraction from wipers...I think it does change the way you feel how it handle.
You think wrong.

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It's all about perspective....                         

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If all of these ingredients are not increasing/decreasing some feelings then I'm wrong. But then man, you have a cold heart aka you're not enough emotional ;)

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versedi said:
If all of these ingredients are not increasing/decreasing some feelings then I'm wrong. But then man, you have a cold heart aka you're not enough emotional ;)
k

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Using bonnet cam in no way invalidates someone's opinion on handling/physics. In fact, it reinforces it. Bonnet cam gives the best representation of the car's actions with no distractions, and to a lot of people that's way more fun to drive than cockpit. 

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That's like saying Micro Machines give a realistic impression on in-game physics.  

How can you compare sitting in the drivers seat of  a car, looking out, to sitting on the top of a windscreen/roof-skin looking down?  You sit IN a rally car, you sit On top of forklifts.... 

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I used to be a bonnet driver but I just love the dash cam in Dirt Rally. It looks awesome and it sounds awesome.

When switching back to bonnet I get the feeling the car is less responsive/understeers more but that just placebo ofc.

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They're easily comparable because they're identical views. They both point forward. One is in the car, the other is 3 feet forward on the hood free from distractions.

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dg comes sees degrees eliteness in action slides back out ..... :D

it doesn't matter what you use 1080 is just as skillful as 200.

people drive how they drive.don't worry about it.

if you fast you fast that's it.

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ramPage16 said:
They're easily comparable because they're identical views. They both point forward. One is in the car, the other is 3 feet forward on the hood free from distractions.
There is a difference in viewing the road from somewhere slightly above the front of the car you are driving, just over the front axle, & viewing the road from down inside the car in between the front & rear axle.  


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I'm actually missing the point you're trying to prove now. Your original statement was that Porkhammer was being hypocritical for criticizing the handling when he doesn't use the most realistic cam. My point is that it's the most competitive view that gives the clearest representation of the cars actions. If there's anyone who has the best idea of how a car handles in this game, it's someone who uses bonnet cam and their input should be held in high regard.

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Man I thought my joke about the R4 Subaru spoiler whinging would be well-received, but you guys are having an even weirder argument in here. :D

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Please let my KB power stay in the top 10 in Owner's Daily, please let my KB stay in the top 10... *prays*
I like Flugzeugring, reverse or not. :)

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dwkGravey said:
Man I thought my joke about the R4 Subaru spoiler whinging would be well-received, but you guys are having an even weirder argument in here. :D
It's an old 'difference of opinion', no one thinks the other is right :)

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I'll happily record a 30 fps video of me driving from cockpit view just to prove that it's not even a tiny bit harder. The 2000's cars are too easy to drive regardless of camera view.

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ramPage16 said:
My point is that it's the most competitive view that gives the clearest representation of the cars actions. If there's anyone who has the best idea of how a car handles in this game, it's someone who uses bonnet cam and their input should be held in high regard.
Of course, all of that applies only when you ignore the chase camera which... well... how should I put it... literally shows what is happening with the car. Quick example: you won't notice that the rear wheels clipped through something (aka went through it like it didn't exist) but you'll notice that from a chase camera.

Since we're obviously not sitting in the cars themselves, the best idea of how a car handles comes from someone who is using a very good steering wheel while playing on chase camera. He sees what's happening and feels it. Every other camera doesn't fully show what's happening with the car. You can only guess at best.

Bottom line: Use whichever camera floats your boat and just enjoy the game.

PS. Which camera is most competitive is a completely different subject that is highly dependent on what type of information you need in a given moment.

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We'll agree to disagree. My opinion of what best represents handling is a fixed cam because I instantly see the car's reactions to the road and my inputs. The chase cam is not directly fixed to the car's orientation. It has damping and delay which does not provide a clear picture of what's happening to the car.

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KevM said:
Low wheel rotation & bonnet cam - complains it's not sim enough....  ??
Why bonnet cam? Because I am not in the 3D-glasses, I have constrained view through single display. In this case cockpit view is much more unrealistic.

Why low wheel rotation? Because in the high speed racing no time for 100500 full turns of the steering wheel.

And
is it so important - 270 or 540 degrees? Man with 540 degrees can complain, but man with 270 degrees can't? What a nonsense?

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Well, that was amazing; i actually was force retired from the daily :(

Had a really unlucky off (lawyd, that thing is heavy) and managed to blow two tyres in one crash, must have raced another 3 corners before the terminal damage 80% appeared :(

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ramPage16 said:
We'll agree to disagree. My opinion of what best represents handling is a fixed cam because I instantly see the car's reactions to the road and my inputs. The chase cam is not directly fixed to the car's orientation. It has damping and delay which does not provide a clear picture of what's happening to the car.
It's true if you only judge on how the "screen" is moving. With chase camera you're looking at the car in that situation, not how the screen goes left and right (or up and down when it comes to Finland). Another thing, the dampening and delay mean that you have a much more stable view of the situation, which in turns means you'll most likely miss less things in terms of feedback. Not mistake it with getting them sooner.
Best proof is that when something goes wrong, racing drivers look at replays to know exactly which part went wrong. Those replays when possible will be watched from a camera that was situated on a track, not onboard one.

Simply put, it depends on how you're used to detecting the cars behaviour. If you're used to judging from how the screen is moving, then you'll get more "immediate" feedback from the bonnet, while with chase you simply look at the car. How the screen is moving is not important to you. You will see all the things you would notice from a bonnet, because again, you see the actual car. All of it. If it goes into a slide, you see it goes into a slide. If it gets understeer, you see that. And so on and so forth.

While hood camera may be the one that is faster to provide feedback on the car, it provides less of it. That's a fact, not an opinion. If you don't see the car you can only assume what is happening with it. And assuming is not knowing. Especially when you assume what is happening with the car based on how the screen is moving.

Again, use whichever camera floats your boat. But if we're talking just pure amount of precise feedback to tell what is actually happening with the car, nothing will beat a camera that shows the actual whole car. If you see what's happening with the car, you know what's happening with it. It's pointless to even discuss about it as it is so obvious it hurts.

PS. You can always mod the chase camera to behave like a fixed one. Just so you know.

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