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Bottoming Out - Is there an Equation for this?


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In trying to come up with a way to know whether a car bottomed out in the telemetry programs - the variables would seem to be ride height (reference plane) -10 (thickness of plank) and the four wheel suspension positions. The wheel positions in the UDP data seem to be set very close to 0 when the car is not moving - so 0 would seem to be when that wheel is at ride height (for front or back). So couldn't you figure what the real-time plane of the plank is - given the four different wheel suspension position, -10 for the actual thickness of the plank... and then whether there is part of the plank (or all) touching the ground. 

The problem seems to be that while there is useful data for the movement of the four wheel suspension positions - that is not true for front and rear ride height which is abstracted and not realistically measurable. So if Codemasters would assign a real height value we could figure bottoming out - but without it...  

Or are my calculations just way off base?

Thanks

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On 8/12/2021 at 12:42 AM, dwin20 said:

In trying to come up with a way to know whether a car bottomed out in the telemetry programs - the variables would seem to be ride height (reference plane) -10 (thickness of plank) and the four wheel suspension positions. The wheel positions in the UDP data seem to be set very close to 0 when the car is not moving - so 0 would seem to be when that wheel is at ride height (for front or back). So couldn't you figure what the real-time plane of the plank is - given the four different wheel suspension position, -10 for the actual thickness of the plank... and then whether there is part of the plank (or all) touching the ground. 

The problem seems to be that while there is useful data for the movement of the four wheel suspension positions - that is not true for front and rear ride height which is abstracted and not realistically measurable. So if Codemasters would assign a real height value we could figure bottoming out - but without it...  

Or are my calculations just way off base?

Thanks

Nope bud, you are right, and finally someone else are pointing at the problem. This game doesn't share what we really need for telemetry! It's impossible to understand real ride height, as it's impossible to estimate aero load! An 11 rear wing Vs a 1 rear wing results in same suspension travel..so it's not adding any further compression aka impossible to estimate aero load. Not to mention rear and front coefficient of lift its the exactly the same, as if the front and rear wing generate same load! Plus the fact they keep using clicks instead of NM or mm or Angles... This game need a seriously step into realism. 

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On 8/18/2021 at 2:21 PM, Alastre said:

Nope bud, you are right, and finally someone else are pointing at the problem. This game doesn't share what we really need for telemetry! It's impossible to understand real ride height, as it's impossible to estimate aero load! An 11 rear wing Vs a 1 rear wing results in same suspension travel..so it's not adding any further compression aka impossible to estimate aero load. Not to mention rear and front coefficient of lift its the exactly the same, as if the front and rear wing generate same load! Plus the fact they keep using clicks instead of NM or mm or Angles... This game need a seriously step into realism. 

Does the suspension travel change with speed as the car accelerates?

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6 hours ago, JOmNrES said:

Does the suspension travel change with speed as the car accelerates?

They should because of the weight transfer...so as soon as you are on throttle the weight shift from front to rear and rear suspension squat (compress). Same for high speed...the more you are fast, the more wing you have, the more downforce will push the car down so a rear wing set on 3 will push the suspension down less than a wing set on 5 (with the same spring force of course). 

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7 hours ago, Alastre said:

They should because of the weight transfer...so as soon as you are on throttle the weight shift from front to rear and rear suspension squat (compress). Same for high speed...the more you are fast, the more wing you have, the more downforce will push the car down so a rear wing set on 3 will push the suspension down less than a wing set on 5 (with the same spring force of course). 

Right, but you’re saying this isn’t the case with the game?  Whether a wing is at 11 or 1 the suspension travel is the same?  But does it at least increase with speed like it should?  This would tie ride height directly to suspension levels and eliminate the impact of aero, wouldn’t it? 
 

I’m trying to understand how to properly think about downforce levels and ride height in the game…like everyone else.  Even if it isn’t perfectly accurate, it can still always be understood.  😛

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32 minutes ago, JOmNrES said:

Right, but you’re saying this isn’t the case with the game?  Whether a wing is at 11 or 1 the suspension travel is the same?  But does it at least increase with speed like it should?  This would tie ride height directly to suspension levels and eliminate the impact of aero, wouldn’t it? 
 

I’m trying to understand how to properly think about downforce levels and ride height in the game…like everyone else.  Even if it isn’t perfectly accurate, it can still always be understood.  😛

Welcome to the club mate, it's always nice to a have a new member on board! 😂

I can tell you for sure That NO suspension travel stay the same regardless of the wing setting...can't remember how they travel in relation with speed I'll check later and let you know! 

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On 9/21/2021 at 2:42 AM, JOmNrES said:

Right, but you’re saying this isn’t the case with the game?  Whether a wing is at 11 or 1 the suspension travel is the same?  But does it at least increase with speed like it should?  This would tie ride height directly to suspension levels and eliminate the impact of aero, wouldn’t it? 
 

I’m trying to understand how to properly think about downforce levels and ride height in the game…like everyone else.  Even if it isn’t perfectly accurate, it can still always be understood.  😛

Yes dropping the rear wing will increase your speed. How much you would need to compare. I just raced tonight a Zandvoort and dropping the rear about 3 clicks in the practice sessions certainly did increase speed down the straight. (not a huge amount but it did incerase) You really have to play around the feel you like in the balance and depending on your car development in career mode.

What I do is to use a practice and try different setups on 1 soft then another on a new soft. Note the sectors/ time and feel. Restart the session and repeat with different settings to then get to a setup for that race weekend. Restart the session and continue for the real career. 
I find a setup in time trial might be a base to work with but depending on career season and development then that will change.

With height it should be the front that bottoms first. 
Watch your replay in the bumpy sections and see if there are too many sparks. Also after the races if you feel the height was not correct then watch the replay and compare your sparks to the AI around the track. Adjust as you see it.

Cheers

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