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So, I went throught the 10 seasons of "My Team"...

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Excellent post, this very valuable to know! 👍

I did 4 seasons before seeing that the AI start getting extremely fast and lost a bit of interest, but 4 seasons was good entertainment. I signed only slow unknown drivers to midigate the fact that the team progressed faster than the competition. Much better than Career Mode whereby you cant choose a team mate and control the shortcomings of the game mode.

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2 hours ago, KrazyLurt said:

Excellent post, this very valuable to know! 👍

I did 4 seasons before seeing that the AI start getting extremely fast and lost a bit of interest, but 4 seasons was good entertainment. I signed only slow unknown drivers to midigate the fact that the team progressed faster than the competition. Much better than Career Mode whereby you cant choose a team mate and control the shortcomings of the game mode.

Currently in my 4th season, I purposely nerfed my own progression by not only spreading out the spending on my R&D researches, but also not really upgrading the Resource Point Generation facilities until I really felt like being left behind (which didn't really impact me all that much until the 3 departments rule change at the end of season 3, which dropped my aero to dead-last because I went out of points)

Having less resource points definitely made things more interesting because I'm constantly doing catch up, but, not in an annoying way because the speed of the generation is still fast enough, you just need to do a bit more planning.

I also only hire F2 drivers to balance things out, the buffs from the personnel facilities are simply too OP if they were applied on the F1 drivers with very high base stats.

And I absolutely agree on the fact that AI's pace increased exponentially the more progress their teams made in the R&D departments, I could barely catch them up without lowering the difficulty settings by 3-5% (From around 104-107% on average in my first 2 seasons). Especially during qualifying they're simply monsters, unrealistically so, if you use fast-forward it made things even worse.

Thank you for going through all that hassles for us, I was worrying about the slower teams never being able to catch up with others in R&D, it's good to see Williams being not too far behind.

 

Edited by DRTApophis

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Really interesting post and weird behaviour of the AI... I'm currently almost ending my season one but mine is Career Mode (Elite mode), never played an F1 title before, started with 90 AI, I raised to 95 qualy (90 race) soon, in the second part of the season I set everything to 100 (except a couple of race 105 qualy), I'm 14-4 with my team mate in qualifying and 16-2 in race. But my increased speed may be related to my poor starting skill as well...

From how things stand now, I will probably try a season 2 something like between 103Q-100R & 105Q-102R, I'm wondering if the described behaviour will affect also my Career Mode, I will monitor it...

Thank you for sharing :classic_smile:

Greetings,
Nuv

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I think this just shows that there needs to be something more than what we have in career mode, because the money and R&D points just becomes useless.

We need something to invest in, like your own engine, a second team/F2 team, your own test track, etc...

 

Edit: Also interesting to see that McLaren had the 2nd best car, but finished way down in the points lol. Also Lewis Hamilton is still racing at 45? Nice... xD

Edited by hsf

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8 hours ago, Erudain said:

AI seems to be extremelly impacted by upgrades and drivers pace/racecraft upgrades.
I played the first 4 seasons at 98 AI, that was enought to be 9th the 1st season and win titles the 3rd and 4th season. In season 5 Lando hits the 100/100 racecraft/pace with the same car, and I start to notice he's getting 0.500-0.600s better times in qualys, I can still beat him in race because the AI stupid things like doing 2 stops when 1 will do, or me starting on mediums and he on softs. By season 6th the qualy gap can go up to 1sec in some tracks, also as the other teams also start to max out other AI start to beat me in qualys, I had to lower the AI to 94 to qualy among the top 5. By season 7th I'm barely making it to Q3 with the best car

Same thing here. In Career Mode (not myTeam); Season one 95, season two 98, season three I increased the difficulty even more to 101, but I started having trouble to make it to Q3 (right at the beginning in Australia) despite having the best car according to R&D chart. 

It's true that in the Race you make up a lot of time, but starting always at the back just ruins the game.

I am noticing that the AI speed is also increasing throughout this third season, so I was racing the first half at 95 for Quali and 101 Race, but now I have to lower Race difficulty as well, and I am doing a lot of trials to get the level right. It's also very unsatisfying to be forced to change difficulty level between sessions. I would like to have some consistency and know that I can beat the AI at 101 for example. 

Very frustrating because in Grand Prix mode, I can do Quali and Race with the same difficulty and have great races.

Bwoah.

  • Agree 1

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For R and D, are you confirming that the My Team car is actually the car that can have the highest performance points when all cars are fitted with all the upgrades? In other words, the performance graph in the picture shows when every team has applied all of their upgrades on the tree? I am curious to know which team has the highest performance points after all upgrades are applied.

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3 hours ago, Krisperfectline said:

For R and D, are you confirming that the My Team car is actually the car that can have the highest performance points when all cars are fitted with all the upgrades? In other words, the performance graph in the picture shows when every team has applied all of their upgrades on the tree? I am curious to know which team has the highest performance points after all upgrades are applied.

You can check in every category to see how your team compares with the others.

Your car has the best aero package of all the teams, full bar to the right, just slightly above RB and McLaren who seems to be the 2nd best in aero and their bar hasn't moved for a couple seasons, so safe to say they maxed.

Chassis and Durability is equal for all teams.

Engine is dependant on how many upgrade packs the developer releases which is random (as you can see in the screenshot my engine is 21/23 because I'm missing 2 developer packs), if all 4 engines have all packs released they are all equal 100 performance / 100 reliability.

So in the end, if all the teams have max engine, max aero, max chassis, max durability, your team car is the best because of the slightly better aero.

Edited by Erudain

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1 hour ago, Erudain said:

You can check in every category to see how your team compares with the others.

Your car has the best aero package of all the teams, full bar to the right, just slightly above RB and McLaren who seems to be the 2nd best in aero and their bar hasn't moved for a couple seasons, so safe to say they maxed.

Chassis and Durability is equal for all teams.

Engine is dependant on how many upgrade packs the developer releases which is random (as you can see in the screenshot my engine is 21/23 because I'm missing 2 developer packs), if all 4 engines have all packs released they are all equal 100 performance / 100 reliability.

So in the end, if all the teams have max engine, max aero, max chassis, max durability, your team car is the best because of the slightly better aero.

I see. I wish they would make it that when all cars have all upgrades fitted, that they will be having equal performance points. 

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Did you ever figure out why, how or where the AI is fast when it has a maxed out car? Apex speeds, exit traction, straight line speed?

Did you start getting problems with tyre temperatures after maxing out downforce on the car?

These two questions are interlinked. The AI is practically unaffected by tyre temperatures, so I'm wondering if that's what's going on here.

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most likely I will finish two races of the first season and ******* delete this game, because There are a lot of bugs and no one wants to fix them. I won't buy this **** anymore.
ps. on my Steam account of F1 games from 2010 to 2020...

  • Haha 1

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38 minutes ago, FTBuzzard said:

i think 10 seassons are not enough 😄

Personally I think it's more than enough atm, there aren't enough changes between seasons to keep things fresh.

May be they should have a few different R&D trees for each department (that have different point requirements to progress and maxed-out stats are varies), then the game randomly pick one every time when there are rule changes.

Or that when rule change happens the game allows you to tweak the rules in the settings before the season starts. For example:

  • If there's engine rule change, there could be options for players to change the maximum KERS deployment per lap, or maximum engine power and etc.
  • If aero is what affected, it could be options to adjust the base value of drag or downforce or slimpstream/dirty air effectiveness and such.

Or at least just let us edit the full calendar after season one.  

Or even better, let us adjust each AI team's base performance & potential progression speed at the start of new season.

So on and so on...

 

Edited by DRTApophis

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Interesting stuff, good research 🙂 

 

@Erudain how did the car feel as you went through the seasons? I'm halfway through Season 2 at the moment and just got the best Chassis; it feels like I can put the power down out of corners much earlier than before. 🙂 

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@janbonator 

no idea how the AI is so fast on straights mainly, like in Monza for example, running a 1-2 wing + rich mix + overtake deployed and the AI will slingshot past me if they have DRS and I don't, I have to push them all the way inside to force them to lock before the 1st chicane. In the next lap me having DRS + rich mix + overtake I'm barely gaining on the AI which doesn't have DRS.  

My bet is that a 100/100 AI works like the +100 AI in previous games where their cars actually were faster since they can't make the AI "smarter".

I didn't notice tyre temp problems, quite the opposite, as the chassis gets better a lot of tracks where M/H are the best strategy become M/S since tyre wear drops a lot when you car is lighter and chassis gets to the max.  

 

@PJTierney

The main differences I watched were, I could lower my wing setups a little as your aero got better, but at least for my style I always needed to have more rear wing than front. I don't know if it was the car being lighter in the back as you have less fuel weight with the efficiency upgrades but using equal wings I always felt like having a loose rear in the last seasons.

Also I noticed that I needed to raise the car height, probably as your aero and engine gets better and your chassis lighter, you're creating to much downforce and the car bottoms out. Using my S1-2 setups in S7 can make the car "spark" the whole lap bottoming. 

Edited by Erudain

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14 hours ago, Erudain said:

Also I noticed that I needed to raise the car height, probably as your aero and engine gets better and your chassis lighter, you're creating to much downforce and the car bottoms out.

I'm already noticing this in Season 2; I'm scraping the road everywhere 😄 

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5 hours ago, PJTierney said:

I'm already noticing this in Season 2; I'm scraping the road everywhere 😄 

Speaking of scraping the ground, I've been thinking that the visual damages caused by driving on some of the curbs (not even particularly thick) are a bit much.

Such as the outside curb of Albert Park's turn 12, or Zandvoort's turn 9 & 14. If you just ran a little deep on those curbs (like halfway to the middle), you frontwing, side pod, and floor will all get major visual damages, and it happens even when you're just in season 1 with very little downforce, and setting the ride height & suspension doesn't seems to help.

Your frontwing also receive tons of chip damage just driving through the lowest point of Eau Rouge (without touching any curb).

Edited by DRTApophis

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I was surprised to see how much I had to adjust the car from season to season in terms of set up to maximize my lap times. I was very disappointed in how the AI teams were unable to handle reg changes. After season 2 all departments were hit and I came out with the best car. We took 16 poles and 16 wins out of 16 races, but I just beat my teammate to the title.

End of season 4 had aero and chassis reg changes and again we had the best car, taking 15 poles and 14 race wins from 16 races.

I just complete Season 5 and again have the best car out there, we took every pole, fast lap and race win. I only beat my team mate to the title thanks to his 2 DNFs over 16 races. No other team can compete and the new reg change was covered off by me with all the R&D points I had accumulated.

My plan is to sign the slowest driver and to defund my personnel department so he gets no bonuses, and take the weakest engine. My hope is to get other teams involved in the title fight as my current option seemed to be a choice between My Team running away with it but guarantee a title for one of us, or having my team mate slaughter me but have other drivers fighting me (but only me).

The lack of things to spend money on, the ease of covering off reg changes, and the lack of competition from other teams is a real draw back to My Team.

 

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Sorry to bring this back up my career save (which I was very much enjoying) is being ruined by the AI becoming much, much faster as the cars develop, exactly as identified by the OP in this thread. The result is to completely unbalance the game mode. We have seen a few issues like this in previous games but nothing on this scale- the only option is to significantly reduce the AI level, but its almost impossible to then work out what level you should be at as it changes so much and your in the middle of a career. Very frustrating and very unsatisfying. @BarryBL, I did ask a while back if you could raise it with the developers, is this something that is being looked at? Its a bit of a gamebreaker for offline career and myteam for me, I'm seriously considering going back to just playing single championship seasons.

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2 hours ago, pacers101 said:

Sorry to bring this back up my career save (which I was very much enjoying) is being ruined by the AI becoming much, much faster as the cars develop, exactly as identified by the OP in this thread. The result is to completely unbalance the game mode. We have seen a few issues like this in previous games but nothing on this scale- the only option is to significantly reduce the AI level, but its almost impossible to then work out what level you should be at as it changes so much and your in the middle of a career. Very frustrating and very unsatisfying. @BarryBL, I did ask a while back if you could raise it with the developers, is this something that is being looked at? Its a bit of a gamebreaker for offline career and myteam for me, I'm seriously considering going back to just playing single championship seasons.

HI @pacers101

A thing to remember here is the AI will improve statistically, especially the younger drivers. In terms of the change, what are the numbers behind this? Also, are you in the best team?

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2 hours ago, BarryBL said:

HI @pacers101

A thing to remember here is the AI will improve statistically, especially the younger drivers. In terms of the change, what are the numbers behind this? Also, are you in the best team?

Thanks Barry.

I'll try and do some tests and let you know roughly what kind of swing we are looking at, vs my team mate, trying to keep as much constant as possible, but it may take a few days. As an initial stab I'd estimate a swing of approximately 1.5+ seconds per lap in favour of the AI when the cars are fully developed. It is quite a noticeable jump in a game that is all about consistency of lap time (say you have found a great level and would regularly qualify within +/-0.2secs of Leclerc in season 1, by season 6 or 7 you are qualifying 1.0-1.5sec down, that's a big difference). The OP talked about dropping the AI level from 98 all the way down to 85 by season 7, and others seem to be noting a similar scale of change. You raise a good point on driver ratings, although someone like Leclerc can't actually get much better because his initial ratings are very high, so he is maxing the ratings out early on in the career.

Ps. I don't want to complain about the game too much, overall I consider it to be one of the best, if not the best, single player games I have ever played. But it would be even better if this was looked at, as it does affect the enjoyment of otherwise awesome game modes (myteam and career).

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Hi there,

I don't know how a team changes its behaviour in the track through the seasons by increasing its car level, but if it may help, here more or less how it works at least in season 1-2:
100 points of difference in Teams Performance overall stats mean around 1 second per lap, so more or less equal to 10 points of AI (then we know each track is different etc.).

Here a tab of what the performances should be at the beginning of season 1 (100% unofficial measures)

 

 

We know also drivers stats play a role into the overall performance, but all in all it looks approximate but quite satisfying calculation. This has been checked during my whole season 1 and beginning of season 2 with the performance of my teammate as a reference, together with the poleman/race winner and the fastest driver of a couple of teams with similar stats as mine.

For example the Mercedes which started at ~583, after 4 races of season 2 is currently at ~753 and it's 1,7 s. faster than in season 1. 

Probably this must break after a certain car level/season... :classic_mellow:

 

Regards,
Nuv

Edited by Nuvolarix

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One thing for everyone going to test to be aware of is that, make sure you run qualifying in real time:

  1. Doing out/In-Lap manually.
  2.  Never use fast forward when AI is doing their fast lap (doing so during In-out lap is fine, but you have to time it properly so it doesn't affect their fast lap)
  3.  And stay out on the track until you know everyone has done their final run.

By doing these you get the most accurate AI lap times, they're almost always slightly faster in their final run. But if you use fast forward not only the timer is speed-up, their cars are also speed-up, they can easily shave a second or more off in this scenario it's ridiculous. 

Skipping back to garage while AI are still doing their fast lap or the session ended before they finish their final run also might boost their lap time significantly, but it's inconsistent and I haven't figure out what triggers it exactly.

Edited by DRT-Apophis

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I’m going to add to this. I was completing Singapore FP3. Bit of context as it started dry but quickly went wet. it dried out at the end with 6 minutes left so everyone went into the pits bar Gasly. So he completes his first two laps and was completing lap 3 when the session ended. 
 

If you look at the video, his first sector is a 27.586 and then the session ends. Not surprised he jumped ahead of me with the usual ending session bug but wondered where he gained the time because it wasn’t stand out as the track was transitioning. 
 

You’ll see he completed an additional THREE LAPS!

We all know weird things go on with skipping but @BarryBL three laps? 

  • Confused 2

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