Using Reverb G2, constant dropped frames :(

[RagingBeard]

I am getting an incredible number of dropped frames as shown in fpsVR. I can easily be on over 100 dropped frames in a minute or so.

This is even when running at a very low SS of 30% for example, and framerate stays at 90fps, GPU and CPU usage very low (3090 & 10900k). So to be clear, this isn't low framerate or reprojection etc, it is literally only "dropped frames".

Other sims run great, just something is causing an issue with DR2. I didn't have this problem with my Vive Pro.

Thanks.

[RagingBeard]

Just tried with my Quest 2 and no dropped frames, so seems specific to WMR/G2 for me. Is it just me?

[RagingBeard]

Video here.. Can anyone help with this Dirt Rally 2.0 VR issue please? : simracing (reddit.com)

[PJTierney]

Hey there.

Just to confirm, have you tried everything here?

 

 

[RagingBeard]

Hi, I have yes, I have used DR2 great with Vive Pro and Quest 2, this issue is only with G2, or specifically WMR most likely. Issue is still there if I lower SteamVR supersampling to just 30% for example, lower than either of those headsets. 

[PJTierney]

23 hours ago, RagingBeard said:

this issue is only with G2, or specifically WMR most likely

The G2 has a larger per-eye resolution than many headsets so there may be something to this.

It could also like you said be something specific to WMR, but I haven't seen enough comments from others to prove either of these things 🤔

If I find out any info I'll let you know; I'm asking around.

[RagingBeard]

I can use the Quest 2 on high super sampling and get a smooth experience, while the G2 even at very low super sampling (so a MUCH lower resolution), I still have this problem.

[PJTierney]

Seems specific to the G2 or WMR then.

I've asked about it but got no potential workarounds yet to suggest.

[Badfish226]

What GPU are you using? I'm getting this issue with a 3080 and G2.

[Palladin82]

Same here frames are dropped no matter what headset and game settings I am using, 

HP Reverb G2 + 10900k + RTX 3090 

Did anyone found solution on this ? 

[RagingBeard]

I'm running 3090, but appears specific to G2/WMR for me. I don't have the frame drop issue using Quest 2, and didn't have it in past with 2080ti and Vive Pro.

[uz1l0v3r]

Perhaps this is the reason (there's a hotfix driver, linked at the bottom of the thread)?

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/geforce/forums/game-ready-drivers/13/402768/valve-index-missing-dropped-frames-since-nvidia-d/

[RagingBeard]

Made no difference to me sadly. 

[Palladin82]

Hi, 

I tried practically everything:

- changed refresh rate of G2 into 60 Hertz  

- tested practically all settings on G2 WMR settings and Steam VR settings

60 hertz brought a little better performance but stuttering still exist. 

I have noticed that on FPSVR software I have constant drops on FPS (below 60 FPS) but on the graph there are no dropped frames observed + my GPU is only running on 40% of available power,

It really looks like a poor support for WMR headsets or Steam VR. 

It is really frustrating to not be able to play on my new G2. 

Not sure what I can improve in terms of hardware (i9-10900K / 64 GB RAM / RTX 3090/ Fast SSD) 

Best Regards

Greg

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Ialyrn]

Turn off screen space reflections, set vehicle details to low, set crowds to low, turn off any multisampling, get rid of any supersampling (SteamVR will super sample automatically based on your PC's hardware, so you need to manually set Dirt Rally 2 to run at the correct per eye resolution).

These are the settings I found to cause the most issues in VR with Dirt Rally 2.0. Crowds are known to cause stuttering issues in Dirt games, setting them to "low" or turning them off stops this.

Screen space reflections will take a big chunk of the FPS

For some reason when vehicle details are set above "low" in VR, the cars light will cause the frame rate to stutter and drop; especially in area's with lots of trees. I found it to be the worst on Scotland, but can happen at any location.

On top of these things, you can also turn off the advanced lighting and camera effects that are all locatated at the bottom of the graphical options. These items can eat into the FPS also.

[RagingBeard]

Thanks but this isn't a performance issue. I can set things very low and still have dropped frames, whereas with the Vive Pro or Quest 2, both running at a higher resolution than the G2, the issue is not there.

[Palladin82]

Yes - that is true, it is not performance issue - I am getting the same results on high and very low

[LostOne84]

Hi,

I remember that I had to force disable DX12 in WMR for SteamVR because it is causing a regular stutter (about once per second for about a tenth of a second).

In case you haven't tried it might be worth a shot. It should be somewhere in the UI but in case you can't find it there you can also edit "YourSteamlocation"\steamapps\common\MixedRealityVRDriver\resources\settings\default.vrsettings

[Jaggers271]

Hi,

 

Similar issue here.  Intel i9-9900KS, NVidia MSI Suprim X 3090, MSI MEG Z390 ACE mobo, 32GB DDR-4000 C19 memory, 2TB EVO Plus NVMe SSD.  Using a relatively fresh install (2 days old) of Windows 10 Pro.  Previously used an HTC Vive (original) and had everything on Ultra, with no issues.

 

fpsVR Report:
App: DiRT Rally 2.0 HMD: HP Reverb Virtual Reality Headset G20 (90.001 Hz, IPD 61.7)
GPU: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3090 (27.21.14.6140) CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i9-9900KS CPU @ 5.1GHz
Delivered fps: 89.15  Duration: 38.9min. Headset was active: 33%
GPU Frametimes:
Median: 5.4 ms
99th percentile: 6.6 ms
99.9th percentile: 7.1 ms
frametime <11.1ms(vsync): 100%
CPU frametime:
Median: 3.7 ms
99th percentile: 5.2 ms
99.9th percentile: 7.4 ms
frametime <11.1ms(vsync): 99.9%
Reprojection Ratio: 0.8% (for Index/Vive/VivePro headsets only)
Dropped frames: 691 or 0.3% (for Index/Vive/VivePro headsets only)
Max. SteamVR SS: 100%
Render resolution per eye: 3160x3088(by SteamVR settings, Max.) (HMD driver recommended: 3159x3089)

 

The Dirt2 Rally Steam VR graphics settings are at their lowest.  CPU usage averages 10% with a short peak of 45%.  GPU usage sits at about 62% with a short peak of about 76%.  It's all well within limits, I'm getting very nearly perfect 90fps indicated yet I regularly get stutters in game.  In game, fpsVR manifests these stutters as purple 'spikes' in its GPU frametime graph, and I see a stutter.  It happens regularly and is easily repeatable.  But the game sees 89.15 fps average with the longest frametimes at 7.1 and 7.4ms, which should be a complete non-issue and not noticeable, but fpsVR records 691 dropped frames after 40mins play.  In game though, it's like someone pressing pause for a tenth of a second, really throws off the immersion and is enough to cause accidents!

I'm using nVidia drivers 461.40 which to my understanding should have incorporated the VR stuttering hotfix driver 461.33.  Suggestions elsewhere have said this might be an issue with reprojection settings, but I'll try the DX12 fix mentioned above.  

Any suggestions welcome.

 

Edited February 11, 2021 by Jaggers271
Adding fpsVR screenshots.

[Jaggers271]

 

Further to the above - it is possible to get decent performance on a 3090 with G2 and Dirt Rally 2.0! Just need to figure out how - see the vid below...

 

 

[BozScaggs]

Having the same issue here. 

Running an MSI 3090 Suprim X and 9700k. Everything was running smooth as glass on my Rift S in Oculus mode. As soon as I upgraded to the Reverb G2 I see intense stutters no matter the video settings. Plenty of headroom available. FPSvr and the SteamVR GPU monitor show many purple spikes corresponding with the stutters. Sometimes it will be smooth for about 10-20 seconds at the start of a race, but inevitably the stutters begin and make the game absolutely unplayable. Such a shame as this was one of my top 3 sims before.

 

I've tried all the fixes linked here and so many more. Reinstalled windows even. Tried multiple nvidia drivers. It has to be something not paying nice with steamvr or WMR. OpenComposite doesn't seem to work whether I try individual or global installation - it makes the game launch in 2D mode every time.

 

I remember hearing that CodeMasters stopped supporting the game so we may be out of luck and have to move on...

[Jaggers271]

Just to add my findings, having tried hours of suggested solutions - I found that biggest improvement was when using the nVidia Studio Driver (461.40).  I think the issue is possibly driver related, but I've spent too much time already on this and, as has been mentioned, I think it might be time to move along to another sim as Codemasters are no longer working on it.  It's real shame, DR2 was by far my favourite driving game.  Onto PC2 or AAC perhaps.  

[Jaggers271]

To add to the mix, it seems that WMR developers may have identified a performance bottleneck between SteamVR and WMR.  See the link below.

https://www.reddit.com/r/WindowsMR/comments/lmyusg/windows_mixed_reality_for_steamvr_updated_12536/gny2b6p?utm_source=share&amp;utm_medium=web2x&amp;context=3

Hopefully, things might improve when this issue gets sorted out.  Steam and Microsoft seem to be working on it.

[RagingBeard]

Yeah be great if that is the issue. I have tried all the recommended steps but no improvement in DR2. 

I'm resorting to downloading DR1 again and hope that runs fine to at least be able to get some rally in. 

[djbutcher13]

Unfortunate seeing this. I am running my old Asus WMR with my 3090 (Reverb G2 should be here end of week) and seeing similar problems. 3090 has no problem running my low resolution headset, im only at about 75% usage at high settings but I get those frame drops. I hope it's  steam->wmr problem

[BozScaggs]

I potentially have some words of hope for everyone suffering from these G2/WMR stutters

I may have stumbled upon a magic combination of settings that is giving me an experience very similar to that of my Rift S. As stated above I am running an RTX 3090 and 9700K.

I'm not exactly sure which of these things has done the trick so I will provide a list of everything I did this evening. 

1. Deleted the "Dirt Rally 2.0" folder from Documents>My Games (This resets all your video settings but not wheel bindings)
2. Started "Windows MIxed Reality for SteamVR" app via my shortcut on the desktop. This starts WMR, Steam and SteamVR all in one.
3. Launched fpsVR and launched Dirt Rally 2.0 in SteamVR mode
4. Tried a race at the default (medium preset) video settings but everything was stutterville like usual. 
5. Exited the race and went to video settings. Changed to MSAA x2 and Anisotropic Filtering 4x then in advanced settings made all settings at the lowest possible value they could go to. Basically everything to off or low or ultra low. Everything was smooth but looked like garbage. In the past there would be stutters even at these lowest settings
6. I began increasing some settings one by one and testing each. 
7. So far I have found the below settings to work. You can possibly increase some other things, but I haven't had time to test yet.
   MSAA x2 and Anisotropic Filtering 4x
   Shadows to High
   Ground Cover to Medium
   Shaders to High 
   All other settings to lowest possible setting

Other Pertinent Things
-Dirt is fully up to date in Steam
-Windows 10 Home is fully up to date
-Nvidia Driver 461.40

SteamVR settings
-SteamVR SS 100% and game specific SS at 100% (I can't remember exactly what this equates to but around 3100 x 3100)
-Motion Smoothing disabled
-Legacy Reprojection Off
-Advanced Supersample Filtering On
-Overlay Redner Quality Low

Results
I have tried about 8 tracks and a couple cars. I'm seeing 1 to 3 brief stutters throughout the race. These little stutters correlate with purple spikes as seen on fpsVR or in SteamVR's native GPU monitor overlay in Developer settings. GPU utilization is 60% to 80% depending on the section of the track. These results have persisted through a computer restart and multiple restarts of the game.

Give it a try when you have a moment and let me know how you do. You might try to gradually increase other things. Perhaps we will find the main culprit. On my preliminary testing, it appears that it is not just one settings but a specific combination which makes it pretty difficult to determine.  

[bpjod]

NOTE: I posted this earlier today on Steam's DR 2.0 forums. I'd really like to find a better solution, so I'm copy/pasting the same below. I hope I don't offend anyone with my cross-posting.

--------

I got an HP Reverb G2 and have spent a lot of time tweaking my graphics settings it to run acceptably, not great. "Upgraded" from a Rift CV1. Maybe something here can help you and/or others out.

Hardware:
Asus Strix B550-i motherboard
AMD 5800X
RTX 2070 Super (461.40 Driver)
32 GB RAM

My Reverb G2 is plugged into the USB port on my 2070S. Any of the ports on the motherboard gave me errors.

NVIDIA Driver Settings:
On Adjust Image Settings with Preview, first select "Use my preference emphasising" and slide to PERFORMANCE.
Then click "Use the advanced 3D image settings", then click "Take me there"; then
Power management mode: Prefer Maximum Performance

WMR settings:
My Home: Low & 720p (don't think this matters, but don't want any resources wasted on WMR's Home).
Experience: Optimise for performance
Resolution: 4320 x 2160 (best quality) - (I let SteamVR downrez this, see SteamVR Settings)
Frame Rate: 90 Hz (although according to fps VR I'm only hitting 90 fps maybe 20% of the time, the rest of the time at 45 fps)

SteamVR settings:
Render Resolution: Auto on main screen

Then in "Per-Application Video Settings", for DR2.0:
Custom Resolution Multiplier: 68% (here's where I downrez the resolution)
Motion Smoothing: Use Global Setting

DR 2.0 Graphics Settings:
Multisampling: CMAA (this one's very important, at any MSAA setting I get unacceptable frames dropping. My only significant complaint about CMAA is gravel on the road surface becomes shiny, otherwise I'm okay with the downgrade in quality from MSAA in order to significantly reduce the number of dropped frames).
Anisometripic filtering: 8x (doesn't seem to matter too much)

Shader Detail: High (This seems to be the source of all the problems. Set this to Low and I can run MSAA and every setting on High or Ultra and everything's just fine. However it looks absolutely dreadful - like a bad cartoon, not lifelike at all. Sad. I wonder if this is a problem unique to the Reverb G2 or whether it's like this for all graphics cards pushed to their limits with extremely high resolution "screens". Anyone know?).
Texture Detail: High
Reflections: High
Screenplay Reflections: Replay
Shadows: Medium
Night Lighting: Low (still experimenting with this, was getting dropped frames at night in the rain and set it here; medium seemed ok during a dry night)
Ambient Occlusion: Ultra Low
Advanced Ambient Occlusion: Off
Particles: High
Advanced Blending: Off
Weather, Crowd, Cloth, Mirrors: Low
Vehicle Details: Medium
Track: High
Object: Low
Trees: Medium
Ground Cover: Low (seems to have a fairly large effect on frames dropped if turned up)
Skidmarks: On
Motion Blur, God Rays, Chromatic Aberration, Bloom, Light Streaks: Replay
Lens Dust: Off

I tried to strike a balance to get acceptable gameplay and this seems to be it for my system. The CPU uses 8 of its 16 cores at ~20% with the odd spikes to 60% and the other 8 cores near idle so I'm not CPU bound.

I get mostly 45 fps and maybe 5-12 dropped frames per stage. Maybe about 20% of the stage (and of course in the menus) I'm getting 90 fps. GPU usage seems to be around 40-65% (fluctuates). GPU temps are usually < 60C. I wonder why GPU usage isn't higher, it's not that it's running too hot. I guess if it's at 60% and 45 fps, then maybe it would have to run at 120% to hit 90 fps and since it can't do that, it trundles along at 50-60% and 45 fps.

I've had an RTX 3080 on order forever, but not having any luck so far. I'm not sure that would even push me up to 90 fps at High settings, but I can wish.

What's really puzzling me the most is the Shader Detail setting. Why the huge difference in performance switching from Low to High (the only two settings, else I'd try Medium)? Low is so stupid looking, it's hard to think why they even left it in the game. This really puzzles me.

Any how, I left this here to give other HP Reverb G2 users a place to start. Hopefully something here can get you up and running. To reach the above settings took me weeks of frustration and nausea inducing driving. At least now I can race again, but I still wish for a smoother experience and wish I could run at higher settings to experience the HP Reverb G2 and DR 2.0 in all its glory.

I'm kind of thinking the problem is with WMR's compatibililty with DR 2.0, but that's just a hunch I have. I was able to play Half-Life Alyx on Ultra settings with barely any dropped frames and on High with no detectable dropped frames. Given the comment above about the Quest 1 being much better than the G2, I'm really wondering about WMR and whether it's the problem.

If anyone has any improvements to these settings or other tips for improving frame rate and fewer dropped frames, I'd love it if you'd post them here as I'd like to get a better experience. DR 2.0 is 80%+ of my VR gaming and the primary reason I "upgraded" to the HP Reverb G2 so I'm all for improving my VR experience in DR 2.0.

[RagingBeard]

@BozScaggs I am sure I have deleted the Docs folder before, maybe I will try again and I have run with all kinds of settings lowest to highest. But it's interesting you have seen a big improvement.

I can play a stage on the Quest 2 over VD with high res and settings and get 0 frame drops, yet in the G2 even with lower res I can literally get hundreds on a stage.

[RagingBeard]

I wonder if there is a way to run it through Revive?

For many Index and Vive users playing iRacing, you need to force it through Revive to prevent a horrible world wobble issue (iRacing are aware of the well known issue).

Perhaps it could work in this instance too if anyone knows how.

[BozScaggs]

I had also deleted the documents folder before with no change. That was about a month ago however.

I suspect something changed in the cornucopia of programs required to get this thing to run. I know there were updates to: WMR, SteamVR, WMR for SteamVR, Windows 10, the game itself, Nvidia driver. I suspect something changed in one of those.

I'm still able to play with smooth frames, but if I increase in-game settings from what I posted above it starts dropping frames again despite having ample headroom and low frame times. I can increase SteamVR SS without any negative impact though. Currently running 130% 

[GuusHugo]

I am having EXACTLY the same problems with my Reverb G2 and 3080: unplayable/stutter hell with the lowest possible settings.

I tried everything that I could think of, Steam in DX11, lowest settings that are possible, older Nvidia drivers, tried all steam settings, tried to follow the steps from above etc.etc. but there is nothing that makes this game work in VR.

Even on the lowest settings with 50% resolution it's a complete stutter hell.

This while the game runs flawless here at 4K with everything at ultra+msaa 4x on my 2d screen !

I bought a new wheel and the Reverb G2 and the 3080 FOR THIS GAME IN VR, and now it's all unusable, it was all for nothing.

Codemasters/EA: Please don't give up this game and it's players, we NEED this patched/solved ! Please confirm to us that this issue is being worked on. Thank you in advance.

[GuusHugo]

On 2/26/2021 at 11:08 PM, BozScaggs said:

I had also deleted the documents folder before with no change. That was about a month ago however.

I suspect something changed in the cornucopia of programs required to get this thing to run. I know there were updates to: WMR, SteamVR, WMR for SteamVR, Windows 10, the game itself, Nvidia driver. I suspect something changed in one of those.

I'm still able to play with smooth frames, but if I increase in-game settings from what I posted above it starts dropping frames again despite having ample headroom and low frame times. I can increase SteamVR SS without any negative impact though. Currently running 130% 

I can at least update that it isn't the nvidia driver, because I even tried the first nvidia driver with 3000 series support (456.38) and the problem is exactly the same; DR2 simply doesn't work in VR.

Really sad to read that this game has been given up... This was the best game that CM ever made.

[RagingBeard]

Just tried DR1, exactly the same issue and it runs through Revive so my previous thought on Revive being a work around is a non-starter anyway.

[GuusHugo]

I was just trying Revive+DR1 also.. I can confirm that Revive indeed doesn't solve this issue with DR1, it's indeed exactly the same.

So there isn't a single Dirt Rally title that works with the G2. This is so sad, because that's what I bought the G2 for. And the worst thing is that there is zero feedback from the developers. This issue is already clear for 2+ months but the developers don't confirm that this bug will ever be solved or that it's even worked on.. I really hope that they will put this major bug on the radar and that we could play Dirt Rally 2 soon in VR.

[GuusHugo]

On 1/12/2021 at 1:05 PM, PJTierney said:

Seems specific to the G2 or WMR then.

I've asked about it but got no potential workarounds yet to suggest.

Can you confirm that this issue is beeing looked at? Or will it never be solved?

[PJTierney]

I don't have any further updates to my previous message, sorry 😞 

If I do get any updates, I'll pass them on.

[GuusHugo]

On 2/28/2021 at 11:43 AM, PJTierney said:

I don't have any further updates to my previous message, sorry 😞 

If I do get any updates, I'll pass them on.

Thank you for your reply PJTierney. But you haven't confirmed my question, neither you have denied it.

So I will ask you again: Can you confirm that this issue is beeing looked at?

With that question I mean: Are the developers looking for a bugfix for this compatibility bug (Reverb G2 + Nvidia 3000 series)?

[PJTierney]

42 minutes ago, GuusHugo said:

Thank you for your reply PJTierney. But you haven't confirmed my question, neither you have denied it.

So I will ask you again: Can you confirm that this issue is beeing looked at?

With that question I mean: Are the developers looking for a bugfix for this compatibility bug (Reverb G2 + Nvidia 3000 series)?

I'll ask again and let you know if I hear back.

 

In the meantime, have you tried the video that @Jaggers271 posted earlier?

 

 

 

[RagingBeard]

I just tried to copy that video, clearly something has changed as it does not perform anything like that at all!

I used 100% SS, advanced settings to off and medium preset same as him, dropped frames just sky rocket and it's unplayable.

[PJTierney]

Thanks for that, shame it's not working out.

 

As I mentioned above I've asked internally what's up with this headset so hopefully I can share something soon.

[KoniBlank]

Ohhh i thought i'm the only one with this problem!  

I had the same Issue with my vive pro in past but solved it after i disables the Aura LED in USB settings it works perfect. Now i have a G2 and the problem ist back and nothing helps! 

I think this is an USB conflict or issue... I tried out everything but i have this Framedrops too. (3090 and i9 10850K with 32GB DDR @3200MHZ) 

 

[GuusHugo]

7 hours ago, PJTierney said:

I'll ask again and let you know if I hear back.

 

In the meantime, have you tried the video that @Jaggers271 posted earlier?

 

 

 

Yes but even with settings WAY way lower then that (the lowest possible settings, even lower then the lowest preset) in combination with 50%/50% resolution in Steam and no cmaa/msaa at all; it still lags/stutters. This while with exactly the same computer/setup/settings, the game runs flawless in 2D/no VR + 4K + Ultra settings + 4xMSAA + 60hz Vsync, without a single framedrop!

I tried every single thing that I could find about this issue and I tried myself even more then that (tried even the first Nvidia driver, full reinstall of the game, deleted the mygames map in documents, reinstalled WMR, tried all possible SteamVR settings and Nvidia settings etc.etc.) but nothing works. The image keeps flickering/stuttering, always.

6 hours ago, PJTierney said:

Thanks for that, shame it's not working out.

 

As I mentioned above I've asked internally what's up with this headset so hopefully I can share something soon.

I really hope that you could get some feedback on this, a solution or at least that this issue is beeing worked on. I'm not the only one as you can read, and the more that I read online about DR2+G2+3080/90, the more users that I find that are dealing with this bug.

Thank you for your attention and let's all hope for good news soon, please keep us updated.

Edit: I just want to add that all other VR games run flawless also: Automobilista 2, Assetto Corsa Competizione run without any framedrops at all. On the same Reverb G2 + 3080 card/computer/SteamVR/WMR combination. So there is clearly something wrong with Dirt Rally 2, something "bugs" it or is incompatible... Everything besides DR2 run flawless. As you can read here from other users; they have the same problem.

Edit 2: I see that you Recommended Jaggers271's post. But in that video is no new info at all, he's just lucky that he got it working somehow without lag, but the settings that he mention DON'T solve the issue. Maybe he's using an old DR2 release, old WMR/nvidia driver/steamvr combination or an USB hub that we don't know about etc.etc. ? Only speculation! but there is nothing to solve our issue in that video.

So I recommend to remove the recommendation of this post to not cause unnecessary confusion since the issue isn't solved by this video at all !

Edited March 1, 2021 by GuusHugo
extra info 2

[GuusHugo]

12 hours ago, PJTierney said:

I'll ask again and let you know if I hear back.

 

In the meantime, have you tried the video that @Jaggers271 posted earlier?

 

 

 

I've watched this video now sevaral times on your recommendation. Could you please explain what's there to find in the video? Maybe I missed something... Since you "recommended" the video, it's now on the top of this thread; you suggest that there's a fix to find in this video. But there clearly isn't or I missed something? I only see that he runs it at medium settings, that's all but no further information.

So please let us know why you pointed this on the top of this thread or tell us what there is to find in this video?

An another update, I've found the "first" WMR drivers: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/mixed-reality/enthusiast-guide/mixed-reality-software (version: 10.0.19041.2034) This is the first driver for the G2. It also doesn't make a difference(I updated the G2 and the hololenses together..).

The oldest Nvidia driver also doesn't make a difference. So it doesn't seem to be a driver thing.

SteamVR in DX11 mode also doesn't make a difference.

The SteamVR beta option in Steam + Windows Mixed Reality for SteamVR in beta mode also doesn't make a difference.

Is there any possible way to install an older Dirt Rally 2.0 release? So that we can test that? Maybe the issue occured since the latest or one of the latest patches. I cannot find to go back to a previous DR 2.0 release... any input on this is welcome.

Thank you in advance.

[PJTierney]

Hey again.

I got word back on this and there's a few things at play here.

 

First, neither Windows Mixed Reality nor the HP Reverb G2 are officially supported by DiRT Rally 2.0, which means we're relying on however they plug into Steam VR's systems natively (in other words, there's no game code specific to WMR/G2 in the game, just Steam VR code).

That being said, after some research we came across this thread which was posted just over a week ago. That comment directs to this thread where Microsoft are aware of Windows Mixed Reality / Steam VR issues and are working with Valve to rectify them. Here is the Microsoft quote for context:

 

Quote

We do have some [WMR] feature updates in the works.

One of the notable ones is a change we're working on with Valve that'll significantly reduce the amount of GPU memory used when running SteamVR.

That one's exciting because we've found it has a cascading effect - a lot of VR workloads tend to max out the GPU memory, and reducing the amount used reduces the need for memory paging, leading to a smoother overall experience.

 

Quote

Right now the issue is that we have to create an intermediate set of GPU buffers that we copy the SteamVR content into before we send it off to our system compositor.

The change we're working on will eliminate that set of intermediate buffers.

Since each buffer is (generally) sized to match the resolution of the headset, the memory savings potential is huge.

 

It looks like the Windows Mixed Reality subreddit is very active with several Microsoft people contributing to replies, so it'd be worth keeping an eye on this for when their fix is released.

 

As for DiRT Rally 2.0, Windows Mixed Reality isn't supported as mentioned before, so I'm afraid there's no fix planned on our end.

Sorry I couldn't help any further, but I hope this information is useful and that you (and other WMR players) see their issues resolved soon 😞  

[RagingBeard]

Thanks but I have no issues in other games at all, only Dirt Rally 1 and 2.0, so I don't think it's the same issue for me. I guess that's the end of DR for me then, perhaps until a new Steam headset comes out which beats the G2. Maybe there will be a DR3 by then with VR in mind from the start, unlikely but one can hope.

[GuusHugo]

5 hours ago, RagingBeard said:

Thanks but I have no issues in other games at all, only Dirt Rally 1 and 2.0, so I don't think it's the same issue for me. I guess that's the end of DR for me then, perhaps until a new Steam headset comes out which beats the G2. Maybe there will be a DR3 by then with VR in mind from the start, unlikely but one can hope.

Same for me. Everything runs flawless in VR with this G2 headset/3080 in high resolution/settings and even ACC similair as you posted in your video's(maybe a few fps less since you have the 3090 and I have the 3080) which is the most demanding game of all.

So VERY sad to read that Codemaster refuses to give normal VR support to their best game(it simply doesn't work at all). DR2 is the best game that you guys ever made and I enjoyed the 2D experience a lot, but now that I know that VR is "next level"; it's very hard to go back to 2D. So I have to take the same conclusion as RagingBeard... " I guess that's the end of DR for me then "

10 hours ago, PJTierney said:

Hey again.

I got word back on this and there's a few things at play here.

First, neither Windows Mixed Reality nor the HP Reverb G2 are officially supported by DiRT Rally 2.0, which means we're relying on however they plug into Steam VR's systems natively (in other words, there's no game code specific to WMR/G2 in the game, just Steam VR code).

That being said, after some research we came across this thread which was posted just over a week ago. That comment directs to this thread where Microsoft are aware of Windows Mixed Reality / Steam VR issues and are working with Valve to rectify them. Here is the Microsoft quote for context:

It looks like the Windows Mixed Reality subreddit is very active with several Microsoft people contributing to replies, so it'd be worth keeping an eye on this for when their fix is released.

As for DiRT Rally 2.0, Windows Mixed Reality isn't supported as mentioned before, so I'm afraid there's no fix planned on our end.

Sorry I couldn't help any further, but I hope this information is useful and that you (and other WMR players) see their issues resolved soon 😞  

@PJTierney: "That comment directs to this thread where Microsoft are aware of Windows Mixed Reality / Steam VR issues and are working with Valve to rectify them."

We know that they are working on a bug, but that is NOT this bug. Dirt Rally 2.0 (and 1 also with "Revive") is the ONLY game that give such huge problems that even at Wolfenstein 3D settings keeps flickering/lagging, at every possible setting it stutters.

This has nothing to do with this issue, the issue that they talk about there is for performance improvement: " One of the notable ones is a change we're working on with Valve that'll significantly reduce the amount of GPU memory used when running SteamVR ".

This fix will give in general VR games in VR/SteamVR/WMR a bit more FPS/better performance. But Dirt Rally 2.0 is simply UNPLAYABLE at every single, even the lowest possible settings since the whole image flickers and give HUGE framedrops! That's not what they are solving there. I don't understand where you get that information,

If you read further there, after a few comments, Microsoft reacts with the following message as you can read there:

• "It probably reduces the frame time slightly by removing that extra operation, but the copy shouldn't be impacting performance that much. But at the same time reducing memory pressure can help a lot if stuff is getting paged out. We've definitely seen performance improvements in that scenario in our limited testing."

So it doesn't solve anything with games that simply don't work at all(Dirt Rally (2.0) is the ONLY game that stutters/flickers/framedrops with every possible setting). It's a bug that Codemasters have to fix or it will never be fixed at all. I understand from you that you don't want to support the best VR glasses in the world for sim racing (the Reverb G2 and maybe other great WMR headsets in the future) so that VR is now dead for DR2. Thank you for letting us now in the end, please let us know if codemasters changes their mind, we will appreciate all you support on this because DR2 is a GREAT game.. but will even be better in VR.

[GuusHugo]

I found something interesting: https://steamcommunity.com/app/690790/discussions/0/2270320616968522692/

I NEVER saw both eyes on the monitor here when trying to use VR with the G2. On my monitor it shows as it is in this attachment, so something with the Reverb G2 goes differenly then "normal". Maybe that's the cause of this issue?

[Ialyrn]

On 3/2/2021 at 8:38 PM, GuusHugo said:

So it doesn't solve anything with games that simply don't work at all(Dirt Rally (2.0) is the ONLY game that stutters/flickers/framedrops with every possible setting). It's a bug that Codemasters have to fix or it will never be fixed at all. I understand from you that you don't want to support the best VR glasses in the world for sim racing (the Reverb G2 and maybe other great WMR headsets in the future) so that VR is now dead for DR2. Thank you for letting us now in the end, please let us know if codemasters changes their mind, we will appreciate all you support on this because DR2 is a GREAT game.. but will even be better in VR.

Its not as simple as CodeMasters just adding support for the Reverb G2, that isnt how the whole VR thing actually works currently. Cant say if that will ever change or not, but it isnt a CodeMasters issue, but an industry issue for having a fractured system in place for VR as opposed to a set standard. This makes impletmenting every VR headset a difficult task, and more are releasing all the time.

What you find happens currently, at least in terms of VR capable games released via steam anyway. Is that they will support an entire VR platform. The two VR platforms that Dirt Rally 2.0 supports via steam, are OculusVR and SteamVR. Two very indepentant VR platforms, they have a lot of simularities, but also a lot of differences. It is the VR platform that supports the specific headsets designed to work with it.

For SteamVR, the headsets it supports directly are the Valve Index and the HTC Vive.

For Oculus VR, that is the Rift CV1, Rift S, Quest (via Oculus Link), and Quest 2 (via Oculus Link).

Dirt Rally 2 doesnt support the individual headsets, just the platforms they work on. Its up to Steam and Oculus to add that individual headset support directly into their respective VR platforms.

Windows Mixed reality is its own VR platform, not connected to either OculusVR or SteamVR. Which is a platform as a whole that Codemasters did not support when Dirt Rally 2 was made. For them to do so now, it wouldnt be a case of just flipping a switch; but making entirely new code specific to WMR as a platform. WMR also wasnt really going that great before the HP reverb came along, which has now been followed by the reverb G2. WMR was practically a dead platform till that point. So it makes sense that CodeMaster's didnt support the WMR VR platform at the time DR2.0 was made.

I use Oculus to play in VR, but I have played DR2.0 using SteamVR also. And it always performed worse than native Oculus does.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There are perhaps a few things you can do to help matters, if you are willing to try.

Multi sampling - I use none, this is a known FPS eater in VR in Dirt Rally 2. On top of this, I would also make sure there is ZERO super sampling going on with this title. No matter what VR platform you use. This includes making sure that your per eye resolution is set right in steamVR.

Screen space reflections - I turn this one off completely in VR.

Night Light - I set this to "low", as I found it caused intermittent stuttering on night stages in VR.

Crowds - I set this to "low". Crowds set higher than "low" causes stuttering anytime spectators are visible. This happens in both VR and non VR modes. A long standing issue with multiple CodeMaster titles.

Vehicle details - I set this to "low" also, as I found any higher caused lag when the car lights are turned on. Especially on stages with lots of trees, such as Wales and Scotland.

I turn turn off the following settings -
God Rays
Chromatic Aberration
Bloom
Light Streaks

The rest of the in game graphical settings, I found to be much more forgiving. But items like "mirrors", "Reflections", and Shadows" can be lowered for better general FPS. I personally have these set to medium. Any other setting, I have set to high.

There are a couple of file tweaks you can make also, in the games "C:\Users\xxx\Documents\My Games\DiRT Rally 2.0\hardwaresettings" folder. Inside the file "hardware_settings_config_VR"

You ideally want to set these particular settings as follows, as it helps with performance and also helps a little with reading text in VR (for some daft reason).

<resolution width="1280" height="720" aspect="auto" fullscreen="0" vsync="0"

Setting those parameters will not change the resolution inside your VR headset, just what is displayed on the desktop while you are in VR. It also wont adjust the settings for when you play the game outside of VR.

Also, disable "steamVR home". I found it to be a massive GPU resource hog. To the point as soon as I start up steamVR with SteamVR home enabled, I hear my GPU fans ramp up drastically. And thats before starting a game. So disabling it may help you gain a little extra performance in VR in general, not just in Dirt Rally 2.0

You have to also keep in mind that your Reverb G2's have a much higher resolution than my 2 Oculus headsets. Your headsets will be harder to run anyway. I am not posting this information up to say that your not having issues, or that you cant be having them because I can play the game in VR without issues. I am posting it up to try and help you get some enjoyment from the game while you wait for Microsoft and Steam to come up with a solution to improve your overall performance. Dirt Rally 2 isnt the best game on the market for VR performance as it is. In all honesty, even on Oculus. It has more issues than any other VR game I have ever tried to run to date. That includes ACC, which is a very demanding game to run in VR. I find Dirt Rally 2 harder to get good performance out of. So your not alone. You literally have to tweak and tease Dirt Rally 2.0 in VR in order to get a good experience. No matter what platform you are using for VR. Its just Oculus has the easiest time of it.

[RagingBeard]

I appreciate the long reply, but this issue isn't related to performance as has been discussed. Dropped frame occur at low settings and resolution in the G2, but do not occur on the same system using a different headset with very high settings and resolution.

[Ialyrn]

49 minutes ago, RagingBeard said:

I appreciate the long reply, but this issue isn't related to performance as has been discussed. Dropped frame occur at low settings and resolution in the G2, but do not occur on the same system using a different headset with very high settings and resolution.

Another thing you all can look at, is in regards to USB. A lot of onboard USB 3.0 setups suffer from bandwidth issues, which can cause a good amount of stuttering and other problems in VR. You often find that you need a powered PCI-E USB 3.0/3.1 expansion card in order to run VR properly. I had to buy one for my current gaming PC, as my Oculus headsets (I have a CV1 and a Rift S) both hated the on board USB.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Inateck-Superspeed-Ports-PCI-Expansion/dp/B00B6ZCNGM/ref=sr_1_10?crid=1Z6WF42877WOJ&amp;dchild=1&amp;keywords=pci-e+usb+3.0+card&amp;qid=1614904270&amp;sprefix=pci-e+usb+%2Caps%2C147&amp;sr=8-10

This is the one I had to buy, and it resolved all USB related issues. Its a fairly small outlay. Its actually really difficult to tell if its a USB issue, unless you happen to have a second system with an entirely different motherboard that you know 100% works with your current VR headset properly in order to test with. I just happened to be in that posistion, as I have 2 gaming desktops and a gaming laptop. Both of my Rift headsets worked flawelessly on my old gaming desktop and my laptop, but not on my new gaming desktop. So I knew for sure it was a USB issue in my case.

It might be worth a try for anyone suffering with issues with their Reverb G2's, especially if they have beefy specs.

In regards to my specs.

Desktop System 1 (my old gaming rig).
MSI Z170A Krait Gaming (VR worked perfectly on this motherboards USB 3.0).
i7 6700k quad core
16gb (2x8gb) 3000mhz DDR4 dual channel ram
8gb GTX 1080

Desktop system 2 (current gaming rig).-
Asus ROG Strix Z490 Gaming-E (VR didnt work well at all on this motherboards USB 3.0. Suffering with stutters and total drop outs).
i7 10700k octa core
16gb (2x8gb) 3200Mhz DDR 4 dual channel ram
RTX 2070 super.

MSI Gaming laptop -
i7 8750H hex core
16gb 2666Mhz DDR4
GTX1070 laptop GPU with 8gb dedicated Vram

Edited March 5, 2021 by Ialyrn