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Assist Nerf!

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Hello. Cars with assist should be slower a little. It only Help at beggining to Learn but later playing without assist should be rewarded by faster times. 

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Fantazmagori said:

Hello. Cars with assist should be slower a little. It only Help at beggining to Learn but later playing without assist should be rewarded by faster times. 

It already is slower with most assists on.

Steering assist understeers a lot and makes it almost impossible to steer for tight turns except if you break sooner, which in return makes you a lot slower in tight corners. (It's godforsakenly awful currently and I wouldn't even suggest for beginners to have it activated because you are sure to crash in hairpins and other tight corners)

Breaking Assist also makes you a lot slower because the game starts to break/shift down much earlier on the Dynamic racing line in an attempt to try avoiding you overshoot the corner. If you turn it off you can go faster by breaking later.

And what other assists really are there?

Automatic shifting? Well automatic gearboxes are much faster in real life too because they shift so fast its beyond the human reaction time.

 

If that issue is complaining about multiplayer... well then play only on games that forbid certain assists from being activated.

Altogether players using assists and advanced players not using assists shouldn't be mixed together. You are automatically in for imbalances.

Edited by MeduSalem

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The biggest complain so far is that using ABS seems equal to no ABS braking distance.

I don't use ABS so I can't really say, but that's the most mentioned assist that is not balanced.

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6 hours ago, MeduSalem said:

Automatic shifting? Well automatic gearboxes are much faster in real life too because they shift so fast its beyond the human reaction time.

 

 

Automatic gears often puts you in a too high gear on exit. Manual just gives you more control when breaking and rotation.

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Abs off is not hard but Abs on is at least as fast as without the assist. You have zero disadvantages if you use the abs assist 😕

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I play full assists(except steering), my son no assists and no matter how perfect my lap I am no where near his lap times. 

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Can understand for players online, but then the host should be able to decide how the races go. Either with or without assists.  For single player only, hell no. Everyone has the right to play the game how they see fit.

 

I only use medium TC btw.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/13/2020 at 2:37 PM, Aef251 said:

I play full assists(except steering), my son no assists and no matter how perfect my lap I am no where near his lap times. 

Well, there's between you and your son a big skill/experience gap which somewhat skews the whole comparison. The thing here is to know if players with at similar level are advantaged by using ABS or not. Can't speak about it since I don't use it but this was always a topic.

 

Host rules should solve it once and for all. Like Ace Combat 7 MP for example.

Edited by Nas00
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On 7/12/2020 at 4:59 PM, MeduSalem said:

And what other assists really are there?

I think what most people have in mind when talking about assists are the ones indicated on the TT leaderboards: traction control, ABS and gears. There's the dynamic racing line too. Unlike the steering and brake assists you mentioned I think this sets of assists has far more scope to make a lot of players faster. I'm trying to get to grips with manual gears currently but I'm still definitely at a stage where I'd be faster with automatic gears. 

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1 hour ago, Ultra3142 said:

I think what most people have in mind when talking about assists are the ones indicated on the TT leaderboards: traction control, ABS and gears. There's the dynamic racing line too. Unlike the steering and brake assists you mentioned I think this sets of assists has far more scope to make a lot of players faster. I'm trying to get to grips with manual gears currently but I'm still definitely at a stage where I'd be faster with automatic gears. 

Yeah well. I think the best approach would still be splitting the leaderboards into two categories... for those who don't use any assists and those who use assists.

Then no nerfs would be necessary and those who play without compete only with other people who play without.

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9 minutes ago, MeduSalem said:

I think the best approach would still be splitting the leaderboards into two categories... for those who don't use any assists and those who use assists.

I agree. I said as much earlier in the thread :classic_smile:. An alternative would be to be able to filter the current leaderboard by the assists used. Either would be quite a big changes for CM though. 

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Isn't this just a topic about people still not good enough without assists to top the leaderboards complaining others use assists? If you are good enough without assists you will beat a player with assists. Stop blaming assists, practice more and harder 😈

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The one thing I've noticed is that high breaking assist, actually, penalizes people for breaking themselves. For example, I can just coast through most turns on beginner, so I suggest starting out on amateur so you actually figure out when to brake. I realize there's a line that tells you when to brake, but it's redundant on beginner. Thus, I think the break assist options should be full>medium>low>off.

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On 7/12/2020 at 4:47 PM, Fantazmagori said:

Hello. Cars with assist should be slower a little. It only Help at beggining to Learn but later playing without assist should be rewarded by faster times. 

No 

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Generally speaking, assists, expecially full braking, make you slower, anyways. In fact, I'm gonna completely reinstall my Xbox game after removing all save data because I want the chance to take my lumps with either no assists or just traction control from the beginning because NASCAR '99 didn't offer them and I wish I hadn't used the steering and breaking assists at all. Granted, the more recent NASCAR games might offer something of the sort, but I doubt them doing so because the Cup series only visits Sonoma and Watkins Glen, with other sanctioned series adding one series-dependant track.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/12/2020 at 5:47 PM, Fantazmagori said:

Hello. Cars with assist should be slower a little. It only Help at beggining to Learn but later playing without assist should be rewarded by faster times. 

I agree to a certain extent.

 

Fact is, at the moment assisted drivers (with medium TC and ABS on) are able to stay close to no assists drivers, whilst full assists are thoroughly slowed down. Especially in longer race distances (25% / 50% / 100%) and or in wet weather conditions, this becomes problematic, as the assisted driver will be able to have a similar pace as the non assisted driver. Whereas the non assisted driver has to be extremely cautious and delicate with their inputs to not spin or crash the car, assisted drivers are unaffected by that and have to put in almost no efforts to stay fast and consistent. A non assisted driver has to be robotic and at the verge of anxiety throughout the whole race, a assisted driver just uses the throttle and brake pedals as a on/off switch. 

 

As it stands right now, currently, putting assisted and non assisted drivers in the same lobby is nonsensical and unbalanced. Also, assisted drivers therefore do not have a incentive to try and learn no assists driving.

 

Imo, there are 2 viable solutions to fix that issue:

 

Solution 1. 

Give Multiplayer a proper filter system that helps us sort the lobbies more coherently (i.e. assisted lobbies / no assists etc.), so that people won't join the wrong ones and waste time. Also, give Time Trial Leaderboards a filter option too, to sort laptimes in multiple categories (car used or team, input device used as in wheel or pad, no assists or assisted etc.).

 

Solution 2.

Is a drastic change in how assists are being utilized.

 

Path A = Make assists significantly slower than no assists per lap, i.e.:

-Full TC 1,5 seconds slower

-Medium TC 0,75 seconds slower

-Braking Assist 1,5 seconds slower

-ABS 0,75 seconds slower

-Auto Gears 0,5 seconds slower

 

How?

 

TC cuts off power and has slower acceleration.

Braking Assist brakes around 30m before the optimal braking point consistently.

ABS lets the player get the right deceleration, when braking at around 15m before the optimal braking point.

Auto Gears always shifts up at around 11300rpm, and thus significantly reducing top speed and acceleration.

 

Path B = Add penalties for running assists, but let assists be just as fast as no assists, e.g.:

 

-TC, higher engine temperatures and thus faster engine degradation.

-Braking Assist and ABS, higher tyre temperatures and thus faster tyre degradation.

-Auto Gears, higher chance of random gearbox failures.

 

Whatever happens, Codemasters needs to rebalance the whole structure of how the game is being played, to ensure fairness and realism, as well as promote E-Sports and the competitive nature of the players to gradually become better drivers.

 

My personal favorite solution would be a combination of Solution 1 (filter options) & Solution 2 Path A (significantly slowed down assists):

Casuals, who do not care that much about competition anyways and usually only play career mode, would not be bothered that much about this change. They would still be able to enjoy the game regardless. But, on the other hand, highly skilled players, that run in mixed leagues and abuse assists only to gain a advantage in consistency, probably will not approve such a change for obvious reasons.

 

Solution 2 Path B (added penalties for the usage of assists), would also be quite interesting:

But, ultimately, it would be a too big of a change for the Casual audience, as then they would have to deal with higher tyre & engine temps / degradation and random gear box failures, which is not in the interest of anyone that does not want to have more simulation and only plays the game for a easy time.

 

TLDR:

Codemasters, please give us filter options for Multiplayer (assists, no assists) and Time Trial (assists, no assists, input device, team used etc.) and make assists slower by around 3 seconds (if full assists are being used).

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by TheEmpireWasRight
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1 hour ago, TheEmpireWasRight said:

I agree to a certain extent.

 

Fact is, at the moment assisted drivers (with medium TC and ABS on) are able to stay close to no assists drivers, whilst full assists are thoroughly slowed down. Especially in longer race distances (25% / 50% / 100%) and or in wet weather conditions, this becomes problematic, as the assisted driver will be able to have a similar pace as the non assisted driver. Whereas the non assisted driver has to be extremely cautious and delicate with their inputs to not spin or crash the car, assisted drivers are unaffected by that and have to put in almost no efforts to stay fast and consistent. A non assisted driver has to be robotic and at the verge of anxiety throughout the whole race, a assisted driver just uses the throttle and brake pedals as a on/off switch. 

 

As it stands right now, currently, putting assisted and non assisted drivers in the same lobby is nonsensical and unbalanced. Also, assisted drivers therefore do not have a incentive to try and learn no assists driving.

 

Imo, there are 2 viable solutions to fix that issue:

 

Solution 1. 

Give Multiplayer a proper filter system that helps us sort the lobbies more coherently (i.e. assisted lobbies / no assists etc.), so that people won't join the wrong ones and waste time. Also, give Time Trial Leaderboards a filter option too, to sort laptimes in multiple categories (car used or team, input device used as in wheel or pad, no assists or assisted etc.).

 

Solution 2.

Is a drastic change in how assists are being utilized.

 

Path A = Make assists significantly slower than no assists per lap, i.e.:

-Full TC 1,5 seconds slower

-Medium TC 0,75 seconds slower

-Braking Assist 1,5 seconds slower

-ABS 0,75 seconds slower

-Auto Gears 0,5 seconds slower

 

How?

 

TC cuts off power and has slower acceleration.

Braking Assist brakes around 30m before the optimal braking point consistently.

ABS lets the player get the right deceleration, when braking at around 15m before the optimal braking point.

Auto Gears always shifts up at around 11300rpm, and thus significantly reducing top speed and acceleration.

 

Path B = Add penalties for running assists, but let assists be just as fast as no assists, e.g.:

 

-TC, higher engine temperatures and thus faster engine degradation.

-Braking Assist and ABS, higher tyre temperatures and thus faster tyre degradation.

-Auto Gears, higher chance of random gearbox failures.

 

Whatever happens, Codemasters needs to rebalance the whole structure of how the game is being played, to ensure fairness and realism, as well as promote E-Sports and the competitive nature of the players to gradually become better drivers.

 

My personal favorite solution would be a combination of Solution 1 (filter options) & Solution 2 Path A (significantly slowed down assists):

Casuals, who do not care that much about competition anyways and usually only play career mode, would not be bothered that much about this change. They would still be able to enjoy the game regardless. But, on the other hand, highly skilled players, that run in mixed leagues and abuse assists only to gain a advantage in consistency, probably will not approve such a change for obvious reasons.

 

Solution 2 Path B (added penalties for the usage of assists), would also be quite interesting:

But, ultimately, it would be a too big of a change for the Casual audience, as then they would have to deal with higher tyre & engine temps / degradation and random gear box failures, which is not in the interest of anyone that does not want to have more simulation and only plays the game for a easy time.

 

TLDR:

Codemasters, please give us filter options for Multiplayer (assists, no assists) and Time Trial (assists, no assists, input device, team used etc.) and make assists slower by around 3 seconds (if full assists are being used).

 

 

 

 

 

Solution 3: Stop whining about it. If you're good enough on no assists you will beat assists users. If you don't, then you're just not quick enough. Also, not everyone WANTS to go no assists. I for example have no interest in going no TC, no abs and no line. I race for fun and no assists are not fun for me. Believe me, I tried multiple times on multiple F1 games and it just kills the fun for me in playing this game.

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My (insignificant) vote would be to keep the main game mechanics exactly as they are now but to add TT filters and lobby controls to ensure like vs like comparisons/races.

2 hours ago, TheEmpireWasRight said:

-Braking Assist 1,5 seconds slower

Just to pick one bit out of your huge posts I don't personally think any time penalty is necessary for braking assist since using it is enough of a hindrance on its own.

2 hours ago, TheEmpireWasRight said:

Casuals, who do not care that much about competition anyways and usually only play career mode, would not be bothered that much about this change. They would still be able to enjoy the game regardless.

I strongly disagree with this point. I'm certain people who don't play online would still very much care if their in-game times suddenly dropped mid-season, and so actually probably would many who do play online but who are also playing career/My team modes. Plenty who don't play online probably care about the TT leaderboards too.

The more I think about it the more I think it's too late for a significant change to the game mechanics, which is partly why I favour the filtering/lobby controls option.

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Posted (edited)

I'm using TT to get used to the F1 series, after which I'll probably stick to GP mode.

Edited by TurkeySloth2107

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