Are all assists off in Esports?

[Sir_Overtakesalot 199]

10 minutes ago, Krisperfectline said:

They should enforce the rules to only cockpit cam to make it realistic. I use cockpit cam, unadjusted, and I can race on 105% ai on 50% races, and on a pad with no assists. I believe that if people can drive using cockpit cam, then the esports drivers should have no problem adapting to it. 

Not a fan of freedom of choice huh. 

[SIMRACER123 355]

6 minutes ago, Mike5500 said:

Not a fan of freedom of choice huh. 

No but you would expect if a esports motorsport series wants to look credible in the long term it will consider going down the route of cockpit only.

After all, the best of the best will have no problem adjusting and they would all be racing the same view.

Seeing a F1 esports event with people driving sat on top of the engine looks very arcade like and im not convinced shows the capabilities of the drivers in the best light.

[Krisperfectline 63]

4 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

I don't think anybody is disputing that it's easier to drive using T-cam.

I prefer cockpit camera, and in F1 2020, I do not have it adjusted. Pad user as well and no assists. It allows me to be a lot more accurate in braking and apex speed. On codemasters games, driving on T-Cam does not give me a good feel for the car. Maybe I definitely need to get closer to the real life feeling to extract the maximum out of my driving. I started playing F1 2015 on T-Cam, and after a few weeks, I felt the need to use cockpit camera, and immediately, I was able to drive faster and more consistent, particularly in preserving tyres. 

 

 

4 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

Using a pad and arguing for realism? 🙂

FWIW why I'm not convinced eSports 'should' use cockpit cam as I'm not convinced the lack of depth perception  doesn't make it unrealistically difficult.

If I have money to invest in a decent wheel and pedals, I’ll do it, and I might even decide to try for esports. I have been always wanting to get a wheel to get close as possible to realistic conditions. The fact that esports drivers compete to be the best leads to them in using the best available settings. I mean if the rules allow it, then you will do it right? Maybe they are convinced that some people believe cockpit camera is better than t-cam and vice versa? I prefer cockpit camera when I am playing. F1 drivers do not have a choice in the view that they select when driving on track...

[USPBauer24 82]

2 hours ago, Krisperfectline said:

I prefer cockpit camera, and in F1 2020, I do not have it adjusted. Pad user as well and no assists. It allows me to be a lot more accurate in braking and apex speed. On codemasters games, driving on T-Cam does not give me a good feel for the car. Maybe I definitely need to get closer to the real life feeling to extract the maximum out of my driving. I started playing F1 2015 on T-Cam, and after a few weeks, I felt the need to use cockpit camera, and immediately, I was able to drive faster and more consistent, particularly in preserving tyres. 

I agree. I can't explain it but I can feel more grip in cockpit cam - I can feel the balance of the car more and feel when I can accelerate. 

I have used cockpit view with no assists now for five years and if a normal guy like me can do it, then esports drivers should as well. 

I feel that T cam is used because it gives the advantage of a better view - you can see the apex for the whole corner - in cockpit, you have to know where the apex is because you lose sight of it once you have turned in. You end up relying on your instincts more and on the feel of the track and the kerb.

If T cam wasn't an advantage, then all real motorsport drivers would be sitting on top of their car and not in it. 

[SIMRACER123 355]

😁

[MikeV27 19]

I prefer cockpit just for the immersion, although I did adjust the vertical height a bit. The virtual rear mirror has made it much easier too. I placed mine right on the halo so it blends in nicely.

I can agree t-cam (and hood cam in other racing games) is sort of an assist as well. It’s usually the go-to for a reason.

Edited July 25 by MikeV27

[amazingblaze 112]

"we used to DREAM of living in a corridor" 

[Ultra3142 384]

41 minutes ago, MikeV27 said:

I prefer cockpit just for the immersion, although I did adjust the vertical height a bit. The virtual rear mirror has made it much easier too. I placed mine right on the halo so it blends in nicely.

I can agree t-cam (and hood cam in other racing games) is sort of an assist as well. It’s usually the go-to for a reason.

I'd view the rear view mirror as a pretty serious assist that real F1 cars don't have 🙂. 

[Lurtz 86]

Sorry - you don't think that real F1 cars have mirrors??? 

[MikeV27 19]

46 minutes ago, Ultra3142 said:

I'd view the rear view mirror as a pretty serious assist that real F1 cars don't have 🙂. 

I know what you mean, it’s a slippery slope when arguing something like this. But real F1 drivers are able to turn their heads and look, I cannot. So I say that’s a fair compromise.

Edited July 26 by MikeV27

[Sir_Overtakesalot 199]

@Lurtz he said rear view mirror, not mirrors

 

 

Edited July 26 by Mike5500

[marioho 686]

The virtual rear view mirror is available in T-Cam too.

[Sir_Overtakesalot 199]

39 minutes ago, marioho said:

The virtual rear view mirror is available in T-Cam too.

I Didn't know that. Thanks for letting me know. I'll have to try it out now lol

Edited July 26 by Mike5500

[BelgiumDude 461]

3 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

I'd view the rear view mirror as a pretty serious assist that real F1 cars don't have 🙂. 

I'd say the real drivers had an advantage over us as they have usable mirrors. Rearview mirror is not an assist. It's a mirror. It's mandatory to have usable mirrors on car. Read the rules of F1. Codemasters have been endangering our lives for years by supplying us with cars without usable mirrors. The cars were actually illegal. Luckily no one died.

Rearview mirror is not an assist, it's a safety measure. 

[Sir_Overtakesalot 199]

6 minutes ago, BelgiumDude said:

Rearview mirror is not an assist, it's a safety measure. 

So is sitting on the top of my digital race car. That way if an accident is imminent.. I can easily run away from the chaos lol. No unbuckling of belts required

[marioho 686]

I think @Ultra3142 point was that the virtual rear view mirror is quite the aid that real drivers don't have. Indeed they don't. The feature is there because in the game we have way less of a capability to read the track. Reduced field of view, washed down feedback from the tarmac, and so on. It is necessary to cross that bridge between reality and simulation.

His point is solid, in my opinion. Cockpit view is nice and all but to praise it as the one and only way to play for those seeking realism is disingenuous as unless you play in VR or have a setup that allows you a broader view of what's going on plus decent feedback from the wheel, realism is out of the window.

[alnchn 11]

no, players never experience the g-force that real drivers experience

[BelgiumDude 461]

What about wearing just socks? Is it an assist? I see many esporters just use sock. Real drivers wear shoes. I'm not saying that those who just wear socks are cheating but they seem to have an advantage 

[USPBauer24 82]

This thread is hilarious.

[Falstojudilofa 115]

I like cockpit when doing hotlaps, but vs AI and online, I always misjudge where others are. So, I usually just go back to T-cam for the sake of being able to see if someone is 30cm away or 2 meters.

[Ultra3142 384]

I think most understood but I was indeed referring to the new virtual rear-view mirror as an obvious and significant assist. (I quoted a post referring to this new feature and the ability to choose where to position it.)

I'm still not convinced that cockpit cam doesn't make things unrealistically difficult though, and nobody has actually responded to this point. Real drivers are looking at 3D objects with two eyes, such that each eye gets a different view. This gives a sense of depth perception not possible in the game, and also actually allows them to look 'through' the central Halo pillar to a degree*. This is why I don't think it's obvious that eSports should enforce the use of cockpit cam as opposed to T-cam even though the latter unquestionably makes driving easier. I do understand that those who choose to race using cockpit cam would like to see eSports drivers doing the same though, and I suspect I'd probably feel the same if I did.

Does anyone recall if any of the real F1 drivers tried out cockpit cam and shared their on thoughts on this subject? It would be interesting if they did.

 

* Hold your hand out straight in front of your at arms length, and rotated so you're looking sideways on (palm facing left say). If you close one eye at a time you'll find there is nothing you can't see with at least one eye, since each has a different part of the field of view obscured. When looking normally with both eyes this enables you to essentially see 'through' your hand. As such I think that switching the Halo pillar to transparent in the game is actually less obviously unrealistic than it may first appear.

Edited July 26 by Ultra3142

[GreaseManelli 0]

T-cam users = subhumans

[Ultra3142 384]

2 minutes ago, GreaseManelli said:

T-cam users = subhumans

Maybe lets not insult the majority of the game's players? Just a thought. 

[Shorti62 5]

I heard the same, that T-cam could be faster than cockpit. But to be honest, I tried driving with t-cam, and it didn't go well for me.. I personally am faster and more consistent with cockpit cam. Gave a chance to t-cam twice, for full 90 minutes practice, and I just cant get used to it, feels unnatural to me. So I'll just stick to cockpit. Especially now with rear mirror, it's just great.