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AI Difficulty

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On 7/19/2020 at 7:23 PM, svensenk86 said:

Will do that mate,as soon as I finished one season i can post my values. But it will take a while,kids and real life just allow me one race weekend per day 😂

How, by the beard of Zeus, do you get one race weekend a day in when you have kids?  I have to get up at sparrow's fart to sneak in an hour before the daily carnage begins.  A race weekend on 100% will take me between 3-7 days depending on how much work the wife needs to do in the evenings.  

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I always leave the same difficulty for all circuits. But I realized that at Silverstone I don't pass anyone after the race started.

I think the difficulty should be the same everywhere. Can this be considered a bug?

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On 7/19/2020 at 12:35 PM, Simonodef said:

I'm driving a lot on Hungaroring in recent days as we have the real race there this weekend and I'm struggling as hell in the race. In qualifying I'm really quick, in the top cars I easly get pole position, in cars from the middle of the pecking order Q3 is not a problem (I just took P4 in Racing Point), but in the race they are just massively faster than me, whereas I really don't think that I make too many mistakes. 

That's my main struggle as well.. Some circuits I qualify on pole by +1s, but in the race can't manage to put it together.. A few laps will do, but as soon as the AI closes in, I'm directly lost.

Thereby I think I have decent experience with F1 games. Used to race time trial most of the time and able to set some decent times. In the race I feel the AI level of 50 (and in which I struggle) is not in comparison to my experience and time trail times.

Any tips involving these experiences in races?

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Posted (edited)

I had the same in Vietnam and it Was mainly caused by too lower rear wing. While in Quals you use drs every lap, its tightening doesnt make such a difference as in the race where I was loosing huge amount of time on this very long straight.

Edited by wojtekjoe

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12 hours ago, BlueSilhouette said:

That's my main struggle as well.. Some circuits I qualify on pole by +1s, but in the race can't manage to put it together.. A few laps will do, but as soon as the AI closes in, I'm directly lost.

Thereby I think I have decent experience with F1 games. Used to race time trial most of the time and able to set some decent times. In the race I feel the AI level of 50 (and in which I struggle) is not in comparison to my experience and time trail times.

Any tips involving these experiences in races?

I had this issue previously for a few races - seems to be tyre related. Be careful not to use a car setup that is used in time trial where you set the fastest lap possible as it may hurt overall race pace.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, wojtekjoe said:

I had the same in Vietnam and it Was mainly caused by too lower rear wing. While in Quals you use drs every lap, its tightening doesnt make such a difference as in the race where I was loosing huge amount of time on this very long straight.

I don't know, I ran a 3 front 7 rear wing for Vietnam in My Team and qualified 13th, maybe could have been a few places higher but wanted to keep an extra set of softs for the race. Anyway, finished the race in 6th with all clean overtakes. Actually finished 5th but had a 3sec penalty due to strict corner cutting rules so dropped a place to Albon.

Point being, more rear wing didn't hurt me in the race (100% distance) compared to quali.

Edited by JesseDeya

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51 minutes ago, Turtlemoose said:

I had this issue previously for a few races - seems to be tyre related. Be careful not to use a car setup that is used in time trial where you set the fastest lap possible as it may hurt overall race pace.

Seems as a logic explanation.

Which elements in the setup would you advice to adjust? So that quali pace will not suffer a lot, but the race pace will be more competitive.

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14 minutes ago, BlueSilhouette said:

Seems as a logic explanation.

Which elements in the setup would you advice to adjust? So that quali pace will not suffer a lot, but the race pace will be more competitive.

For me it seems the Front Camber under "Suspension" Geometry is the main one for me. Having it far over to the right gives the car great turn in but then can really effect the tyres. Same with either the front suspension and /or Front Anti-Roll bar - I tend to keep these at about "4".

Can compensate the understeer with the brake "bias" being set towards the middle.

 

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On 8/3/2020 at 11:05 PM, BlueSilhouette said:

That's my main struggle as well.. Some circuits I qualify on pole by +1s, but in the race can't manage to put it together.. A few laps will do, but as soon as the AI closes in, I'm directly lost.

Thereby I think I have decent experience with F1 games. Used to race time trial most of the time and able to set some decent times. In the race I feel the AI level of 50 (and in which I struggle) is not in comparison to my experience and time trail times.

Any tips involving these experiences in races?

For me the soulution was turning off carcass tire temperature, on Hungaroring I've been overheating front tires massively, in the third sector front left tire's temperature was up to 112℃ after few laps and I wasn't able to manage that. 

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How, by the beard of Zeus, do you get one race weekend a day in when you have kids?  I have to get up at sparrow's fart to sneak in an hour before the daily carnage begins.  A race weekend on 100% will take me between 3-7 days depending on how much work the wife needs to do in the evenings. 

:D good question, first of all I drive just 50% races. I am used to the tracks so I do not need that much practice sessions, just do 3-4 practice programs, qualifying ends normally in Q1 with my car actually ;) so you are right, could be that I need 2 days for a race weekend. but I see you know the struggles ;)

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I played 2 and a half season on my Team mode. I'm playing at 104%

In general, the AI is too strong on Quali compared to the race

I've found that the AI were really strong last sector on Australia, always losing 0.4s

At Bahrain, the AI are really good T9 and T10

At China the 2nd sector is mega from the AI

But in general, the AI is not too OP, just in Quali

 

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In general, the issue with the AI difficulties is usually more of an issue with our skill varying between tracks. I was competing for 20th spot in Vietnam... and 8th in China for instance 😛 

Forgot to add: There are definitely differences between the AI pace between tracks, it's just very tough to balance as we have differences depending on the track as well!

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3 hours ago, svensenk86 said:

😄 good question, first of all I drive just 50% races. I am used to the tracks so I do not need that much practice sessions, just do 3-4 practice programs, qualifying ends normally in Q1 with my car actually 😉 so you are right, could be that I need 2 days for a race weekend. but I see you know the struggles 😉

My wife recently discovered an Aussie show called The Block which she is now binge watching, she made me watch an episode to see if I can get into it.  I quite enjoyed it but saw an opportunity.  I told her it wasn't my thing and wasn't really keen to watch it.  She is now more than happy for me to head down to my little garden games room so she can watch a load of Aussies whingeing about "renos" and "drywall".  Being married with kids teaches you to think on your feet.  Now I must figure out why my hard tires feel like i'm on ice after about a dozen laps in Monte Carlo.  

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I've made a calculator to help with this issue (just a Google Spreadsheet). Here's my rough findings of 100 difficulty AI compared to the top legitimate leaderboard times (please use the calculator for accurate results, these are just a rough guide).

Track Speed Difficulty
Australia 103.6%  +4
Bahrain 102.1% -7
Vietnam 103.2%  +1
China 103.3%  +2
Netherlands 103.3%  +2
Spain 103.1% 0
Monaco 105.3%  +17
Azerbaijan 103.2%  +1
Canada 103.0% -0
France 103.0% -1
Austria 103.6%  +4
Britain 102.2% -7
Hungary 104.5%  +11
Belgium 102.4% -5
Italy 103.0% -1
Singapore 105.3%  +17
Russia 102.6% -3
Japan 102.8% -2
USA 102.9% -2
Mexico 103.8%  +5
Brazil 103.1% -0
Abu Dhabi 103.5%  +4

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On 8/4/2020 at 3:33 AM, Ronei2020 said:

I always leave the same difficulty for all circuits. But I realized that at Silverstone I don't pass anyone after the race started.

I think the difficulty should be the same everywhere. Can this be considered a bug?

I think Silverstone is the best ai circuit after watching youtubers. I am yet to race or drive that track in this game, but I think we are up for it at that race. It’s going to be a challenge driving flat out laps at Silverstone consistently... I also race with the same difficulty on every track, 105%. 
 

11 minutes ago, NinjaElmo said:

I've made a calculator to help with this issue (just a Google Spreadsheet). Here's my rough findings of 100 difficulty AI compared to the top legitimate leaderboard times (please use the calculator for accurate results, these are just a rough guide).

Track Speed Difficulty
Australia 103.6%  +4
Bahrain 102.1% -7
Vietnam 103.2%  +1
China 103.3%  +2
Netherlands 103.3%  +2
Spain 103.1% 0
Monaco 105.3%  +17
Azerbaijan 103.2%  +1
Canada 103.0% -0
France 103.0% -1
Austria 103.6%  +4
Britain 102.2% -7
Hungary 104.5%  +11
Belgium 102.4% -5
Italy 103.0% -1
Singapore 105.3%  +17
Russia 102.6% -3
Japan 102.8% -2
USA 102.9% -2
Mexico 103.8%  +5
Brazil 103.1% -0
Abu Dhabi 103.5%  +4


I think it depends on track and the player. I struggled to keep up with the ai on Spain, but on Baku, I was absolutely flying. On Spain, when I raced as Bottas, I was on average 0.1-0.3 slower than Hamilton, whilst at Baku on the same difficulty, I was 0.3-1.0 faster than Hamilton at times, and this was when we were running the exact same tyres and in clean air with the exact same tyre life. This is all at 105% ai.

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10 minutes ago, Krisperfectline said:

I think it depends on track and the player. I struggled to keep up with the ai on Spain, but on Baku, I was absolutely flying. On Spain, when I raced as Bottas, I was on average 0.1-0.3 slower than Hamilton, whilst at Baku on the same difficulty, I was 0.3-1.0 faster than Hamilton at times, and this was when we were running the exact same tyres and in clean air with the exact same tyre life. This is all at 105% ai.

Oh yeah definitely. The player is in most cases the largest factor in any percieved changes in difficulty. That's why I tried taking that individual player error out in my calculator, but ideally everyone could adapt their difficulty per track based on how confident they are. My data tells me to up the difficulty for Monaco, but oh boy do I suck at Monaco and am by no means going to make it any harder for myself by upping the difficulty. There are a few tracks that people consistently seem to have issues with though (Singapore AI too slow, Silverstone AI too fast), and that does show up in the results.

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29 minutes ago, NinjaElmo said:

I've made a calculator to help with this issue (just a Google Spreadsheet). Here's my rough findings of 100 difficulty AI compared to the top legitimate leaderboard times (please use the calculator for accurate results, these are just a rough guide).

Track Speed Difficulty
Australia 103.6%  +4
Bahrain 102.1% -7
Vietnam 103.2%  +1
China 103.3%  +2
Netherlands 103.3%  +2
Spain 103.1% 0
Monaco 105.3%  +17
Azerbaijan 103.2%  +1
Canada 103.0% -0
France 103.0% -1
Austria 103.6%  +4
Britain 102.2% -7
Hungary 104.5%  +11
Belgium 102.4% -5
Italy 103.0% -1
Singapore 105.3%  +17
Russia 102.6% -3
Japan 102.8% -2
USA 102.9% -2
Mexico 103.8%  +5
Brazil 103.1% -0
Abu Dhabi 103.5%  +4

Thanks, I was considering on doing something similar a few days ago for 110 AI, though with a bit of a different approach. I thought I'd see where the 110 AI time would be placed on the leaderboards on a given track, taking into account the amount of players who had set a time in TT.

Can you open up the numbers a bit though? I'm assuming "Speed" means 100 AI's quali laptime compared to the world record? Difficulty is a bit confusing at least reflecting to personal experience. I found Bahrain and Baku very easy, but definitely agree on Monaco, Britain and Hungary. Not yet gotten around to Singapore.

 

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3 hours ago, janbonator said:

Thanks, I was considering on doing something similar a few days ago for 110 AI, though with a bit of a different approach. I thought I'd see where the 110 AI time would be placed on the leaderboards on a given track, taking into account the amount of players who had set a time in TT.

Can you open up the numbers a bit though? I'm assuming "Speed" means 100 AI's quali laptime compared to the world record? Difficulty is a bit confusing at least reflecting to personal experience. I found Bahrain and Baku very easy, but definitely agree on Monaco, Britain and Hungary. Not yet gotten around to Singapore.

 

This table is pretty rough, make sure you try the spreadsheet if you want to try the results properly. You're correct on the speed column, I used the world record time that didn't use assists and didn't look suspicious (so wasn't a full second faster than the next best, this could have introduced some errors, but usually it was the same players getting those times). The difficulty column compares those AI speeds to Spain as the base, and 'tries to' recommend the difficulty on the assumption that an increase in difficulty by 1 improves AI lap times by ~0.1 (lap length taken into account, difficulty change over 105 has double impact). 

I was surpised with Bahrain too. I've only really raced there on My Team though, and since it is so early in the season I might put a 'poor' result down to my own performance rather than blaming the AI. If you want, you can leave some feedback on my survey linked on the calculator, and if enough people find the same results, I can add some track weights to the calculations.

Oh and just a heads up for if you do your own testing, sometimes Hamilton ***** it and someone like Vettel will get pole. Make sure you ignore those results.

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@NinjaElmo I'll keep an eye on that sheet of yours. Just answered your survey too. Great work.

I've logged all my data so far too, v.g. Bahrain a track I felt quite easy to compete on:

image.png.870b8912f55a83608bf7fbafddbfac47.png

 I think it would be nice if we could move this discussion to its own thread. Your post and a couple others before go beyond the "it's so hard c'mon plz fix ferrari 2fast4u".

 

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It could have just been a off day for me but I was doing the practice programs at Hungray at 90 AI difficultly and no matter how many times I tried or put in a good lap I couldn’t beat the pace deltas. I race from 85-90 and I usually easily beat the programs, but Hungray was super hard.

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