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Codemasters sim or Arcade?

CODEMASTERS WHAT THE CUSTOMER WANTS.   

112 members have voted

  1. 1. YOU WANT F1 GAME TO BE SIM, ARCADE OR SIMCADE YOUR CHOICE! 😊



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1 hour ago, UP100 said:

The others were done this year with such surveys like how is the multiplayer and another one that was generally about did you/didn't you buy F1 2019 and why would you/would you not purchase an upcoming F1 game

I won t buy the upcoming F1 game 😥😥.. Its with a lot of sadness and unhappiness that i am saying but its True.. I won t buy next F1 game because i will look for another sim.. I Will buy season pass of Assetto 

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2 hours ago, CarlosSantos87 said:

I won t buy the upcoming F1 game 😥😥.. Its with a lot of sadness and unhappiness that i am saying but its True.. I won t buy next F1 game because i will look for another sim.. I Will buy season pass of Assetto 

Good for you I guess!

Somehow you're able to mention AC more often than I'm able to mention rF2 😁

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2 hours ago, UP100 said:

Good for you I guess!

Somehow you're able to mention AC more often than I'm able to mention rF2 😁

RF2 is great Sim too mate..i played for years and years the RF1.. And i had modded that game alone in somethings and made the game a little more realistic.. Each One of us have to choose what we think better and what enjoy more.. And by the way i repeat for the 1000 time i am an greateast Fan and current customer of Codemasters but I am tired for waiting a simulation Handling and nothings happen.. So like we have other great options to have a lot of fun Racing 😍😍

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4 hours ago, CarlosSantos87 said:

I won t buy the upcoming F1 game 😥😥.. Its with a lot of sadness and unhappiness that i am saying but its True.. I won t buy next F1 game because i will look for another sim.. I Will buy season pass of Assetto 

I don't think ACC, unlike AC, has any open-wheeled cars...

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On 5/4/2020 at 8:21 PM, sloppysmusic said:

Nope, nope, and nope again. Your extreme opinion....

LOL, you're too much bro.

These are all games, all games model physics, some better than others, obviously. Some games like NFS purposefully defy physics, but all games are based on physics.

If you think one games physics are more realistic than another games, awesome! Whatever.

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56 minutes ago, Pitchpole said:

 

LOL, you're too much bro.

These are all games, all games model physics, some better than others, obviously. Some games like NFS purposefully defy physics, but all games are based on physics.

If you think one games physics are more realistic than another games, awesome! Whatever.

LOL back you basically agreed with me but hinted you did not?! I said all racing software had various degrees of sim accuracy, ie better or worse to us. You said they ALL model physics. Which IS simulation! And of COURSE the physics of every game differs in realism to other games. Unless they all copied the same model variation HAS to occur!!

PHYSICS = SIMULATION

DEFYING PHYSICS = GAME.

We agree!

:classic_biggrin:

I have to ask are you just trolling me? Because OK you did a good job if so, I totally fell for it!

😄

 

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How do you guys think this game is even close to a simulation. I’m not hating but let’s be honest, the only realistic thing this game has are graphics. 

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Posted (edited)

I think everyone got different definition on what’s arcade and sim.

Arcade machines zero physics

 

 

8BC5EAA6-2768-434E-9E68-592058011737.jpeg

Edited by Hill0

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Arcade = Physics that are made up to imitate, rather than trying simulating the real thing. 

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Posted (edited)

Arcade physic is when the car can actually go sideway & you can control the slide. Has lift off oversteer generally.

Simulation physic is about assist being mandatory, insert magic number to make the car faster & all the car understeer. The car understeer so much that you are required to bomb dive with the brake & make the car rotate from the front with the steering in order to trailbrake. The best simulation is about the ability to win effortless with on/off throttle control(aka early on power, meaning accelerate late with on/off switch).

Edited by MrDeap

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2 hours ago, LEWISt17KIMI said:

Arcade = Physics that are made up to imitate, rather than trying simulating the real thing. 

Another variation of this theme:

Arcade - the car compensates for the weaknesses of the driver

Simulation - the driver compensates for the weaknesses of the car

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37 minutes ago, dwin20 said:

Another variation of this theme:

Arcade - the car compensates for the weaknesses of the driver

Simulation - the driver compensates for the weaknesses of the car

Awesome words 😃😃.. Better simple explanation Don t exists.. 

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Reputable Simracing titles core engine is flawed & it's all about the supreme ability to drive wrong. When you steer over the limit, the car keep cornering when in real life, the car just plow straight.

I bet it's related in how the rear end slip angle interact too quick to the steering input & it's impossible to trail brake properly. If you google "Comparing and improving steering forces in a race car and race simulator to increase simulator fidelity", according to the data... the car corner so much faster in chicanes in the sim.

In kunos games I compared the G meter while taking a chicane & I noticed that the G force switched much faster while changing direction than the real thing. Even when drifting, you don't even need to input much steering when pulling the handbrake to start the turn in.

Understeer happen the traction is inferior in the front than the back, but if the rear end also corner the front will more likely to understeer using correct tire data, because the back end is turning with the front too early.

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Posted (edited)

The problem now is the realistic racing games absolutely require a decent wheel pedal set-up. I race on console but with a decent rig and I just cannot explain the difference to friends if you combine the wheel, ffb, VR if the game supports it, and a good physics based game from playing on a flat TV with a gamepad in your hands. It's a totally different beast entirely.

A good example is when dirt rally 2.0 was free on PS+ last month and the amount of casuals who said it was rubbish and deleted it straight away. They probably tried to play with a pad gave it half hour and then lost interest due to the difficulty. I bet if they sat in my rig and I said you have one hour to hit that time on that stage, I bet if they have any experience in driving cars in the real world they would be engrossed by the feeling and it may well convert some people to go out and buy a sim set up for home.

The overall point is it's really difficult to cater to both sets of players with the same game, and the pad and wheel users are further apart than they ever have been in what they expect from a racing title. 

Is it time codemasters looked at offering two products for F1 like the dirt series? Maybe two dedicated modes on the same game disk with dedicated servers for each? Is turning assists on and off enough to please both types of players now?

The more realistic PC racing games become and the bigger esports gets the harder it's going to be for codemasters to stick with the current approach of one size fits all. 

Edited by dfooster
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And how much is a more sim F1 going to cost??  iRacing is a monthly subscription and at least £100/year.  F1 20XX is competing with hundreds of similarly priced games titles.

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Infairness Id be pretty much happy with the F1 series if they for one would split all the different assists up and have different leader boards for those who use tcam or pads.

Combine this with better force feedback as its lacking and its going in the right direction.

The handling is ok not great by any means you have a basic feeling in the car but I cant help comparing it to Pc2 and AC now and ita disapointing.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, dfooster said:

The problem now is the realistic racing games absolutely require a decent wheel pedal set-up. I race on console but with a decent rig and I just cannot explain the difference to friends if you combine the wheel, ffb, VR if the game supports it, and a good physics based game from playing on a flat TV with a gamepad in your hands. It's a totally different beast entirely.

A good example is when dirt rally 2.0 was free on PS+ last month and the amount of casuals who said it was rubbish and deleted it straight away. They probably tried to play with a pad gave it half hour and then lost interest due to the difficulty. I bet if they sat in my rig and I said you have one hour to hit that time on that stage, I bet if they have any experience in driving cars in the real world they would be engrossed by the feeling and it may well convert some people to go out and buy a sim set up for home.

The overall point is it's really difficult to cater to both sets of players with the same game, and the pad and wheel users are further apart than they ever have been in what they expect from a racing title. 

Is it time codemasters looked at offering two products for F1 like the dirt series? Maybe two dedicated modes on the same game disk with dedicated servers for each? Is turning assists on and off enough to please both types of players now?

The more realistic PC racing games become and the bigger esports gets the harder it's going to be for codemasters to stick with the current approach of one size fits all. 

I'm not sure if I would be alone in saying this, all applies to the console only:

I played project cars 1 on a gamepad, it took a while but I got quite good. When I went to a wheel it took me some time to get close to my gamepad times, but eventually was considerably faster. I've also got project cars 2 and have played with both pad and wheel but, prefer and am faster, with a wheel.

With dirt 1 I was good on the gamepad, never played it with a wheel. Dirt 2 I really struggle with a wheel and am faster with a gamepad, the wheel ffb is poor in my opinion, and you have an advantage steering from lock to lock on the gamepad. WRC8 however I find better on the wheel, better ffb but my times are similar with both devices.

With the f1 games I've played on both wheel and gamepad (16,17,18) I find little difference between gamepad and wheel. Ultimately I prefer the wheel with f1 games for immersion, but again compared to the likes of the "real sims", the ffb is poor.

On PC, my friends rig with a wheel setup (don't have my own PC rig yet, this is my next step) there are games like rFactor and Asseto Corsa, that feel much superior in comparison to the above. Never have I used a gamepad on a PC driving game. PC2 is better on PC as you can use custom ffb files that improve the ffb feel.

So to me it's a mixed bag. Pretty much all driving games can be played with both wheels and gamepads, and as long as the leaderboards and online lobbies can be filtered by input device and assists used, I can't see what all the fuss is about.

Let the apples play, and be compared with, the apples, and likewise for the pears!

Edited by ChasteWand
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When the Codemasters F1 games started it was for the casual gamer, now with esports and F1 drivers on board they have to move to a more Simulation model, certain details that that would never be a concern are now important like accurate track details. with the new consoles the game could really go a lot further.

Regarding the casual gamer, F1 is not as popular as it once was similar to cricket due to been on pay tv.

I'm sure the F1 games before Codemasters had a arcade mode.  

 

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6 hours ago, DANDREWTHOMSON said:

now with esports and F1 drivers on board they have to move to a more Simulation model,

If you are trying to create an F1 driving experience it is hard to argue with actual F1 drivers. But looking at the opportunity for Codemasters, they are getting input from people who have the actual experience...

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A different tack - how many of those who want a more sim model drive from cockpit view?

If one is not driving from cockpit view,  then I don't think there is any thing to complain about🤔🤔

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Posted (edited)

Imo, at least the tire model / ers & fuel simulation, and the ffb need to be made much more realistic, if we will not go the full sim route for whatever reason.

 

Casual players and newcomers already got more than enough options to slowly move up the ranks. So we do not need to continue the quest of catering towards them at such a extent. 

 

Now it's time that the ones who like to compete on a higher level, including E-Sports or leagues etc., and love the simulation aspect of racing, also finally get some bang for the buck.

 

Especially cockpit driving deserves a lot of love (ability for Multiplayer lobbies or leagues to force cockpit camera view onto everyone, steering wheel screen with multiple pages that are loaded with vital info, higher look to apex angles, helmet cam, VR etc.).

 

There is still lots to improve.

Edited by TheEmpireWasRight
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Not 'defending' the driving model as a sim here, but it's not just the driving though, is it? The whole F1 game is a simulation of Formula 1, especially the career - it simulates what it is like to be a driver in an F1 team, competing in an F1 championship. I think Codemasters deserve some credit for that, as most other sims are simply that - a simulation of a car.

Yes, the others have various options to build your own race or season, but they are generally pretty lifeless. (ok ACC has a championship too). But in general, even those with excellent handling simulation, are not as strong when it comes to conveying an 'atmosphere' of the sport.

The main thing that draws me to the Codemasters F1 games is this whole package, the simulation of F1 itself, the development of the car, the fight for points each race, and the fight to get a better seat - not just the car (even though it is always the most important factor).

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Agree with the top comment Project cars career is not really a career is it, you can hop wherever you want in a way teams don't approach you. The AC career looks pants. Basically the 'sims' are better for online play or if you wanna drive a few laps.

Career/sense of progression draws me in and F1 does that but it must be improved for sure the bugs year in year out ruin the experience somewhat.

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I really like the game because of the well done career mode. But i drive also other games that are much more difficult. And really often i wish f1 would be more sim. But i think Codemasters is doing very well over the time. The F1 Games had done every year a step forward.

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6 hours ago, AdamFreeman said:

Agree with the top comment Project cars career is not really a career is it, you can hop wherever you want in a way teams don't approach you. The AC career looks pants. Basically the 'sims' are better for online play or if you wanna drive a few laps.

Career/sense of progression draws me in and F1 does that but it must be improved for sure the bugs year in year out ruin the experience somewhat.

Whats is causing this lack in F1 Games from Codemasters is the much more Sim Handling and immersion of realistic feeling of the car.. this is what is missing a lot in the game.. ONLY.. And improving a Online Mode Penalty System 

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