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why does ferrari not have mission winnow?


CF1Cypher

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Mission Winnow won't be included in the game as Velo in McLaren. These companies as @SmokyAtom07 mentioned are tied to tobacco companies so they cannot be included in a video game. If you want to have mission winnow and velo on McLaren so much just wait till the game releases and moders will probably add them.

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yeah, with PEGI and ESRB i thinks they are very stringent on references to like alcohol and drugs for instance when Williams was sponsored by martini, we would always have the Bahrain livery same basically applies to mission winnow and velo as its advertising something restricted to over 18.

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1 hour ago, SmokyAtom07 said:

I believe it's tied to a tobacco company and that affects the age rating to include it.

It hasn't been included in previous game and it's highly unlikely they'll change tack now so don't expect any inclusion of the logo.

This is the correct answer. 

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3 hours ago, PJTierney said:

This is the correct answer. 

Why can Codies not add age verification into the game settings similar to what the Nascar Heat devs did?

If that's not possible, why not a "F" that's designed similar to the MW logo then?     The same with the McLaren car... instead of leaving the blue side pod blank, why not just put McLaren in there in white text?  At least they'll look somewhat closer to the real liveries then.  Take a look at what the devs of Nascar Heat did with the alcohol sponsors.   For example Brad Keselowski's Miller Lite car, instead of "Lite" across the hood, in a similar styled font it says "Brad".  I didn't like the use of the drivers name, but I get why they did it in that game, here though for F1 I think if we added the McLaren text based logo on that blue sidepod it would look so much nicer.  Something similar could be done with the Ferarri/MissionWinnow logo, no?

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3 minutes ago, petro1319 said:

Why can Codies not add age verification into the game settings similar to what the Nascar Heat devs did?

If that's not possible, why not a "F" that's designed similar to the MW logo then?     The same with the McLaren car... instead of leaving the blue side pod blank, why not just put McLaren in there in white text?  At least they'll look somewhat closer to the real liveries then.  Take a look at what the devs of Nascar Heat did with the alcohol sponsors.   For example Brad Keselowski's Miller Lite car, instead of "Lite" across the hood, in a similar styled font it says "Brad".  I didn't like the use of the drivers name, but I get why they did it in that game, here though for F1 I think if we added the McLaren text based logo on that blue sidepod it would look so much nicer.  Something similar could be done with the Ferarri/MissionWinnow logo, no?

Things like that obviously WOULD be possible.  However, they haven't done that in real life and the game isn't there to work around what would aesthetically look better, but more to reflect what the car realistically looks like.

There's precedent for things like this, where; Mild Seven became Team Spirit. West became Mika/David.  I think Lucky Strike had something similar with a replacement on the BAR. However, they were things that the teams actually did to cover up, or rather replace, the sponsors. Ferrari don't do that. They leave it blank when not using the logo and that is what the game incorporates to reflect realism. 

McLaren do use other sponsors in that location where Velo aren't permitted, I believe. However, I don't think they're used frequently enough to be classed as their main sidepod sponsor so it's left blank. I know A Better Tomorrow and Velo are both tobacco based and they're the only two I can recall on the sidepod off the top of my head. 

No harm in asking for something, I guess. I just don't think it's something that will be strongly considered. On PC, mods will fix your request. On console, may be just something you have to struggle on with, unfortunately. 

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27 minutes ago, PJTierney said:

That's up to Ferrari/McLaren and if they want such things on the car, Codemasters can't just do "whatever" when it comes to licensed content 😉 

Then why / how is it possible to leave parts of the liveries away / skip sponsors? Are not all sponsors to be treated equally under that license? Would be interesting to learn.

Edit - fun fact: In the news April 15th concerning the release date of F1 2021 where all car designs are shown in a slide show / side view, the Ferrari car is not even there, because it would be so (too) obvious that this is not the real thing. Its a shame somehow, and I recall the old commendatore saying "my cars do not smoke" 😛

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1 minute ago, Schneehase said:

Then why / how is it possible to leave parts of the liveries away / skip sponsors? Are not all sponsors to be treated equally under that license? Would be interesting to learn.

There is a relationship between Codemasters and the teams to establish how they both want the car to appear.

For example, the Ferrari team says what it would like the car to look like. Codemasters say "we're not comfortable with having the tobacco company logo". They agree to have the exact car without the logo. It's basically compromising and dealing with it like adults.   The teams, and the respective 'banned' companies, aren't stupid and know the effect of having an alcohol/smoking logo on a 3+ game and they know it's not worth the hassle of getting it included, because it just wouldn't be feasible for all parties. 

Those that play the game generally enjoy the sport in real-life. That's where they'll see the logos.  A 5-6 year old who just wants to play a racing game will be upset when it turns out to be an 18 because of a tobacco company, who then by proxy get a bad reputation. That's not positive marketing for them and people asking "hey, where's that logo?" is better advertising of their product. 

It's not Codemasters leaving parts out willy-nilly. They agree the appearance of the car with the respective teams. 

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Why not have an 18+ version in addition then? Could be a DLC or sumsuch. Or finally include an editor, so noone has to fiddle with photoshop any more just to get closer to the real thing, and we can finally switch back Hamilton versus Bottas stats.

On a different note, it is strange that a 3+ game has no problem with "terminal damage" but it does with 2 letters in green color 😄 

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5 hours ago, kyrillos152 said:

Mission Winnow won't be included in the game as Velo in McLaren. These companies as @SmokyAtom07 mentioned are tied to tobacco companies so they cannot be included in a video game. If you want to have mission winnow and velo on McLaren so much just wait till the game releases and moders will probably add them.

 

5 hours ago, Nightfire1964 said:

yeah, with PEGI and ESRB i thinks they are very stringent on references to like alcohol and drugs for instance when Williams was sponsored by martini, we would always have the Bahrain livery same basically applies to mission winnow and velo as its advertising something restricted to over 18.

 

4 hours ago, PJTierney said:

This is the correct answer. 

 

How come Singha is in the game since 2019, if tobacco and alcohol sponsors are supposedly "not allowed"?

 

Singha is a Thai Beer company!

 

f1-2021-screenshot-1.jpg

220px-Singha_Beer.jpg

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singha

 

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7 minutes ago, Schneehase said:

Why not have an 18+ version in addition then? Could be a DLC or sumsuch. Or finally include an editor, so noone has to fiddle with photoshop any more just to get closer to the real thing, and we can finally switch back Hamilton versus Bottas stats.

On a different note, it is strange that a 3+ game has no problem with "terminal damage" but it does with 2 letters in green color 😄 

I don't think it's the green letters themselves that they have problems with... more the context of the company the letters represent! 

I agree it'd look aesthetically better to have some logo's there. I just accept that it isn't a feasible option. 

I think it's good marketing for them to NOT be on the car as it increases discussions about them which is subliminal marketing at its finest. Advertising when not advertising. 

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8 minutes ago, SturmDesTodes said:

 

 

 

How come Singha is in the game since 2019, if tobacco and alcohol sponsors are supposedly "not allowed"?

 

Singha is a Thai Beer company!

 

f1-2021-screenshot-1.jpg

220px-Singha_Beer.jpg

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singha

 

That is a very valid point. However, I know they also do non-alcohol things with mineral water and green tea. I guess that gives them a little leeway.

Plus it's usually the Whisky / other assorted spirits that mainly feel the brunt of the alcohol rules. 

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1 hour ago, PJTierney said:

That's up to Ferrari/McLaren and if they want such things on the car, Codemasters can't just do "whatever" when it comes to licensed content 😉 

Fair enough, So safe to say it's a licensing issue then that even prevents you guys from putting even something generic on the car.  Surprised McLaren or Ferrari would be upset with it being their own logo, or slogan though.  Licensing is a funny, frustrating thing though I imagine.   Thanks for the response though!  Hopefully they come around to the idea down the road.

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12 minutes ago, petro1319 said:

Fair enough, So safe to say it's a licensing issue then that even prevents you guys from putting even something generic on the car.  Surprised McLaren or Ferrari would be upset with it being their own logo, or slogan though.  Licensing is a funny, frustrating thing though I imagine.   Thanks for the response though!  Hopefully they come around to the idea down the road.

yes but whether the said sponsor would be happy about their space being used like that is another thing you have to think about

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Does Singha have a non-alcoholic beer?  Am I imagining things/confusing it with real world F1 but weren't there Heineken sponsors on track walls in F12020 because of their 0 alcohol products?   Again, maybe I'm confusing my time spent in F1 2020 the game with watching real F1.   Maybe that's a sign I've turned too many laps in the game..  😄

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3 minutes ago, Nightfire1964 said:

yes but whether the said sponsor would be happy about their space being used like that is another thing you have to think about

It does seem odd to me that a fully licensed game like Gran Turismo allows you apply any livry, sponsor decal, anything you really want at all to any licensed car in the game and take it online for the world to see your hello kitty themed BMW M5. 

Yet F1 we can't even add a fictional sponsor to a blank space. 

Honestly don't get why it's so tightly controlled like this, do they really protect anything in this way? 

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5 minutes ago, Nightfire1964 said:

yes but whether the said sponsor would be happy about their space being used like that is another thing you have to think about

True.   I deal with licensing issues sometimes in my daily work life.  Funny thing is I represent these other companies promoting and selling their products; but I'm not allowed to use any of their logo's etc. in promotional material due to licensing.  It's a nightmare and really makes no sense to me since I'm here to sell their stuff; but we can't use their logo's without their permission.  I get protecting the brand and stuff, but it's just a nightmare.  Just figured since we've seen alternative options used in other games rather than blank spaces that there may be an easy solution here that maybe wasn't thought of previously.  As I said earlier, licensing is a nightmare to deal with.   Just surprised a company that CANT have their logo in the game would be concerned with a generic placeholder that slightly resembles their logo.  Not sure how the devs for Nascar Heat got around it with all the sponsors and stakeholders there, but they did so I figured it may be possible here.

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3 minutes ago, KNT2011 said:

It does seem odd to me that a fully licensed game like Gran Turismo allows you apply any livry, sponsor decal, anything you really want at all to any licensed car in the game and take it online for the world to see your hello kitty themed BMW M5. 

Yet F1 we can't even add a fictional sponsor to a blank space. 

Honestly don't get why it's so tightly controlled like this, do they really protect anything in this way? 

Braking Point will be quite interesting as it's going to cover multiple season, 2019 F2, 2020 and 2021 F1, the cars will have to reflect their liveries and sponsors from these years then? 

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2 minutes ago, KNT2011 said:

It does seem odd to me that a fully licensed game like Gran Turismo allows you apply any livry, sponsor decal, anything you really want at all to any licensed car in the game and take it online for the world to see your hello kitty themed BMW M5. 

Yet F1 we can't even add a fictional sponsor to a blank space. 

Honestly don't get why it's so tightly controlled like this, do they really protect anything in this way? 

well with the BMW you just have to get permission from one owner and seeing their cars are used in a whole host of games like forza and GT it's easy whereas with f1 you have the cars whit a good many sponsors all have different agendas with how they like there logo being used. you also have to deal with F1 as a whole. and for this reason of liveries is why Toyota or Mitsubishi can't fully remember stopped allowin their cars to be in games like forza horizon

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4 minutes ago, Nightfire1964 said:

well with the BMW you just have to get permission from one owner and seeing their cars are used in a whole host of games like forza and GT it's easy whereas with f1 you have the cars whit a good many sponsors all have different agendas with how they like there logo being used. you also have to deal with F1 as a whole. and for this reason of liveries is why Toyota or Mitsubishi can't fully remember stopped allowin their cars to be in games like forza horizon

The counter argument would be MotoGP allows customisation to a very similiar level to GTS, but perhaps their brand and companies involved aren't in such a strong position where locking out these kind of things is viable. 

At the very least I do hope for some more tools to come to MyTeam / Multiplayer livery design. Rather than just a handful of specific spots, to be able to go nuts with the colours, design and sizing of premade (if it has to be that way) sponsor designs would be a big step up. Including on suits and helmets as well. Those are still bugged now tbh. 

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26 minutes ago, KNT2011 said:

The counter argument would be MotoGP allows customisation to a very similiar level to GTS, but perhaps their brand and companies involved aren't in such a strong position where locking out these kind of things is viable. 

At the very least I do hope for some more tools to come to MyTeam / Multiplayer livery design. Rather than just a handful of specific spots, to be able to go nuts with the colours, design and sizing of premade (if it has to be that way) sponsor designs would be a big step up. Including on suits and helmets as well. Those are still bugged now tbh. 

One possibility is that, they would lose an opportunity to monetize if players could freely create liveries to the level of games like Forza or GTS, not to mention creating that system probably requires more sophisticated programming which might be a lot of work but with very little reward from the developer perspective. 

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1 hour ago, KNT2011 said:

It does seem odd to me that a fully licensed game like Gran Turismo allows you apply any livry, sponsor decal, anything you really want at all to any licensed car in the game and take it online for the world to see your hello kitty themed BMW M5. 

Yet F1 we can't even add a fictional sponsor to a blank space. 

Honestly don't get why it's so tightly controlled like this, do they really protect anything in this way? 

Licensing is a very complicated process of trying to get hundreds of brands to agree on things. Also "company X does it, so why can't company Y?" can simply be answered by each brand and developer/publisher having unique relationships and requirements.

 

For a little insight into this, here's a blog post:

 

Side-note, it's not just teams and drivers that require licensor approval, everything that is owned by an external entity requires such things, even individual buildings in famous cities (look up the credits for GRID on that one).

Our Licensing team are heroes for navigating such complicated things for every game 🙂 

 

The motor(sports) industry is way bigger than the videogame industry; they call the shots 😉 

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1 minute ago, PJTierney said:

Licensing is a very complicated process of trying to get hundreds of brands to agree on things. 

 

For a little insight into this, here's a blog post:

No, I understand, It's just frustrating, and seems backwards. Do they not want to be shown in a video game? I understand they want control over their image but man, it's so counter productive for something that benefits THEM. 

I remember discussions around giving the player the chance to have say customizable Alpinestar racing gloves, ala other games that cnan do this, and just unreal to me that Alpinestar would consider this something CM should pay them for? They don't want the publicity? Bonkers. 

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2 hours ago, petro1319 said:

Does Singha have a non-alcoholic beer?  Am I imagining things/confusing it with real world F1 but weren't there Heineken sponsors on track walls in F12020 because of their 0 alcohol products?   Again, maybe I'm confusing my time spent in F1 2020 the game with watching real F1.   Maybe that's a sign I've turned too many laps in the game..  😄

I don't think there are Heineken adverts in F1 2020 but I have a vague recollection that there may have been in the beta version that YouTubers were playing this time last year? 

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12 minutes ago, Ultra3142 said:

I don't think there are Heineken adverts in F1 2020 but I have a vague recollection that there may have been in the beta version that YouTubers were playing this time last year? 

I can't remember if the game had Heineken boards, but one possibility is that he had mod installed (the realistic sponsors mod or something, I have them)

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What I don’t get though. In FIFA if you play in English language all teams that have a bookmaker as jersey sponsor, have it on the jersey in the game as well. Why is a bookmaker allowed, but a name which no common person knows is tied to Marlboro isn’t?

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35 minutes ago, DRTApophis said:

I can't remember if the game had Heineken boards, but one possibility is that he had mod installed (the realistic sponsors mod or something, I have them)

I'm sure the strict rules on what can be shown re. preview builds would have prevented that. I may be misremembering, just something I have a vague recollection of. 

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I've just checked some old videos. What I was remembering is that last years' preview build had the Heineken 'When you drink, never drive' advertising boards round at least Vietnam but these were removed in the released version. They didn't say Heineken on them but the association was presumably still judged to be reason enough to remove them despite the positive message.

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You know, one could solve this in several ways. I cant fathom that Ferrari themselves want as little sponsor reference on their in game cars as possible. Why not have a green area, or green stripes, or whatever at the proper spot and this would be so much more immersive? Counts for McLaren als well, even having a white bar in that place would look better (or make LOVE not VELO^^).

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5 hours ago, Schneehase said:

You know, one could solve this in several ways. I cant fathom that Ferrari themselves want as little sponsor reference on their in game cars as possible. Why not have a green area, or green stripes, or whatever at the proper spot and this would be so much more immersive? Counts for McLaren als well, even having a white bar in that place would look better (or make LOVE not VELO^^).

MW logo not on the Ferrari is more immersive than using green stripes as replacement, because that logo won't be on their car on every track anyways. And, tbh, using random stripes would make an already ugly livery even worse LOL

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4 hours ago, Schneehase said:

I would not have a problem if the livery changed depending on the track - but noone will demand that much realism from the devs, will we?

Well, people have been demanding WAY more stuff than that LOL

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