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F1 2020 Denuvo

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Is denuvo going to be in F1 2020? Steam page doesn't mention it, but last year was the same with F1 2019 and it had denuvo.

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6 hours ago, Mitchell49 said:

Is denuvo going to be in F1 2020? Steam page doesn't mention it, but last year was the same with F1 2019 and it had denuvo.

If previous entry to series had denuvo it's 99% chance that f1 2020 will have it to

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14 hours ago, ZtwoA said:

If previous entry to series had denuvo it's 99% chance that f1 2020 will have it to

If the exe is similar to last year and the launch times then yeah. 

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Yeah, I too see no point in them changing that. After all, F1 2019 didn't get cracked, so it worked for them.

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Posted (edited)

It got bypassed actually using Goldberg Emu, when will devs realise the people who pirate it wouldn't have bought it anyway. 

They're wasting hundreds of thousands of £ for a DRM that increases load times by a factor of 2, punishing their paying customers. Remember when they left the Denuvo free DRM in the free weekend with F1 2018? I grabbed that and swapped it with my legit version, it was infinitely faster. Here's the side by side comparison I did. 

 

https://streamable.com/p0tjt

Edited by kraM1t
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1 hour ago, kraM1t said:

They're wasting hundreds of thousands of £ for a DRM that increases load times by a factor of 2, punishing their paying customers. Remember when they left the Denuvo free DRM in the free weekend with F1 2018? I grabbed that and swapped it with my legit version, it was infinitely faster. Here's the side by side comparison I did. 

Well I don't think we can really say if they're wasting their money or not, as we don't have their data. We only know that Denuvo slows down the startup process, although some of that could simply be due to different build settings.

So basically what I'm saying: Yes, Denuvo is annoying, but we don't know the statistics what the developers/publishers see 🙂 

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yes probably the manual has a line at the bottom stating ' ONLINE REVALIDATION. This Game connects to a third party server to validate your Steam ticket' which probably means denuvo

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Ha! so when your game crashes, and it takes over 2 minutes to get back in the session because of the insanely long loadtimes, it's really codies messing your race up on purpose? 😂 that's hilarious. And it speaks volumes about their priorities.  

If the online was working that would be the perfect DRM 
That and mod support via the steam workshop. (The things we could fix ourselves.......  my god just thinking about it makes me sad) 

Smart developers don't punish their paying customers to scrape a little bit of cash. (if at all) 
They make sure the online part of the game is up to scratch so you wouldn't want to play without it (mods being an option too looking at cities skylines for example) 

If online is good, people are able to make their own livery/helmet designs and share via the workshop, download mods to fix and tweak the game in any way you want again via the workshop, and has sensible dlc (e.g. Classic cars/tracks) then you would NOT need to cripple your own game with shitshows like denuvo. 

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It's missing the point a bit. Yes, Denuvo cripples loading performance there is no denying that and yes it is anti-piracy but it is also anti-tamper.

It's also not a perfect solution as it's clear some modifications get past the anti-tamper. On PC that is a major issue, shouldn't just be down to leagues to suspect and eject players that are cheating.

For offline modes, I don't give a hoot - let people fiddle with anything, if they can't do stuff with the difficulty turned right down then IDK.

But for competitive play then it needs to be a level playing field and other games are / have adopted similar / much worse technology. 

The only problem for me is if it affects the very thing it's designed to protect, game integrity.

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On 6/19/2020 at 9:32 PM, steviejay69 said:

It's missing the point a bit. Yes, Denuvo cripples loading performance there is no denying that and yes it is anti-piracy but it is also anti-tamper.

It's also not a perfect solution as it's clear some modifications get past the anti-tamper. On PC that is a major issue, shouldn't just be down to leagues to suspect and eject players that are cheating.

For offline modes, I don't give a hoot - let people fiddle with anything, if they can't do stuff with the difficulty turned right down then IDK.

But for competitive play then it needs to be a level playing field and other games are / have adopted similar / much worse technology. 

The only problem for me is if it affects the very thing it's designed to protect, game integrity.

Well the way I see it the problems online are mainly there because there is no central place were everything is calculated and simulated. Every client has to trust all the other clients and they just say where they are and none of the other clients gives a hoot about how they got there. Your client doesn't even know the setups of the other cars so it wouldn't know what speeds should be possible etc. It's just a trust system and that's very bad in a game where the difference all too often is in the 0.001 regions. I get that everything should be simulated on your pc first  and you'd want 0 input lag but there should be a dedicated host server that just keeps track of everything and corrects clients whenever they do funny stuff, and it's from there that spectators should get their information too. 

Apart from giving paying customers a worse experience, they indeed also stop us from modding the game and fixing things they are too lazy (or constraint by time) to do themselves which is a bad thing.
While i get that in terms of car liveries, especially if they want to sell more stupid Haloween dlc,  but they should really make everything else but the models moddable, (or... you know... changeable in game by design.)


Personally i don't think it's a good idea to let your paying customers suffer for your fear for cheaters either. 
Small as this games playerbase is (might change if they finally fix multiplayer though) it's al community leagues anyway where people know eachother well enough and it just wouldn't make sense to try to cheat in such an environment. especially if races get streamed it will take exactly 1 race for people to be on to you and throw your cheaty ass in the bin where you belong. And to be honest i DO feel it's a job of the leagues to make sure everybody plays by the rules. Cripple your game AND failing to protect game integrity is even worse though, so they should just stop crippling. 

If anything it's this stupid ranked mode that makes people cheat to try hard max rank to brag or whatnot. i think your rank should just be based on all your online lap times you did. (of course very much relative to laps in the same conditions/fuel load/tires) that gives us a WAY better idea of how quick someone is and would stop kids from cheating to get high rank in the 5 lap crashmode. 

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24 minutes ago, Bicarda said:

Well the way I see it the problems online are mainly there because there is no central place were everything is calculated and simulated. Every client has to trust all the other clients and they just say where they are and none of the other clients gives a hoot about how they got there. Your client doesn't even know the setups of the other cars so it wouldn't know what speeds should be possible etc. It's just a trust system and that's very bad in a game where the difference all too often is in the 0.001 regions. I get that everything should be simulated on your pc first  and you'd want 0 input lag but there should be a dedicated host server that just keeps track of everything and corrects clients whenever they do funny stuff, and it's from there that spectators should get their information too. 

Apart from giving paying customers a worse experience, they indeed also stop us from modding the game and fixing things they are too lazy (or constraint by time) to do themselves which is a bad thing.
While i get that in terms of car liveries, especially if they want to sell more stupid Haloween dlc,  but they should really make everything else but the models moddable, (or... you know... changeable in game by design.)


Personally i don't think it's a good idea to let your paying customers suffer for your fear for cheaters either. 
Small as this games playerbase is (might change if they finally fix multiplayer though) it's al community leagues anyway where people know eachother well enough and it just wouldn't make sense to try to cheat in such an environment. especially if races get streamed it will take exactly 1 race for people to be on to you and throw your cheaty ass in the bin where you belong. And to be honest i DO feel it's a job of the leagues to make sure everybody plays by the rules. Cripple your game AND failing to protect game integrity is even worse though, so they should just stop crippling. 

If anything it's this stupid ranked mode that makes people cheat to try hard max rank to brag or whatnot. i think your rank should just be based on all your online lap times you did. (of course very much relative to laps in the same conditions/fuel load/tires) that gives us a WAY better idea of how quick someone is and would stop kids from cheating to get high rank in the 5 lap crashmode. 

Totally agree with that, wasn't really being critical of your post just trying to add context, not trying to defend Codemasters either.

Piracy, the argument will rumble on forever. Pirates are NEVER going to buy the game, just people if they're given an EASY choice between a free, pirated, 100% functional copy and a paid, official 100% functional copy of a game - more will choose the free option that would have otherwise. That's revenue loss.

Anti-cheat / tamper needs to be worthwhile, it's patently NOT working all that well if people can apply cheats and it IS impacting on load times for sure - it's whether or not that content scrambling / unscrambling is the cause of some of the issues, IDK. If it is, it's shameful.

Just like it's for lawyers to argue who is the problem and what is worthwhile chasing over piracy, it's equally likely that accountants will decide whether or not the cost of Denuvo is lower than the potential amount of lost revenue to piracy and or any additional damages to the perception of cheating.

 

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2 hours ago, Bicarda said:

Your client doesn't even know the setups of the other cars so it wouldn't know what speeds should be possible etc.

Actually it does! Even the UDP packet data that's transmitted out of the game includes the setup data for all cars 🙂 

struct PacketCarSetupData
{
    PacketHeader    m_header;            // Header

    CarSetupData    m_carSetups[20];
};

You can restrict the data, but most likely that only restricts the data broadcasted through UDP as the ParticipantData includes the info about the setting the player uses.

struct ParticipantData
{
    // Offset: 53
    uint8      m_yourTelemetry;          // The player's UDP setting, 0 = restricted, 1 = public
};

I'd say that it's probably better to leave claims about the code out of the conversation if they can only cause misconceptions. If Codies would develop their games on .NET languages, then sure, as those are easier to inspect.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, UP100 said:
 
 
 
1
4 hours ago, UP100 said:

Actually it does! Even the UDP packet data that's transmitted out of the game includes the setup data for all cars 🙂 


struct PacketCarSetupData
{
    PacketHeader    m_header;            // Header

    CarSetupData    m_carSetups[20];
};

You can restrict the data, but most likely that only restricts the data broadcasted through UDP as the ParticipantData includes the info about the setting the player uses.


struct ParticipantData
{
    // Offset: 53
    uint8      m_yourTelemetry;          // The player's UDP setting, 0 = restricted, 1 = public
};

I'd say that it's probably better to leave claims about the code out of the conversation if they can only cause misconceptions. If Codies would develop their games on .NET languages, then sure, as those are easier to inspect.

well even if people don't set it to private you still can't get the setups through the UDP telemetry.
*REDACTED* and we know that is not true. 

IT only works for AI cars/AI names.  And seeing as my point was about other cars in multiplayer it was very much valid. 

Edit: I don't know how to fix this 😞

 

Edited by UP100
Added redacted

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