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Is My Team too easy?

Is the My Team mode too easy?  

98 members have voted

  1. 1. Is the My Team mode too easy? Do you progress from back marker to front runner too quickly?

    • Yes, I moved too quickly from a back-marker to race winner.
    • No, I'm still a back-marker/midfield runner well into my second season or further.
    • Neither, I was expecting the progression to take less than 1.5 to 2 seasons.


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Posted (edited)

Hi all, looking to start a discussion and get your opinions and thought… The question : Is My Team mode too easy? It’s a simple question although I’m sure the answers will be anything but simple..

 

Before we get going though, this is not relating to the AI difficultly level while racing. I race with the difficulty set high, but my results are relative to my car and teammate, so I’m expecting similar experiences for people racing on 70 difficulty, for example..

 

I think the mode IS too easy, and I’ll give my thoughts..

 

In S1, I started with a Merc Engine, Jordan King as my 2nd Driver (as I know him personally, as he was a test driver for my team previously IRL). I selected Loop as the title sponsor - with the goal of 5 points finishes. Ambitious, yet achievable? During the relevant interviews, I played up the team in all situations (to increase team acclaim) and sponsors where possible (to get cash injections). My other key tactics were focusing on activities that would boost the team acclaim and generate R&D points (especially in early game). Latterly my acclaim has become more important. Cash was initially spent on boosting R&D point income from each dept, the durability one is an efficient one to work with initially.. Focusing on boosting experience stat of the second also brings in more R&D points I think? I kind of completely ignored activates that improved their pace - as my long term goal was to sign a top driver. Similarly I ignored team morale activities and generally they just stayed as “good” morale. Picking the right sponsors is also good, you want to be able to achieve the bonus goal EVERY week - pick the best paying one you can realistically accomplish each week. In later seasons, the ones where you OR your team mate has to win/get podium is a good shout - as even if you have a bad race, they can bring home to money! Finally, in practice, I always went for purple in the practice programs, for the extra resource points, however minor the gains become there..

 

S1 started with expected results, generally outside the points or very low points paying positions, where strategy allowed. The obvious exception being Monaco where a well timed safety car came to my rescue - this felt somewhat realistic and I revelled in our good result. As the season went on I joined the midfield, sometimes I was in the middle of them (in the performance charts), sometimes I was still at the bottom, but because it was so close that still often yielded somewhat decent points paying positions. Changeable conditions in Q in Mexico allowed my to get the Inters on at the right time and achieve a freak pole position, while everyone was still on Extreme Wets. A wet race meant I gambled on a 0 Stop strategy and it mostly payed off. I lost P1 but still got the teams first podium. At the end of the season, two depts had reg changes and although I managed to adapt all parts, upgrades were few and far between in the second half of the year.

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Moving into S2, we started near the bottom of the performance charts again despite our focus on carrying over upgrades. However, we’re able to generate so many resource points that by race 8 or so, we were at the top of midfield and a well set up car playing to our/track strengths meant we could compete for podiums. In the mid season I switched out my second driver for Carlos Sainz and spend the remainder of my money maxing out all my driver perks. The reduced engine wear perk was beneficial as we haven’t focused much on the durability side and our R&D point generation is boosted.

By race 13/14 we were equal with Merc and trading P1 with them. No reg changes at the end of the year made the start of S3 easy! Cash flow was high, we resigned Carlos, Level 3’d most depts meaning upgrades rarely fail, they come in quick and we generate a lot of weekly resource points.

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I switched up the format for S3 to keep the game feeling fresh. A compressed 10 race calendar and one shot Q - just to spice things up a little. I also hit level 20 team acclaim during the off season. So have my 4th sponsor. Also, now we are generating so many resource points that we’ve pulled well clear of Merc. I don’t know where this is going to be honest either. I can’t see our rate of development slowing down before the end of the year or we’ve maxed the car - whichever comes first.

 

Personally I feel the rate of development was too quick and there’s no sign of it slowing down. I also do not have the difficulty too low for my ability - I’ve been on a par with my team mate (especially since signing Sainz) and if I mess up and don’t get the good result, he is sure too!

What’s everyone else’s experiences? I wanted more of a slow burn. S1 felt good but since then it’s ramped up too quickly and it’s kind of ruined the realism and immersion to be honest. I’m not interesting in running a maxed out car, I want realism. I’m debating doing another My Team career, just so I have something work towards again, but I'm also looking forward to doing another F2 career, when 2020 is updated in the game. Failing that, I might have to fall back to other racing games as I’m really not sure where to go after S3 - I just don’t see the AI catching up.

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Does the game need a difficulty setting for the non racing parts of the game too? Where DNFs can be more costly, where money and R&D points are harder to come by etc..?

Edited by joetoml1n
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Realisticly yes. Going in with a new private team without a lot of money in the bag it's gonna be near impossible to get to the top at all. It took Red Bull 5 years with all that money they had behind the team.

But, this is a game. I doubt any player would want to drive 4-5 seasons before even winning a race. Most will lose interest. Being able to win the odd race in the second season and then challenge for WC in the third seems reasonable to me.

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Posted (edited)

@Lakrits 

Understood, and I agree that some would lose interest - which is why I think there should be a difficulty setting for this too. Personally, I would want a longer game and this game COULD last me until F1 2021 but only if I had to really work for the accomplishments. If I had to invest multiple in game seasons to become WDC/WCC then I would and it could keep me going until 2021. But at the mid point in S2 with the best car and throughout S3 it looks like I'll have no challenge at all, I'm kind of done with it. I'll finish this seasons to hopefully win both titles but I want to be able to fight with the other teams. I don't want to be a significant chunk ahead of the rest of the pack for the next 7 seasons - but I can't see any alternative (other than just not upgrading my car, but that's artificial and also then what's the point in 3/4 of the game mechanics).

Edited by joetoml1n

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I don't know how you drive but I drive 100% races with full practise and qualify. This way I've only managed to get through half of the first season so far. That way it will take longer to get to the point where it goes boring and I do enjoy full races since it makes things more real for me.

 

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@Lakrits

I do 50% races. Until this season (S3) I had full Q (now I'm on one-shot, just for the change more than anything, to keep it feeling interesting) and of course you can't change the P length, it's set by the race distance I believe (another of my annoyances). However, the need to run anymore than 9/10 laps in P isn't there.. I personally don't need the practice, the car requires only minor tweaks season to season, the tracks don't change year to year (unlike real life with resurfacing or corner tweaks etc) and the car doesn't react realistically to different temperature conditions and the like, so there's little to have to adapt to. As a result, there's very little to do in P later on, I think.. 1x flaying lap for all practice programs to achieve purple, except 3-5 laps for the race strategy program.

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I think there are two trenches where the mode suffers as a whole. How much a player's experience bleeds in each one varies from one guy to the next.

  • The AI performance progress;
  • The AI on the track.

R&D feels like the great catalyst for the perceived competitiveness. If you’re competent and lucky on getting R&D points early you can turn on the coasting mode as early as season 2. On Career mode you can still change teams to spice things up but in my opinion the AI progress is at the root of the problem.

Once you breakthrough on the performance charts the AI doesn’t seem able to catch up. It pretty much feels like a Mercedes simulator. Reg changes can only do so much to disrupt the flow as when you’re sitting on a Smaug pile of R&D points it’s more a nuisance than a real competitiveness leveler.

I have very little baggage compared to franchise veterans as combining my lifelong gameplay I only have 4 seasons on these “roleplay” game modes, so take it for what it is. Just an anecdote.

I love the concept of reg changes and the concept of putting you as a driver into the fray to collect R&D points in practice sessions is a big win in my book. But I think the game lacks a proper balancing design. This should be done on the AI side of things, making a title contender pop up now and then to keep things fresh even when you a clean R&D sheet.

There are different R&D trees for different teams so maybe putting them on a rotation – maybe even pari passu with the reg changes – could also help on making the game enjoyable on the long run.

The other focus point is the AI on track. I do think there’s an imbalance going on, but not on the terms you see people rambling on about. I got podiums on my first season and even a win at Brazil, but they all felt deserved and/or a justified product of circumstances – AI mistakes, safety cars and grid penalties. I’m ok with that, that happens every single season on the real thing too. But players are left with the task of constantly tuning the AI and when parameters aren’t clear, you probably get everything from people setting the AI so that they can purple every practice programme under the sun while others bump it so that they get a race result of “x” or “x-1” flat out the whole calendar regardless of the inherent variability that tracks and driving styles have of racing.

The issue arrives when this ends tying up with my first point, and you disentangle yourself from meaningful competition on the performance charts.

I think the game should have balancing systems in place to be able to provide satisfying journeys whether it takes you 2-3 seasons to win the championship or a 4 season marathon to snatch that cup. The AI needs to catch up with you organically to give a run for your money and it seems to me that the balancing act should be done mostly behind the AI curtain.

TL;DR: I think the R&D could use some revising to make the AI more dynamic and able to shake things up. It wouldn't be as much of a problem to be snatch a WDC at season 2 as long as I had to be constantly battling with one or two (varying) other teams.

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I asked this on another thread this morning but wouldn't starting with a higher AI level make acquiring R&D points more difficult and thereby make it take longer to reach the point where your car is too dominant?

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Posted (edited)

I don't think that's the way. Neither is baking in worse odds for a successful development. Once you get to the top of the charts the AI fades away.

It's not by forcing you to stay at the bottom of the charts for longer that will inject long term enjoyment in the mode. The AI performance needs to be more dynamic. Again, on Career mode you can always swap seats. You made a dinasty out of McLaren? Cool, now you have a giant to topple if you decide to move over to Red Bull. That helps keeping the gameplay interesting.

It still doesn't help with the constantly increasing pile of money and R&D you get by then. This needs working. When you get to be a billionaire in both factory and finances it feels like you have topped the game.

I may change my opinion as soon as the next couple posts, but for now I'd like to see rotating R&D trees on the player side and better balancing designs on the AI's.

Edited by marioho

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I’ve made mine tougher by running sim damage and no flashbacks. On a controller that adds so much to the game. 
Interestingly I’m qualifying way worse than before, probably because I’m less inclined to push unless I have maximum confidence in the car. Which hasn’t been often this season. 
I’m wondering if anyone has had to actually shut down a facility yet? Seems to me this mechanic doesn’t come into play at all? 

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8 hours ago, marioho said:

I don't think that's the way. Neither is baking in worse odds for a successful development. Once you get to the top of the charts the AI fades away.

It's not by forcing you to stay at the bottom of the charts for longer that will inject long term enjoyment in the mode. The AI performance needs to be more dynamic. Again, on Career mode you can always swap seats. You made a dinasty out of McLaren? Cool, now you have a giant to topple if you decide to move over to Red Bull. That helps keeping the gameplay interesting.

It still doesn't help with the constantly increasing pile of money and R&D you get by then. This needs working. When you get to be a billionaire in both factory and finances it feels like you have topped the game.

I may change my opinion as soon as the next couple posts, but for now I'd like to see rotating R&D trees on the player side and better balancing designs on the AI's.

I understand where you're coming from and can see this needs an adjustment. However, if Codemasters were expecting people to play at a difficulty that means most wouldn't reach the point you're describing until many seasons later due to earning R&D points at a slower rate then this becomes a rather different discussion. 

I think it must be tough for Codemasters to try to balance game design for the most dedicated players who may play many seasons whilst I'd guess a more typical player may only complete a couple, if that. I do agree with the points you and @joetoml1n have made about how to try to change things to help with the former though.

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You need to try having children. It’s been two weeks since I was last able to turn the game on.

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Posted (edited)

@Mintona I have! Luckily I’ve managed to get one race a night in, fairly consistently over the past month. Babies bed time, film/tv series with the gf and then a race while she does her own stuff too.. 

 

@marioho Thanks for expanding on my thoughts. I also agree that if it doesn’t take longer for the player team to get to the front, the AI need to remain as competitive.  I don’t like artificial game mechanics but something needs to be done to keep the next closest (in reality I would like next 2/3 closest) teams within touching distance of the player. Currently the gulf between me and P2, which is still Merc, is too big.

Edited by joetoml1n
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Ultra3142 said:

I understand where you're coming from and can see this needs an adjustment. However, if Codemasters were expecting people to play at a difficulty that means most wouldn't reach the point you're describing until many seasons later due to earning R&D points at a slower rate then this becomes a rather different discussion. 

I think it must be tough for Codemasters to try to balance game design for the most dedicated players who may play many seasons whilst I'd guess a more typical player may only complete a couple, if that. I do agree with the points you and @joetoml1n have made about how to try to change things to help with the former though.

Which is why I don't think they should touch our R&D income? Haha I said it is the AI's R&D progress that needs tweaking. Once you surpass them on the charts they become dead fish.

It is not the same as simply decreasing the player's R&D income. It is one thing to have the midfield with an occasional podium as your limit for too long, which is what I assume is the scenario you fear. It is wholly different thing though to have 1 or 2 AI teams keeping up with you on the top of the charts, as podiums are always within grasp but the competition is high. No problem if you make it to the top of the charts as soon as season 2, as long as the AI keeps up.

I'm not advocating for a handicap for the player. That would make the game a slog. What I would like to see is the game keeping the AI competitive - buffing their R&D to keep pace with you. Preferable with some alternation too so that we don't have the same top AI teams indefinitely.

If you're competent in collecting R&D points, the game should not become monotone by season 3.

That's only part of the problem though. It is not a good sign to have a massive pile of money and R&D points. Which of why rotating R&D trees could be interesting. 

Money though...

Edited by marioho

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31 minutes ago, marioho said:

Which is why I don't think they should touch our R&D income? Haha I said it is the AI's R&D progress that needs tweaking. Once you surpass them on the charts they become dead fish.

It is not the same as simply decreasing the player's R&D income. It is one thing to have the midfield with an occasional podium as your limit for too long, which is what I assume is the scenario you fear. It is wholly different thing though to have 1 or 2 AI teams keeping up with you on the top of the charts, as podiums are always within grasp but the competition is high. No problem if you make it to the top of the charts as soon as season 2, as long as the AI keeps up.

I'm not advocating for a handicap for the player. That would make the game a slog. What I would like to see is the game keeping the AI competitive - buffing their R&D to keep pace with you. Preferable with some alternation too so that we don't have the same top AI teams indefinitely.

If you're competent in collecting R&D points, the game should not become monotone by season 3.

That's only part of the problem though. It is not a good sign to have a massive pile of money and R&D points. Which of why rotating R&D trees could be interesting. 

Money though...

Would not more significant resets for both the AI and player help improve longevity and indeed realism for those interested in running many successive My Team seasons?

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Games arent hard or too easy. It all depends how much time you have to play them.

I'm still in Season 1, going for to the last races of the season. I hardly get to the points, my car falls apart very often despite investing lots of upgrades to durability. Sometimes I score high in qualifying only to drop to almost last because the MGU something is breaking again. So here's one hoping season 2 goes a little better.

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Posted (edited)

To me, it is way too easy. I've said this before in another thread but we need more options in the game to suit everyones needs. We all play the game differently, for example some people like to have a championship winning car in season 3 and some want to work hard and only have it in season 8. I also feel like there should just be more upgrades available and make the impact of major/ultimate upgrades less significant. Same goes for the facilities, once you have everything fully upgraded the money just keeps coming in and you have nothing to spent it on.

Edited by Jordutchy

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I think it's down to how you play it to be honest. 
In F1 2017 it was also really easy to very quickly become the best team and become so dominant that real-life Mercedes would be jealous. 
But I never allowed myself to make more than 2-3 upgrades a season. Sure, the guy comes over to you a lot saying that we do need to spend the resource points if we don't want to fall behind, but that's something I just ignored. 
I tried to keep it as realistic as possible, because you wouldn't see Williams leaping from last to first in a matter of a season in real life either. So 2-3 upgrades at most, then maybe a big one at the end of the season to kickstart you into the next season.

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@Malarky94 

Surely that answer confirms there’s something inherently wrong with the game model then? If you have to actively hold yourself back to keep it balanced.. 

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want complexity ? put 110% AI.
The higher the AI, the more difficult it is to perform tasks in practice !!!
And if you do not complete the tasks in practice, you will not receive resources !!!
And without resources, you can't improve the car, and without a fast car you can't earn points and even more so a title.

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After 4 years with basically the same R+D engine, I think it's time that they introduced a realism mode that can be selected (whilst the existing system can be kept for those who like it). Most of the ideas are based from what drivers and team personal say about how f1 design and development actually works but hopefully some of the below can be adopted to introduce some longevity into the my team mode:

1. Hire a technical director - similar to the hire a 2nd driver, has experience and ability to adapt to regulation change statistics for example. Will feed into some of the ideas below to ensure the longevity. I would like to see the technical director determine how the R+D points should be spent based on feedback from the  player. One thing I find interesting about technical directors is that they are all talented, most of them constrained by funds, ie. Aldo Costa was at Minardi in the early 90's and is now one of the most successful designers ever and would introduce a nice additional element to the mode. Maybe you have to start with Jeff and his technical team, but can replace him if you have the funds later on in the game for someone more talented/experienced

2. Start the career with a test - With a random car (ie. could be down on power, overweight, imbalanced etc, but different for each player so it's not the same for everyone), do a 5-10 lap test session at Barcelona. Up to the driver to understand where they would like improvements before the season begins. Could be a token system just like the teams will use before the 2021 season begins. I remember hearing the Totoya test car was a dog before they entered f1 in 2002 which help them (but not much as the 2002 car wasn't exactly brilliant). 

3. Make the player evaluate upgrades in practice - Instead of telling the user that the upgrade has failed, they have to evaluate it during practice and use that and the 2nd driver feedback to say if the part stays on for the rest of the weekend or needs further development. The stats of the technical director can be used to determine the likelihood of failure. IRL, they use GPS data to determine if engine upgrades (as an example) have worked so could introduce some data logging (feels like going back to Grand prix 2/3 days)

4. Engine cost/development - Make the engine cost based on how many engines are used during the season. At the moment I can have 15 engines for the same contract cost for the year, base the initial cost on 4 engines, and then deduct from the cash if any additional parts are ordered. Also, make it so only the engine supplier team can make an ultimate upgrade available to the teams they supply and can only be introduced to the engine pool if a new engine is used (ie. only if the engine is at 0% use or new engine ordered). This is based on reality where you hear of different spec engines used, especially at Spa and Monza, maybe Azerbaijan as well.

5. Season to season car improvement - Feeds on from the technical director above. User to determine the balancing act between team cash and the balance between focusing on the new car or continue developing the current car. The technical director stats can then determine if they want to go high risk/high potential reward or low risk/low reward approach. Could even have a current year R&D tree and a next year R&D tree. Can then do the testing/tokens to evaluate the new car at the test at the start of every season.

Even though not expecting any of these next year, would love a proper hardcore mode. Plenty of examples in F1 history where teams have improved/regressed in their car designs and some of those key lessons could be put into the game.

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in general, all these discussions are useless !!!
codemasters and 70% of all this will not do ...
they have been unable to do a normal SC for 5 years, but you want everything like in real life ...

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I would say this to OP. Is 70% the right AI difficulty for you? I only say it because I play on the same level and by season 3 I've questioned the fact it is too low a setting for me. Even to a point where track by track it can matter. Some tracks 70% seems okay a level for me with a fully stat bumped Russel as my 2nd driver, but at others I'm too far ahead in qually and race.

I will say I agree it is a little too easy to out develop the other teams if you are smart enough to go with a resource point heavy upgrade plan from start. I did that as well, both from the team's facilities upgrades, and from my own driver perks to increase number I get from the practice program challenges. For me this is the biggest issue, as while I guess it is possible a team could luck or skill into a good car off the bat, I don't like how easy it was to out develop the Merc from back of the grid. 

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, halfblindgamer said:

I would say this to OP. Is 70% the right AI difficulty for you?

2 hours ago, MilligramSmile said:

want complexity ? put 110% AI.
The higher the AI, the more difficult it is to perform tasks in practice !!!
And if you do not complete the tasks in practice, you will not receive resources !!!
And without resources, you can't improve the car, and without a fast car you can't earn points and even more so a title.

I do not race on 70% difficulty. I'm currently 105%, with constant push to get it higher. As I said in the initial post, I expect someone who is at 70% level to experience similar results. That is because the amount of resource points do not scale with difficulty. If your level is 70% and you have to work for your goals/practice programs/accurate race results, then thats no different to me racing on 105% and doing the same, or in fact someone racing on 110% - the resource points would be the same.

 

Edited by joetoml1n
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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Ultra3142 said:

Would not more significant resets for both the AI and player help improve longevity and indeed realism for those interested in running many successive My Team seasons?

It would help, which is exactly why I suggested rotating the R&D trees. Keeps things fresh while giving the player something new, as the path to his yummy upgrades will not be the same.

There's still the key thing of keeping the AI competitive on the performance charts. There's no use resetting the player progress if the AI still struggles to catch up.

And some balancing needs to be made on the new upgrades. Getting back to that unsteerable boat of a car we have on S1 is not exactly fun.

Edit: @joetoml1n yeah, people missed the point about the imbalance in competitiveness when you're competent at collecting R&D points. It makes no sense to bump the AI just to make practice programmes harder or to skip them altogether to keep the game fresh.

And the problem isn't you getting a fast car on S2, but the AI fading behind in the performance.

@halfblindgamer was in line with this on their second paragraph though. The top teams should not become dead on the water once you get up there.

@jameswallace I love your point 5 and had actually suggested a month or so ago.

Edited by marioho

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