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Learning Curve

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Posted (edited)

As you know, this is my first F1 game coming from NASCAR games. Thus, I had a learning curve from those games to this one, which I'm pretty comfortable in saying I'm on the back half of. However, I've encountered a learning curve from last year's F2 cars and the classic F1 cars to this year's F1 cars in that the setups I used successfully on those cars don't seem to work as well on the F1 cars. For example, I'm able to reel off consecutive clean laps on Australia with the setup below (defaults not pictured) in a classic F1 or F2 car but have only had one or two cleans in several attempts with a current F1 car. Granted, I should've expected something like this. How was your learning curve for your first open-wheel racing game?

D-force 01
Aero: 7-8
Suspension: 3-2
Anti-roll: 5-4
Ride: 4-6
Tyres: 22.2 psi-20.3 psi

Edited by TurkeySloth2107

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Posted (edited)

With Australia it's often simply knowing when to attack and when to lift off that can make a difference in laps. There's some full throttle turns but they won't always be, sometimes you'll have to back off as your entry wasn't at the right angle. Certainly turn 5 under the trees is one, if your entry isn't on point you're spinning on the kerb and the wall is right there for you, 11/12 as well where on a perfect entry you can go full throttle, if the first part isn't right but you don't back out, you're heading to the gravel on the far side. 

It's really just experience, I would suggest lifting more on this track, specifically those corners, so you can begin to see the lines more clearly, the more you do it the quicker you'll see it and recognise in a split second if you can floor it or you need to ease it through this lap and try again the next. 

And remembering that while it has a great flow to it, AUS is still a street circuit, and needs to be respected as such. 

Edited by KNT2011

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Posted (edited)

If you're learning my inclination would have been to ignore F2 and classic cars actually. The classic cars in particular are harder to drive. I've not tried F2 cars.

Edited by Ultra3142

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7 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

If you're learning my inclination would have been to ignore F2 and classic cars actually. The classic cars in particular are harder to drive. I've not tried F2 cars.

If the F2 cars drive anything like last year they are garbage to drive. The F1 cars are much easier.

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F1 2019 was my first game in the series and my first racing game in a long, long time. Can't talk about F2 cars as I only did the F1 2019 Career mode scenarios you're prompted to do with them. Classic cars I generally don't like except for the newer ones, but even them I find myself liking more their sound and looks than the actual driving. 

I play on a pad and it was quite a ride starting at AI level 19 with all assists under the moon active and now on AI 100 with everything off barring ABS. I got onto setups quite early though and in my experience they play an enormous role on your car handling specially when you start to iron your input mistakes out of the equation.

Speaking of setups, I'm not a fan of that particular one and seems to me most people aren't too. At least looking at the average setup from somewhat experienced users you find on sites like f1carsetup.

I usually grap the setups posted by people with some good activity on those forums plus a few I find online that seem reasonable enough and throw them on an Excel sheet. From that sample I get the median average and the mode average for each setting. Mode is interesting as it gives you the most common value in that sample, not your mean average.

For Australia in particular, my own setup, Mode and Average from said sample:

image.png.104308e022473c9aba42e9420ba00a0a.png  

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16 hours ago, TurkeySloth2107 said:

How was your learning curve for your first open-wheel racing game?

This was my first:

Formula 1 97 - Wikipedia

 

I'd pretty much only do Monaco because it had walls I could bounce off of 😄 

I didn't start learning how to "get good" until Gran Turismo the year after and the License Tests.

 

Modern racing games are much easier to get into because not only do many of them have decent assists and tutorials, but because YouTube exists.

Don't know something? Put "F1 2020 how to _____" into the search bar and you're sorted.

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37 minutes ago, PJTierney said:

This was my first:

Formula 1 97 - Wikipedia

 

I'd pretty much only do Monaco because it had walls I could bounce off of 😄 

I didn't start learning how to "get good" until Gran Turismo the year after and the License Tests.

 

Modern racing games are much easier to get into because not only do many of them have decent assists and tutorials, but because YouTube exists.

Don't know something? Put "F1 2020 how to _____" into the search bar and you're sorted.

Boys got lucky in those days. Imagine they had to bring to life not just Monaco on 97 tech, but Baku, Singapore and Hanoi :classic_laugh:

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Interestingly, I'm starting to find learning in the rain easier than in the dry. This could be because, as stated earlier, the NASCAR game I have the clearest memories of was mostly ovals, which are flat out during straights (up to 322 kph) and breaking during the turns. Thus, my driving style is rather aggressive. For example, I just ran several laps at Silverstone, of which my first full one was clean after aborting two or three times for overrunning Club's first turn on the flying portion or Abbey on the actual lap. However, I think it took me several complete laps to get a clean go in the dry.

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12 minutes ago, TurkeySloth2107 said:

Interestingly, I'm starting to find learning in the rain easier than in the dry. This could be because, as stated earlier, the NASCAR game I have the clearest memories of was mostly ovals, which are flat out during straights (up to 322 kph) and breaking during the turns. Thus, my driving style is rather aggressive. For example, I just ran several laps at Silverstone, of which my first full one was clean after aborting two or three times for overrunning Club's first turn on the flying portion or Abbey on the actual lap. However, I think it took me several complete laps to get a clean go in the dry.

I wonder what you make of the Hungaroring? This track has a flow during races I find that is the closest F1 has to a NASCAR short track feel like Bristol or Martinsville. 

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Posted (edited)
On 8/3/2020 at 11:51 AM, PJTierney said:

This was my first:

Formula 1 97 - Wikipedia

 

I'd pretty much only do Monaco because it had walls I could bounce off of 😄 

I didn't start learning how to "get good" until Gran Turismo the year after and the License Tests.

 

Modern racing games are much easier to get into because not only do many of them have decent assists and tutorials, but because YouTube exists.

Don't know something? Put "F1 2020 how to _____" into the search bar and you're sorted.

 

5158DDSD4AL._AC_.jpg

This one was my first.

A cult classic with one hell of a learning curve. Especially with a keyboard 🤣.

Edited by Nas00
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38 minutes ago, Nas00 said:

 

5158DDSD4AL._AC_.jpg

This one was my first.

A cult classic with one hell of a learning curve. Especially with a keyboard 🤣.

this was mine... i think i still have the manual somewhere. The technical explanations of what each setting did is still better than most explanations today

GRAND PRIX 2 Pc Cd Rom Original GEOFF CRAMMONDS GP2 GP BIG BOX ...

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1 hour ago, KNT2011 said:

I wonder what you make of the Hungaroring? This track has a flow during races I find that is the closest F1 has to a NASCAR short track feel like Bristol or Martinsville. 

One of my favorite tracks ever. So relentless and merciless. Very sweaty business with strong FFB settings. Not uncommon to have to deploy ice bags after 50% or 100% races.

I've never really gotten into Nascar, but Hungaroring is the last thing that comes to my mind when I think about North-American racing such as Nascar or Indycar. I suppose Bristol or Martinsville are not ovals then?

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Bristol and Martinsville are 0.5 mile long oval short tracks, both are very demanding, one of them (Bristol) has very high banking and extremely fast, the other (Martinsville) is flat. There is no "resting periods"  during racing on the track, you constantly have to be on alert due to the cars are extremely close to each other at high speeds and a single mistake can result in a multiple car crash. Both races are 500 laps long.

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As a general tip I would tell you to concentrate more on consistency than speed when learning any new racing game or even starting out on a new track.

Missing the apex at a specific corner? Brake 10m earlier, and go on until you can consistently do clean laps. And do yourself a favour and use only TT until you are really confident with understanding what is happening. Proper racing games have many nuances that can overwhelm you when learning. In F1 games many have to do with overheating tyres and tyre wear which I would recommend taking out of the equation when starting out.

And use the default setup for now, keeping in mind that each track has some peculiarities when it comes to how cars behave (low grip surfaces, bumpiness, off camber corners) which might confuse you even further. I would say stick to Monza with a default setup and go around the track until you can consistently (5+ laps) hit more or less the same sector times. Overdriving the car is a very common issue in F1 games, due to high downforce masking out driver mistakes much more than in a GT car.

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13 minutes ago, ragequit1 said:

Bristol and Martinsville are 0.5 mile long oval short tracks, both are very demanding, one of them (Bristol) has very high banking and extremely fast, the other (Martinsville) is flat. There is no "resting periods"  during racing on the track, you constantly have to be on alert due to the cars are extremely close to each other at high speeds and a single mistake can result in a multiple car crash. Both races are 500 laps long.

500 laps sounds so long, haha. Sounds like a good time though - just a different kind of stress. The nature of Hungaroring doesn't really change if you are alone on the track or with other cars. It's just a constant flow of (hopefully) apex-to-apex driving. It's probably more fun to drive alone, for me at least. With ovals it must be the opposite.

 

3 minutes ago, nuNceP said:

And use the default setup for now, keeping in mind that each track has some peculiarities when it comes to how cars behave (low grip surfaces, bumpiness, off camber corners) which might confuse you even further. I would say stick to Monza with a default setup and go around the track until you can consistently (5+ laps) hit more or less the same sector times. Overdriving the car is a very common issue in F1 games, due to high downforce masking out driver mistakes much more than in a GT car.

Solid advice overall but I just wanted to touch this part. The default setup is horrible. A much better choice would be the 4th preset called "more top speed" or something like that. It works much better on almost any track than the default setup.

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For somebody starting out I'd say the Default Preset is fine. It's more important to get the driving habits down right before fiddling with setups.

The Increased Top Speed preset is great though, in my last My Team race I was as second faster round Silverstone with it.

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8 minutes ago, ragequit1 said:

Bristol and Martinsville are 0.5 mile long oval short tracks, both are very demanding, one of them (Bristol) has very high banking and extremely fast, the other (Martinsville) is flat. There is no "resting periods"  during racing on the track, you constantly have to be on alert due to the cars are extremely close to each other at high speeds and a single mistake can result in a multiple car crash. Both races are 500 laps long.

Correct. Aside from most NASCAR tracks being ovals, I drifted away from it because most of the races have competely arbitrary and variable mile-based lengths that range from 300-600, as opposed to F1's standardized 305 km (rounded up) distance. Mind you, I think one of the road courses held a race measured in km prior to this year.

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Posted (edited)
48 minutes ago, janbonator said:

One of my favorite tracks ever. So relentless and merciless. Very sweaty business with strong FFB settings. Not uncommon to have to deploy ice bags after 50% or 100% races.

I've never really gotten into Nascar, but Hungaroring is the last thing that comes to my mind when I think about North-American racing such as Nascar or Indycar. I suppose Bristol or Martinsville are not ovals then?

It's not really the track shape that brings that same feeling, but when you're in the midst of a Hungarian GP, the short acceleration into long corner into short acceleration into long corner routine really puts me in the same rhythm as those NASCAR short tracks. Hungary having one or two overtaking spots as well means you can find yourself in a 'pack' to some extent at times. 

I was just wondering if a NASCAR racer felt any familiar muscle memory kicking in when racing in Hungary! 

Edited by KNT2011

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Nascar is grueling. Indycar on ovals is insane. F1 should do at least one oval, that would be a lot of fun.

 I think Monaco reminds me of the door to door, bumper to bumper action of Bristol or Martinsville. But even then there is still more room to breathe in F1.  I don't think a good road course can ever replicate a short oval, it's literally like being in a traffic jam at 100-130mph.

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6 hours ago, losbuttcheeks said:

Nascar is grueling. Indycar on ovals is insane. F1 should do at least one oval, that would be a lot of fun.

 I think Monaco reminds me of the door to door, bumper to bumper action of Bristol or Martinsville. But even then there is still more room to breathe in F1.  I don't think a good road course can ever replicate a short oval, it's literally like being in a traffic jam at 100-130mph.

To be honest I don't really see why F1 should race on an oval. What can an F1 car bring to oval racing that Indycars can't?. The cars are not designed to race ovals, most of the drivers have never raced on them and the tires would explode in a few laps.

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6 hours ago, losbuttcheeks said:

It's literally like being in a traffic jam at 100-130mph

Something that personally I don't see the appeal of watching and I would be pretty horrified if F1 included such a race.

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2 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

Something that personally I don't see the appeal of watching and I would be pretty horrified if F1 included such a race.

While I think a track like Martinsville really lacks a lot of appeal and is certainly one for the short course hardcore, a race at Bristol is an absolute blast given the huge banking, total lack of track space, and "it's just a flesh wound!" mentality as crews send their battered cars out with tape to replace their entire front assembly. It's a race I think should be experienced at least once by any fan of motorsports. 

And you can't argue with the sheer scale of the setting

Bristol-Motor-Speedway-Night-Race.thumb.jpg.dcf80a8929060b8ce43ca14dc4614180.jpg

 

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Different forms of racing have their own character and appeal. It's not that I'd have no interest in going to experience an event like in the photo (I would :classic_smile:) but this is different to not wanting to watch F1 cars reduced to just driving around in circles. A great deal of work has gone into making them capable of rather more :classic_smile:.

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Posted (edited)

Haha just the other day I was listening to a interview with former F1 driver Eddie Cheever and he went on a bit about the differences between it and Indy. Different sports that require different set of skills from the drivers to deal with different demands, as well as different features in the cars to deal with different circumstances. 

It is one thing to deal with a canted oval track surrounded by a uninviting concrete wall while driving under 2-3G forces on you. Another whole different package to speed through a 12-16 turns track with varying width and angles while feeling spikes of over 5G forces on your neck. What use is trail braking on an oval?

And I'm not downplaying how cool or skill-demanding indy is. That's all to say they're very, very different. Cheever talks about it, a bunch of F1 drivers try to give indy a go after retiring from the former aiming for that tempting Triple Crown or to just keep on racing and they just back off after a while. It is simply not the same. The tension of having that solid barrier on your side with no run off is what he heavily emphasized as being a no-joke.   

Not to talk about that as-old-as-the-grave debate of "what is faster, indy or F1". Broadly speaking, full throttle speed over a given distance? A F1 car will fall behind a Indy one as it just cannot maintain that top speed indefinitely. ERS will run out of juice. Sprinkle a few corners on the path though and that's a bye bye indy as F1 cars are designed to swallow and slingshot out of corners like hot knife on butter.

Indy and F1 are not interchangeable. 

Edit: Oh FFS there comes @Ultra3142 undercutting me again! At this point I may as well just propose a joint venture with you.

Edited by marioho
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13 minutes ago, Ultra3142 said:

Different forms of racing have their own character and appeal. It's not that I'd have no interest in going to experience an event like in the photo (I would :classic_smile:) but this is different to not wanting to watch F1 cars reduced to just driving around in circles. A great deal of work has gone into making them capable of rather more :classic_smile:.

Oh for sure, though the sadistic part of me that watched Montoya drive into a track dryer at the Daytona 500 (I like JP! Just what a moment..) would find some enjoyment in seeing Hamilton, Vettel et al handle a raging oval :classic_laugh:

(yes I also saw Lewis drive Tony Stewarts NASCAR back in the day but I mean in a busy competitive race!)

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