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F2 2021


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53 minutes ago, SmokyAtom07 said:

Generally you know who is a good driver and who isn't by around the 3rd or 4th race in a season.

Generally, yes. Apart from some exceptions. Like Giovinazzi in 2016 didn't score any points in the first 4 races but finished the season 2nd behind Gasly. Or like who Coletti led the championship by 24 points after 8 races in 2013 but afterwards scored only once and finished 5th in the standings. 

But it's not like they can't update the driver stats for F2 just like they do for F1. 

I don't know, currently it feels like the F2 DLC is very disconnected from the core game. You can use the cars in time trial and online but only as your own driver so basically it's just a livery update then. Or you can do quick races with them, no full season in Championships mode. Or you can do a full season in quick play if you don't want to do ANY other quick races before that season is finished. 

I really hope Codemasters find a better way to implement all this extra stuff (F2, Icons, classic cars etc.) in the core game. I'm actually mulling over some ideas for improving the usage of legendary drivers and might post it in the Suggestions forum at some point. Who knows, Codies might pick it up. Braking Point was basically 1:1 copy of my wishlist post on the old forums, the only difference being that I wanted the story stuff to be a part of the Career mode, not a separate experience. 

 

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I don't understand the update.
Fittipaldi and Beckmann are with Charouz and Campos, wich happened at Monza. So this update based around Monza GP
Jack Aitken is still with HWA, but was replaced by Jack Hughes at Monza, so its not based around Monza GP.
 

Edited by FTBuzzard
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6 hours ago, FTBuzzard said:

I don't understand the update.
Fittipaldi and Beckmann are with Charouz and Campos, wich happened at Monza. So this update based around Monza GP
Jack Aitken is still with HWA, but was replaced by Jack Hughes at Monza, so its not based around Monza GP.
 

I presumed there was a cut-off date just before Monza.  I had expected to see Nannini but wasn't sure what team he was going to be with, so was surprised he wasn't at all. Not complaining as I like Fittipaldi though. 

Sometimes they know waaaayy in advance that a driver won't have the funding for the next race so they say "Enzo joining Charouz at Monza" but it'll be before Hughes was confirmed as HWA. That only happened because Aitken was in a bad accident in Belgium, if I remember correctly?  So they were probably expecting Jack at that race and that was their driver cut-off so Jake didn't sneak in until just after. 

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On 12/8/2021 at 5:26 PM, Sector4 said:

After careful consideration I've decided that it would be great if Codemasters added FIA F3 to the franchise.

IF they also add Macau.

1017889850--20191115-_R3I1276

1017887855--20191114-_R3I0843

I know it's not part of the official FIA F3 calendar, only a one-off "World Cup" but...

I second this proposal!

Actually I spoke about that here, so it would be nice if we can make Codies consider it 😉

 

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On 12/8/2021 at 4:26 PM, Sector4 said:

After careful consideration I've decided that it would be great if Codemasters added FIA F3 to the franchise.

IF they also add Macau.

1017889850--20191115-_R3I1276

1017887855--20191114-_R3I0843

I know it's not part of the official FIA F3 calendar, only a one-off "World Cup" but...

I would love that too and made a similar suggestion as well as introducing F2 MyTeam.

 

BUT

 

Until F2 is even incorporated properly, I don't think F3 should even be looked at. 

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1 hour ago, Sonic6L said:

I would love that too and made a similar suggestion as well as introducing F2 MyTeam.

 

BUT

 

Until F2 is even incorporated properly, I don't think F3 should even be looked at. 

I have previously raised a MyFranchise thing where you control teams across all 3 so I like the top idea of having an F2 MyTeam. I think it doesn't work as well unless you start introducing NewGens and that could be an issue.

I disagree on the second part though. I get the point of view that F3 shouldn't be looked at until they show they can do F2 first, I do. It's a perfectly valid opinion. However, if they did have something where F2 and F1 work together properly and and they then wanted to introduce F3 then they'd shoehorn that in as an afterthought again and it'd be like it is now so all that's happened is you've moved the goalposts from a poor F2 integration to a poor F3 integration.   What would be better is if they overhaul how F2 currently works to get something where F1, F2 AND F3 working in one built-from-the-ground-up and fit-for-purpose design. 

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In my view there is a lot that needs changing for F2 some are big things and some small and to be honest this should of been done at least 2 years ago.

The first thing is that we should be allowed to change the fuel loads for practice and qualifying otherwise you can only do 1 lap and along with qualifying we should be able to use 2 sets of softer tyres like they do in real life.

The tyre choices are wrong for 3 races. Bahrain Jedda and Abu Dhabi

Now that the season is over surely the order of the cars can be adjusted so it mirrors the real championship order. and try to make a way to get the ai to overtake each other 

Add alternative strategies for the feature so its mixes up the races and makes it interesting, by doing this change it would add so much to replay ability.

It would be nice if there are some changes to F2 instead of just changing the cars from year to year 

 

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37 minutes ago, ojhowells said:

In my view there is a lot that needs changing for F2 some are big things and some small and to be honest this should of been done at least 2 years ago.

The first thing is that we should be allowed to change the fuel loads for practice and qualifying otherwise you can only do 1 lap and along with qualifying we should be able to use 2 sets of softer tyres like they do in real life.

The tyre choices are wrong for 3 races. Bahrain Jedda and Abu Dhabi

Now that the season is over surely the order of the cars can be adjusted so it mirrors the real championship order. and try to make a way to get the ai to overtake each other 

Add alternative strategies for the feature so its mixes up the races and makes it interesting, by doing this change it would add so much to replay ability.

It would be nice if there are some changes to F2 instead of just changing the cars from year to year 

 

These two in bold are mainly linked and the second biggest problem I have with the mode. The main problem I have is what you mentioned in italics with the performance of the drivers being wholly misrepresentative of the season we've watched.  There are some outliers based on championship order, such as Armstrong should have had around 30-40 points more but his engine was a big of mincemeat at times and he lost points that way.  However, Nissany and Deledda are always at the front of my F2 2021 and Tsunoda was pure dominance in F2 2020 (I assume because it uses his F1 2021 stats).  I don't get how that can't be noticed?  Surely someone would notice in the F1 mode if Latifi and Giovinazzi are always on the podium... Why should it be different for F2?

However, back to your bold point, the problem is that all the drivers are around the same ratings (60 to 70) and all the cars are basically the same (give or take a tenth or two).  Contrast this with F1 where the ratings are from around 70 to 95 and the cars have massive variance.    So, what F2 will need to cause overtakes is varying strategies to encourage the overtaking. However, in the game the AI calculates the fastest method of getting from lights to flag and then they all choose that. It makes sense logistically as if Soft-Hard takes 45 minutes and 12 seconds and Hard-Soft takes 45 minutes and 43 seconds then obviously it would choose the first option.  Then they pit over the course of 2-3 laps of each other so the tyres aren't that much fresher so there's no performance difference. 

Programming the better drivers lower down (for example, Shwartzman who may qualify 12th) to go on an alternate strategy is where they should be going.  It shouldn't be all drivers as you would have drivers like Sato, Zendeli and Beckmann qualifying lower and then being the ones to use the alternate and getting strong results, which also isn't representative.  Or, at least, if the inferior drivers are on the other strategy, then their rating should mean they shouldn't get higher than reverse grid pole positions.

You're completely right that it needs implementing better though. 

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On 12/10/2021 at 11:06 AM, SmokyAtom07 said:

I disagree on the second part though. I get the point of view that F3 shouldn't be looked at until they show they can do F2 first, I do. It's a perfectly valid opinion. However, if they did have something where F2 and F1 work together properly and and they then wanted to introduce F3 then they'd shoehorn that in as an afterthought again and it'd be like it is now so all that's happened is you've moved the goalposts from a poor F2 integration to a poor F3 integration.   What would be better is if they overhaul how F2 currently works to get something where F1, F2 AND F3 working in one built-from-the-ground-up and fit-for-purpose design. 

Fair point, but I would say it's too much work for CM and not possible unless braking point goes, which I doubt it will. 

F2 is missing two key things for me, strategies, not all cars run the same strategies of the soft tyres and then harder, some reverse that but that's not reflected in the game.

AI overtaking is also missing. Just seems to be one procession with hardly any overtaking.

Edited by Sonic6L
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7 minutes ago, Sonic6L said:

Fair point, but I would say it's too much work for CM and not possible unless braking point goes, which I doubt it will. 

F2 is missing two key things for me, strategies, not all cars run the same strategies of the soft tyres and then harder, some reverse that but that's not reflected in the game.

AI overtaking is also missing. Just seems to be one procession with hardly any overtaking.

Changing the strategies would be an easy one that would also increase the overtaking a bit, drivers in the back starting on the softer compound overtaking the drivers on the harder compound in the first laps and vice versa in the last laps.

But the main problem for the overtaking is probably how the AI is coded. They (going by f2 2020) have all very similar pace, except for MSC who only got buffed because of this F1 season, and its not distinguished between qualifying pace and race pace or a tyre saving driving style. Take Boschung for instance, if there were quali pace and tyre saving as additional ratings he would have quali pace above the average but also low tyre saving, which would result in him going fast in quali starting near the front like he did in the past race but slowly get overtaking the further the race goes on.

At the moment they have the results in qualifying based on the pace the will also have in the race, of course some little deviation here and there but overall pretty much that, so of course there rarely gonna be anything going. The quali pace and tyre saving ratings would help with this and additionally the car performance variety i made for quali/race balance would amplify this in a subtle way so that Ticktum might have a bad quali (i know he wont be there next season and doesnt have bad quali pace) starting P14 but saving his tires, having a car setup for race balance and better race pace he could be up to 0.4-0.5s per lap faster than a lot of drivers and therefore overtake.

However a reason for the lack of overtakes could also be the coding of the AI themselfes, that they dont get as much treatment as the F1 driver AIs but i cant say anything specific on that.

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Seems to me they need to introduce some little mistake making into the AI. So a driver might miss the braking spot in a turn or miss a shift. 

I would also like to see a pressure system where you get in a guys mirrors for a couple of laps it causes those little mistakes to happen or happen more often, more for some drivers than others.

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2 hours ago, TvRacinFan said:

Seems to me they need to introduce some little mistake making into the AI. So a driver might miss the braking spot in a turn or miss a shift. 

I would also like to see a pressure system where you get in a guys mirrors for a couple of laps it causes those little mistakes to happen or happen more often, more for some drivers than others.

Mistakes were in the early build of the game but I believe got removed after some patches. 

I've noticed in my own game the F2 AI does make mistakes every so often. I had one where I was racing hard against Schumacher at Spa, he made a mistake by braking late and then eventually spun out, gifting me P1 really. 

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18 hours ago, Meza994 said:

Changing the strategies would be an easy one that would also increase the overtaking a bit, drivers in the back starting on the softer compound overtaking the drivers on the harder compound in the first laps and vice versa in the last laps.

But the main problem for the overtaking is probably how the AI is coded. They (going by f2 2020) have all very similar pace, except for MSC who only got buffed because of this F1 season, and its not distinguished between qualifying pace and race pace or a tyre saving driving style. Take Boschung for instance, if there were quali pace and tyre saving as additional ratings he would have quali pace above the average but also low tyre saving, which would result in him going fast in quali starting near the front like he did in the past race but slowly get overtaking the further the race goes on.

At the moment they have the results in qualifying based on the pace the will also have in the race, of course some little deviation here and there but overall pretty much that, so of course there rarely gonna be anything going. The quali pace and tyre saving ratings would help with this and additionally the car performance variety i made for quali/race balance would amplify this in a subtle way so that Ticktum might have a bad quali (i know he wont be there next season and doesnt have bad quali pace) starting P14 but saving his tires, having a car setup for race balance and better race pace he could be up to 0.4-0.5s per lap faster than a lot of drivers and therefore overtake.

However a reason for the lack of overtakes could also be the coding of the AI themselfes, that they dont get as much treatment as the F1 driver AIs but i cant say anything specific on that.

Fair and valid points mate. 

Have a like. 

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10 hours ago, Sonic6L said:

Mistakes were in the early build of the game but I believe got removed after some patches. 

I've noticed in my own game the F2 AI does make mistakes every so often. I had one where I was racing hard against Schumacher at Spa, he made a mistake by braking late and then eventually spun out, gifting me P1 really. 

They do make a few mistakes but not nearly as many as I believe they should. I recently increased the difficulty level and see that they spread out more around the track where before it would be one long train of cars.

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17 hours ago, TvRacinFan said:

They do make a few mistakes but not nearly as many as I believe they should. I recently increased the difficulty level and see that they spread out more around the track where before it would be one long train of cars.

In early builds of the game they were making a fair few mistakes when pressured and added to the realism. 

 

I.e. locking up under brakes, going wide, spinning out, collisions with other cars. Now they're pretty much on rails. 

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23 hours ago, ojhowells said:

Does anybody know if there are any updates like alternative strategies happening for f2 or not in future patches? 

I wouldn't be expecting any more significant patches in the game at all anyway. Maybe a few minor fixes here and there but nothing that changes gameplay.

And, even if there was a decent change, I wouldn't expect to see anything involving the F2 part of the game.  It's an afterthought that they shoehorn in and then ignore after that. 

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