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Coop career: Ferrari vs. Aston Martin?


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My Friend and me wanna start a coop season. We are thinking about which of the teams would make the most fun for our expierence we want.

50% Race, Full Qualifying, 1 Practise per race-weekend, the other will be skipped, 97 AI Level. On this level we are more or less as good as our teammates in the One-Lap-Qualifying-tests in bahrain and spain, so this level should make a realistic performance overall. 

1. Our Settings:

All Career Settings are low (income money, amount af R&D points etc.) except of Team AI Acclaim and our Team Acclaim. We hope that we have a lower development speed, because in the past games, you could make an update almost every race. The development speed was so high, that in the end of a season a williams almost could have the strengh of a mercedes at the beginning of the season, what is quiet unrealistic. We hope with a lower R&D Rate setting, this problem is solved. What are your expierences here? We kept the Team AI acclaim on standard because we hope, that a higher team acclaim next to a lower AI Driver acclaim income, makes unrealistic driver transfers more rare. Maybe we should put the Team AI acclaim income to "high"? What do you think? Other ideas?  By the way does the failure rate settings depends on worn engine parts or is this setting independently from the engine wear? So, do we still have influence on the the possibility to get a engine failure, when we put this setting on high? 

2. infrastructure of the teams

I noticed that Aston Martin has a better car in the beginning of the season (ca. 1-2 tenth quicker overall). But if I look at the facilitilys of the teams, Ferrari seems to have much more potential than AM. Ferraris Facilities are about mostly 3 and 2, instead of AM which has facilities with level 2 and 1. The amount of R&D Points Ferrari gets from its facilities is ca. twice as high. Besides that, with the higher level for its facilities Ferrari seems to be able to have a higher amount of upgrades per season, because of development speed and lower failure rate. We are not sure, maybe development with ferrari is too easy? Is AM more a challange? How are your expierences? Does the teams invest in their facilities over a season automatically or does the level of facilities never change here? 

3. Our goals:

We want realistic expierences. We want to do one practise each Race weekend in which we try to do finish every R&D Programm. So the amount of R&D from practise would be high. Maybe to high (with a ferrari)? 

We want a challange where we have to fight about points in the first half of a season, maybe a fight about P3 in the constructors in Season 1 and in Season 2 we want to attack the top Teams. This should be possible with both teams. What do you think? What are your expierences, what would you advise? 🙂 

Edited by DonBlanko
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  • DonBlanko changed the title to Coop career: Ferrari vs. Aston Martin?

I think if you have the R&D rate set to low, that it should take at least three seasons to max out your car...what I recall seeing last year was that players could max out their car within 2, maybe 2.5 seasons, and at that point it's just a matter of banking points until new regs come into play and trying to keep everything. If "low" speed can't make that part take at least 3 seasons it seems like that's a problem in a 10 year mode.

In a MT save I just started, I set everything to low. My guess was that it was reasonable to interpret as "low" = slow changes, but I don't think anyone's done enough racing/simming to report on their findings yet.

No surprise that Ferrari would have better facilities; I'm sure they have better ones (or at least bigger and more expensive ones). Surely Codies/EA expect Ferrari moving to the front of the field more likely than AM, and it might even have been expected by the FIA that they build it in that way.

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I don't know if the changed the potentials of the car from last season but AM/RP was quite high in the end, so I think your objectives are quite on point.

I'm on Italy in MyTeam with the same debuffs and the car starts in the lower end of the spectrum and I just reached alpine in RD but can't go much higher because no moneys for infrastructure. Its noticeable slower but it is still quite faster than the AI...maybe high RD for the AI might offset this if one doesnt think that the player debuff is not enough (didnt test it).

For me the problem is not really RD points per se, but how quickly you get those boosts doing training. Since you're going for a one session of practice only, might wanna consider just being allowed to do each programme once to give a bit more of a challenge.

In regards to failure rate, it gets higher with wear but it can happen too on a brand new equipment, depends a bit on the engine reliability. On Baku I had a DNF because my new MGUH blew...I was on a great race. 12 races, 1 DNF so far. I had one problem with DRS and 2 with ERS glitching software and 1 gear failing on the sixth race of the first gearbox set. Oh, renault engine btw.

All in all, the faults gave me a nice touch to wake up in the races and have been really enjoying it.

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50 minutes ago, diderooy said:

I think if you have the R&D rate set to low, that it should take at least three seasons to max out your car...what I recall seeing last year was that players could max out their car within 2, maybe 2.5 seasons, and at that point it's just a matter of banking points until new regs come into play and trying to keep everything. If "low" speed can't make that part take at least 3 seasons it seems like that's a problem in a 10 year mode.

In a MT save I just started, I set everything to low. My guess was that it was reasonable to interpret as "low" = slow changes, but I don't think anyone's done enough racing/simming to report on their findings yet.

No surprise that Ferrari would have better facilities; I'm sure they have better ones (or at least bigger and more expensive ones). Surely Codies/EA expect Ferrari moving to the front of the field more likely than AM, and it might even have been expected by the FIA that they build it in that way.

Yep that was a big problem of immersion, that the development was far to fast. So we had the same thoughts with setting everything to low. You may be right, that the most of us has not enough expierences, but nevertheless some of us did career mode in single player already and it seems to be almost the same with the coop mode.

Jep it is no surprise and quiet realistic, that Ferrari has good facilities. I mean, they are a big team with big financial possibilites. I like that the infracture of the teams is quiet different and realistic. 

What is your standing in your MT save now in point of development or are you still in Bahrain / First Race?

27 minutes ago, Hichel18 said:

I don't know if the changed the potentials of the car from last season but AM/RP was quite high in the end, so I think your objectives are quite on point.

I'm on Italy in MyTeam with the same debuffs and the car starts in the lower end of the spectrum and I just reached alpine in RD but can't go much higher because no moneys for infrastructure. Its noticeable slower but it is still quite faster than the AI...maybe high RD for the AI might offset this if one doesnt think that the player debuff is not enough (didnt test it).

For me the problem is not really RD points per se, but how quickly you get those boosts doing training. Since you're going for a one session of practice only, might wanna consider just being allowed to do each programme once to give a bit more of a challenge.

In regards to failure rate, it gets higher with wear but it can happen too on a brand new equipment, depends a bit on the engine reliability. On Baku I had a DNF because my new MGUH blew...I was on a great race. 12 races, 1 DNF so far. I had one problem with DRS and 2 with ERS glitching software and 1 gear failing on the sixth race of the first gearbox set. Oh, renault engine btw.

All in all, the faults gave me a nice touch to wake up in the races and have been really enjoying it.

If you reached alpine in R&D in Italy, your development speed is quiet realistic i guess. I mean it does not seem to be overpowered then. Maybe it is a bit, but not that much. A bit of progession should still be there, otherwise it is impossible to win the championship sometime. 😄 

Your Idea to set AI R&D amount (or how was setting called) on standard or high could be a good way to make the challenge harder. But I am afraid, that maybe we are not fast enough in developing anymore, if the AI overtakes us in development speed. I don't know how much the changes of settings effects totaly. 

You mean, that only one of us should do f.e. ERS programm per race-weekend and not both? Would we get twice of the amount of R&D if we do both the same practise programm? If yes, this could be to easy of getting R&D points I guess. Like you mentioned. It is difficult to find the right balance, but it is importend to have it for a realistic immersive challenge. 

And great what you expierenced with the engine failures. This is the expierence I wished for. 1 DNF Failure in 12 Races is really okay. Not to much, not to less. You mean, when we increase engine relability the chance of getting Engine failures decreases overall? 

 

Thanks for your answers!

Edited by DonBlanko
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1 minute ago, DonBlanko said:

Yep that was a big problem of immersion, that the development was far to fast. So we had the same thoughts with setting everything to low. You may be right, that the most of us has not enough expierences, but nevertheless some of us did career mode in single player already and it seems to be almost the same with the coop mode.

Jep it is no surprise and quiet realistic, that Ferrari has good facilities. I mean, they are a big team with big financial possibilites. I like that the infracture of the teams is quiet different and realistic. 

What is your standing in your MT save now in point of development or are you still in Bahrain / First Race?

If you reached alpine in R&D in Italy, your development speed is quiet realistic i guess. I mean it does not seem to be overpowered then. Maybe it is a bit, but not that much. A bit of progession should still be there, otherwise it is impossible to win the championship sometime. 😄 

Your Idea to set AI R&D amount (or how was setting called) on standard or high could be a good way to make the challenge harder. But I am afraid, that maybe we are not fast enough in developing anymore, if the AI overtakes us in development speed. I don't know how much the changes of settings effects totaly. 

You mean, that only one of us should do f.e. ERS programm per race-weekend and not both? Would we get twice of the amount of R&D if we do both the same practise programm? If yes, this could be to easy of getting R&D points I guess. Like you mentioned. It is difficult to find the right balance, but it is importend to have it for a realistic immersive challenge. 

And great what you expierenced with the engine failures. This is the expierence I wished for. 1 DNF Failure in 12 Races is really okay. Not to much, not to less. You mean, when we increase engine relability the chance of getting Engine failures decreases overall? 

No no, Both can do it, but run it only once each programme, so if an objective miss, its still ok. But, if you think progress is ok on How i described, i did every programme, usually reaching all objectives, so its fair game too 😄

Ive been steadily investing on reliability, i dont know how it improves because the game doesnt really specify, but it does affect because some teams does suffer from it.

I think you can change options midseason so if anything its possible to increase the AI benefits.

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1 hour ago, DonBlanko said:

nevertheless some of us did career mode in single player already and it seems to be almost the same with the coop mode.

What is your standing in your MT save now in point of development or are you still in Bahrain / First Race?

With that first part, are you saying that you (or someone you're in contact with) has already done/simmed a bunch of single player career and found the results to be similar in terms of R&D points between this year and last year? Or are you saying between this year single-player and coop career?

_________

For the second part, I just got through Bahrain last night. It starts you with the 1,000 points and I earned another 500ish (or more?) during that weekend between me and Guanyu Zhou. I didn't catch the bonus %s listed at first, I was just looking at the department bonus/penalty numbers, so spent too much on a high-morale department upgrade that had no bonus. I later noticed the practice program bonuses and did some of those...one of the spark plug upgrades (engine power, minor I think) was 33% off! Got another (major, I think) upgrade for something like 18% off because of a practice bonus.

I suppose they need to make the discounts big enough to make it worth doing things in an order that you wouldn't otherwise have chosen. I suspect, though, that because of A.) the number of upgrades per department in the last two editions of the game, and B.) based on the amount of "performance" it's adding to the bar in the team comparison chart as you add upgrades, that it will not take nearly as long to complete the R&D tree as it used to...

Would love to see the math on that from someone who got it all completed.

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2 hours ago, diderooy said:

With that first part, are you saying that you (or someone you're in contact with) has already done/simmed a bunch of single player career and found the results to be similar in terms of R&D points between this year and last year? Or are you saying between this year single-player and coop career?

_________

For the second part, I just got through Bahrain last night. It starts you with the 1,000 points and I earned another 500ish (or more?) during that weekend between me and Guanyu Zhou. I didn't catch the bonus %s listed at first, I was just looking at the department bonus/penalty numbers, so spent too much on a high-morale department upgrade that had no bonus. I later noticed the practice program bonuses and did some of those...one of the spark plug upgrades (engine power, minor I think) was 33% off! Got another (major, I think) upgrade for something like 18% off because of a practice bonus.

I suppose they need to make the discounts big enough to make it worth doing things in an order that you wouldn't otherwise have chosen. I suspect, though, that because of A.) the number of upgrades per department in the last two editions of the game, and B.) based on the amount of "performance" it's adding to the bar in the team comparison chart as you add upgrades, that it will not take nearly as long to complete the R&D tree as it used to...

Would love to see the math on that from someone who got it all completed.

While i dont have the numbers, it seems to be that minor upgrades receive a higher discount value than major upgrades, so they tend to level out in numbers deducted. At the start of the mode since we have few parts to upgrade, they quickly add up, but as the number of parts to develop grows, the discounts are more distributed.

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14 hours ago, diderooy said:

With that first part, are you saying that you (or someone you're in contact with) has already done/simmed a bunch of single player career and found the results to be similar in terms of R&D points between this year and last year? Or are you saying between this year single-player and coop career?

_________

For the second part, I just got through Bahrain last night. It starts you with the 1,000 points and I earned another 500ish (or more?) during that weekend between me and Guanyu Zhou. I didn't catch the bonus %s listed at first, I was just looking at the department bonus/penalty numbers, so spent too much on a high-morale department upgrade that had no bonus. I later noticed the practice program bonuses and did some of those...one of the spark plug upgrades (engine power, minor I think) was 33% off! Got another (major, I think) upgrade for something like 18% off because of a practice bonus.

I suppose they need to make the discounts big enough to make it worth doing things in an order that you wouldn't otherwise have chosen. I suspect, though, that because of A.) the number of upgrades per department in the last two editions of the game, and B.) based on the amount of "performance" it's adding to the bar in the team comparison chart as you add upgrades, that it will not take nearly as long to complete the R&D tree as it used to...

Would love to see the math on that from someone who got it all completed.

I was talking about the underlined one.

Good point with the bonus. I also didn't spend much time on looking at this but you are right, sometimes the effect of these bonuses is quiet noticeable. Hm.. I hope you are not right. 😄 I really don't want faster development. Maybe I am wrong, but isn't it unrealistic how fast the development is in the games ? But yes we still shouldn't forget, that it is a game, right. But maybe I am wrong and the amount of updates, which the teams put on the car in a season, is quiet realistic and just the effect and possibility to much in the game? I don't know. But when I look on what @Hichel18 wrote, it is quiet okay with his development speed in this game compared to the AI, depends on where his car in MT started. 

I think we will decrease the amount of updates overall per race and bring more bigger updates in a season after each 3-4 races. This should be a more realistic und noticble effect of the updates.

By the way, does anyone know the overall effect of setting the R&D rate to low instead of standard? What it is in numbers or percent? 

 

 

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7 hours ago, DonBlanko said:

 

By the way, does anyone know the overall effect of setting the R&D rate to low instead of standard? What it is in numbers or percent? 

 

 

25% less points gained. Doing a full practice nets you 450 instead of 600 (at least on myteam). That is also true to all source of RD that you stand to gain.

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